Sofia Says

Simorgh

pardon my french but you have got to be one of the biggest idiots ever

 first of all if you look in irans history we actually HAVE HAD gay marriages (yes marriages!) in iran for thousands of years! and actually gay people were accepted in iranian society for thousands of years as equals! //direland.typepad.com/direland/2009/02/i-wrote-the-folliwng-article-for-gay-city-news--when-iranian-president-mahmoud-ahmadinejad-made-his-infamous-claim-at-a-sept.html 

In fact if you look at the link above you will see that HOMOPHOBIA in iran is actually a recent invention brought to you by... you guessed it... the West! So your tirade about homosexuality being non-Iranian is based on lies and misinformation! Please read a few history books, I know that's really hard for you but please try and start with the link above :) I wish you luck! 

 actually i would like anyone disagreeing with homosexuality to read the above link first before commenting!

BacheShirazi thank you for bringing some sense to her! 

Simorgh, your words

couldn't be more repulsive.  Might I suggest you consider your words carefully before you express your regressive opinions. And at the least, when you disagree with me or any other person, please convey your opinions intellectually.

Thank You

Some Sense and Sanity

BacheSirazi,

 Thank you for bringing some sense and sanity to this discussion.  I couldn't have dissected the issue better, and appreciate your words.  This isn't about standing up for Gay Rights in particular, rather knowing that with every human rights that is violated, another one is soon to come for another group of people.  We have to stand up for eachother, and stand up for what is right.  With radicalism, no one wins.

Simorgh

Some rights are universal but sexual orientation is not and never has
been. Gay rights is very much a trendy modern movement shoved in
people's faces for the last twenty years. Fifty years ago gay rights was
criminal even in the West and because it has become acceptable in the
mainstream for the last twenty years everyone has to accept and comply.
All of a sudden gay people are sane and those who object to this form of
human behaviour are 'sick' and in need of 'counselling'. Why? Because
the media says so in the last twenty years. Utter crap.

So your point is basically that equality for gay people is a new thing. OK. So what? You do realise that equality for people of different ethnicities is also relatively modern? This includes the west.Secularism is also relatively modern, do you want to go back to theocracy?  What is your argument here? That societies change their opinions on issues over time?  

 "Oh, no! There's a difference", say Gay rights campaigners.  Consanguine
relationships can produce genetic illnesses for offsprings  they say
but what if they elect not to have children? Would it be OK then to have
sex with your own sister or brother?

Why not? Who cares what they do as long as they don't bring a disabled child into the world. I don't see the problem here. If a brother and sister want to just have sex without producing kids or anything then why do you care? How does that effect you? 

 If genetic illnesses are sysnonymous with consanguine relationshhips
then can it be suggested that there is a correlation between AIDS/HIV
and gay people without being attacked for being a bigot?

44 percent of people suffering from HIV in the U.K got the disease through gay sex. 45 percent through heterosexual sex. Although HIV rates are high among homosexuals, this doesn't mean gays should not have rights. The problem here could be easily fixed if people practised safe sex. Condoms reduce the risk of STDs by about 85-95 percent. Problem solved. 

Also a disabled child who is born from an incest relationship is not in that situation through any fault of its own. Homosexuals can take responsibility for what they do in regards to sexual activity. A child can not take responsibility for the actions of its parents. To think these things are the exact same is extremely stupid. 

  I fully condmen all executions in Iran including executions of
homosexuals and as much as I disapprove of any acts of violence against
them, they must never be able to granted the same ridiculous freedoms as
in the West. Imagine having gay marriages or gay adoption in Iran?

Yeah, I'm imagining two men getting married in Iran. Who gives a shit?  Why should I care if two men or two women want to get married? How does that effect me? 

As for gay adoption, if you can prove to me that a child being raised by two men or two women is significantly worse for the child that being raised by a man and a woman then I will agree with you. However, this article disagrees with you. 

 //www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/01/16/gay-parents-better-than-straights_n_1208659.html

  Gay rights
had no place in pre-Islamic society in Iran and has no place today. 

 While I have the most respect for Pre Islamic Iran, this has to be one of the stupidest things I have ever read in my life. Gay rights had no place in pre Islamic Iran so automatically it should have no place in modern Iran? Are you even mentally sane? How could anyone write this without realising how stupid it is. Should we base all of our laws on a period of Iranian history that ended in 651 AD? 1400 years ago. Great idea Simorgh, why not bring back  execution by elephant as well? 

Homosexuals

Whilst I condemn the killing and inhumane treatment of homosexuals in Iran and -as much as it pains me to agree with the IR Terror Regime- I do not believe that homosexuality is a universal human right. Unlike gender, race, and colour there are very few international human rights conventions which makes explicit references for homosexuals. Some rights are universal but sexual orientation is not and never has been. Gay rights is very much a trendy modern movement shoved in people's faces for the last twenty years. Fifty years ago gay rights was criminal even in the West and because it has become acceptable in the mainstream for the last twenty years everyone has to accept and comply. All of a sudden gay people are sane and those who object to this form of human behaviour are 'sick' and in need of 'counselling'. Why? Because the media says so in the last twenty years. Utter crap.

The rationale behind legalising homosexuality is that what men/women do as consenting adults in the privacy of their own home is not for moral censure by society or the government. The same should also apply to incest and other consanguine marriages such as first cousins. If a brother and sister wish to have sexual intercourse then they deserve to enjoy the same rights of privacy as homosexuals. 

"Oh, no! There's a difference", say Gay rights campaigners.  Consanguine relationships can produce genetic illnesses for offsprings  they say but what if they elect not to have children? Would it be OK then to have sex with your own sister or brother?  If genetic illnesses are sysnonymous with consanguine relationshhips then can it be suggested that there is a correlation between AIDS/HIV and gay people without being attacked for being a bigot?

Let me put it striaght (no pun intended!), a free Iran without the IR should not espouse some Western illnesses such as gay rights. Human rights in Iran is not to be mistaken with gay rights. I fully condmen all executions in Iran including executions of homosexuals and as much as I disapprove of any acts of violence against them, they must never be able to granted the same ridiculous freedoms as in the West. Imagine having gay marriages or gay adoption in Iran? We must ensure that Iranians who disgrace themsleves and do not behave like upright citizens have no place in a free Iran post-IR. Gay rights had no place in pre-Islamic society in Iran and has no place today. 

I strongly advise all Iranian gays to seek counselling and refrain from their behaviour. If you can't control themselves then please do not embarass our community by promoting what you do in your private life. I won't ask so please don't tell.