Current Events

Aynak

I don't want to get side tracked over Shah. He was a dictator but we had social and personal freedoms. He did not care what we wore or ate or drank as long as we did not challenge him. 

What worries me about "vote of the people" is that they are  easily manipulated. We need a "good" leader who is going to set the right direction. Otherwise I fear the backward forces are going to manupilate "democracy" into another IR. As you said we have some people who still want to go back to 6th century even after living in the  West. Personally I do not think they form a large part of Iranians. But other nationalities do have a larger population of such people.

At the end it boils down to: do you trust the Iranian people at this time to make the right democratic decision. To opt for UN charter freedoms; secularism and democracy. Or will they vote back some kind of fanatic into power. Remember the track record is not that great. People picked about as bad a maniac as possible.

I am not sure. I hope they do the right thing. A powerful and "good" leader will set the course. Without that the nation is thrown into a "sink or swim" deal. The danger is that "good" leader turns out to be another dictator as bad as before. I don't know the right path.

Re:VPK

The biggest challenge here, is to have a collection of people who can abide by a process, the outcome of which is determined by votes.   Unfortunately from what I see, for many groups it is either their way or highway.

We just witness a group who came to power 30 years ago through democratic means, but yet when the democratic outcome does not favor them, they resort  to guns and violence.

Reza Shah was not much better, or else we would not be facing the current predicment.   It is mind buggling how we live in the west, see how they do their horse trading without a drop of blood and yet we still want backward systems.

I agree and I wont trust Mousavi or anyone who wants to take me to the golden age of "Imam".   On the other hand, anyone who says they would respect and abide by perpetual vote of people (and not just one time deal) to detrmine the position of power, that is the system we should strive for.   Not powerful personality which will corrupt or keep the corrupted system.

May we all have good dreams.

Aynak

I am well aware of the various definitions. Yes, we have the UN documents; we have the USA bill of rights; Magna Carta; and so on. Unfortunately again you missed the point completely. I was indicating that there are many definitions of freedom. If people do not agree on the idea of freedon you get civil war. Yes just skipped over that part in your anger to jump at the Shah.

I said who I like as leaders. People with a vision. I am not a monarchist but I will take Reza Shah any day. As you said it is my right to my opinion.

I am particularly mistrustful of the "half baked" leaders: Mousavi; Karroubi; Rajavi; Ebadi. People who still try to put on a nice face on Islam and shove it down peoples throuats. I want a leader who will put aside political correctness and tell it as it is.

Re:VPK

VPK: 
What is freedom?

   Fortunately here, we have UNCHCR declartion.  But simply put:

--freedom to assemble

--freedom to speak your mind

--freedom to have your belief

--freedom to form political parties

If someone says they get offended by someone elses freedom, that's their problem.   THe explanation is very clear.

VPK: Why does leader make some people go into a "Stalin" or "Hitler" hysteria?

Hmmm?  may be because YOU meantioned Reza Shah, and not Ghandi or MLK, or even FouladVand? as the type of leader you want?   The fundamental problem, the monarchy crowd does not understand, is that it is not the persons power, but a persons right that would make a free socieity.    

May we all have good dreams.

Aynak

It is ridiculous to compare Iran of 2000 or 200 or even 20 years ago to
doay.  

No it is not. People do not change their basic character in 20; 200 or 2000 years. We are still basically the same humans that we were 2000 years ago. Just as capable of good and bad. Evolution works at a very slow pace and we have not changes much in 2000 years.

The simple approach would be to dream about good old days, which were not all that good anyway.

You are totally misunderstanding me; as have others. I am talking about moving forward. The IR is the one that wants to live in the "good" old past. We pick the good parts of the past and discard the bad parts. 

Everyone sees, every one wants FREEDOM. 

What is freedom? I have heard Muslims claim their freedom is violated if someone draws a cartoon. Others claim their freedom is violated if there are women without hijab. Or what about the husband''s freedom to punish his wife or kids. See is is not well defined. Please hold off on the slogans and caps and thing about it.

I remember they asked Shah about giving people freedom in some interview. He said: freedom to do what? It was a good question now we know what freedom people wanted.

People want strong leaders and that is not going to change. I don't mean arrogant tin plated dictators. I mean people like Amir Kabir; Fouladvand; Reza Shah. Human race does not change its nature in 20 or 200 or 2000 years. In America people democratically pick strong leaders. Or at least those perceived to be strong. That is why they picked Reagen over Carter. Russians picked Putin.

We need to understand the key to democratic process is collective decision making, coalition building, give and take.  

Yes that is valid. But there are places you do not compromise. For example no compromise over right to pick your religion. No compromise on "honor killing" or stoning and so on. There is nothing to compromise over the right to not get killed for your religion. Or not to kill your wife even if she leaves you.  Unfortunately the Muslim ides are so far off that someone needs to sit them down and explain civilized behavior to them. 

That's how we make a truly resilient system, not by searching for another Stalin or Hitler or Reza Shah, which we already know not only their final outcome, but the outcome for their people. 

Why does leader make some people go into a "Stalin" or "Hitler" hysteria? Iran is in a low point and needs to restore confidence in its people. Was Martin Luther King "Hitler"? Was"Gandhi"Hitler. Please tone down the slogans and think.

Iran needs revival of Persian culture.  People are confused between Islamic and modern messages. Someone has to stand up; tell it for what it is and be strong enough to handle what the Mollah dish out. 

Re:"Arash4545 & Tehran"

VPK writes:

"Almost all the Iranian "Muslims" were Zoroastrians. Their leaders
converted to Islam and they followed. Rome had all kinds of religions
and used to make fun of Christians. Their leades became Christian; they
followed. What we need in Iran is a Reza Shah. A person to stand up to
Islam and tell the Mollahs where to stick it. People will follow a
powerful leader. Reza Shah managed to ban the Hijab almost 75 years ago 
People went along and soldiers were willing to enforce his rule."

Wow.   Looks like someone does not understand:

--Past history  (remember they hung Sheikh Fazlollah?) and then what happened to Reza Shah?

--Current history (what has just happened to Saddam and Mubark)?

It is ridiculous to compare Iran of 2000 or 200 or even 20 years ago to doay.   The simple approach would be to dream about good old days, which were not all that good anyway.

Today, it is the age of information revolution.   Unique in the entire history of humanity.   Everyone sees, every one wants FREEDOM.

All solutions must adhere to meet this basic need or will fail, as they consistently have.   We need to understand the key to democratic process is collective decision making, coalition building, give and take.   That's how we make a truly resilient system, not by searching for another Stalin or Hitler or Reza Shah, which we already know not only their final outcome, but the outcome for their people.

May we all have good dreams.

Arash4545 & Tehran

People follow leaders and do as they are told. That is specially true in Iran. We have thousands of years of people following their leaders.

Almost all the Iranian "Muslims" were Zoroastrians. Their leaders converted to Islam and they followed. Rome had all kinds of religions and used to make fun of Christians. Their leades became Christian; they followed. What we need in Iran is a Reza Shah. A person to stand up to Islam and tell the Mollahs where to stick it. People will follow a powerful leader. Reza Shah managed to ban the Hijab almost 75 years ago  People went along and soldiers were willing to enforce his rule.

Why? Because he was a powerful leader and no one messed with him. We need a leader who will set the tone for Iran and point it the right way. This leader is not Mousavi; Karroubi; Ebadi; Rajavi. Mr Fouladvand was a perfect example of such leader. I am afraid he may have been killed by IR. The only one we got now is Reza Pahlavi. I am not sure he has what it takes. There are others but they are not the "well known" bunch of tools that West promotes. Without the right leader you are right. We may be stuck with an Islamic mentality for an indefinite period. Islam got forced on people and may require a bit of doing and leadership to get rid of or at least minimize.

It'll only add to their popularity

Every single stupid step the regime is taking, helps the opposition Green movement. Islamist regime leadership must have hired some of their supporters on this site as advisers on how to deal with the opposition!

Sag-e Zard..

Baraadar-e shoghaal ast!!!!

Let them devour each other ;0)

Can't agree more with "Tehran  e Azad"

THE SAD TRUTH

It is unforetunate but except a few million people in major cities in Iran the majority of the Iranian population is brain washed by 1400 years of  Islamic rhetoric.  Again it is extremely sad but this regime has a lot more supporters that you may think.

What you see in iran today is nothing but an internal war between the different factions of Hezbollahi's over  the right to rob the country.

Mousavi , karoubi, khatami and Rafsanjani are just pissed off cause Khamenei and ahmadi's group are not letting the so called greens to devour  the countries wealth like they used to .

Mr. Mousavi Khoeini recommends the opposition to stay peaceful!

He also asks others protesting peacefully to report who ever is showing courage and possibly answering fire with fire. Hay mr. M.K. drinking sunkist from Stanford and "migi lengash nakon" ... your leaders are under house arrest (I don't give a damn) and many in prisons and soon to be executed. Peaceful so things don't get out of hand for your mullah brothers and fathers?