Litany

Cliches, cliches, cliches...

"No not by him personally but Khatami stood by and did not utter a word. He watched them all helplessly and even so shamelessly approved of some of them."

This is not true. You don't know what you're talking about. You're just repeating some old cliches without even checking the facts. Otherwise, you would have known that Khatami and his proponents stood up against many of these atrocities. In some cases they obtained results and in others they failed. But they did something. Just be a little fair. Khatami was the one who dismantled the whole Ministry of intelligence and destroyed their operational capability. (I don't care if the judiciary followed up or not, the fact is that similar murders didn't happen since then). Khatami was the ones who formed the Constitutional council (Shoraayeh ghaanoon asasi) and pushed hard to free many of the journalists and bloggers despite having everyone (including people like you) against him. Khatami and his entourage were the ones who followed up each case at the "Commission asl-e 90" and made the Parliament tribune a tribune to condemn the abuses against students and co. and put pressure on the hardliners (if you even know of Zahra Kazemi's case, it's because of them. Just ask Mohsen Armin the things he did. I've asked).

Please stop repeating this nonsense propaganda like a parrot.

"I can google and find some of his speeches at different university gatherings he went to asking students to shut their mouths, in one he even told them "kay mikhayn shomaha adam beshin""

This is a lie. Khatami didn't tell them "key mikhaayn shomaaha adam beshin". Bunch of agitators started insulting him and interrupting his speech. They literally shouted insults and profanities. They didn't let pro-Khatami students ask questions. In no democratic country is such behavior allowed. What he told them was "Araam baashid ... Adam baashid". This is not an insult. This is not shutting their mouths! This is respecting order during a public presidential speech! It's the ABC of civility. You want the video? It's here:

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=qrZw-yGlyTk

And so what he told students "Adam baashid?!" They should! Are students SACRED figures? Are they some sort of Saints no one should offend? Come on! They disturbed the President during his speech and got yelled at. Big deal. They would have gotten kicked out by huge security guards with tazers had this happened in the US.

Besides, why don't you see beyond your nose? Just the fact that these students felt free enough to yell at the President, question him without any censorship and in public, insult him, call him names shows that the political environment Khatami had created allowed such dissent. Why don't you see that? In what other country in the Middle East are students allowed to act like that in front of the chief of executive?

Once again, think a little for yourself instead of repeating the same old cliches you've heard from Monarchists, Mojahedin-e Khalgh, agitators (like Tahkim Vahdat students) and sell outs.

"what did he reform then? A lot of people in power might have good intentions, what counts is to put them into action! just tell me that he had good intentions but he ain't got any power to implement them or just tell me that he got good intentions but he is too coward and chicken to put thme into action and I will shut up, but please don't take me and I am sure alot of people who agree with me as retards."

What did he reform?! Mostly mentalities. He created a generation of civil society activists. He changed the dominant political discourse within a political system where no one dared anymore to talk of freedom and dialogue. He acted as a teacher for hundreds of thousands of young people who looked up to him as a pacifist non-violent leader (in the Middle East mind you). He laid the ground for countless NGOs from which people like Shirin Ebadi surfaced. He laid the ground for important social movements like the women rights movement to take off. He crated a prosperous environment for pop music, art, the cinema and literature to develop and influence millions of people.

He was the one who gave a good image of IRAN to the world. He is respected among academics, world leaders and thinkers of the world. His "Dialogue among civilizations" theory is thought in universities around the world. People like the former President of the Swiss confederation work FOR him at his Foundation in Geneva. For God's sake snap out of yourself and think outside that little box of yours.

The sad this about people like you is that whenever something good is done in Iran, you say "its for the regime" and when they screw up, you complain! If a President succeeds in mobilizing world opinion, provide a good image of the country and improve the general life condition of Iranians, you would say "he did all that to save the regime's face". And if he doesn't (like Ahmadinejad), you scream at the top of your lungs. Make up your mind.

To conclude: Reform doesn't mean amending the constitution or radically changing the power structure. Reform should before all affect the grassroots. It should prepare a nation gradually. Teach them their rights. Show them the means to achieve their rights. That's what Khatami did, along with his extraordinary economic legacy.

It's easy to dismiss a huge movement like the reformist movement (with all its ups and downs) with silly one-liners like "the mullas must go". But for people who actually take the time to think in depth, the only solution is gradual change.

I just hope he is elected again because he is not only a good political leader, but he is also a formidable social leader whose passage would once again change the Iranian society for the good.

to Reza55555

"All the sad things you referred to (Zahra Kazemi, 18 tir, arrests..etc) were not committed by Khatami, but rather by the hardliners who tried to undermine his administration. "

No not by him personally but Khatami stood by and did not utter a word. He watched them all helplessly and even so shamelessly approved of some of them.

"The human rights violations you refer to were meant to pressure Khatami into abandoning his reform agenda. Why do you blame HIM for them? Why do you blame the only guy with good intentions here?"

What reform agenda? he called any mere mention of the slightest change to the constituion or powers of the Valayat-e-Faqih treason to the values and principles of the revolution! I can google and find some of his speeches at different university gatherings he went to asking students to shut their mouths, in one he even told them "kay mikhayn shomaha adam beshin"

what did he reform then? A lot of people in power might have good intentions, what counts is to put them into action! just tell me that he had good intentions but he ain't got any power to implement them or just tell me that he got good intentions but he is too coward and chicken to put thme into action and I will shut up, but please don't take me and I am sure alot of people who agree with me as retards.

"According to your logic, no politician should ever attempt to do anything good in Iran, because he will provoke the reaction of bad people, and there would be a cost. This is simply stupid."

No it is not stupid, it will be fatal in today's Iran even if that so called politican has good intentions and really wants to do something for the benefit of the people and the country and not just the establishment he is part of and it demand a lot of courage and determination on the part of that politician, but in all honesty we both know deep down in our hearts that kind of courage and determination is non-existent in Khatami. He proved it in the eight f.....g years he was the so called president of the IRI.

The man said it himself in his own words that the position of the president in the IRI is that of a "butler" (tadarokatchi) to the Supreme leader and that he could not do a damn thing about it.

In conclusion, regardless of what you and I think, we both know people specially the youth will go and vote for him any way just like they did vote for Rafsanjani last time out of a lack of a better choice to choose between bad and worse. He might be good for the IRI's image outside Iran, bring in some lucrative contracts for the IRI, but please do not insult my intelligence by trying to convince me that he can really REFORM a structurally unreformable system.

Muslim Reformers & Hardliners:

You can’t rehabilitate a murderous regime. Period. Murder is a deed that can’t be reversed or undone. The perpetrators must be punished and removed from power.

What is happening in Iran is beyond your comprehension. However, for the sake of other readers, I will attempt to explain:

Since any form of political dissent in Iran is confronted with brutal reaction of IRI thugs, political activists have sought many avenues of dissent. Hidden inside the “reformist” movement is the cry for freedom from tyranny. Similarly, passive resistance to unjust laws and the boom of non governmental organizations in pursuit of social causes and improvements are other examples of political dissent in Iran.

The day will come that we must confront IRI thugs with force. For now, we march to a different tune…

I probably shouldn't waste

I probably shouldn't waste my time debating with you. But it's so sad to see that there are still people like you who (ignorantly or shamelessly) attribute all the sad events that happened during Khatami's administration to Khatami himself. You don't seem to be able to make the distinction between what Khatami achieved as a President and what was done during his era by his opponents to stop him.

All the sad things you referred to (Zahra Kazemi, 18 tir, arrests..etc) were not committed by Khatami, but rather by the hardliners who tried to undermine his administration. If you're not capable of making the distinction, then I think you are the one in need of a serious head examination.

The human rights violations you refer to were meant to pressure Khatami into abandoning his reform agenda. Why do you blame HIM for them? Why do you blame the only guy with good intentions here?

According to your logic, no politician should ever attempt to do anything good in Iran, because he will provoke the reaction of bad people, and there would be a cost.

This is simply stupid.

To naive gullible Reza55555

"I urge you to take a look at United Nations Human Development reports (google it) and compare the country Khatami inherited with the one he handed over to Ahmadinejad. You would see how Khatami has by far the best record in all categories (when I say the best, I include the Shah's era as well - just read the reports). "

Hogwash! Did that report also include the chain murders of writers and intellectuals like Mokhtari, Pooyandeh,etc., the brutal murder of Forouhars in their own homes?!! did it mentions students being thrown out of their dorms' balconies for wanting their rights? All those thousands of students who were imprisoned, tortured, hanged or forced to flee the country for their lives? Akbar Mohammadi's sudden demise?! Ziba Kazemi's brutal murder in prison?! do you think people are that absent minded and short on memory?

Where do you think UN gets it data from other than IRI own government official sources? their data is just like CIA factbook's data on Iran, all gathered and collected from IRI own government official sources and websites and must be flushed down the toilet ... lol

I remember back at the Shah's time, the government always produced a clean dossier of its Human rights records for the UN, It was always the dissidents and human rights organizations they were in touch with which produced more factual reports of what was really going on in the country's prisons.

Vis-a-vis the impotent Khatami, Ahamdinejad has the backing and support of the most influential/powerful elements of the country disregarding the Supreme Leader, including the entire revolutionary guards and baseejee establisment, the Council of Guardians and all those turbaned dinosaurs in Qum firmly controlling all levers of power.

Besides, even if they ALL agree upon Khatami serving a third term for the sake of regime's survival, economy and its image abroad, do you honestly think it will be like 12 or 8 years ago?!!!!!!!!! If you think so, then you'd better get your head examined real good!

What you say is so out of

What you say is so out of touch with reality that I don't even know how to respond.

Ahmadinejad literally destroyed Iran's industry, ruined the economy, ruined our foreign relations and flushed all past achievements down the drain; and you still believe he is better than Khatami for the future. Based on WHAT?

I don't know what you base your analysis on, but if you really want to have a more objective and clear idea of what is really going on, I urge you to take a look at United Nations Human Development reports (google it) and compare the country Khatami inherited with the one he handed over to Ahmadinejad. You would see how Khatami has by far the best record in all categories (when I say the best, I include the Shah's era as well - just read the reports).

As for these wannabe students, they have nothing better to do than to agitate the atmosphere. They'll get beaten up and no one in the government would raise its voice.

You Khatamichees make me sick to my stomach

What rationality?

This time around it will be quite different. Those rabid dogs have learnt their lessons very well.

I believe Iran will be better off under Ahamdinejad. Mark my word, there will be much less torture, much less imprisonment, much less hangings, etc. etc. under him and much easier for Iran to approach the U.S.

Once again, just as the

Once again, just as the country's heading towards some rationality with the potential comeback of President Khatami, these overexcited wannabes are agitating the climate.

This is the typical scenario: The hardliners provoke students. The students react. The hardliners beat up a couple of students. Then the students get angry and turn against no other than Khatami for not taking a radical position in their favor.

This is an electoral stunt played numerous time by the hardliners. Each time our "brave" combative Che Guevara-wanna-be students fall in the trap.

It is amazing how with all their pretension, they always get used as convenient tools to bash the most moderate factions of Iran's political spectrum.

This is sad.

Stupid song to lower the cause

Stupid is stupid does. The song is a shame for the fadakari that the Irani kids are doing. we should write to the song writer and the singer

نگرانی دوباره

نگرانی دوباره از گسترش شپش در مدارس تهران، سرمایه
نگرانی ندارد ........گسترش شپش و سفلیس از نعمات وجود
ملا است

ملایان حاملان بردن شپش از دهات به شهرها و آوردن سفلیس
از شهرها به دهات ایران بوده اند !

زنان صیغه ای دور و بر حرم همگی حاملان و پخش کنندگان سفلیس
میان مردم ایران بوده اند و مردانی که اینان را صیغه میکرده اند شپش
را برای خانواده های شهری خود ارمغان سفر زیارتی میاورده اند

Students are shouting Basiji

Students are shouting Basiji boro gomsho! I like this one much better.

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=UytG8wByRIQ

Asking for Break Dancers

Sorry, I can’t give them up! They are my kin! I found out a few members of my family were dancing to this song last night and making placards. I asked them what they were doing, and they replied, “We are getting ready to fight!”

The young generation in Iran has the fervor to face the mullahs head on! I know full well that I must give them up someday to our motherland. For now, I hold on to them as hard as I can…

wrong! radio farda is the biggest joke

ever

i asked for break dancers Laleh!

Inspiring Lyrics

The words are inspiring. The music, though, is a matter of taste. Nothing is to be gained by quarrelling over the music.

No one claims that this song will overthrow IRI. The subject of the lyrics is charged with that burden. Let’s stand with them regardless of our different tastes in music.

I guess this is no joke!

//www.radiofarda.com/archive/news/20090225/14...

It's a joke!

the techno is too much, I agree with Abarmard.

where are the break dancers?

just like these clueless tehrangelesi's. they think making a MTV music video is going to overthrow IR!

stillnotfunny

ooooh someone IS part of the dooghaki oppositions in LA. Be proud of that, why the mad face? What I am should not be your concern Mr. democracy. toro sanana?

Abarmard

Nope. I don't get it! Are you also with the Iranian democracy movement when you google out IRI's doogh bag accomplishments on a regular basis? You're more pathetic than IRI thugs.

funny??

Absolutely not funny, but the song yes.

I hope that you are with the Iranian movement for democracy and not just goggling the doogh that a zoned out "opposition" in LA preaches. That's cheesy, and this song is cheesy not the great Iranian kids that live and die for what they believe. Got it?

Coming from the king of

Coming from the king of cheeziness is quite comical!

Seventy students are reported to have been arrested after the protests by AKU students against propaganda burial of 'unknown martyrs'.

Seven are reported to be in critical condition in hospital after having been physically attacked by Ansar Hizbullah hired thugs and twenty five are hiding in the student dormitories while the Islamic regime's forces have surrounded the university but as yet have decided not to enter the university grounds and attack the dormitories, in case another 9th July student uprising takes place.

Journalists, academics and students of the world, where the HELL are you?

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=pfhXjgrlgWk

Abarmard: DO you find this funny too?

lol

The song was really funny from the cheesy side