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DK Jaan

by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Sat Feb 18, 2012 09:13 AM PST

 

I agree with you just pointing out West did not really oppose IRI. Rather did its bit to help it! But yes most of the blames goes to the Iranian people of 1979. Particularly self styled intellectuals filled with *** are to blame.

Yes about unity you are right again. I know what they got in mind; it is pretty obvious who is with IRI.

In all honesty I do not see much coming from most groups.

VPK jan blaming foreign powers for our own shortcomings

by Darius Kadivar on Sat Feb 18, 2012 07:49 AM PST

is Easy

 

But history has proven time and again that it takes more than chidish Jealous rants for a nation ( let alone a people which often boasts of having 7000 years of civilization) to distinguish itself from others and become a role model in turn by always repackaging the old slogans in order to safeguard those in Power under one pretext or another:

 

 

BROKEN RECORD: Woman on IRI TV “We're Only good at shouting slogans since Shah Left” 

 

Iranians need to Grow Up and take Responsability for their own shortcomings first if they ever wish to contribute to a more constructive alternative for their own future and that of their own children.

 

Otherwise they will be merely an instrument of what they claim to be fighting against namely the IRI:

 

Press TV 'Investigates' Prince Charles 'Right To Veto' Laws

 

LOOK WHOSE TALKING ? Press TV denounces "Saudi Dictator Who Seeks to Halt Protests"

 

 

IRI Press TV claims 'Parasite' Queen Elizabeth II Fears UK Break Up

 

 

As such I find more in common with genuine Iranian Intellectuals who far from despising the West are inspired by them:

 

Daryush Shayegan Global Dialogue Prize Winner

 

than the likes of  amirkabear4u, MOOSIRvaPIAZ , Jaleho or Pendar Nik or other likeminds on this website who should maybe look in the mirror before lecturing me on where I or my likeminds should stand particularly when they keep boasting about the "Masses" and the poor "Mosta'azafs" back home but have absolutely nothing to offer as a blue print for change in order to make their lives any better or easier other than under the artificial cloak of "patriotism" taking the side of their "Republic" whenever it seems in danger or fragilized.

 

I have had sufficient exchanges with these folks over the years to know exactly what they mean by "Hambasteghi" !

 

And that is : safeguarding THEIR republic !

 

Fetchez La Vache

 

 

Well Sorry Not in my Book !  

 

What have the Pahlavis given us in return? (Monty Python)

 

 

 

 

Recommended Reading:

 

BBC News - Iran: UK diplomatic break is step into unknown by John Simpson

 

 

 

 

Dear DK

by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Sat Feb 18, 2012 04:26 AM PST

 

The situation in Iran is very complex as you know. Nobody has all the faults or the answers. Yes the devolution was a GIANT mistake no doubt about it. The "intellectuals" were and are at fault.

But it is also true that Britain and other Western nations do support IRI. They have sold them items that were used to repress people. Not to mention housing Khomeini and trashing Shah in Western media prior to 1979 train wreck.

We are never going to get to the bottom of this all. Nor will people get on the same page regarding the responsibility. The regime will go and an-tellectuals will still be debating '53 in nursing homes.

amirkabear4u if anyone supports the IRI survival it's

by Darius Kadivar on Sat Feb 18, 2012 05:26 AM PST

people like you and your likeminds (i.e: confused and stubborn coalition of JM, Islamists, confused Intellectuals with nothing to offer as a blueprint for change other than your frustrated complaints) who for the past 33 years have stubbornly opposed the emergence of a genuine Third Wave as a constructive Alternative to the Un Iranian Regime and Devolution you supported wholeheartingly merely because of your individualistic hatred of the Pahlavis.

 

COMPLAINING JOMHURYKHAH: What Have the Pahlavis EVER Done For Us ? ;0)

 

Who were Anything BUT the Sidkicks of the British:

 

Shah Of Iran Critisizing Britain

 

Nor of Israel or the US:

 

Shah of Iran & Mike Wallace on the Jewish Lobby

 

 

 

Yet so falsly depicted as such by you and your likeminds to this day while comfortably resding in the "Imperialist West" !

 

For someone raised by a devout Shiite mother and a committed socialist father, monarchy has never been my cup of tea. By Hamid Dabashi (cnn)

 

Ebrahim Golestan: "The Shah's Coronation Made Me Wanna Vomit" (BBC)

 

 

For Contrary to your understanding I don't Kiss European or UK royal Asses ...

 

Bill Maher - On Monarchy and State ;0)

 

 

I embrace the concept of a Constitutional Monarchy and I try to learn and observe how they were implemented in the first place and how they operate:

 

ROYAL FORUM: Explaining the Concept of a Constitutional Monarchy to a Staunch Republican

 

 

And try in my own modest capacity to intellectually offer a compatible model for Iran's future.

 

Crown Prince Reza on importance of "Checks and Balances" of future regime

 

 

 

So Yes European Monarchies DO inspire me in the same way Western Republics seem to Inspire you and your likeminds as an Ideal form of government.

 

So I don't see why I should apologize for it !

 

All the more that You Folks haven't apologized for the Republic and Revolution you so wholeheartingly supported only to deliver this:

 

HISTORY OF VIOLENCE: IRI's Reign of Terror Begins (BBC Report 1979)

 

 

Yet hypocritically claim Your Devolution was "highjacked" just to ease your own consicence.

 

Constitutionalist's Rebuttal of Republican Assessment that Revolution was "Highjacked"

 

 

So before asking accountability from us Constitutionalists from your High horse maybe you Jomhurykhah folks who claim you are such smart asses should explain why you failed your "Briliiant" and "Glorious Revolution" ?

 

Khomeiny, Gobtzadeh and Co in Neuphle Château France

 

And do so on your own Terms Without quoting Abbas Milani whenever you are running out of arguments ...

 

Shah Admonishes The Working Class: "Stop Praying All Day and Roll Up Your Sleeves"

 

And looking for pretexts to justify your own errors by blaming it on our policies. 

 

We constitutionalists have been accountable for our Past errors and even crimes when commited.

 

ROYAL ACCOUNTABILITY: Crown Prince Reza Praises Mossadegh's Patriotism (ANDISHEH TV)

 

ROYAL ACCOUNTABILITY: Crown Prince Reza on Torture During His Father's Rule

 

 

But Unlike you folks We don't play the hypocrite by presenting ourselves as Saints with no blood on our conscience with no intellectual responsability for our choices.

 

We Assume our Past with ALL the Positive and ALL the Negative and ALL the contradictions.

 

But we KNOW where we stand and always stood:

 

RESTORATION: Shapour Bakhtiar advocates Restoring the Monarchy

 

pictory: Bakhtiar Denounces Bazargan's Provisionary Government in exile (1979)

 

 

 

 

If you were such Smart Asses you would have known that democracy in the West was only possible because of the Separation of State and Religion commonly known as Secularism.

Yet from Day ONE what you folks were advocating in replacement of the Shah you wished to see toppled was Anything but That:

 

Khomeini: No Monarchy even if in a Genuinely Constitutional Form| Iranian.com

So don't blame us Constitutionalists for Your Own Poor Choice :

 

Gobtzadeh translates khomeyni hichi!! 

all the more that what you folks who boasted to be so "Openminded" and "Educated"  on the workability of "democracy" in IRan advocated a Republic which proved workeable First in the Western Hemisphere you so despised:

RESTORATION: Britain's 'Glorious Revolution' of 1688 and the 'Bill of Rights'

 

MONARCHICAL REPUBLIC: Political Participation in Elizabethan England

 

Maybe if you had done Your Homework and Learned from those GENUINE Intellectuals who defined and developed these political "concepts" 

 

HISTORY OF IDEAS: Ian Davidson on Voltaire's "English Exile

 

GOOD READ: All You Need to Know About The Enlightment Philosophers

Machiavelli's "The Prince" and the "Art" of Governing It would have avoided you from taking any crap coming out of the mouth of any Beesavad  à la Bahram Moshiri or Hamid Dabashi for granted and posing as  "Intellectuals" who barely understand the difference between Copy and Pasting these concepts and suggesting concrete steps towards implementing them:


HISTORY FORUM: Bahram Moshiri's Take on The French Revolution and Why He Misses The Point ;0)


And failing miserably in explaining how they are relevant to Iran's political and historical evolution:

MOSHIRI's COLD HAND's: Bahram Moshiri Slams Pahlavi Era Gun Ban Policies

 

The Vocal Minority you folks dismissed back in 1979 without even bothering to listen to their calls for Caution knew the calamity YOUR Devolution implied on Iran's future and tried to warn you against your own Intellectual arrogance.

 

 

VOCAL MINORITY: Pro Shah and Pro Bakhtiar Demos amidst 1979 Revolution 

 

Only to fall on Deaf Ears !  

 

But if it eases your conscience and personal ANN TELECTUAL EGO Congrats YOU WON ! 

 

SOURCES OF FURY:Nader Naderpour on origins of IRI's "Death Slogans" towards US and Israel

 

Pity that the Iranian People you claim to speak for have Lost in their legitimate demands for self determination.

 

 

CNN:Video exposes Iran crackdown on students at University  Tehran 

 

All that in the name of concepts like "Democracy" and "Human Rights" which your political family hardly put to practice !

 

pictory:(FOR REFERENDUM BASHERS) Women Punched in Face by Revolutionaries

 

Yet claimed to want to explain with your confused distortions ...

 

Mashallah Ajoudani on Intellectuals and the '79 Revolution

 

But Please allow me to wish a Happy Birthday to YOUR Glorious Revolution of 79 ! 

 

Shah Kar Kardeed Bekhoda !

 

 

 

 

The animosity

by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Sat Feb 18, 2012 02:45 AM PST

 

between groups is a big problem. I see it fanned on a weekly basis on IC. The basis of it are people who require absolute agreement. If you are not for "my" position then you are an ***. 

Some trash anyone who says one good thing about Shah. Others trash anyone who makes a single criticism of Shah or Mossadegh. We have no balance of thought. But I note mostly this is coming from the same people who were around in 1979. 

Still rehashing the old fights.  I don't think they are going to change. They are by now at least 50 or 60. People do not tend to change at that age. There will be change but not by people who are running these groups.

 

DK Jaan:

by G. Rahmanian on Sat Feb 18, 2012 02:36 AM PST

"We" didn't have to continue debating, if "we" were intelligent enough to unite.

The enmity that exists among some opposition groups is as nauseating as it can get. At times, though, I get the feeling such enmity is pretty shallow, too.

Taking into account the gravity of the problem of saving our country, it is extremely infantile to debate or even mention the past when the present is so demanding.

Got to agrree

by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Sat Feb 18, 2012 01:59 AM PST

that Amirkabir has a point. Why did his company provide IRI with mobile phone tracking? Why is Britain supporting IRI then whining about it specially William Hague.

correct DK

by amirkabear4u on Sat Feb 18, 2012 01:55 AM PST

Instead of kissing british royals back side, tell their government to stop secretly supporting IRI.

The way IRI behaves not even russia or china behaves. If you cared to notice they are creating a supper power of mullahs from junk. Then their people will say oh it is difficult to remove IRI.

 

Fairness and Equality in Justice

If true then we won't see and end to IRI in our life time ...

by Darius Kadivar on Sat Feb 18, 2012 01:47 AM PST

And we can continue debating on the so called "coup" of 53 and the virtues of "democracy" and the relevance or not of the "Green Movement" amongst our selves for another generation.

 

The future of Iran won't be decided by Iranians, with the Devolution of 79 we merely broke our alliance with the so called "Corrupt" West and "Great Satan" only to naively delivering our country to our new masters: China and Russia !

 

Neither of which are genuine Democracies unlike America and Europe which our Intelligentsia at large kept and keeps accusing of "Neo Imperialism".

 

Shame on the Iranian ANN TELECTUALS of 79 who did not evaluate the long term damage their advocacy of Revolution implied on our self determination.

 

If things change in the "rapport de force" between the Iranian regime and the people it won't be in our lifetime.

 

Be Prepared to Welcome to the New 'North Korea' ! 

 

And Thank you NIAC ... Khoub Maroh Ghaeedeen !