ELECTIONS

Dear "hamsade ghadimi", Dear "Anonymous76",

USA is the weakest democracy among the real democratic countries, normally only 50% vote (compared to the European 70% to 90%); that´s the reason why the States are ruled by the lobbies (Representative Democracy with a primacy of Oligarchy - lobbies - over Democracy in opposite to Europe where you have many Parliamentary - Constitutional - Democracies). So USA is not the country we should be model ourself on.

I undestand you, you are not happy with the candidates (by the way, me too). You just criticise, but what is your better solution? I will vote invalid. This shows participation. Every voice counts, Saberi´s case proves it.

to mineum71

i find it curious that you start every conversation apologetically, and then you go on and say something untrue about me or what i've said.  this is a bit of passive-aggressive behavior.  i am not a bisavad or say chert o pert because i don't agree with you.  i am not sulking (ghar kardan) because i don't want to vote nor do i think that typical iranians sulk.  i AM NOT encouraging boycotting of the election as you can see in my previous comments.  i am not trying to prescribe to others what to do as you seem to be doing.  some of my best friends are going to vote and we remain freinds despite our differences.  all i've said is that i have not heard a convincing argument to vote.

speaking of the last election: you contribute ahmadinejad's election to people's complacency.  do you not remember that khamenei decreed that the reform party was not allowed to campaign or participate in the last election until two weeks before the election.  that's when the reform candidate decided not to run.  he decided not to run because he knew the outcome was already decided.  rafsanjani was a last minute replacemnent so that the world does not see the mockery of elections in iran. 

//www.voanews.com/english/archive/2004-02/a-2004-02-02-27-Pro-Reform.cfm?moddate=2004-02-02

you may think that rafsanjani is a better choice but i bet if you can turn back time, iranian people (knowing what they know now) would still pick ahmadinejad.  not that they like him but because they distrust rafsanjani even that much more.

 i am not the only one who has this opinion (see others' opinions below).  you don't need 100% turnout for a democracy to work.  the voter turnout in the US has been 38% (1994) to 63% (1960) in the past 50 years.  each person will ultimately do a cost-benefit analysis for their voting effort (or any effort for that matter).  i do not see any benefit of voting for a smiley face, but the cost of going to the polling station is more than zero.  if IRI would publish the number of write-in ballots (including the smiley faces), i may consider voting though.

Dear MiNeum71

Why are you talking of stubbornness? Many people do not want to vote because their VIEWS and OPINIONS are not represented in the elections. People who have secular views do not have any candidate who represents them, as all candidates are representing various trends of political Islam.

People living in the West vote for parties and movements sharing their ideas and values and most Iranians in the West have got used to that.

What you need to understand is that in the IR system, nobody, especially those who are filtered by the Guardian Councils to be the ultimate candidates, wants to “change” the IR structure of power. This is pure illusion to think that Khatami wanted to end the “velayate faghih”. There might be reformists who want this, but not the candidates and certainly not when they are in power. They want the status quo but MAY have different opinions on how to rule the country, economically and socially, but they do not want any change in the structure or hierarchy of the regime. Otherwise they would have been filtered.

You are saying that democracy only works when members of the society participate and respect other participants. May I ask you who respects the views of those do not approve the velayat e faghigh, who do not want an Islamic system to rule their daily lives, who do not want a mullah to tell them how to think, how to drink, how to dress, how to eat? As long these people do not feel respected, they will stay out of these elections and it is quite understandable.

Respect is a two-way street and you cannot expect people who have felt disrespected for the last 30 years to suddenly be patient, be respectful of the same old system and people who rule it!

VOTE But Then JOIN the Iranian Solidarnosc ... ;0)

As Prescribed by Winds OF Change ...

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=oaSclIZMwEU

Prince Reza Pahlavi's speech at UC Irvine on may 06 2009

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=CXdsBxwn9II

Qui m'Aiment Me Suivent ...

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=seuQJc6CSm8&feature=related

LOL

Wahtever the Outcome of the Elections, My Position Remains the same as 30 years ago:

I WAS, AM AND WILL BE FOR REGIME CHANGE, Until they ASK FOR MERCY :

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=KE2orthS3TQ

LOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooooL

What difference does it make any way?

I keep seeing article after article (probably until the elecshow day) particularly on this Website, encouraging people to go and vote YET I have noticed that so far everybody who speaks in favor of or aganist voting are the same so called "usual suspects"!

It seems to me that all those who want or do not want to vote have already made up their minds since there has not been a single new convert to either camp.

I have not voted in any of the last eleshows and am not going to start now even though I carry the Islamic Republic's birth certificate, passport, etc. because deep down I do not see any room for improvement in the system unless Khamenei suddenly drops dead then there might, I say, might be some room for improvement PERIOD

In either case, Khamenii & Co. (e.g. The Guardian Council, top clerics in Qum and the Revolutionary Guards) will decide the end result whether Ahmadinejad is chosen or not!

p.s. Do not be fooled by Khamenii's superficial support for Ahmadinejad, he might in reality be supporting Moussavi

Another sign of the Dayi Jan Napelon Flu

As evident from many posts in Iranian before I have seen that the Dayi jan Napelon Flu has not left the Iranian society and mind. Many of us still feel that "The enemy" is after us, that it wants to destroy us, that it is united.

This kind of thinking and feeling leads to passivity. Since the "enemy" is united and gets help from Britain and CIA it is impossible to do anything so we should just sit and do nothing, since doing something is always good for the enemy. Doing nothing and talk in other hand is good, since the "enemy" is really affraid of public opinion (see AntiRacism gathering in Switzerland to see how much they care about talks and PR).

I would like to say as I have already said, there is of course difference between evil and less evil. One gets all the foreign connections blocked by stupid speeches, spend money like crazy to push for Mahdis return, endorses an interior minister who has false P.H.D papers, lies right into your face without blinking, feels himself answerable just to Mahdi.

IRI has not helped your or my vote since the revolution and they could
not care less if 10 percent of people vote as long as it is the right
10 percent.

So if you want another 4 years of Ahmaghinejad politics, further isolating Iran and pushing it to more extreme then please do not vote.

/Bidar bash ke ma bekhabim

Dear "hamsade ghadimi",

Please, please, don´t take it personally, but not voting is the silliest thing one can do. When you say, a boycott helps the nation, what is then the benefit for the society and the people? This typically Iranian Ghar Kardan and Laj-bazee Kardan is such a bad habit, really typically Iranian, and one of the worst things one can do; this reminds me of my primary school when 8y children are sucked. But grown up people? I´m really full of respect for your opinion, but this non-activity is a nonsence solution.

There is no guarantee that voting can help the people immediately, but no-voting guarantees the same bullshit for the next four years.

By the way, there is one thing you should be criticised for: 4 years ago many Iranians didn´t vote using exactly the same arguments, and as we know, things became worse. Same game again?

You mentioned the 3Ks. But: Ali Khamenei was never elected, and there are also liberal forces ruling inside the IRI. Liberal votes make them stronger in this system, and this can provide a step-by-step solution towards a
secular society.

After the revolution there were many theocrats who didn´t agree Khomeini´s policy, there were many conflicts inside that stratum. Today Ali as-Sistani is living in Iraq, Hussein Ali Montazeri was placed under house arrest (and is still sitting at home although this condition ended officially in 2003), and Hossein Kazemeyni Boroujerdi is suffering from multiple health complications including heart problems in a prison somewhere in Iran.

After the Revolution many of the clerics oppose the theocratic concept of rule by Islamic jurists and emphasise that there is no compulsion in religion or Islam that is not political. They also critisise the IRI and support the rights of the Baha'is saying that they are the citizens of this country, they have the right of citizenship and to live in this country. Furthermore, they must benefit from the Islamic compassion which is stressed in Quran and by the religious authorities.

These liberal forces can only work if they feel the support by the people. And the best support is to vote in June. And to show patience.

You are doing the same mistake like people did in the late Shah era. 35 years ago Iranians wanted more, the perfect country (or something like that) should be served up on a plate. Now? Who do you want to serve us a democratic Iran on a plate? And make the change with Ghar Kardan and Laj-bazee Kardan?

I see light at the end of the tunnel anyway: Democracy can only work, when the members of the society both participate themselves and respect others participations (views, opinions). So democracy needs an improved civilised and educated culture, not necessarily an economically developed society.

The one and only solution I see is to educate the people toward a respectful society, and I think this is going on quite well. It takes time, but this can be a lesson which in the long run brings a good result.

Political culture is divided into social culture and construction culture. The social culture is daily life´s matter of courses in their entirety. The construction culture has two functions: it must thematize the social culture and it must create and develope new cultural matter of courses.

Iran´s society is improving anyway. More and more women can read and write, that makes the society less religious and makes birth control
possible, Iran´s birthrate was 1.689 (2008), the infant mortality is falling, from 44,17 (2003) to 35.78 (2009 est.); this is a great reality.

Iran is already a secular country, only the leading elite still hasn´t noticed it (demographic data are much more evident than any political rhetoric).

I see the step-by-step solution. The circumstances are becoming better, then many exil Iranians will return (specially from Europe), and they and the contacts with Iranians can help the society to change into a democratic governance.

If you don´t have any preferences for the elections, go and draw smiley faces. At least you showed your voice.

ما میگیم شاه نمیخوایم نخست وزیر عوض میشه!

این شعار رو زمان انقلاب یادتون میاد؟

چرا شما ها فکر میکنین که رأی تون به حساب میاد اگه خلاف رأی رهبر باشه؟

بابا جان........ویک آپ اَند اِسمل دِ کافی........بخودت بیا........آخه حضرت رهبر به چه زبونی به شماها بگه که « تا من اینجام شما هفتاد میلیون هیچ پُخی نیستین»........

یکنفر «فقیه» در مقابل هفتاد و اندی میلیون سفیه........حق «وتو»ی یکنفره.........چرا فهم این قضیه اینقدر سخته؟

اگر فردا هفتاد میلیون رأی بدن به خود «پیغمبر اکرم» حضرت رهبر یک تنه میتونه بگه........«با نص صریح اسلام ناب محمدی مغایرت دارد ، فلذا....بی خیال»! غیر از اینه؟

با این حساب اصل شرکت در انتخابات ریاست جمهوری  نفی اصل ولایت فقیه نیست؟

کجای این قضیه رو من نمیفهمم (یا شما)؟

When are you people who believe in reformist vs Conservative

would wake up..No matter who comes to power, the last work is to be said by Khamenei..Velayet faghih together with Khamaneni control Iran..They are all from same rotten roots...When are you guys going to open your eyes and see that there are no differences between these people. The whole constitution is based on an ideology which they forced upon all Iranians no matter their background, religion etc....

Real option is to protest against IRI

In undemocratic system like IRI, the officials are appointed and not elected by popular vote. Votes in IRI system only serves ONE and ONLY ONE purpose .. to show support for they IRI system (i.e. an unelected, LIFE LONG ruler).

Therefore, stop support of IRI by simple act of disobying their orders to go to voting booths.

can't we just get along

to the person that called me bisavad:

persuasion through debate is much more effective than insulting or bullying through posturing.  i will not preach and lead by example! khatami, to me, is of the same cloth as khamenei and khomeini.  in fact, the three of them (k, k and k) are relatives through marrigaes, wear (and wore) the same black turban and don't believe in secular government.  i do not think that khatami had the power to fundamentally change the government nor any other presidents under the current regime.  my question was: what did khatami do during his presidency (other than shaking hands with some of the leaders of the world) that made him a good president?  this is a legitimate question that need not be answered with another question.

a puppet president with a smile and a puppet president with a fist both give you the same net result.  this is khamenei's version of 'good cop, bad cop.' 

i will not change my mind until i hear a more persuasive argument on the voting issue.  and i will not insult anyone who doesn't espouse my beliefs.

a great question

Should we be patient and expect change from the current system or revolt against it. I believe this is the roots of our political divide

We shouldn't polemic on that

You may find more details on wiki about the French revolution (FR).
//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Revolution

The FR does not end to Robespierre. Robespierre is to the French revolution what Gholamhossein Ajeh-E is to the Iranian revolution.
After more than 70 years of events, the French revolution led to one of the greatest democracy in the world.

And... In "Popular Exploitation of Enemy Estates in the English Revolution", Christopher O'Riordan, talks about the "English Revolution" refering to the period of the English Civil Wars and Commonwealth period 1640-1660.

The subject of your article is great. We may stick on it.

:-)

I think you need to reread the history, the french revolution lead to something like the IRI we have today. Think Robespiere. After many bloody revolutions they evolved.

Also in England you could call it revolution but in history book I have heard of it as evolution.

/Bidar bash ke ma bekhabim

Could you ...

please point to a revolution that has lead to democracy?

- The French revolution,

- and the English revolution some 150 years before the french one, which led to a constitutional monarchy now.

Writer's comment!

First thanks for your comments.

Second I talk from my own experience when talking about typical youngsters in Iran. I was there recently and I meet some outside Iran where I live. They are mostly academic so they are from the class where you would expect more knowledge, they are from different parts of Iran and from different type of families.

Also to people who endorse revolution. Can you somehow calculate just what would happen after a revolution? What guarantees do you have that the situation becomes better than it is today? Could you please point to a revolution that has lead to democracy?

/Bidar bash ke ma bekhabim

Dear "hamsade ghadimi",

I´m sorry for claiming this, I consider you being one of the typically Iranian Bee-savad, who is only good in Chert-o-pert goftan. Khatami era not better than Ahmadinejad era? Congratulations.

Too far to understand the issues

I will not encourage anyone to vote or boycott. Personally, I will not vote, not as a sign of boycott, but mainly because I have lived out of Iran for too long and I am too far to really grasp the issues of average Iranians. After all, they are the ones who will live with the consequences of these elections, not me.

Following these elections from here is very difficult. I do not really know the main domestic issues (economy, employment, health care, security...) and what each candidate is proposing.

Humbug!

Where have you gone, Originality? If there is anything lacking in our world it is not choices but the dearth of original, non-borrowed thoughts. The author of this article needs to look up the meaning of the word 'originality' in a good dictionary. It will serve him right. Why do we Iranis have to borrow our lexicon, idiolect, words, jargons, whatever you want to call it, from the morons in the West? The key words & key references used in this article can easily be obtained in a neo-con's essay. How odd that while the world is waking up to the damage and nightmares the neo-cons wrought for us, yet some Iranians are still holding on to these dream-nightmares of the neo-fascists in the West, better known as the neo-cons!!! Why some Iranians are so retrograde and regressive? Was it not the neo-cons who were going to bring 'democracy' to Iraq & Afghanistan & the rest of the ME? So what are the democratic choices that the Iraqis and Afghanis ( and now the Pakistanis) are enjoying now: drones firing missiles into Afghani wedding & villages, killing the bride, her relatives, guests & ordinary hardworking benighted people, that is certainly a choice the neo-cons did not bother to tell the world about; another choice, an Iraqi mother sobbing for her 13 year old son because he is illiterate, thanks to the American fascists having bombed & destroyed Iraq's infrastructure once one of the best in the ME; another beneficent democratic choice: the children of the Pashtus living in Southern Afghanistan are dying of preventable diseases and wounds because the West has laid siege upon them and the Pashtus will not allow Western medical aid workers & supplies since they know Western agents will be inserted aplenty, thus the Pashtun leadership prefer to have their children die rather than to surrender to the hated Western crusaders. These are some of the 'real' & 'tangible' choices the Western democracy has brought to he people of the ME who had no choice in receiving these choices they did not ask for and did not want! The author bemoans the lack of choices as if he is in a bazaar looking for the best bargain, so that he can 'choneh bezaneh' to get the best deal that serves his fancy.
So why Ahmadinejad? Why he is the BEST choice under the stringent circumstances? His extremism is a response to the Western terror & extremism. Let me think... the genocide of the indigenous people of the Americas, that certainly qualifies for terror & extremism...the nuclear holocausts in Hiroshima and Nagasaki (both unnecessary since Japan had declared its readiness through diplomatic channels to surrender unconditionally de facto), that certainly should qualify for terror & extremism Western style; napalm bombings and extensive use of Dioxin (Agent Orange) which killed some 2 millions in Vietnam and altered the genetic code of the Vietnamese whose children are hideously malformed, that is certainly American brand of terror & extremism; the uninhibited use of depleted uranium ordinance in Iraq which has condemned the Iraqis & their children to genetic diseases of malformation and early death for years and years, that is certainly Western terror & extremism. Ahamdinejad is responding to the pre-existing extremism & terror of the West. He is the only Iranian politician who has used his pulpit to condemn the occupations of Iraq & Afghanistan and ask for the immediate withdrawal of Western crusaders. The truth is we can not do to the future generations of Iranians what the Qajars did to the present one: namely, to capitulate to the West, enjoy the paltry morsels the niggardly Westerners might throw our way, and let the future Iranians deal with what we have no stomach dealing with in our time. The entrenchment of the Western forces & bases in Iraq & Afghanistan for Iranians living in Khorasan & Khuzestan would signify what the Zionist state's entrenchment signified for the Palestinians: Apache helicopters spewing fire into Palestinian communities with utmost impunity & arrogance, the refugee status of an entire Palestinian nation, & the rest which we all know all too well. Ahamdinejad has my vote. He is the best choice for Iran given the extremism & terror of the West & the responsibility we must feel toward the future generations of Iran.

voting argument not convincing

i think that the theocracy in iran has made a mockery of voting.  they (the mullahs) have made this theatre to show the world that there's a democracy in iran.  the country is run by one man (khamenei) and his cronies.  all who pose, or chosen as candidates are puppets of this regime and have no power to pursue the agenda they propose during their candidacy.  i feel like a fool to participate in the presidential voting.  local voting is another matter and i think there may be real differences in candidates at local level.

 i'd like to hear what people think that khatami, the last great hope, and the one many people were hoping to run again did during his presidency.  yes, he did shake some hands of other leaders (although, he denied shaking the hands of president of israel in the last pope's funeral!).  is that enough?  would you call that a good start? not to me.  people like khatami or the reform party may talk in a gentler voice but they are the supporters of the status quo.  during khatami's presidency, how many newspapers were shut down?  how many editors were put in prison?  even the media were duped in thinking the political environment has changed and they were in an era of openness.  i like to know how you get educated in a country where the media is suppressed.  a country where people only believe in the sports pages and nothing else.  a country where naive expatriate journalists are jailed on trumped up charges (roxana saberi, hosseing derakhshan) or killed (zahra kazemi).

the voting in iran has been a good exercise for when the regime changes and we have real democracy.  people have gotten used to voting.  i don't advise people to vote or not to vote; but you can count me out.  i do not want to go on stage and participate in this tragic play.  i'll be reading the sports pages. 

For those who want to boycott these elections

Ahmadinejad is the candidate of Khamenei who decides everything in Iran. So be aware that by boycotting, you will not turn your back to this regime but will legitimize this hard line governance [over people living inside the country] and Khamenei’s position as velayateh-faghuih.

Ahmadinejad is the only guy in the IR who really believes in the apparition of Mahdi. His assertions that he had a hallow of light above his head, or when he prays, Mahdi is with him; are the ultimate reality for him! He was once visiting a church and suddenly stopped and begun to salute an invisible person. People around him asked what he was doing; he told them that he was saluting Mary [Maryam moghadass!]. Some people working for him have the absolute convictions that he’s crazy insane.

Above that, Iran earned more than 300 billion dollars during his presidency. Nobody knows how he spent all that money! The high treasury, governed by an ultra-conservator, just asks him to know in which project he spent all these money, and Ahmadinejad doesn’t respond. In one hand he goes to his every day ritual of khamenei’s hand-kissing and in the other he does what he wants without any objections

choghok, you wrote,...

"if you ask a typical young Iranian that has come out of Iran how he
defines democracy and sees it you will find that they do not know it at
all".

At all?!!! Do you have any data to support your claim about what "typical" young Iranians know, or dont' know, about democracy?

Not voting is apathy

It does not look good for Iranian to have a low turnout for voting. It will damage the morale of everyone, including the activists. We may or may not have real choices available but as long as we keep a huge turnout for voting, it spreads fear into the hearts of dictators, enemies, etc. The high turnout simply shows that people are serious about their rights and that they are not about to give up! So I say we must all vote, even if we don't see a real choice. Then we must continue to demand that the government keep on improving. Just keep at it! It is only when we give up and say "makes no difference" that we start to lose. Apathy is loss. Hope is win!

Those who push for the boycott should know...

boycotts leave the scene entirely under the incumbent's control, in this case Ahmadinejad. I'm encouraging everyone who's eligible to vote.  The best way to protest, if that's your intention, is to use write-ins or blank ballots. But please go to the polls and vote.

Hey buddy. Go and create "another real option"

If it is true, what you say: "Iranians are all divided for this years election as the ones before that." Then you can be sure we will have more of the same until Iranian's unite around a single pole.


Revolution away from a rational, modern, pluralistic and secular government, evolution within an irrational, terrorist, useless and fascists government?? That's all the advise you had for us.?

All must go and vote

Mr. Ahmadinejad appeals to some crowd because of his supportive programs. On the other side, Mr. Mousavi lacks the charisma necessary to attract the young. This could be dangerous for Mousavi or Reformist supporters.

All those who see this election as an important one must participate. boycotting elections is boycotting better policies.

Dear "choghok",

thanks for this short great article. I don´t know what the non-voters expect from their boycott, I also prefer at least the less worse solution.