Green fire

Photo essay: Protesters in streets of Tehran following presidential election

by AP, AFP, Reuters
13-Jun-2009
 
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Mehdi khan

by Dariush (not verified) on

Of course, violence is not the solution. You should know what I stand for by now,"justice" and "Peace". What I wrote was not a tip or nothing new. That is what MEK did in the 80's. That is what people do when they are stabbed, shot and killed and there is no justice. It doesn't have to be that way. Is IRI going to repeat the same mistakes in a larger scale or is it going to learn from those mistakes.

Respect is a two way street and justice is for all.


Mehdi

They should stop the protests now

by Mehdi on

Clearly, the protesters are not a majority. They had more than enough opportunity to attract everyone to their cause and they didn't. Pushing forward will only result in more violence, injury and death. They should pursue the matter through legal channels and continue their progress through peaceful means. Do not listen to those who post "ways to kill" tips. Violence is not the answer. 


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Bijan A M / Samad_Agha

by Dariush (not verified) on

You are right. There is not a shred of evidence to support any involvements of west or Israel. Let us hope they make the right decisions and change the policies to benefit all the people.

My theory was a push for peace.

My mentioning of chomagh on those who burned buildings with people in them would have only saved their lives, but the oppositions are sending people in front of machine guns and get them killed because they belive that is the price for freedom. However, even that was not to support the crackdown, but to avoid what is happening now. That is why I was emphasizing that it is not going to stay peaceful and I was against the armed resistance.

Your wrote, I am for velayateh-fagheeh and went on and on analyzing that. You are wrong. I have only voted once and that has been a "NO" to IRI after the revolution. You assumed i am for velayateh-fagheeh, because I have defended IRI on their stance for Iran's rights and independence and therefor, I must be a fanatic Muslim and for velayateh-fagheeh.

Samad_Agha
I have plenty of answers for you, but this is not the time. I will catch up with you later. Until then, you go have fun with your naneh agha.


Samad_Agha

آقای بیژن

Samad_Agha


با این عرب زاده‌ها که نمی‌توان بحث کرد. اینا دشمنشان اسرائیل هست و بس. فلسطینیها هم دارن دعا میکنند که مبادا این رژیم پست فطرت سرنگون شه. جلاد داره سر مردم رو میبره، این مادر به خطا میگه نگا چه جلیقهٔ قشنگی‌ پوشیده. احمقی مهر نمازش رو ناف رهبر گذشته، این نخود مغزها هم پیشونیشون رو ناف احمقی.


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You are right. Rigging must

by Dariush (not verified) on

You are right. Rigging must have happened. Otherwise, why would a leader sweep the will of millions under the rug. But there are other ways to deal with rigging than this.

Khamenei's massage was clear. He would rather to murder than to face fraud embarrassment. Now, how do you deal with that? Is it wise to continue fighting arms with rocks? Is this just not causing more deaths to oppositions? Where do you see the victory?

The purpose of fighting the west and Israel is to protect Iranian's rights and well being, not serving the enemy by taking Iranian's rights.
Just as, the goal of the reformist leaders should be first, the well being of their supporters and all Iranians and not to get them killed. Getting people killed, as some of these oppositions are doing, is not going to bring freedom. Revenge has blinded them. How can an opposition tell people to go ahead and fight machine guns with rocks?

I would rather to let an election go and get more organize and let Ahmadinejad clean the corruption and if things didn't get better, the reformists and oppositions are still there. Who knows, by then Ahmadinejad and khamenei may be assassinated.

I might be wrong, but both Reformists and IRI are making the wrong decisions in my opinion.

This is not Montazeri or a few thousand MEK. It is foolish to think millions can be silenced by terror for ever. If no war comes, this will only grow underground in the forms of guerilla fighting, car bombings and assassination of government officials and others. IRI's actions is giving this movements a clear goal and a life of it's own with no need to a leadership. More terror is going to make it worse for IRI.

LalehGillani has the blueprints. I wonder what she thinks about fighting head on with force and armed resistance now. Imagine if people were armed, there would be tens of thousands dead by now.

I hope both sides come to their senses and stop this madness before it is too late.

People shouldn't let themselves to be used. They should stay off the streets and get organized better, instead of getting themselves killed.


Bijan A M

Conspiracy theorist is alive and well (to Dariush)

by Bijan A M on

Sir, we are all sick of it too….Sick of minimizing and undermining people’s cry and struggle for freedom and revolt against dictatorship by portraying them as robots and tools of the west and Zionists. How dare you to insult the spirit of this uprising, directly or indirectly. You portray yourself as a rational intellectual who cares about Iran and Iranian but your fundamental belief is flawed.

Of course you don’t come out openly supporting IRI but you believe that there exists a form of democratic velayate-vaghih that Iranian people should peacefully strive for. Here is where your belief is flawed. Here is where you don’t have the courage to admit the flaw and open your mind to other possibilities. You therefore blame it on foreigners, the west and the Zionists. You brag about all the accomplishments of the IRI in “absolute” terms whereas those accomplishments should be viewed in “relative” terms. Where would we have been with the vast amount of resources and the windfall of commodity prices that Iran has enjoyed in recent history? I am not even talking about civil liberty and human rights. You give credit of advancement in science and technology to Ahmadi, and yet most of those who are risking and have lost their lives are the beneficiaries of your hero’s (AN) programs.

Your love for human lives and peace is admirable but you have to re-think the foundation of your belief system. The reality is that there is no such a thing as a democratic theocracy. Its either one or the other. And, there has never been and there will never be a peaceful transition from one to the other, period (IMHO). It is sad and heartbreaking to see the bloodshed and feel helpless in your ability to contribute, but unfortunately that’s the price of freedom. I only pray and hope that well organized democracy loving leaders and/or organization emerge to more effectively (less bloodshed, less chaos) guide this tremendous energy towards a clear goal of secular democracy. There will be plenty of time after victory to dish out to the criminals of IRI what they deserve.      


Souri

dear Khaleh mosheh

by Souri on

I agree with you, I think this is the result of the despotic IRI actions. Nobody deny the fact that this government is oppressive.

Meanwhile, what Dariush seems to say (and also is my opinion) is that the proportion of this event seems too much bigger than just a simple objection to a rigged election. Those young people are really acting brave, like this is for a real revolution, while in fact it is nothing else than just a change of president under the same IRI system.

That's where we are becoming surprised and pessimistic. In fact, this
is because we are feeling sad and worry for our young Iranian. WE never
said, these protesting people deserve what they are getting.

You guys, must be more indulgent and patient with other people's views and not attack everybody who state a different opinion. We are not against our people, we are not defending IRI government, neither AN-Khamenehee nor Mousavi-Rafsanjani.

Is this so difficult to understand for you?


khaleh mosheh

This is caused by the regime not a foreign power

by khaleh mosheh on

This would not have happened if they had not rigged the election or even when they did, on friday the supreme leader could have made amends. He did not, instead he unleashed murder and meyham.

Life is about deeds and thier results. This is the result if the despotic IRI actions. 


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What I feared to happen, is

by Dariush (not verified) on

What I feared to happen, is happening and I am sick of it.

You spoke of peaceful demonstration. Did it stay peaceful? You spoke of armed resistance. Where are the arms? Are they on the way from Israel? Would that help or escalate the fighting and the number of deaths?
Did you not see this coming or did you not care? As long as they die, so you can be free?
Yes, I would rather to wait and organize a better campaign and try again in the next election, than getting people butchered like this.

Now, a fraud embarrassment is turning into civil war.

whether this movement was a western and Israeli plot as I belive, or not, as you believe, the answer is not crackdown and bloodshed. The answer is giving protection by government of Ahmadinejad to demonstrators to hold their rallies peacefully and safely and an organized control by oppositions to make sure their supporters keep peace and those who don't, be arrested by their own security personal, so it doesn't create any clashes with police and get out of control. The answer was to release innocent political prisoners, not to imprison more political prisoners. The answer was to respect human rights and freedom of speech not disrespect. The answer was to close the gap between people and government and Unite, not to divide. This is what majority of protesters want.

What is happening today will only help the possible plot and create division and civil war. The government of Ahmadinejad is playing into the Israeli hands. Next comes the smuggling of weapons and bombs to create more chaos and civil war. Then they throw a peace offer to Hezbollah and Palestinians to keep them in tact, so they don't play the foot soldier for Iran, then comes the bombing and now they have millions of foot soldiers in Iran, our brothers and sisters. I believe this was the whole purpose of sanctions and propaganda, to create economic disaster, tension, and division and pave the road for war. It is Ahmadinejad's responsibility to protect all Iranians from injustice and he will be held responsible for what happens. This is the beginning and can be stoped by doing the right thing, by merging the two groups and more importantly respecting human rights.

There is a wise way and there is a foolish way.

I hope Ahmadinejad choose the wise way before it is too late!!!


Souri

please delete

by Souri on

I will post it later. Thanks.


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hamsade hamishegi:)

by KouroshS on

On Ahmadinejad support

I am not an ahmadinejad supporters, yet at the same time i can not blame and deny another person's claim of what this man has or has not done for this country. I hear calls from here and there and there is a lot of those calls who make the claim that he has really reached out to poor areas and has done such and such. Whatever he has done and under whatever circumstance he has done them, I can not be the judge because i simply do not live there. SO at least partially have to give this supporter some benefit of the doubt, that he just may be right a tad bit. Look i agree with what dariush says that each and every regime has its bad and good points. You or no one else can deny that. Even you called the pahlavi's regime A dictatorship when pointing out the fact that it was under them that our nuclear program got its pangs.

 

On az abe gel allod mahi gereftan

These demonstrators and protestors may have nothing to do with foreign powers, Ok, They absoultely do not have any ties to those powers, But what was one big factor that charged them up and made them start the movements? Who was egging this on from the beginning? Who inititiated and came up with the Green movement concept? Was it anyone else but Mousavi who happens to behaving his hand in the same cookie jar as these "corrupt" Mullahs? Or was it anyone other than karoubi? No we are not and can not and should not redicule them as puppets, but we need to put thing in perspective and avoid giving misdirected and misguided support to all the killings and pushing our young ones to "defenselessly" take the bullets.What good is a defenseless struggle when at the end it is the young ones who parish? do you want to lend your support to that, all the way from USA or europe, rather than finding a logical solution and looking at all the options before more people get killed?

Like it has been said so many times, how  can we have an democratic system when the intolerance level and finger-pointing game is at its peak?

 

On the hpothetical section

Wait a second. You think that the "voting was rigged" part a hypothetical question now? Buddy, you have got me all shook up here now, I thought that was one of the reasons why people are out in the street?? Of course, You bet that there is something to be gained at least by answering this one question. There is not a logical pattern in the questions that you are posing here!! So let's hope that they are successful in the end, through various nonviolent means and ways which results in no casualties , I thought you portrayed this as an "struggle agianst a brutal dictatorship" now all of a sudden the goal has been reduced and reformatted to mere fundamental changes within the same garbage system? This is the context in which you want to see your democracy? The Islamic democracy? You want to make changes in asystem that is being managed and led by a dictator? how would you seek to democratize a Brutal dictatorship?

 

On violence

Sure, I see all these as violent acts and i am in total agreement with you. Yet at the same time, it is really hard to ignore the fact that buisnessess have been destroyed, damages have been done and violent riots have indeed taken place. People are fed up i totally understand, but such acts hardly places a demonstration in the "peaceful" category. Can you claim that people who break windows and disrupt routine flow of trade in any city, do necessarily belong to the Ahmadinejad groupies and are doing this on purpose? Or are these people part of the mousavi supporters?

No, this is not about winning or losing a debate, But it also is not about blaming each other and taking shots at each other for positions that we take and the reasons and logics for it. You seem to be ignoring that fact BIG TIME:)


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Tab dari Darush?

by Areyo Barzan (not verified) on

Where the hell in my posting I defended any mulah let alone Rafsanjaani.

I have problem with the whole foundation of this system and I want to see them all in court paying for their crimes.

However I can not ignore the facts when they themselvse confess to their crime as this is the normal procedure in any trial(paying attention to confession of the criminal) 

Furthermore  shir o Khorshid has notting to do with the late Shahanshah or Reza Pahlavi and every thing to do with my Iranian Nationality and Persian Identity. To know more just read the book "Tarikh che ye Shir o Khorshid" by "Ahmad Kasravi". Although I know that reading is not realy your style 

seriusly man, If this is your logic then you must be very desprit and I have no  time for desporadoes


hamsade ghadimi

dear kourosh

by hamsade ghadimi on

do you see all the crap this dariush character and his cheerleaders dishing out? i will break it down for you my friend, the way i see it.

 

ahmadinejad support 

do you see how these people are attributing all the productivity of Iranians, not just during his term but the cumulative effort of Iranians from many past years to ahmadinejad? in his post on jun 19, 12:33 am post, dariush details it. for example, as if ahmadinejad single-handedly was responsible for the nuclear program that had indeed initially started under our last dictatorship regime. and yet they are so quick to dismiss all the social ills of the country because ‘he had inherited them from the previous governments’.  my friend, do you see this unashamed and obvious support of ahmadinejaad and the corrupt system that he represents? do you see that these people claim the status quo is better than the continuation of the defenseless struggle of our people against a brutal dictatorship?

mahi gereftan dar ab-e gelaalood

do you see how these people try to divert the discussion and talk about rafsanjani and the shah?  the movement of the people should be the focus, not rafsanjani, not the shah, not ahmadinejad, not mousavi, not… these demonstrations are about the protest to the system that doesn’t listen to its people, dismisses the notion of democracy and even rigs the ‘election show’ that they have constructed (in the absence of democracy). this protest has nothing to do with Israel, the united states, the individual corrupt mullahs. the people have seized the opportunity of another humiliation, of being called arazel o obash, to defy the system. are we here to ridicule the movement as ‘puppets’ or ‘puppets of puppets’?

hypothetical questions

how will you answer ‘what if ahmadinejad really won’? or ‘what if the voting was rigged’? or ‘what if the partial vote count proved ahmadinejad won’? will you get anywhere with posing these rhetorical questions? people are demanding a new election to cast away these doubts. they are demanding under conditions that would show a legitimate effort to hold fair elections: international observers, representation of all candidates at the voting centers, exit polls, and all other factors that is deemed to ensure fair elections. above all, if the people are successful, it will not be only about fair elections anymore, it is their hope and mine that there will be fundamental changes to the system. changes that bring us closer to a democratic nation.

violent or peaceful demonstrations?

what is your definition of violent demonstrations? the way that these thugs and their cheerleaders define it is the simple act of defying the system. have you seen the videos where the motorcycle-riding thugs just move through the crowd and beat them mercilessly? do you see the videos where the fed-up crowd rushes back to these thugs and throw them off their motorcycles only to defend them from their apparent lynching by the mobs? do you see the humanity of the demonstrators in face of the brutal agents of the system? did you listen to khamenei’s ban of peaceful (and silent) demonstrations? did you listen to him say that any protest (violent or not) will be responded in the harshest manner?

this discussion is not about winning a debate contest or getting the last word. and frankly, I find it sickening that these people have the gall to make the ridiculous claims and accusations that they have made (and supported) in this blog and elsewhere. how about you?


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My dear hamsadeh

by KouroshS on

You are making some very brilliant and compelling arguments here and there. This is about the message you left for souri after not reading her whole entire essay and during which you analyzed dariush's certain statements.

I agree with the conclusion on the first sentence, But you are , i guess deliberately omiiting the "otherwise. if you want to start riots and chaos" chomagh is what you will get. Not just that if he indeed is NOT the president then that is when you get the chomagh. There is a difference there dadashe man.

So he is saying that ONLY if you want to cause riots then of course whether it is just and righteous or not the security forces will deal with it in such a manner. Now, i am not calling these guys and brave kids the instigators of chaos and riots, but this makes sense(not in approving what these forces are doing against our kids) You will see violence when you commit violence,.

there will be arrests and what nots.  I have seen vidoes on Youtube, that aside from the brutalities of the basijis and other forces against these young fellows, that shows them walking on the streets filming the vandalisms and all other damages, and say In pasokhe ma asst be karhaye dolat. and telling his friends that "do ssaat dige in mire roo site"

So the main thing here is that we need to be able to distinguish between those who want to protest quietly and make their voices! heard that way and those who want to be the forsat talabs and start riots.


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Never trust a Shahi

by Ramtin (not verified) on

As for Rafsanjani/Pahlavi.. it is a well known fact that Shahanshai's are willing to support the granting of Rafsanjani and his "bache ragoss" children permanent amnesty and a life in Switzerland or some luxurious island somewhere in exchange for him to do the IRI in and for a return of Pahlavi to the throne.. Naturally he gets to keep all the money aswell and get Interpol off his back. How do you like that? Lucky Mr Rafsanjani and family.. a lifetime of thievery and murder by these Billionaire mafioso's and those loyal Shahi's are willing to look the other way if they can go back to "the good old days". It's just one thief helping out another. Make no mistake..they will do ANYTHING so that their precious unemployed barely high school educated "king" can be "reinstated".


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Areyo Barzan

by Dariush (not verified) on

How is that you defend Rafsanjai so much? Considering that you use "sheer o khorshed flag". So my conclusion of Rafsanjani joining his business partner Reza Pahlavi in U.S. is not wrong after all.

You cannot put Montazeri and Rafsanjani in the same
boat. They may dress the same, but they seem to have been the opposite of each other. You made the same mistake about Iran and Hitler.

Anyone commits any crime should pay for their crime accordingly. Not the way you are trying to crucify Ahmadi for the crimes of Rafi. Is this the justice system you are planing for the new government?

You asked for one thing right Ahmadi has done, I gave you many.
Now you tell me what have you done for Iran? I bet not a damn thing. Only using her and complaining.

I just read the bad news of khamenei dismissing the possibility of fraud. I think Rafi and Ahmadi have come to an agreement and Rafi is safe and Mousavi is no longer an overnight revolutionary and people have been used and betrayed again. Now what?

This is the result of building an opposition supported by criminals.


Souri

dear Dariush

by Souri on

I am following this thread without participating actively. By principle I always stop when people are becoming, unreasonable, accusative and hateful.

Nevertheless, I can's stop being astonished by your good reasoning and logical statement. Just wanted to assure you again of my full agreement with all you just said in your last post. Great speech!! I loved it. Thank you.


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Dear Darush

by Areyo Barzan (not verified) on

In my previous posting I explicitly asked for no propaganda crap. But that is exactly what you provided AGAIN.

The phony claims that you make about what IRI under Ahmadi has done might fool a person who is living abroad and is not involved with the issues and the fabric of our society.

But for a person like me who lives here and every day sees a lot of young bright people out of job with no prospect for a better future this, for a person who sees a lot of his young girl hamvatans resort to prostitution just to survive, who sees every day the best and brightest are fleeing the country and the factories and companies go busted one after the other. Who has to live under an inflation of more that %25, your list is noting but laughable propaganda BS and I have no time for BS.  Also when it comes to accepting some responsibility what is heard again is the same old boring line that the IRI has been using since 30 years ago. Blaming your own incompetence, betrayal and thievery on foreign powers. This was the name of IRI’s game from day one and we do not buy it any longer.

After thirty years of the same old crap, like many others I think it is time to change the record. And as far as the sanctions are concerned if IRI stops supporting the terrorists around the world, pull its nose out of Palestinian problem and stop perusing nuclear weapons, the sanctions would be lifted tomorrow.

However it should also be considered that many of the IRI insider like Saraan-e Sepaah do not want these sanctions to be lifted, because in that case they will not be able to smuggle goods to the country and sell it 10 times the normal price and the door of Dubai would be shot for ever. But of course as I said before if you do not want to know these facts then there is noting much that I can do about it.  On the other note I should say that I find it quite rich that you consider yourself more knowledgeable than the many historians, political analysts, economical experts, journalists and writers who devoted their lives in researching and analysing these affairs and if that is not rich enough you claim to know this regime and its nature better than insiders like Montazeri or Rafsanjani who were at the hearth of the IRI for more than ten years. 

In a way very it is funny that as this debate goes on further and further you are digging yourself in deeper and deeper.

So, tell me mate if you do not read books and do not consider the option of social and political experts or well established historians and human right activists to be valid, then where you get your “knowledge” from. Are you one of those blind followers of the Rahbar who believes that Sed-Ali is in direct contact with God and goes to bed with Jebraeel every night and gets stuffed with new wisdom till morning, or may be just like your favourite president you get your directions from Imam e Zmaan following that Hale-ye noor   :-)

 

As far as Ahmadi Nejaad’s involvement in IRI’s crimes is concerned you should know that in 1368 he was a Paasdaar and directly involved in the fire squads that murdered over 13000 of this country’s best children. I have read insider eye witness confession on that file. Now if that is not a crime then I do not know what you call it.

 

However I believe that I have exhausted all your knowledge base and ability to debate and this discussion is getting more and more boarding by the minute as you have noting new to offer and are going over the same BS again and again


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Areyo Barzan

by Dariush (not verified) on

You asked what good Ahmadinejad has done?
Improving science and technology, sending satellite to space, nuclear energy, manufacturing and building many industrial equipments and machineries, strong army, helping millions of needy Iranians, building dams, power plants, electricity, running water and school to villages, roads and bridges. All these and more, when facing sanctions, threats and corruption.

why such a bad economy? Imbalance income vs expenses. Due to sanctions, improvement projects and corruption.

Now, has there been crimes and injustice in IRI? Of course.
Is Ahmadinejad responsible for 30 years of injustice. Of course not.
Is he responsible for injustice in his term? Probably is for some, specially with respect to civil liberty and political prisoners, but much have been committed by many others despite his partial efforts to fight and stop them.
Has this presidential process been right? I don't think so.
Has there been fraud? There is reasonable doubt and there should be a monitored reelection in my opinion.

I said, I support the good that IRI has done and condemn the wrongs they do.

You wrote,
"I am afraid this is a very weak argument as I can also argue that Hitler, Pinochet, Pol Pot, Mussolini and Stalin did some “good” and some bad. However any right minded person can see that their bad and evil far outweighed the little “good” that they might have done"

How do you deal with the good and bad of a government. If you don't admit their good, they will never buy your criticism. How can you deny the good or bad? Should the government be improved or changed? That would be ideal, but which path should be taken under this circumstances and replace with which government?
What is created today, is a room full of gas, short of a spark.

Your examples of Hitler and Mussolini are not even close. Again. a Zionistic exaggeration. Israel today is much much closer to Hitler than Iran could ever be.

You wrote,
"As they say:
One can awaken the person who is in deepest sleep, but can never awaken him who is pretending to be asleep".

Sing something original! I am getting tired of the same old songs.
I am well awake and you are singing "lala e" to put me to sleep not to wake me up.

You keep on bragging about reading books, but seems like it hasn't done you any good. Not every book is good for you. Reading books will educate you only if you have the capacity not to be brainwashed by them. otherwise, they are just another brain washing tools. Apparently that is the case with you.
I am sure many of these criminal politicians have read more books in a year than you in your entire lifetime.

I answered to most of your crap, if you have any more, I will be happy to answer them. As for you having anything against me or not,
Do you really think i give a rat ass for your opinion about me? Just as you cannot intimidate me, you cannot bribe me.


hamsade ghadimi

dear dariush, ahmadinejad's biggest chearleader

by hamsade ghadimi on

if you write english more coherently, you wouldn't be able to use so much double-talk: "...western and israeli agents in and out of iran and rafsanjani through mousavi..."  huh?  so, neither mousavi nor rafsanjani are israeli agents, right? or rafsanjani is, and mousavi is not? and if that is the case, then mousavi doesn't know that rafsanjai is an agent? or they're (israelis on one side, and rafsanjani and mousavi on the other side) working independently, right? surely, you can straighten this out. surely, you can come up with a more coherent conspiracy theory.

you sound like this other dariush that keeps making fun of my name. well, i'll tell you again, i mean i'll tell you for the first time, once you get a chance to make a pilgrimmage from your yol tappeh to tehran and had the pleasure of talking to a tehruni, maybe you can be enlightened by some tehruni slang including hamsade. ;)

you never told me where are all these 62.7% of ahmadi supporters. why they don't show their presence. is it because they're so confident that the voting was fair and square, and the polite people they are they just sit home? or they have the basijee thugs do the dirty work for them? with the chomagh as you like to put it. where are they? let's face it, your breed is dying out, and there were never that many ahmadi supporter.  and to reply to your earlier statement, no i will never cry to have ahmadinejad back if he's kicked out. they might be able to bring another scumbag like him but they couldn't find any worse.

you remind me of the story about the mosquito: "pasheh jav migiratesh, mire karkhooneye pif paf arbadekeshi."  boro ja'mesh kon, boy.


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hamsade ghadimi

by Dariush (not verified) on

You made a comment about my name and some others. At least our names are original. Look at you name! "hamsadeh ghadimi". I am not even talking about the name, I am talking about you, spelling it. It is not "hamsade" you fool! It is "hamsayeh". I don't even know were the hell you come from, that you can't even spell a word in Farsi and you claim to be Iranian.

You wrote, "talk is cheap".
I always believed it is not, until I heard you talk.

You wrote,
"you indict mousavi as a western and Israeli agent attempting a coup in Iran".

your statement:

"What I see is a coup attempt directed by western and Israeli agents in and out of Iran and Rafsanjani through Mousavi by fooling and using the public."

Where did I say Mousavi is an agent? I said "through Mousavi". I think, Mousavi is also being used by Rafsanjani. Now whether Rafsanjani is being used by foreign agents or is using them and what kind of agreement they have, is a different deal from Mousavi.

You want to tell me that Mousavi is behind this movement? The man cannot even make a sandwich without a "cheeez". Every sentence he makes is "ineh", "uneh", "cheezeh". And when he doesn't like a question, like you, he explodes and claims to be a revolutionary. Being against IRI or for IRI doesn't guaranty a person's illegibility for presidency. When he talks, i don't see an architect, i see a construction worker.

You ask where are Ahmadinejad supporters. How do i know? Give him a call and ask him. Chances of you being able to talk to that dictator is more than you calling any democratic president on the face of this planet and being able to talk to them. Don't you agree?

I would guess, even Ahmadinejad supporters think there should be a reelection to clear the air, or they may have been advised not to clash with demonstrators to avoid bloodshed. Let us hope that demonstrators don't get their hands on weapons as some of you wish, then you will know what bloodshed and civil war is. This is not a movie or novel, boy.


hamsade ghadimi

talk is cheap

by hamsade ghadimi on

it never ceases to amaze me how these iri apologists like to use per-islamic names, or women names (jaleho, mehrnaz, iran...) and so vehemently defend their "benevolent" dictatorship.

"dariush"

you indict mousavi as a western and israeli agent attempting a coup in iran.

your statement:

"What I see is a coup attempt directed by western and Israeli agents in and out of Iran and Rafsanjani through Mousavi by fooling and using the public."

well, why aren't there demonstrations against mousavi accusing him of this crime? where are the 63% supporters of ahmadinejad? do you think this crackpot theory will appease the crowds? do you think they will turn back and forget they live in tyranny? do you think they will find refuge in the benevolent arms of ahmadinejad and father khamenei from this israeli rat?

where are these 63% supporters of ahmadinejad? that's what i want to know. where's the outrage of this "majority" who have all the backing of the regime?


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What are you afraid of?

by Areyo Barzan (not verified) on

Well Darush! 

Why is it that you think I do not live in Iran. Did I crush your perception of the average educated Iranian activist or do you want my home address and personal details so that you can send the boys around?

You say IRI has done some good and some bad.

I am afraid this is a very weak argument as I can also argue that Hitler, Pinochet, Pol Pot, Mussolini and Stalin did some “good” and some bad. However any right minded person can see that their bad and evil far outweighed the little “good” that they might have done.

I can write a book about the wrongs and crimes that IRI has committed, both in terms of economical devastation and mass execution, human right abuses and lack of personal liberty, looting our national wealth and feeding terrorist groups in our expense (both financially and in terms of our international reputation) and many many more.

One just needs to read the memoirs of Hassan Ali Montazeri to get the picture.

Now! Can you name even one good thing that IRI has done without resorting to empty rhetoric and cheap slogans?

I have no personal vendetta against you or any one else on this site, but as an Iranian if you are not an agent of the IRI then I am afraid you are grossly under-educated and misinformed. Hence I erg you to read a few books before opening you mouth and embarrassing yourself. Learn about the history of the revolution and your country’s current history.

If you want I can give you the names of a few books as you can find them much easier in the U.S than we can in Iran, or you can give me your email and I will send you the pdf version of the books I have about the history of revolution and the criminal activities of IRI cronies in Evin, Ghezel Hesaar and other places. I will send you the eye witness accounts of the crime they committed in Kurdistan and facts about the mass executions of 1368 when in one night alone over 4000 political prisoners were murdered and buried in Khavaran and other grave yards across the country.  

 

For once in your life be a man and instead of resorting to cheap insults try to open your eyes and mind to the fact. Even if you do not like what you hear.

Finally Ahmadi has already been in power for four years and he has done NOTTING despite the fact that during those four years our oil revenue was record high. Plus the fact that by the accounts of Majlis it self a large proportion of this money has gone missing in his government’s expenditure. That was why he could not name the people on Rafsanjani’s camp who stole oil money. Because they had similar incriminating evidence on his side and cabinet members.  

That was why after his controversial speech in one of his Ostaani trips a few months ago, where he promised to reveal the names of those who stole from Beit-Ol-Maal he suddenly went quiet and that is why he is still keeping quiet about it.

 

However the bottom line is that if you do not know these facts then I can provide you the information but if you do not want to know then I am afraid there is not much that I or anyone else can do  

As they say:

One can awaken the person who is in deepest sleep, but can never awaken him who is pretending to be asleep.  

Now the question is: which one are you


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hamsaye ghadimi / areyo barzan /

by Dariush (not verified) on

Suri, you are right. I think these are cloned monkeys. They keep changing their name and repeating the same crap, thinking they can fool others. Don't worry about them, I can handle them. Thanks

That is all you can say. IRI supporter and thugs. Unlike you I don't follow others like a sheep. I don't belong to any group. Once you belong to a group, you are automatically against the others and vulnerable to be used. I might be right, I might be wrong, but what I say, is what I think, not Reza Pahlavi , Obama , Ahmadinejad or anyone else.

I said previously that I hope the government make the right decisions and no harm should come to the candidates and the protesters. But when, they are burning buildings with people in them, that is not peaceful demonstration. That is attempted murder. This is what happens in a riot, one thing will lead to another and there you have a bloody civil war. You are right. I don't want to see a bloody civil war in Iran, even though, I am not in it. Then there is you, who also is not in it, but don't mind people from both side to be slaughtered as long as one face goes and another face comes without any true indication of progressive change.

Areyo barzan You wrote,
"I am living in Iran"
I say, You are a lying pig.

You wrote,
"I see every day the crimes committed by the IRI and it’s thugs."

I hope the criminals pay for their crimes.

"But these people are sitting in U.S and supporting the IRI."

IRI has done some good and some bad. I support her for the good and I condemn her for the bad.
It seems to me Ahmadinejad is paying for the crimes committed by many others not his, including the members of the oppositions.

To me this looks like a coup, just as they tried with Chavez a few yeas ago after his election. The same allegations and riots.

You wrote, "what the hell I am doing here and why....".

It is interesting. You have been the recipient of this question for years and you answers has been that you are "a kisser, a nokar and a khaen". Are these not in your file?

Now, you mimic like a monkey and think you can question me? As I told your body, you have a big mouth, but not big enough for my .....


hamsade ghadimi

dear areyo

by hamsade ghadimi on

sadly, there are iranians outside of iran who believe in the rule of chomagh as they like to put it. it's a pasteurized word for all the brutal instruments, jail, torture, and intimidation our brave compatriots are enduring. at the same time, they call the peaceful demonstrations that are interrupted by the chomagh, chaos and riots. these iranians don't like chaos and riot. they prefer an orderly iran under the rule of khamenei and ahmadinejad. i'm sure the demonstrators already know that the system values human life less than the value of being able to protest (even if it's destructive at times), and especially, insulting the authority. these iranians would prefer that the disenchanted wait another four years and play the election game again.

the good news is that these people are in the minority. in a demonstration in washington dc this week, amongst hundreds of anti regime protesters, there was a single ahmadinejad supporter carring "antar's" picture.

down with the dictator, its agents and instruments.


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Dear hamsade Ghadimi

by Areyo Barzan (not verified) on

I believe that you are wasting your time trying to reason with the IRI agents.

The reason that they do not accept your argument and will not respond to your legitimate question is not the fact that they do not know about IRI and its nature or do not know about the crimes and treasons of Khamene ee, Ahmadi and others

 

They know very well who they are following or what crimes IRI have been committing all these years.

 

They know very well about the fraud and vote rigging that is happening in Iran.

However they are agents of IRI and as they say “Mamoor va Mazoor”.

 

I am living in Iran and I see every day the crimes committed by the IRI and it’s thugs. But these people are sitting in U.S and supporting the IRI.

 

Although I know that these two have never given a straight answer to any question but my question is that if you are so found of Ahmadi then what the hell are you doing in The U.S. Why don’t you come back to Iran and try to live with under $200 per month and try to feed your family, pay the rent, and support your children’s education.

 

The bottom line is that they are the paid agents or may be the students whose tuition fee are paid by the IRI and they need to protect their own personal interest.


Souri

Read my post or leave this talk

by Souri on

You are wrong if you don't read my post up to the end, but I leave it to your choice. I have already spent lots of time in debating with you, and am not going to do more, if you are stubborn (lol, reminded me of something) like this.

Indeed, it is you who have a comprehension problem, as I mentioned before. Let analyse it:

"If Ahmadinejad indeed got the votes, he is the president and if you don't like it, the only option you have is to peacefully organize and support your future candidates."

1) If AN really got the votes, then you must accept it and try to peacefully organize and support a future president! Nothing wrong with this sentence, unless you don't agree. but it seems we both agree here.

2) Otherwise, if you want to start riots and chaos, chomagh is what you deserve."

Now, as I have mentioned in my long post that you didn't bother to read, your perception is wrong, you are always imagining the worst in what you read (or you just pretend it)

you linked the word "otherwise" to the sentence of "if AN is the elected President ( otherwise= if he is not legally and really  elected )

while what I heard here (and am sure this is what Dariush meant) is this :

Otherwise = if you don't want to accept that fact (in case if he  really and legally won all his votes as an elected president) and 

"if you want to start riots and chaos"

why do you dismiss this so clear sentence in his argument?

Not only you try to change the meaning of the sentence by misplacing the punctuation, but also you deliberately forget the second part of the sentence which begin with an IF!!

You see, either you don't want to understand what is said, or ...

You don't want to understand what is said!

 


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hamsaye ghadimi

by Dariush (not verified) on

This is not a demonstration. This is burning people in buildings. What do they expect to get.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4vqWamoQgM

You read my name and call me anonymous, yet your name is hamsaye ghadidmi. You said, you have been on this site for a while, apparently using some other anonymous names. So you are just another liar with big mouth. Instead of talking about issue you keep talking BS and ask about my anatomy. You do have a big mouth, but not big enough for my balls.


hamsade ghadimi

...

by hamsade ghadimi on

i didn't read all of your essay. let me just stop you at the beginning. if you got this wrong, you probably got a lot of things wrong.

your thug friend said:

"If Ahmadinejad indeed got the votes, he is the president and if you don't like it, the only option you have is to peacefully organize and support your future candidates. Otherwise, if you want to start riots and chaos, chomagh is what you deserve."

let's look at this statement. there are two sentences. the first sentence, if ahmadi got the votes (which we will never know), he's the president (so far nothing, right? unless you can answer hypothetical questions); then the only option (out of the nothing premise) is to go organize for the future.  the second sentence "otherwise", that means if he is not indeed the president, then you have to deal with the chomagh.

did you understand that? and by chomagh, i assume it's the brutality that the people are receiving since there was no actual chomagh seen in any of the pictures and videos of the deomonstrations. have you been watching the videos of what's been happening. do you know how many people have been beaten, killed and humiliated by the so-called 'chomagh'. do you agree with that statement? 

here's a picture of someone meeting the chomagh.

http://iranian.com/main/2009/jun/unknown-martyr

if you agree with that statement, you don't have to explain any further. otherwise, you don't think that brutality is justified, then go and do a pak-nevis of your essay and come back. it must've been a simple comprehension problem.


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