Bavafa

I gave you 2 solid examples of your betrayal of Iranians

Refute them if you wish. Yes like I said opinions when supported & acted upon if they undermine Iranians freedom are treason.  Not just the opinion mind you, the active pursuit of the opinion.  Re: Shah, I disagree with opinions that people give regarding shah's mistakes, x was a mistake or y was a mistake or z was a mistake. Did he make mistakes, yes he did, we all do, it is to be human, but I disagree with the common lists of mistakes many attribute to him.  Those are opinions too and mostly pursuing them does not reduce iranians freedom, but enhances it, gives room for debate and does not tarnish a character. 

Don't speak for me or put words in my mouth

VPK says it is just a difference of opinion that he has, as if people that committ treason don't have a difference of opinion, but doesn't want to explain that that opinion is treason.

I don't need APFSM to speak for me. I will speak for myself when I want to. Frankly I do not have the time or interest to debate with this person. So if anyone wants to know what I think ask me. As for debating this person it is a waste of my time.

Furthermore I find his shameless attacks on me more than disgusting. By his standards difference of opinion is treason! He is unwilling to admit the Shah made a single mistake. 

APFSM: If you call me traitor once again I will be filing a complaint with the admin. I have not done anything to "betray" Iran. Bring up some proof of what you say or apologize. Knowing you neither is going to happen proving you don't have any. You are mentally ill if you think I am a traitor. Go and find someone else to play with. I am not interested in you. I don't want to hear from you. I don't want to debate you. It is people like you who ruin a blog an turn it into a hate fest. 

What is Treason Guys and Gals?

Not a disagreement alone, people are free to have views.  Treason occurs when ones views and actions are a breach of faith in violation of an allegiance towards the freedom of fellow Iranians.  So if the views are against Iranian Freedom this is treason, yes treasonous people have a disagreement of views with the average Iranian that do not serve Iranians.  We all know the mullahs seeking religion in government and those that support them are guilty of treachury, they are not expanding nor defending Iranians Freedom, the way the late shah did. 

VPK says it is just a difference of opinion that he has, as if people that committ treason don't have a difference of opinion, but doesn't want to explain that that opinion is treason.  Those that believed that Religion in Government was Irans solution helped the USA steal our freedom that our parents enjoyed during the good old times, those that are in support of the US govt which brought these mullahs to power, actively helped murder Irans democrats and has helped the mullahs hold power are infact also guilty of treason like the exremists in power today because they betray Irans Freedom like the mullahs.  Wishing an alliance with a power that is currently oppressing the entire region, a USA that has no reason to change its policy at all nor will it, betrayed the late shah and iranians, has helped the mullahs retain power in order to supress Iranians freedom, goes against reason and is treason.  You are free to explain otherwise.

Dear Iraj, jews are not our enemy, arabs are

Dear friend,

You have been brainwashed by stinky ruling mullahs in Iran. No jews ever harm any Iranians. If any jew ever hurt any Iranians I would be the first person who would have stand next to you figthing with them. For example, arabs killed 2 of my best childhood friend in their invasion to Iran. I can't forget and forgive them. In fact our king the cyrus the great helped them.

     Historically, Jews and blacks had been oppressed and discriminated and beaten up. One of my friend whose father is German told me that his father was witnessing one German beaten up one jew to death in downtown Frankfort back in 50's just because he was jew. Poor guy never hurt anyone.  It is not humanity you harbor the hate in your heart against jews. I wish I was in a position that I could invite all jews to migrate to Iran and stay in our country as long as they want and forget living anywhere else. This is human way of looking at events and I am expecting you do the same.

Sincerely,

Siavash 

Friendly advise for Veiled prophet of khorasan

Dear friend,  

  Please consider many of these folks you get into long discussion are at their old age when they are suffering from brain cell damage or  they are forgetfull. This is not intended to be insult. I am trying to pinpoint the fact of life. The mood of these people thinking is concret or rather rigid with no flexibility and proper judgement. The rigidity of their thinking reflects in  their views which blind their social judgement. That goes to the extend that they become partner of stinky mullahs agents on this site and they naively repeat whatever mullahs agents are saying.

   This is just friendly reminder for you.

Sincerely,

Siavash 

Khata?

No Persian :-) 

VPK aziz: گر دانی و پرسی‌، سوالت خطاست!

I knew we weren't going to get any where on this :)

With that said, have a great day.

'Hambastegi' is the main key to victory 

Mehrdad

One more thing

If the Pals were to take my advise they would have not taken any sides. My approach is to have as many friends as possible. Not take sides when you don't need to. Why make enemies for no reason?

Pals did a very stupid thing I never would. Both Iran and Iraq were their backers. They should have been mediating a peace. Nobody with sense will watch their backers tear each other. Only an idiot will join in the slaughter. Plas are idiots.

No Mehrdad

it was not you know it as well as anyone but Pals are sacred cows. The reason was "Arab Brotherhood". In other words because of racism. However Pals supporters never admit it. Because that isn't a talking point.

Hey I am glad to let it go just don't want to put my support behind them. I don't have a grudge or anything. But I will absolutely not give one second of my time to waste over thier problem.

VPK: "I asked why did the Pals support Iraq"....

Could it be that they were following your type of advice and wanting to be on the side of powerful to be golden?  After all, Saddam had all they powerful nations behind him.   Of course, I would hope you know I am being partially sarcastic about this. 

But I know it was wrong of them to support a dictator which was also an initiator/aggressor in an illegal war. 

As I said, for me let bygones be bygones, let’s move on but learn from it.

'Hambastegi' is the main key to victory 

Mehrdad

Mehrdad

Argument of "afraid of coup" is not given by hostage takers as a reason. Besides if they really worried why not close the embassy and ask them to go back to America. That is the civilized way to go about it. 

Actually I don't ask how you or I see it. The point was how Americans saw it. You asked why did they support Iraq. I gave you the obvious reason. I asked why did the Pals support Iraq. Never got any response from anyone.

VPK: When one has an inherent bias….

He/she will look for every possible excuse to justify the action.

One response to your justification would be that US started that war some 30 years earlier when it participated in overthrowing the Iranian government (to put it mildly).  They can also justify that the hostages were a collateral just to prevent yet another coup.

How I look it all, you might ask?!?!?!
Let bygones be bygones and let us learn from it but move on.

'Hambastegi' is the main key to victory 

Mehrdad

What would any nation

have done if their embassy and citizens were attacked (right or wrong) and the representative of the perpetarators of these acts went on TV day and night and ranted "marg bar aamrika"?

I doubt that anyone would be handing out noghl-o nabaat. They would do everything in their power to undermine them. As was the case.

It is your right to be passionate about whatever you have strong feelings about. It is the right recongnized by some and ignored by many others. All I'm saying is that the regime in power now uses this sensitive soft spot (whatever the reason) to its advantage and that, my friend, is the very reason not to fall for it.

Pals and USA

When you cite Palestinian involvement in backing Saddam, do you also
treat other nations (i.e. US and its allies) who had far greater role
in that war and have far greater blood of Iranians then Palestinians.

The big difference is that IRI occupied the American embassy; took diplomats hostage. It is an act of war. Therefore what do you expect the Americans to do? But the IRI bent over backwards for the Pals. Yet they sided with Saddam.

For the record I opposed any American help to Saddam. Just pointing out their reasons to kick IRI. This Pal obsession has nothing to do with justice. If people were really worried about justice they would show great passion for other injustices.

Dear COP: I know your position and respect it….

The question is if some of you can respect my position?

Consider this:

•  This blog has nothing to do with Palestinians and Jews but the hypocrisy of International community.  Now I suspect since it involves Israelis as the golden child, some try to related this to the Palestinians issue. I like to know gooz be shaghighe che kar dareh?

• I raise my voice far greater times about the crimes of IRI against Iranians than the Palestinian-Israeli issue, all the while some who think they are the champion of anti-IRI fight are so often mute and absent of any words, but like an ambulance chaser just follow posts to see who has written anything about US or Israel just to have their say which is nothing but empty rhetoric.

• When you cite Palestinian involvement in backing Saddam, do you also treat other nations (i.e. US and its allies) who had far greater role in that war and have far greater blood of Iranians then Palestinians.

• Lastly, you ought to realize that I never advocate Iranian NATION role in that conflict only my own as a human being.  I hardly think my advocacy for a just and fair solution would have any negative impact on how Iran and Iranians are treated.

'Hambastegi' is the main key to victory 

Mehrdad

Dear COP

Otherwise, We are just clouding the existing issues that plauge us as a nation.

Which is exactly the purpose served by the IRI and its rotten ilk and their never-ending obsession with the Palestine-Israel issue. so that the number of worthless Arab states can be increased from 22 to 23 (give or take). Regards.

COP I agree

Yes COP you are right. I have asked the same question with no response. What about the other trouble spots in the world. How about my own home stolen by the Mollah. Now let us include the reality that siding with Pals may cost Iran a lot. Why should we pay for supporting them? Maybe if it was at no cost to us but the cost is rather high. Plus as you said Pals hate us as demonstrated by their actions. We got to be insane to side with them and make a mortal enemy for Iran. 

Imagine if Pals had "won:. And was no Israel in 1990. Saddam would have had a nuclear bomb and supported by "nation of Palestine". Is that what my dear friend means by victory? No thanks I don't want it. F*** the pals. F*** pan Islamism.

Mehrdad

You know where I stand with this israel/palestine issue.

For many it is a religious issue: Jews vs muslims - Are you religious? I didn't think so. I know you refer to human decency (or lack there of) when confronted about your obessesion with the Israeli issue, but as I have noted many times, IT IS NONE of OUR friggin' business AT THIS POINT IN TIME.

If and when we establish a just system of government that cares about the Iranian people and Iran's prosperity, then may be we should involve ourselves with the Pals and Jews conflic. Its about having other fish to fry.  

All this is against the backdrop and consideration that the Pals sided with that prick Saddam when he was raining scuds all over our beloved motherland.

Otherwise, We are just clouding the existing issues that plauge us as a nation. Don't fall for it.

Up until before Carter, the US record was different to be fair

Since Carter/Reagan the USA has been a terrible enemy for Iranians who seek freedom and secular democracy, the pro-usa crowd of today are traitors, so don't worrry your not alone.  The US actions were not an evil menace towards Iranians and middle easterners until Carters team and all the following Presidents and studying the roots of what the USA has been doing and why, as a result of it becoming an unchained capitalist country I pity those that are unaware of their treason and not because of their idea's, views at all, but the real enemy the USA is being in imposing extremists on Iran to harm and Africanize Iran.

VPK Your twisting the truth is enraging, post I wrote is for all

to make up their own mind. 

Your post is filled with hypocrisies. 

1) "We are either going to have tolerance and cooperation including with Israel and West or nothing."  Hmmmm isn't that a "dictate"?  Isn't that "intolerance" too of those that have a different view than you, even after they provide evidence to back up the real policies that are being are deploying by the west on iranians today in support of extremism? What do you call accusing someone of something you yourself are doing?

2)You are painting an inaccurate picture of me because you don't like the truths that I am pointing to. I am not bringing up false blame or blind hate, but honest outrage at the US pursuit of deceit, manipulation and neocolonialism, which guess what, isn't going to change for the reasons explained below.

3) Guess what?  Others will slowly start to figure out what the USA is doing and since you are self proclaimed in support of the west/US govt. that leaves it open to each person to really reflect on whether your view is a betrayal of Iranians = treason or in Iranians service. 

4) "I reject the idea that disagreement is the same as treason." Good me too, that is why I specifically made clear it is not because you agree or you disagree with me. It is because you are in support of a power that is harming iranians using neocolonialism and imposing extremism.  Others will read my post below.

5) "Intolerant of dissent"  Hmmmm on a National level when the USSR was in conflict with the USA, wasn't it clear that being pro-USSR was treason, giving aid to the enemy?  You forget, Iranians never declared the USA the enemy, it was the USA which took the first blow by betrayal of the late shah, the neutralization of the countries military and backing of extremists that have ever since suppressed and enslaved Iranians.  I have not made the USA Irans enemy, the USA all by themselves through their actions in support of extremists have done it. Today Iranians are being cut down by USA supported mullahs and your view is the USA is okay"  sorry at this level it is treason, not due to the disagreeing, but due to the USA's actions and your support of it.

The version of Freedom listed below that was stolen from Iranians in 1979 was far better than mullahs and bringing, peace, prosperity and improving human rights for Iranians. Dissent and free press were better than today. Few will listen to your "dictates" about what I said. And are thankfully more likely to read my comments for themselves, traitor.

I reject APFSM

I voiced some disagreements to APFSM on this thread. In response he posts a long post and accuses me of being "traitor". Why: because I don't follow his dictates.  Just to help me he actually boldens his own statements. 

In response I reject APFSM; his ideas and his accusations. I reject the idea that disagreement is the same as treason. This is what IRI; MEK and Shah did. In all instances were and are intolerant of dissent. The only difference is the Mollahs waited to take power before showing their real nature. It is easy to write about freedom but what are we taking about. If not hating USA means being a traitor are we all required to hate America? How is that different from now.

I have voiced my doubts over authenticity of APFSM before. I think APFSM is out to discredit Reza Pahlavi by alienating diaspora. Through ridiculous accusations and personal attacks. If I am wrong then RP would do well to publically reject people like APFSM.

If this version of "freedom" wins then God help us. We are right back to IRI or worse. You might as well forget about dissent and free press. 

Plus do we really want another West hating trouble seeking ideology? Did we learn nothing from 33 years? I guess some people did not.

Take your hate and your intolerance with you. We are either going to have tolerance and cooperation including with Israel and West or nothing. 

VPK Your Ignorance is a 3 edged sword, bad for You, USA and Iran

Please don't misunderstand me I'm not ordering you, you have free will and are free to express it, being free though doesn't make you any less a traitor in my perception than the mullahs of Iran and you are both free to disagree completely with me, even make a case for why you may feel I may be a traitor in your perception and I too have every right to express why I feel you both are. Also don't confuse me with others who say all traitors must be shot, I don't believe in executions and though I see you and our mullahs in the same light, unless you killed or ordered to kill you shouldn't even be questioned.  I can appreciate that traitors are usually manipulated by people who are trained to manipulate intellectuals and peoples ignorance or lack of suspicion in questioning leads them into traps, so I don't see being a traitor as a crime per se, freedom of thought and expression which I see as essential requires this view, though if one participates in actions that diminish anothers freedom severly and beyond thought and expression, like physically killing or ordering it then this is unacceptable and should be punished by a court.

You said "It is possible to be a patriotic Iranian and not hate the USA."  I don't agree with that if you mean US govt.  If you said US people I would agree with you, however by clarifying that you meant the US Govt, I disagree." This Requires an explanation, because understanding this is necessary both for sell outs and patriots alike. I don't use traitor lightly, it is reserved for those who support groups that undermine the freedom of Iranians, like you and extremist anti-secular mullahs.

Explanation.  Why being pro USA govt makes one an Iranian Traitor.

The Goal of the USA govt for the last 40 years since 1970's is to support Anti-Secular Extremists across the middle east and north africa and bring them to power over time using various techniques.  The USA uses US funded and organized popular movements "which are fake pro-democracy and fake pro-freedom movements" "the west, USA/France/UK/Israel first use propaganda to maufacture discontent, however unbeknown to their prey they have no real agenda to use these popular movements to bring either greater democracy or freedom"  This is why they are fake movements or mass manipulations intended to produce grave harm to the societies they unleash this tactic on. 

This leaves the governments of smaller countries no good options to respond to this, some have tried to use their militaries to defend against the wests agendas, which as I explained is to sell one thing and deliver another ie to bring extremists to power they can manage.  When the USA & allies can't over throw the governments and bring to power their destructive radicals the anti-secular extremists because they are confronting them with the military, as easily as it did in the 1970's Iran, then in those countries the USA achieves the exact same goal through going to war with those countries. Recent Examples Iraq, Afghanistan & Libya all in the hands of extremists eventually prove this point sufficiently for any rational person.  As you can see the situation for the people will be far from what was the peoples goal was and what was promised to get all the people moving.  Iranians can relate to this as this tactic was used on them.

What the USA opposes for these north african and middle eastern people, Iranians included.

The Possibilty to enhance their lives, the most basic freedom, to have work that pays and a growing economy.  Instead their governments are weakened by ignorant peope that should be flipping burgers and making soups.  Their economes stagnate and you say you support this American govt.

The possibility to Change, having access to quality education, with opportunity and development, like during the shahs time. After trying many times to kill the shah, because he opposed USA interference into Irans development and banking, the US govt finally had to unleash the gullibles to do their work searching for this fake democracy or democracy the USA had no intention of allowing Iranians to realize  The USA wants these extremists to suppress iranians freedom to change, which they do very well and force people at the terror of death to be controlled or crushed.And this USA govt you support.

The possibility to defend their freedom and character, look at the shahs time look at today and how the west is doing everything they can to only allow the extremist mullahs they selected and their gangs to have ongoing control, their courts are a joke, even the likelyhood of change of the IRI at first was set up to be mousavi and khatami crowd, now their options are limited to mek etc . and this is the USA govt you support

The ability to create value and appreciate what they are creating, by having a totally weak and corrupted society that works on bribes in bringing mullahs the us goal is to despoil iran, not allow people to create a multi-dimensional complex prosperous economy.  That the shah was succeeding in this realm, like japan before, to the point where Iran would have had the best social support system in the 80's, this is why they brought mullahs, to stop this one too... and this is the west that you support.

The ability to have daily choices free of manipulation, free school for all, learn what you want, chose your own field, dress how you want, live as you want, all were getting better during shahs time as we all know, yet the USA supports extremsts and makes the people think on some level tht they created this.  This is the USA govt you support

the abilty to be able to pause and reflect on their choices, when peoples standard of living is as it is in Iran today where people work 60hrs plus tostay poor there is no time to pause, there is just famin, drugs to reduce the pain and poverty, this is why the USA wants extremists in power, not a leadership that was creatig the largest middle class growth in the world at the time, something that would have taken another 20 years to balance out, yet the progress was happening and halten intentionally.  This is the USA you support, that wants extremiss for their incompetance.

the ability to transcend and make new choices what we all had, what we have ad what the usa wants for us. yes the US govt you support

So why is poverty, injustice, backwardness and general tyranny and dictatorship at the very heart of what the USA wants.  Why the USA opposes Freedom for these countries and Uses Islamic Extremism as a tool to achieve its aims.  Usually by first promoting the ideal of democracy, only having in mind and in its plans fake democracy or in reality dictatorship and tyranny to the maximum with absolutely no hope of change because the USA is also helping keep them in place after wards??????????

To get this answer you would have to read a book, can you do that? The Universities of Harvard, Milan, Oxford etc, where given funds to prepare a study for the west called "Limit TO Growth" they came up with new scientific formulas as to what was the limiting factors to the growth of their economies and their future freedom.  Sadly this idea of promoting democracy, installing theocratic dictatorships, regressing certain countries was based on their scientific findings on the importance of oil, copper and natural gas in particular.  So Iran could give up all ts oil, copper and gas to the west for free and would still not be rid of the problem, because due to this finding they decided that certain countries for the next several hundred years need to be suppressed so badly that eventually they will be Africanized and incapable of even being able to educate their people.  Well the mullah have so far performed a fantastic job to that end and US policy on this subject won't change one inch as you will realize if you read the book.  The Club of Rome as they are called became the basis for creating Khomeini as a Ghandi and the late shah as a dictator and monster. Looking at many peoples comments, they are so stupid frankly my view of you that they lack the wisdom to even have any idea how badly manipulated they are.  The anti-secular mullahs are just one problem we face as Iranians, the other is the likes of you.  Yes people that would like a little respect for their opinions, yet they have no clue how foolish they are.  I don't respect the opinions of the US govt and co, the antisecular mullahs, childmolestors, or you. Respect for me is gained and earned through what you give, and frankly what you are thinking and therefore giving is what I expect from a traitor not a patriotic Iranian, And I'll also add that I don't support the actions of the US govt, extremists, child molestor or you.

At this point in Iranians history I would add that a traitor is also someone that propogates lies that serve the west neocolonial aims or the USA's aims in maintaining extremists. another reason I would put you in this traitor category VPK is not just for saying the US govt is okay, this reason is very very easy to understand and simple too, like the other long eared, four legged professors we hear from on this site, you quoted, In Reference to the Shah, " I am not surprised he became a dictator." that tiny little lie of yours is not just untruthul but also dihonest, it is helping to propogate the wests narrative it in addition to supporting the US govt, both of which are aiming to Africanize Iran, these are my reasons of why I believe strongly you qualify as a true traitor.  You wonder why I oppose you so openly? Because it is important to be open, regardless of whether I am respected, understood or admired.  I believe that those who use their freedom to attack the character and reputation of a King that never used absolute power or acted unlawfully and in addition are helping secure the wests policy for Iran are traitors to Iranians. Their inability to come up with even one single case of the shah using absolute power or acting unlawfully after 35 years in power is the reason I say, the cause of your treason is not your fault, you have every right to read and believe the wests self serving and disingenuous narrative, since you aren't thinking out of the box I don't feel you could possibly imagine the depth of your own stupidity.  Comments like, the USA changes policy, highlight this, the west doesn't change policy it made based on scientific research and its why they haven't changed it up until now.  To your credit you are not so foolish that you say i blame the USA, when the evidence is ample and there is no blame in my words.

I gave you seven different elements of what I think consttute having fredom, if you truly get
that the USA govt opposes freedom for Iran and that it is a bi-partisan
view and is not going to change.  A Patriotic Iranian would wish Freedom
for Iran and hate any power trying to make sure Iranians in practice do
not enjoy freedom and are instead thwarted from it.

This is why I see pro USA Iranians as unpatriotic as you can get like the mullahs themselves, just like the anti-secular
extremist mullahs in Iran who can't see why the USA loves them and why it wants them. This is not about me being blinded
by hate, so much as you being incapable of seeing what is going on for
personal reasons, not unlike some mullahs.

Hitler caused less poverty and backwardness than the west for other countries, I don't respect hitlers opinions either, nor mussolini's, yet they don't hold a candle to the ignorance of the west from the standpoint of freedom for humanity in my opinion and you say to me you'd like a little respect for your opinions!  Give something worthy of respect.   Those that are knowingly or unknowingly acting out treason for me are not entitled to it, the only group that approaches the mullahs for treason are the likes of those that are in support of a neocolonial wests narrative and ongoing manipulations to stiffle democracy for some. 

My View for the benefit of others.

APFSM

I disagree with you and do not have to go by your rules. You give too many orders to people and pay no attention to other people. Honestly I doubt my idea of freedom matches your idea.

If the shah was surrounded by people like you I am not surprised he bcame a dictator. Respect for other people and their opinions is necessary for freedom. You have obviously not got the idea yet; over and done.

VPK

It is possible to be a patriotic Iranian and not hate the USA.  I don't agree with that if you mean US govt.

The US people I agree with, the US Govt not so. Not if you truly get that the USA govt opposes freedom for Iran and that it is a bi-partisan view and is not going to change.  A Patriotic Iranian would wish Freedom for Iran and hate any power trying to make sure Iranians in practice do not enjoy freedom and are instead thwarted from it.

Obviously you can't think to this level or see it, as you would realize how unpatriotic pro USA people are being, just like the anti-secular extremist mullahs in can't see it.  This is not about me being blinded by hate, so much as you being incapable of seeing what is going on for personal reasons, not unlike some mullahs.

Amirparvis, there is nothing wrong with patriotism...

in fact I cherish it tremendously.  I only caution one ought not to be blinded by patriotism and act based on it blindly. 

And I was just going to add that for many of us, myself at least so I have not spoken for anybody else, I never put Palestine over Iran.  Those are two separate issues.  I have often said and believed that the two regime in Tehran and Tel Aviv are the two face of the same coin.

'Hambastegi' is the main key to victory 

Mehrdad

Dear Mehrdad

I asked you before and never got a good response so will try again. Maybe I missed your response. Why is Palestine so important to you but not Tibet; or my family's loss or so many other problems in the world.

It just amazes me that people say they are for justice. But the only justice of interest is Palestine. How about all the other problem spots in the world. 

There is something just not adding up in it.

APFSM

I don't see Iranians putting USA above Iran; not the ones I personally know. Maybe you know people who are different. Most Iranians oppose attacks by USA but those who support it are desperate to see the Mollahs gone.

You keep assuming that people do or should think as you. Therefore since you hate the USA so should they. But it just is not true. It is possible to be a patriotic Iranian and not hate the USA. Plus not hating USA does not mean worshiping it.

Anyway we are going to have our opinions and that is how it will be. I don't hate the USA.; don't give a *** about Palestine and I don't worship the USA. Hopefully we get a regime that puts Iran above Palestine or whatever.

Mehrdad

I could use some idealism minus realism on myside call it patriotism.  Feel free to use my points, they are well supported and no matter how much some wish to deny its truth they are based on the truth that is inconvenient for pro USA/UK/France/Israeli's to acknowledge as it doesn't fit with their sense of indebtedness.

Mehrdad

I could use some idealism minus realism on myside call it patriotism.  Feel free to use my points, they are well supported and no matter how much some wish to deny its truth they are based on the truth that is inconvenient for pro USA/UK/France/Israeli's to acknowledge as it doesn't fit with their sense of indebtedness.

On the subject of taking sides and why….

I suppose, some folks are motivated by religion, some based on nationalism and some purely based on their own personal gain. I was never religious and at some point in my life very nationalistic.  I am still very nationalistic but my motivation is primary driven based on my conscience and guiding principal based on justice and fairness for all.  I know it maybe idealistic to think this way but I rather be idealistic and on the side of right then realistic but on the side of wrong.

'Hambastegi' is the main key to victory 

Mehrdad