As I read through the comments on this cartoon, I realize most have not realized the irony of it. Depicting a Persian as a brutal fanatic Islamist by a Turk is extreme irony, to put it quite mildly. The Turkic brutes have established themselves as the "scourge of god" by all the cultures and ethnicities that they have come in contact with. They have "Turkified" Persians for the last few centuries along with their Shii Islam. IRI is their's! The Arabs call IRI the Turkic Safavids! It is so entertaining to see the Turkic-Azari, neo-nationalism is such a fraud!
Also, what's up with the M-16 like rifle ?
Btw, they have always been free to speak their language, why do you think most have such thick accents ?
I'm Azari, and I'm proud to be Azari, an Iranian Azari that
is. And I don't approve of this cartoon either. I have to agree that this is a racist cartoon, and I'm surprised that it has been published on Iranian.com. Not only it discriminates Iranian people, but it also promotes separation; Iranian Azaris do not associate themselves with the Russian colors of the rep. of Azerbaijan or that of Turkey for that matter. We are not Turks. We are purely Iranians.
Nothing more, nothing less.
Btw, we speak Azari, not Turkish.
ps Pope, hala dige Azari nisti!
این بابا شباهت خاصی با ا.ن. داره این منو یاد یک جوک انداخت:
لره به احمدی نژاد میگه: این قیافه خودته یا داری مسخره بازی در میاری؟؟
اونوخت ا.ن. میگه تو اصلا میدونی با کی طرفی؟ وقتی میبینه لره همینطور نگاهش میکنه براش میخونه:
بسی رنج بردم در این سال چار..... عجم رو بکردم همه تار و مار;
من آن کینه پرداز جنگ آورم........... چو بمب اتم به دست آورم;
نگوزم از این پس که من ریده ام..... کشیدم به گه کشور از ایده ام;
This "we" mentality should not be used to quash all the opposite thinkers. If a person wants to be Kurd or AzariTurk and speak his language it is his right within Iran. Exactly why would we try so hard to say that we have the same root? Do we need all to have the same root to be good countrymen?
It is like Iranians tend to marry within the family since they think it is good for the family. Well it is not true.It brings both genetic deseases and family problems.
Or religious people be extra nice if you have the same religion as they do, does it mean that you are a better man because you share the same religion?
We share a lot of history and culture and that is enough. we do not need to speak the same language everywhere or share any ethnic roots.
آذربایجان قسمتی از ایران است و ایران هم به نوبهٔ خود مجموی
از اقوام متفاوت با زبان‌ها و رسوم متفاوت هست. این تفاوت‌ها باعث قوت و
غنی بودن فرهنگ ماست و نه باعث پسرفت ما. در صورت داشتن آزادی‌های قومی
فرهنگ آذری ها، کرد ها، اعراب جنوب و ....، شکوفا تر از حال خواهند بود و
این به نفع تمام ایرانیان است.
بیایید و این تعصبات پوچ را که فقط باعث خوش حالی تجزیه طلبان هست
کنار بذاریم و به جای این که به همون بر بخورد، متفاوت بودن خود رو به
رسمیت بشناسیم و محترم بدونیم.
The subject that this cartoon brings up is a serious one that is basic human rights, to be able to speak and study and use your mother tongue. But the way this problem is shown is very wrong and racist way. In most of Irans history since the Arab conquest of Iran, It has been ruled by Turkish tribes. All the way to the Pahlavi dynasty. Even today many of the top position in IRI is hold by Azaris like Ali yek dast.
Common people in say Isfahan or Rasht would not care if people in schools in Tabriz would learn Azari or that people would speak Kurdish in Sanandajs post office. It is the rulers who do not like it and as said the rulers in Iran are not from a specific race.
Forget about Ghadesii khaliffes & Seljuk Sultanes who screwed us both & divided us as Kurds/Persians/Azaris/ etc..chon at the end of the day we all come from the same glorious Medeo-Persian heritage of Eran-shahr. Look past the artificial distortions & see how there is no "you" & "me" but "us" bonded & united under one flag and desended from the same Kiaani heritage. cheers ,Maenim staekli dustom;
"چون ايران نباشد تن من مباد"
Agha Sohrab Ok hala ma nafahmim... shoma chi chekar kardin.. hala ma nafahma boland shodim shoar dadim zaman ke 4 sal pish hamvatanato koshtan chekar kardi? shoma ke eingadar ba fahm budin??...
Education is always the best way to teach people to do the right thing, and you educate people by beating them jailing them humiliating them.... oh excuse me that was the wrong method.. oooo
"چون ايران نباشد تن من مباد"
You are right why we should have a problem with Caramels cartoon and caramel is right their flag means nothing to us, but that does not mean we are indifferent to the people
ما یک ملت متشکل از مناطق، مذاهب، فرهنگ ها و زبان های مختلف هستیم
یکی از دوست های خوزستانی من میگف که در دبیرستان یکی از معلم هاش میگفت (با لهجه ترکی بخوانید)
آا، بیبینید دونیا بی کوجا ریسیدی. بندیی توک، بی شوما عربا، با زبانی فارسی, اینجیلیسی یاد میدم.
The fact is that Iran, as many other countries in the region, consist of many different ethnicities and languages. My Kurdish friend once told me that even within Kurds, they have three different dialects! So, we are not unique in this dilemma
In India, they have 18 unique languages, with probably hundreds of local dialects. Their solution was to adopt English as the one language to communicate within the country since the Tamils would not even consider learning nor speaking Hindi, but love their spoken Tamil
I am not pushing English into the system, but saying that for the sake of unity, there should be one common language spoken, while the localities should be encouraged to practice and teach their local language to their own folks. That means that if Mammad agha and his Kurdish family gets transferred to the Azerbaijan province because of a government job, his kids should have the option to opt out of learning Azeri in the school system that has a primary common language with the rest of the country
As far as jokes, you know that while African-Americans use the "N" word while speaking in the hood, if someone else (a white) uses it, it is a racist comment. So, choose your words and the place to say it carefully
Actually khuneh oonha kheyli kheyli saale keh rikhteh shodeh. I personally know of Azeri individuals (and highly educated ones at that who would have been great assets to Iran) whose blood was shed as far back as over 50 years ago in their fight for freedom in Iran. And the history of this 'sarkoob' goes back much further than that even. There are many facts that are conveniently forgotten by some.
Beghole yeh khoda biamorzi ba'zee ha shalvareh k**neshoon keh 2 ta mishe yadeshoon mireh kiyan o chiyan. That's what we're dealing with today.
Iran as a whole is held hostage by one group of savages and another group can't wait to continue the same BS under a different guise. Sad. Really really sad.
"Everyone is asking where is Tabriz where is Azarbaijan in the post
election movement, we are green but where was the rest of Iran when we
were killed post cockroach cartoon?"
That wasn't a Movement for freedom, it was ethnically motivated and it could happen to any other ethnicity. But they have chosen you Azaries for a good reason.
The idea behind the publishing of c-cartoon was to divide us and they did very well on that. I have to admit that IRR did a very good job in choosing you Azaris since you were an easy pray for them. It would not work on Kurds, Parsies, Lors etc. because they know the Mullahs very well! The newspaper which published the cartoon belongs to IRR and the leader of IRR is Ali geda Khamanie an Azari himslef and the cartoonist was from Azai origin too. So, use your brain and think for a moment, why in a country that insulting its supreme leader is a big crime and one can get executed for that, so easily and so freely a cartoonist with no fear publishes such a cartoon "knowing that Khamanie is from Azarbaijan"? Any answer to this Question? Didn't you smell the rat when it was published? I did.
No answer to other shero ver! Just to remind you that Iran was ruled in the last 1400 years by Arabs, Turks, and Mongols(all non-iranians) with the exception of Zand dynasty and Pahlavies which lasted only 90 years and they brought prosperity and peace to Iran and Iranians. What Reza shah did in regard of language was intended to help you finding your iranian way of living, he just used the wrong method. Education is always the best way to teach people to do the right thing, Amen.
I kind of feel really bad for donating my student OSAP loan to this website few weeks ago.
You conciously put this peice of racism here to make a point???and your e justification is because Persians crack up Turkish jokes?
"Hala yeh baar an Azari Turk made fun of Farsis. Chi shod? Betoon
barkhord? Khoonetoon joosh oomad? Beh namoosetoon tajaavoz shod?"
Migam ye jurhayi adam fekr mikoneh shoma darin hal mikonin ke be Parsha bar khorde. Maloome ke bar mikhore. Haminjoori ke Jokhaye turki maskhare va ahmagheneh hastan, khob een ham hamintoor. Vali adame balegh ke hate ro ba hate javab nemideh. Bardashti eeno gozashti bad miporsi khoonetoon joosh omad? akheh in eham shod estedlal marde hesabi.
[b] even in Islamic Republic (which is one of the worst types of authoritarian rule to ever preside over our country) when Iran news paper made a joke against our fellow Azeris, the government shut down the newspaper. In Iranian.com appreantly same type of racist behavior appreantly not only gets published but justified as well!!!! Marde hesabi kojaye donya yek melato be onvane yek mosht choopan neshoon dadan kare dorostiye.
Ey khak bar sare man ke poole darsamo be adamhayi mesle to midam.
I wasn't angry at you, not at all. Sorry if it came across that way. And I certainly don't think you're one of the facists, however, I have heard enough of 'Azeris who want their language taught in their schools etc. are separatist' BS from them that I do feel it is sometimes necessary to emphasize that we do see ourselves as IRANIAN first and foremost. Reading your comment it seemed to me that you may not fully realize our prioirties.
Sorry again if my comment came across as hostile toward you. I don't need to read again to know where u stand on this :)
i'm all for an open discussion. and also the azaris who commented seem not to have any problem with the comment left by their fellow azari, caramel, below. it just may be there is a wide spectrum of beliefs within the azari community itself. lastly, i would've been at a loss if you had commented in azari; it's a good thing that you can also speak my language (referring to the farsi that you used).
"چون ايران نباشد تن من مباد"
Na na aslan you did not offend me Im so sorry if I came across agressive..,, but I think that this is a sensitive issue and should be openly discussed and realized outside of Iran in such circles that discuss modern day Iran what a serious concern this is... and how it is even now hindering the green movement,,, people are saying be ma che? ma chera berim bemirim khune ma 4 sal pish rekhte shode kasi be fekre ma nabud its very sad.. and should be addressed
my experience is limited to many azari friends that i have had. i did not mean to make the statement for all azaris. i was making a comparison between sentiment of iranian azaris toward azarbaijanis (the country) and iranians. i'm sorry if i offended you. and i'm sure no matter which way i say it, someone will get offended. i should be more careful in stating that this is my experience.
Official minority language acts allow minority speakers to use their language in legal settings--such as courts, road signs etc.--in designated regions of a country.
Here's the Welsh-English example of what such an act looks like. New Zealand also has a similar act with respect to the Maori language. Also see European Charter for Regional and Minority Languages (ECRML). The charter is meant to protect these languages.
The idea may or not work for Iran in its current mess, but for a stable democratic Iran an Azeri-Farsi act seems quite feasible and has successful precedents in the world.
i don't understand your anger to my statement "my azari friends are proud of their language and heritage and also proud to be iranian." i did not mean any significance by the order of pride in azari and iranian. you seemed to be ticked off by the order and/or the use of word 'also', it seems. definition of 'also': in the same manner, likewise, besides, as well. and i am a propoent of all ethnicities to have all the facilities to use their language, and practice their traditions. definition of facility: ease in moving, acting, doing. you may want to read my post again. i think that your anger is misplaced. i even had to ask my friend who is a professor in english regarding the useage of word 'also' when enumerating qualities in a sentence and she didn't think that the quality that was quaified with also means that is less significant.
i'm not an expert in quantifying and comparing someone's ethnicity to their nationality. it would be silly to say that you're a woman first, then an iranian or vice versa, or for that matter any other quality. have i beat this horse to death yet?
and please don't tell me that you've been attacked by so many fascist "parsis" (as you put it) that you thought i'm one of them. have a nice day.
"چون ايران نباشد تن من مباد"
In response to Hamsade Ghadim, of course we relate to people in Azarbaijan, they have the same language and same culture, THEY ARE IRANIAN they are us, how many years has it been? I know a couple in their 90's they have a library in Baku all Persian books and they treat anything with persian script with the most respect... Please look up a copy of the movie Arshin Malalan the original make and everything wriiten in farsi including the words on the store fronts...
Even if they dont consider themselves Iranian which not many at all do in this generation.. they have the same exact language religion food music etc same culture... Watch this music video and tell me in the whole video... forget hejab, these people are our people our languae and exact culture....
//www.youtube.com/watch?v=9e2nMLUjelA
but what you see now is a response to the treatment of Azaris over a long period of time, people in Iran can remember their parents being beaten being fined being jailed for speaking Azari in schools in Reza Shahs time, they can remember who was incorporated in the area governments, it was always fars, these things have left long rifts... and it is not seen because to the generation that lives in the US post revolution the information they review is relative to IRI and what is so called important.. However, inside Iran in Azarbaijan there is a large wave of social unrest.... I went back after 2 years away and my highly educated middle class and up friends where discussing their rights their language their dignity with a passion that did not exist 4 years before.. I don't know what to think when I speak with them I agree with everything they say.. and I ask for us to discuss this openly this is a huge problem.. and the young people in Tabriz which is more modern than Marand Ardebil etc... are not happy....
"چون ايران نباشد تن من مباد"
Enshalla Iran Fedaral Bashe.. ma am khodemune edare mikonim... You know whats sad.. its exactly what I hear when you discuss our language, we immediately hear Jodaye Talab, in the past 5 years mod shode Pan Turkist...
Everyone is asking where is Tabriz where is Azarbaijan in the post election movement, we are green but where was the rest of Iran when we were killed post cockroach cartoon? Where was the outcry when our boys where killed in Tabriz and Marand and Ardebil?? You know what they say in Tabriz.. Chera nagoftin Baradare Irani Chera Baradar Koshi?? Why only when it happened in Tehran ???,,, Why did you not outcry when they brought in Fars Basij to our towns to quell our anger...over humiliation a few years ago.. and kill YOUR PEOPLE????and no do not think our humiliaion was that one cartoon,,, and no do not say You turks own iran the bazaar the akhoonds ENOUGH... Why does our money have a poem that say PARS NEJAD??? Why does the depiction of Azaris in Iranian so called evolved modern cinema of the ME show us Azars as either thickly accented bazaris or poor servants or some construction worker agar kheyli lotf konin we are old pretty women in a goldar Chador with a thick accent... ENOUGH... and again your jokes.. yes and all of you have an ammeh or a friend who is Tork that taught you that joke... ENOUGH We are Iranian that oil in Khuzestan belongs to us Tehran is also ours that blood that was spilled during the war is also ours.. Yet please whenever you see us... Do tell us a Joke that humiliates us or do say TOHRKEEE? Or tell us how we are good cookes and have beautiful women,,, and refer to us as them.. or even better the comment you say so Jokingly Khoda shokr ke nashodim Tohrk..... WAKE UP YOU SEE THE RESPONSE IN THE POST ELECTION... ESLAH KONIN.. KHODETUNO EHTERAM BEZARIN BE MARDOMETUN VAGAR NA AHKHAR AGHABATESH KHUB NEMISHE... VA MA FEKR NAKONIN MIKHAYM JODA BESHIM JAHI BERIM .....VALI EIN GESEH SAR DERAZ DARAD... VA EMROOZ TOOYE IRAN NATIJEYE EIN KARARO MIBINI ROOZ BE ROOZ BAD TAR MISHE!!!!!Merci az ein cartoone Jalebet Agha Jahanshah
No brother, they will never ever never ever never ever never ever never ever GET IT . Because if they friiikin did, today we wouldn,t have nothing but an eggshell of the true Iran that once was left thanks to ajam bardeh mentality. No brothers, You get it & Pope gets it but for every one of you who do there are a thousand who dont GET IT . Get it?
As I said before, Azerbaijan is a fake country and don't forget that it belongs to Iran. Read the history, your logic reminds me of the saying "agar bh mehmoon roo bedee saahab khoneh raa beeron meekoneh". It is the right of talesh minority to speak in Persian because it is their land which is occupied by foreigner forces(Turks and Russians) for many years. Zameen mardoom raa meedozeed bad menat sareshon meezareed! Roo kh neest!
We can not use Switzerlan and canada as example for democracy in Iran. They have different culture, values and their population has a very different composition in compare to iran in term of ethnicity. Their land is not Arabzadeh, Turkzadeh and Mogolzadeh(attacked and infected by A,T,M). We need to develop a democracy in Iran which is appropriate for Iranian people and made by Iranians not by western nations! Get it.
"There are many in English speaking countries who don't appreciate
foreign tongues spoken on their streets and metro cars, and so forth".
If they don't like that we speak in our language in their countries then we should respect them and stop talking in our own language because we are their Guests. Don't forget that and behave like a good guest. It is very rude and impolite to talk in your own language when living in other people's land, of course if they don't like it!
"In many civilized countries, respect for others' rights to speak their mother tongues is considered a fundamental human right"
A civilized country can and will respect rights of other people if they enter that country in a civilized manner. Nobody respects the language of aggressors , rapists and criminals. Get it.
Actually, in Azerbaijan Republic, there is a large Russian speaking minority that is free to operate Russian schools, newspapers, television stations, etc. There is also a "Persian" speaking Talesh minority that is free to speak and educate in their dialect (similar to what we speak in Gilan). I find Iranian logic very interesting. If Iran lacks something we want, then we use as examples, places like Switzerland and Canada, to demand the same rights. When it comes to denying our fellow citizens rights we don't want them to have, then all of a sudden "two wrongs make a right" and we draw comparisons to places like Turkey and repressive Arab states. Finally, there's the issue of others' languages insulting your sensibilities. There are quite a few people in English speaking countries who don't appreciate foreign tongues spoken on their streets and metro cars, and so forth. Why don't we consider that point when we sit in Western cafes and speak in Farsi behind the backs of people only a few meters away, ones who have no idea they're being dissed. Your duplicity in demanding democracy for yourself while denying it to others is a good reason why Iran may still not be ready for individual rights. Successful democracy is not consistent with the tyranny of the majority. Get it? In many civilized countries, respect for others' rights to speak their mother tongues is considered a fundamental human right.
This is the title of the cartoon on the www.sozumuz.blogspot.com site. It means what it says, the issue has been politicized by the regime. The AhmadiNejad-esk guy symbolizes the IRI regime with his military colors and the weapons. Am I missing something?
My understanding is Azeris want to be able to publish and teach in their own language. If you have a problem with that, yet claim to advocate democracy, you don't know what you're advocating.
you said: " Hala yeh baar an Azari Turk made fun of Farsis. Chi shod? Betoon barkhord?... "
*First, turk* khodeti. Most of my familly are Azari, and they do NOT consider themselves turks*. Zanjeer'aa-ye jahanam paareh misheh if ever someone (moi ;-) calls them tork *.
**Second, telling jokes** to each other is different than promoting racism by publishing racist cartoons on an online magazine. Where is
your common sense?! Why don't you post some of those Danish anti-islam cartoons? Those cartoons too were just "an exaggeration of the truth in order to highlight a message". Hey, those cartoons can actually give a message to the islamic republic (or some other islamic countries) about its savage behavior, don't you think?!
***Third, personnaly, I have nothing against this cartoon.
Actually, I think it's great. All them azEris [(!) or whatever...] should keep out of Azarbaijan (and/or Iran) as shown in this cartoon. Mochaker az hammeehanaan-e aziz-e Azari who are doing a great job keeping them far away from Iran (& Azarbaijan).***
*The word "tork" was a derogatory term until the late 19th century, reffering to backwards anotolian nomads or peasants. The ottoman identified themselves as sunni muslims and ottoman, but NEVER as torks. In the late 19th century, as European ideas of nationalism were adopted by the ottoman elite, and anatolia's most loyal supporters of ottoman rule, the term "tork" took on a more positive connotation.[...] The ottomans defined communities on a religious basis, and a residue of this remains in that turkish villagers will commonly consider as torks ONLY those who profess the sunni faith, and will consider the rest of the religious minority to be non-turks. But Kurdish-speaking or arabic-speaking sunnis of eastern anatolia are often considered to be "turks". [...] In recent years, turkish politicians have attempted to redefine this category in a more multi-cultural way, emphasizing that a turk is anyone who is a citizen of the republic of turkey. -source Wikipedia
Also, according to some theologians the word "tork" came from "torquere" (torture); "There are no crueller and more audicious villains under the heavens than the Turks who spare no age or sex and
mercilessly cut down young and old alike and pluck unripe fruit from the wombs of mother"-Fabri of Vienna
The term "turk" acquired a meaning similar to "barbarian" or "heathen" in various European Languages , as evident from the following dictionary entries:
-Websters New Collegiate Dictionary: "one who is cruel or tyrannical"
-Concise Oxford Dictionary: "Ferocious, wild or unmanageable person."
-Random House Dictionary: "A cruel, brutal or domineering man"
**Joke: Within the turkish people, the name "tork" was(is) sometimes used to denote backwoodsmen, bumpkins, or the illiterate peasants in anatolia "Etrak-i bi-idrak", for example was an ottoman play on words, meaning: "stupid turk". -they started the joke (& still do themselves)
***Dameh Azari'aa (mostly bacheh haa-ye Ardebil) garm for shooting, and I mean literally shooting (firing), at azEris(!), whenever azEris(!) goh-e ziyaadi mikhoran. Now, you know why they, azEris(!) came up with this cartoon....
P.S. SamSam!!!!!!
This is made and posted by Bache Akhonds. Whatever, those
problems exist and need to be discussed. JJ, there is a big difference bet/ making fun of someone and insulting someone. I would love to ask JJ to go to the republic of Azarbaijan(The fake one) or to Turkey or even to the arab countries and ask the people and goverment of those countries for his right to speak and read in his native tongue(persian).Then I'd love to see what happens to JJ for asking for his rights in those arab-turkish countries!
Why not teaching to Arabs and Turks something about the rights of minorities living in their countries?Why always defending them and their rights in Iran?
You might ask Kurds in Turkey whether they have the basic human rights or the same rights as turkish people have in Turkey although Kurds are the real owners of that land.
Kurds are Iranians and they should have the right to speak and learn in their own language(in addition to the official language of Iran,"Persian") and practice their wonderful culture and norms.
Speaking in Arabic and Turkish in Iran is insulting Iranian people. You ask me why? My answer to you is; go and read the history and educate yourselves and know what Arabs and Turks did to us. We never had Arabs and turks in Iran and we never had such iranian ethnic groups in Iran.
How should I as Iranian understand this issue? Is Someone asking for the rights of those who invaded our country, who killed millions of us Iranians, raped our women, burned our cities, and destroyed our great civilization? Do they have the right to ask for their rights?Do Germans have the right to go to Israel and ask for their german rights? Do Turks have the right to go to Armenia and ask for their turkish right to speak in turkish?
Funnier than you think......
by Kaveh V on Mon Feb 15, 2010 12:07 PM PSTAs I read through the comments on this cartoon, I realize most have not realized the irony of it. Depicting a Persian as a brutal fanatic Islamist by a Turk is extreme irony, to put it quite mildly. The Turkic brutes have established themselves as the "scourge of god" by all the cultures and ethnicities that they have come in contact with. They have "Turkified" Persians for the last few centuries along with their Shii Islam. IRI is their's! The Arabs call IRI the Turkic Safavids! It is so entertaining to see the Turkic-Azari, neo-nationalism is such a fraud!
Also, what's up with the M-16 like rifle ?
Btw, they have always been free to speak their language, why do you think most have such thick accents ?
I don't like
by Anonymous Observer on Mon Feb 15, 2010 10:29 AM PSTthe ear fuzz of the Persian guy. As a "Persian" myself, I can tell you that my ears do NOT look that hairy!
And why does the Persian guy wearing German lederhosen?!!!
I'm Azari too
by sanazi on Mon Feb 15, 2010 10:24 AM PSTI'm Azari, and I'm proud to be Azari, an Iranian Azari that
is. And I don't approve of this cartoon either. I have to agree that this is a racist cartoon, and I'm surprised that it has been published on Iranian.com. Not only it discriminates Iranian people, but it also promotes separation; Iranian Azaris do not associate themselves with the Russian colors of the rep. of Azerbaijan or that of Turkey for that matter. We are not Turks. We are purely Iranians.
Nothing more, nothing less.
Btw, we speak Azari, not Turkish.
ps Pope, hala dige Azari nisti!
این بابا شباهت خاصی با ا.ن. داره این منو یاد یک جوک انداخت:
Mardom MazloomMon Feb 15, 2010 08:29 AM PST
لره به احمدی نژاد میگه: این قیافه خودته یا داری مسخره بازی در میاری؟؟
اونوخت ا.ن. میگه تو اصلا میدونی با کی طرفی؟ وقتی میبینه لره همینطور نگاهش میکنه براش میخونه:
بسی رنج بردم در این سال چار..... عجم رو بکردم همه تار و مار;
من آن کینه پرداز جنگ آورم........... چو بمب اتم به دست آورم;
نگوزم از این پس که من ریده ام..... کشیدم به گه کشور از ایده ام;
What root?
by choghok on Mon Feb 15, 2010 05:01 AM PSTThis "we" mentality should not be used to quash all the opposite thinkers. If a person wants to be Kurd or AzariTurk and speak his language it is his right within Iran. Exactly why would we try so hard to say that we have the same root? Do we need all to have the same root to be good countrymen?
It is like Iranians tend to marry within the family since they think it is good for the family. Well it is not true.It brings both genetic deseases and family problems.
Or religious people be extra nice if you have the same religion as they do, does it mean that you are a better man because you share the same religion?
We share a lot of history and culture and that is enough. we do not need to speak the same language everywhere or share any ethnic roots.
زبان آذربایجان آذریست و نه ترکی.
پیامMon Feb 15, 2010 02:37 AM PST
آذربایجان قسمتی از ایران است و ایران هم به نوبهٔ خود مجموی
از اقوام متفاوت با زبان‌ها و رسوم متفاوت هست. این تفاوت‌ها باعث قوت و
غنی بودن فرهنگ ماست و نه باعث پسرفت ما. در صورت داشتن آزادی‌های قومی
فرهنگ آذری ها، کرد ها، اعراب جنوب و ....، شکوفا تر از حال خواهند بود و
این به نفع تمام ایرانیان است.
بیایید و این تعصبات پوچ را که فقط باعث خوش حالی تجزیه طلبان هست
کنار بذاریم و به جای این که به همون بر بخورد، متفاوت بودن خود رو به
رسمیت بشناسیم و محترم بدونیم.
The armed man in the cartoon...
by IRANdokht on Mon Feb 15, 2010 01:05 AM PSTIt's not about Farsi and Azari, it's about ethnic groups and the central government. It's obvious that the non-Azari man in the cartoon has the guns.
This report is also about the subject of the cartoon which has nothing to do with racism or ethnic jokes:
//news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/8515588.stm
IRANdokht
Az mast ke bar mast!
by choghok on Sun Feb 14, 2010 11:33 PM PSTThe subject that this cartoon brings up is a serious one that is basic human rights, to be able to speak and study and use your mother tongue. But the way this problem is shown is very wrong and racist way. In most of Irans history since the Arab conquest of Iran, It has been ruled by Turkish tribes. All the way to the Pahlavi dynasty. Even today many of the top position in IRI is hold by Azaris like Ali yek dast.
Common people in say Isfahan or Rasht would not care if people in schools in Tabriz would learn Azari or that people would speak Kurdish in Sanandajs post office. It is the rulers who do not like it and as said the rulers in Iran are not from a specific race.
Goli jaan
by SamSamIIII on Sun Feb 14, 2010 11:05 PM PSTForget about Ghadesii khaliffes & Seljuk Sultanes who screwed us both & divided us as Kurds/Persians/Azaris/ etc..chon at the end of the day we all come from the same glorious Medeo-Persian heritage of Eran-shahr. Look past the artificial distortions & see how there is no "you" & "me" but "us" bonded & united under one flag and desended from the same Kiaani heritage. cheers ,Maenim staekli dustom;
Path of Kiaan Resurrection of True Iran Hoisting Drafshe Kaviaan //iranianidentity.blogspot.com //www.youtube.com/user/samsamsia
"چون ايران
GolinedairaniSun Feb 14, 2010 10:52 PM PST
"چون ايران
GolinedairaniSun Feb 14, 2010 10:45 PM PST
ما یک ملت متشکل از مناطق، مذاهب، فرهنگ ها و زبان های مختلف هستیم
MMSun Feb 14, 2010 10:43 PM PST
یکی از دوست های خوزستانی من میگف که در دبیرستان یکی از معلم هاش میگفت (با لهجه ترکی بخوانید)
آا، بیبینید دونیا بی کوجا ریسیدی. بندیی توک، بی شوما عربا، با زبانی فارسی, اینجیلیسی یاد میدم.
The fact is that Iran, as many other countries in the region, consist of many different ethnicities and languages. My Kurdish friend once told me that even within Kurds, they have three different dialects! So, we are not unique in this dilemma
In India, they have 18 unique languages, with probably hundreds of local dialects. Their solution was to adopt English as the one language to communicate within the country since the Tamils would not even consider learning nor speaking Hindi, but love their spoken Tamil
I am not pushing English into the system, but saying that for the sake of unity, there should be one common language spoken, while the localities should be encouraged to practice and teach their local language to their own folks. That means that if Mammad agha and his Kurdish family gets transferred to the Azerbaijan province because of a government job, his kids should have the option to opt out of learning Azeri in the school system that has a primary common language with the rest of the country
As far as jokes, you know that while African-Americans use the "N" word while speaking in the hood, if someone else (a white) uses it, it is a racist comment. So, choose your words and the place to say it carefully
PS, I am a member of minority as well
golinedairani jan
by HollyUSA on Sun Feb 14, 2010 10:28 PM PST'khune ma 4 sal pish rikhteh shodeh' ....
Actually khuneh oonha kheyli kheyli saale keh rikhteh shodeh. I personally know of Azeri individuals (and highly educated ones at that who would have been great assets to Iran) whose blood was shed as far back as over 50 years ago in their fight for freedom in Iran. And the history of this 'sarkoob' goes back much further than that even. There are many facts that are conveniently forgotten by some.
Beghole yeh khoda biamorzi ba'zee ha shalvareh k**neshoon keh 2 ta mishe yadeshoon mireh kiyan o chiyan. That's what we're dealing with today.
Iran as a whole is held hostage by one group of savages and another group can't wait to continue the same BS under a different guise. Sad. Really really sad.
!!!!
by Sohraby on Sun Feb 14, 2010 10:21 PM PST"Everyone is asking where is Tabriz where is Azarbaijan in the post
election movement, we are green but where was the rest of Iran when we
were killed post cockroach cartoon?"
That wasn't a Movement for freedom, it was ethnically motivated and it could happen to any other ethnicity. But they have chosen you Azaries for a good reason.
The idea behind the publishing of c-cartoon was to divide us and they did very well on that. I have to admit that IRR did a very good job in choosing you Azaris since you were an easy pray for them. It would not work on Kurds, Parsies, Lors etc. because they know the Mullahs very well! The newspaper which published the cartoon belongs to IRR and the leader of IRR is Ali geda Khamanie an Azari himslef and the cartoonist was from Azai origin too. So, use your brain and think for a moment, why in a country that insulting its supreme leader is a big crime and one can get executed for that, so easily and so freely a cartoonist with no fear publishes such a cartoon "knowing that Khamanie is from Azarbaijan"? Any answer to this Question? Didn't you smell the rat when it was published? I did.
No answer to other shero ver! Just to remind you that Iran was ruled in the last 1400 years by Arabs, Turks, and Mongols(all non-iranians) with the exception of Zand dynasty and Pahlavies which lasted only 90 years and they brought prosperity and peace to Iran and Iranians. What Reza shah did in regard of language was intended to help you finding your iranian way of living, he just used the wrong method. Education is always the best way to teach people to do the right thing, Amen.
@JJ Read this
by spatima on Sun Feb 14, 2010 10:18 PM PSTI kind of feel really bad for donating my student OSAP loan to this website few weeks ago.
You conciously put this peice of racism here to make a point???and your e justification is because Persians crack up Turkish jokes?
"Hala yeh baar an Azari Turk made fun of Farsis. Chi shod? Betoon
barkhord? Khoonetoon joosh oomad? Beh namoosetoon tajaavoz shod?"
Migam ye jurhayi adam fekr mikoneh shoma darin hal mikonin ke be Parsha bar khorde. Maloome ke bar mikhore. Haminjoori ke Jokhaye turki maskhare va ahmagheneh hastan, khob een ham hamintoor. Vali adame balegh ke hate ro ba hate javab nemideh. Bardashti eeno gozashti bad miporsi khoonetoon joosh omad? akheh in eham shod estedlal marde hesabi.
[b] even in Islamic Republic (which is one of the worst types of authoritarian rule to ever preside over our country) when Iran news paper made a joke against our fellow Azeris, the government shut down the newspaper. In Iranian.com appreantly same type of racist behavior appreantly not only gets published but justified as well!!!! Marde hesabi kojaye donya yek melato be onvane yek mosht choopan neshoon dadan kare dorostiye.
Ey khak bar sare man ke poole darsamo be adamhayi mesle to midam.
[/b]
In hope of a Free, Independent and Secular Iran
Hamsade jan
by HollyUSA on Mon Feb 15, 2010 05:04 PM PSTI wasn't angry at you, not at all. Sorry if it came across that way. And I certainly don't think you're one of the facists, however, I have heard enough of 'Azeris who want their language taught in their schools etc. are separatist' BS from them that I do feel it is sometimes necessary to emphasize that we do see ourselves as IRANIAN first and foremost. Reading your comment it seemed to me that you may not fully realize our prioirties.
Sorry again if my comment came across as hostile toward you. I don't need to read again to know where u stand on this :)
Cheers.
golineda
by hamsade ghadimi on Sun Feb 14, 2010 09:54 PM PSTi'm all for an open discussion. and also the azaris who commented seem not to have any problem with the comment left by their fellow azari, caramel, below. it just may be there is a wide spectrum of beliefs within the azari community itself. lastly, i would've been at a loss if you had commented in azari; it's a good thing that you can also speak my language (referring to the farsi that you used).
"چون ايران
GolinedairaniSun Feb 14, 2010 09:34 PM PST
golineda irani
by hamsade ghadimi on Sun Feb 14, 2010 09:26 PM PSTmy experience is limited to many azari friends that i have had. i did not mean to make the statement for all azaris. i was making a comparison between sentiment of iranian azaris toward azarbaijanis (the country) and iranians. i'm sorry if i offended you. and i'm sure no matter which way i say it, someone will get offended. i should be more careful in stating that this is my experience.
Minority official language acts
by Ari Siletz on Sun Feb 14, 2010 09:20 PM PSTOfficial minority language acts allow minority speakers to use their language in legal settings--such as courts, road signs etc.--in designated regions of a country.
Here's the Welsh-English example of what such an act looks like. New Zealand also has a similar act with respect to the Maori language. Also see European Charter for Regional and Minority Languages (ECRML). The charter is meant to protect these languages.
The idea may or not work for Iran in its current mess, but for a stable democratic Iran an Azeri-Farsi act seems quite feasible and has successful precedents in the world.
hollyusa, much ado about nothing
by hamsade ghadimi on Sun Feb 14, 2010 09:19 PM PSTi don't understand your anger to my statement "my azari friends are proud of their language and heritage and also proud to be iranian." i did not mean any significance by the order of pride in azari and iranian. you seemed to be ticked off by the order and/or the use of word 'also', it seems. definition of 'also': in the same manner, likewise, besides, as well. and i am a propoent of all ethnicities to have all the facilities to use their language, and practice their traditions. definition of facility: ease in moving, acting, doing. you may want to read my post again. i think that your anger is misplaced. i even had to ask my friend who is a professor in english regarding the useage of word 'also' when enumerating qualities in a sentence and she didn't think that the quality that was quaified with also means that is less significant.
i'm not an expert in quantifying and comparing someone's ethnicity to their nationality. it would be silly to say that you're a woman first, then an iranian or vice versa, or for that matter any other quality. have i beat this horse to death yet?
and please don't tell me that you've been attacked by so many fascist "parsis" (as you put it) that you thought i'm one of them. have a nice day.
Hamsade Ghadim
by Golinedairani on Sun Feb 14, 2010 08:56 PM PSTYashasin Azarbaijan Janim Azarbaijan
by Golinedairani on Sun Feb 14, 2010 08:42 PM PSTDear Sam
by Sohraby on Sun Feb 14, 2010 07:47 PM PSTVery true, I got it.
Dear Sohrabi & Dear Pope
by SamSamIIII on Sun Feb 14, 2010 07:29 PM PSTRe;
"............................... Get it "
No brother, they will never ever never ever never ever never ever never ever GET IT . Because if they friiikin did, today we wouldn,t have nothing but an eggshell of the true Iran that once was left thanks to ajam bardeh mentality. No brothers, You get it & Pope gets it but for every one of you who do there are a thousand who dont GET IT . Get it?
Cheers!!!
Path of Kiaan Resurrection of True Iran Hoisting Drafshe Kaviaan //iranianidentity.blogspot.com //www.youtube.com/user/samsamsia
zakarazi's Remarks
by Sohraby on Sun Feb 14, 2010 07:23 PM PSTAs I said before, Azerbaijan is a fake country and don't forget that it belongs to Iran. Read the history, your logic reminds me of the saying "agar bh mehmoon roo bedee saahab khoneh raa beeron meekoneh". It is the right of talesh minority to speak in Persian because it is their land which is occupied by foreigner forces(Turks and Russians) for many years. Zameen mardoom raa meedozeed bad menat sareshon meezareed! Roo kh neest!
We can not use Switzerlan and canada as example for democracy in Iran. They have different culture, values and their population has a very different composition in compare to iran in term of ethnicity. Their land is not Arabzadeh, Turkzadeh and Mogolzadeh(attacked and infected by A,T,M). We need to develop a democracy in Iran which is appropriate for Iranian people and made by Iranians not by western nations! Get it.
"There are many in English speaking countries who don't appreciate
foreign tongues spoken on their streets and metro cars, and so forth".
If they don't like that we speak in our language in their countries then we should respect them and stop talking in our own language because we are their Guests. Don't forget that and behave like a good guest. It is very rude and impolite to talk in your own language when living in other people's land, of course if they don't like it!
"In many civilized countries, respect for others' rights to speak their mother tongues is considered a fundamental human right"
A civilized country can and will respect rights of other people if they enter that country in a civilized manner. Nobody respects the language of aggressors , rapists and criminals. Get it.
Sohraby's Remarks
by zakarazi on Sun Feb 14, 2010 06:36 PM PSTActually, in Azerbaijan Republic, there is a large Russian speaking minority that is free to operate Russian schools, newspapers, television stations, etc. There is also a "Persian" speaking Talesh minority that is free to speak and educate in their dialect (similar to what we speak in Gilan). I find Iranian logic very interesting. If Iran lacks something we want, then we use as examples, places like Switzerland and Canada, to demand the same rights. When it comes to denying our fellow citizens rights we don't want them to have, then all of a sudden "two wrongs make a right" and we draw comparisons to places like Turkey and repressive Arab states. Finally, there's the issue of others' languages insulting your sensibilities. There are quite a few people in English speaking countries who don't appreciate foreign tongues spoken on their streets and metro cars, and so forth. Why don't we consider that point when we sit in Western cafes and speak in Farsi behind the backs of people only a few meters away, ones who have no idea they're being dissed. Your duplicity in demanding democracy for yourself while denying it to others is a good reason why Iran may still not be ready for individual rights. Successful democracy is not consistent with the tyranny of the majority. Get it? In many civilized countries, respect for others' rights to speak their mother tongues is considered a fundamental human right.
سياسي شدن زبان تركي
bachenavvabSun Feb 14, 2010 04:59 PM PST
This is the title of the cartoon on the www.sozumuz.blogspot.com site. It means what it says, the issue has been politicized by the regime. The AhmadiNejad-esk guy symbolizes the IRI regime with his military colors and the weapons. Am I missing something?
My understanding is Azeris want to be able to publish and teach in their own language. If you have a problem with that, yet claim to advocate democracy, you don't know what you're advocating.
...
by ThePope on Sun Feb 14, 2010 04:32 PM PSTJJj,
you said: " Hala yeh baar an Azari Turk made fun of Farsis. Chi shod? Betoon barkhord?... "
*First, turk* khodeti. Most of my familly are Azari, and they do NOT consider themselves turks*. Zanjeer'aa-ye jahanam paareh misheh if ever someone (moi ;-) calls them tork *.
**Second, telling jokes** to each other is different than promoting racism by publishing racist cartoons on an online magazine. Where is
your common sense?! Why don't you post some of those Danish anti-islam cartoons? Those cartoons too were just "an exaggeration of the truth in order to highlight a message". Hey, those cartoons can actually give a message to the islamic republic (or some other islamic countries) about its savage behavior, don't you think?!
***Third, personnaly, I have nothing against this cartoon.
Actually, I think it's great. All them azEris [(!) or whatever...] should keep out of Azarbaijan (and/or Iran) as shown in this cartoon. Mochaker az hammeehanaan-e aziz-e Azari who are doing a great job keeping them far away from Iran (& Azarbaijan).***
*The word "tork" was a derogatory term until the late 19th century, reffering to backwards anotolian nomads or peasants. The ottoman identified themselves as sunni muslims and ottoman, but NEVER as torks. In the late 19th century, as European ideas of nationalism were adopted by the ottoman elite, and anatolia's most loyal supporters of ottoman rule, the term "tork" took on a more positive connotation.[...] The ottomans defined communities on a religious basis, and a residue of this remains in that turkish villagers will commonly consider as torks ONLY those who profess the sunni faith, and will consider the rest of the religious minority to be non-turks. But Kurdish-speaking or arabic-speaking sunnis of eastern anatolia are often considered to be "turks". [...] In recent years, turkish politicians have attempted to redefine this category in a more multi-cultural way, emphasizing that a turk is anyone who is a citizen of the republic of turkey. -source Wikipedia
Also, according to some theologians the word "tork" came from "torquere" (torture); "There are no crueller and more audicious villains under the heavens than the Turks who spare no age or sex and
mercilessly cut down young and old alike and pluck unripe fruit from the wombs of mother" -Fabri of Vienna
The term "turk" acquired a meaning similar to "barbarian" or "heathen" in various European Languages , as evident from the following dictionary entries:
-Websters New Collegiate Dictionary: "one who is cruel or tyrannical"
-Concise Oxford Dictionary: "Ferocious, wild or unmanageable person."
-Random House Dictionary: "A cruel, brutal or domineering man"
**Joke: Within the turkish people, the name "tork" was(is) sometimes used to denote backwoodsmen, bumpkins, or the illiterate peasants in anatolia "Etrak-i bi-idrak", for example was an ottoman play on words, meaning: "stupid turk". -they started the joke (& still do themselves)
***Dameh Azari'aa (mostly bacheh haa-ye Ardebil) garm for shooting, and I mean literally shooting (firing), at azEris(!), whenever azEris(!) goh-e ziyaadi mikhoran. Now, you know why they, azEris(!) came up with this cartoon....
P.S. SamSam!!!!!!
This is made and posted by Bache Akhonds. Whatever, those
by Sohraby on Sun Feb 14, 2010 08:50 PM PSTproblems exist and need to be discussed. JJ, there is a big difference bet/ making fun of someone and insulting someone. I would love to ask JJ to go to the republic of Azarbaijan(The fake one) or to Turkey or even to the arab countries and ask the people and goverment of those countries for his right to speak and read in his native tongue(persian).Then I'd love to see what happens to JJ for asking for his rights in those arab-turkish countries!
Why not teaching to Arabs and Turks something about the rights of minorities living in their countries?Why always defending them and their rights in Iran?
You might ask Kurds in Turkey whether they have the basic human rights or the same rights as turkish people have in Turkey although Kurds are the real owners of that land.
Kurds are Iranians and they should have the right to speak and learn in their own language(in addition to the official language of Iran,"Persian") and practice their wonderful culture and norms.
Speaking in Arabic and Turkish in Iran is insulting Iranian people. You ask me why? My answer to you is; go and read the history and educate yourselves and know what Arabs and Turks did to us. We never had Arabs and turks in Iran and we never had such iranian ethnic groups in Iran.
How should I as Iranian understand this issue? Is Someone asking for the rights of those who invaded our country, who killed millions of us Iranians, raped our women, burned our cities, and destroyed our great civilization? Do they have the right to ask for their rights?Do Germans have the right to go to Israel and ask for their german rights? Do Turks have the right to go to Armenia and ask for their turkish right to speak in turkish?