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Mirkarimi should be flogged, though he may like the fetish!

We know that he was a panty collector but we don't know for sure if he had other fetishes like being spanked or flogged while in women lingerie for being naughty and bad! 

Everything is sacred

Wrap up

I make two separate posts on two issues. One general and the other specific. I will tell you what I think and then call it a night on this topic. Because I don't have much more to say unless something new happens.

On the general Faramarz says that woman might get away with it. I agree and that bothers me. I don't know what is the right solution. I see the reasoning behind the law but I also see how it is applied and disagree with it.

Regarding Mirkarimi. I don't think the bruise was self inflicted. I don't know how it happened but I would guess it involved Mirkarimi somehow. For the rest I think the punishment is way too much and both sadistic and cruel. 

............

 VPK,

      Here is the news article excerpt:

//blogs.sfweekly.com/thesnitch/2012/01/ross_mirkarimi_update_sheriff.php

......While Lopez was at Madison's house, Mirkarimi saw the two were talking and purportedly told Lopez to come home when she was done. The witness later told police that the couple's young son had said "Daddy made a boo-boo on mommy's arm."....

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Do you think, Theo is a liar by saying "Daddy made a boo-boo on mommy's arm." ?

VPK

Do you want me to answer this question, “What happens if a woman self inflicts a bruise? Then makes a video and presses charges against the husband?”

Answer: She may get away with it or under questioning by the police they may find out that she is lying.

But your question has nothing to do with this case since neither Mirkarimi nor his wife disputed the facts.

You also put several bullet points as “Facts”, none of which are actually true. You also said, “He is making this statement under extreme duress.” which implies that he is lying. He is not lying. He is being truthful and is dealing with his issues.

Please remember that the first step on the road to recovery is admitting that you have a problem, as he has done. Denial is a typical reaction, but it will not help you resolve your issues.

......

VPK,

     So you think ELiana's bruise is self-inflicted or by Mirkarimi?

I said a "hypothetical" case not Mirkarimi!!

Faramarz & Yolanda:

I tried to make my questions as clear as possible. I have a hypothetical question which is separate from the Mirkarimi specifics. I put it up in a separate post as a question.

Please read my post instead of assuming you know what I mean. If you don't want to discuss it then please say so. 

Yolanda you are mixing the Mirkarimi case and my hypocritical one. They are different. I have two separate issues I am discussing. What you call "inconsistent" is two separate issues which you are mixing.

Faramarz: I asked you to please read it and tell me what you think. But your post simply repeats your previous about Mirkarimi. That was not my question so if you prefer not to respond just say so.

..........

VPK,

    Here is what you wrote:

*****************

You are inconsistent in many ocassions!

VPK

If you listen very carefully to what Mirkarimi’s wife says, she never disputes what has happened (the bruise, the imprisonment, etc.) What she is saying is, “leave us alone and let us deal with this issue ourselves, and let him keep his job.” In other words, she is saying that as a victim she should be able to decide if she wants to press charges or not. And that’s where the rubber hits the road.

Since in domestic abuse cases, especially against women, a wife is completely dependent on her husband (financially and otherwise), the laws are written in a way that the crime is not only against the victim but also against the State. So one cannot just forgive and forget.

Again, I urge you to accept his honest plea. Otherwise, you are saying that he was lying in front of the cameras which makes him unfit to be the Sheriff.

Dear Yolanda

I did not say that bruise was done to frame him. I posed a hypothetical case and if you guys want to twist my word: be my guest.

Faramarz part II

Here is what I have to say about his speech.

• No where in it did he say he had in any way done physical harm to anyone. 
• He
  is making this statement under extreme duress. Basically Gascon had a gun to his head. Specially with the "I don't believe him" statement by
  Gascon. A statement under this kind of pressure has no value.

The man has receive mental torture of unbelievable magnitude. To the sadistic joy of people posting on SFGate; Ed Lee and the "Domestic Violence" industry. It got so bad even Willie Brown had to back off. There is no way I am backing off this.

We have a right to be protected from cruel and unusual punishment. This is both cruel and unusual. There is a lot of shame to go around here. People have jumped on the band wagon and piled it on mercilessly. There are very few such as Agnos who showed any human decency. Rest just follow the mob like sheep and kick the man while down.

............

Thank you, Faramarz, for the video clip!

He admitted that he was arrogant and made mistakes! He also said that domestic violence is not a private matter!

He did not say that his wife faked the bruise to frame him! I believe his words! He accepted full responbility for his actions!

Faramarz

I listened to it several times. Please read what I write carefully and I read you and Yolanda. There are two separate issues: Mirkarimi and general law. I will first talk about the general issues then Mirkarimi.

General issues:

I want to know what you think of the way "alleged violence" is treated. I will repeat my question and please answer it.

What happens if a woman self inflicts a bruise. Then makes a video and presses charges against the husband?

There will be no actual proof. There will be no way for a doctor to examine her because the bruise is healed and the video cannot be cross examined or medically examined. Is the guy automatically to be kicked out of his home. Is he to be treated by the whole society as a pariah? Is he to then be put against the full might of the DA? Is he to be chased by hoards of "anti violence" activists? 

All this happened to Mirkarimi before he plead "guilty". In addition his wife denied the whole thing. But the DA went at it cheered on by activist. Is this fair? 

If you think so then please say it. I don't think it is fair. 

I do not know Mirkarimi. I don't support his politicts. I support fainess and justice and as such I resent laws and enforcement that that convict people without a fair hearring or inflict cruel and sadistic punishment on people.

VPK

Please listen to this clip.

Ross Mirkarimi is not a liar when he admits to his shortcomings. He is not walking away from what he did and what he needs to do going forward.

Let's take him at his word, instead of blaming others.

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFihimPoU1o

Yonanda

I am talking about objective justice: meaning did he do it and if so what did he do? That fact will be the same in Iran; in SF or on Mars. Please don't turn this into an Iran vs. America thing.

In addition the business about OJ is typical media sensationalism. One is a murderer the other might have held his wife's arm too hard. If you want to view them as identical fine but they are not in any real sense the same.

• Fact: there is no independent proof that he put the bruise on her. 
• Fact: throughout all this Lopez and Mirkarimi the only two witnesses able to talk say nothing happened. The only one saying there was violence is Madison who was not there. Repeated by Gascon; Nevious and SFGate.
• Fact: the video is not a person and may not be cross examined. Lopez says Madison put her up to doing it. You say she made it to cover herself in a custody battle. Either way it puts a huge doubt over its credibility.

How about this scenario below. Does the guy have a chance in San Francisco. Or is he going to have to submit to total destruction at the hand of angry and violent anti violence mob.

• A woman decided to dump a man.
• She gets picks a fight with him one night and makes sure the neighbors hear her yell.
• Nothing happens; the guy does not touch her or do any harm.
• She then goes and deliberately bruises herself. 
• Then goes to the neighbor and gets it videoed but does not go to the doctor.
• Once the bruise is healed and no doctor can tell it was self inflicted they take the tape to police.
• The guy is arrested and lynched.

...........

In Iran, Eliana's video testamony 'probably' would be totally discredited; but in US, her video and her bruise do have value!

There is no eye-witness to Nicole Simpson's murder, but OJ is a murderer! Many domestic violence cases have no eye-witnesses!

Ross' son is the eye-witness to the abusive incident!

The details

are based on DA allegations as reported by Ivory Madison. As we know she was not an eye witness. Is there any other verification of these? Did Lopez; Mirkarimi or an eye witness that will support this?

The reason I am skeptical is that both Madison and DA Gascon have ulterior motives. If we set aside what people may think of Mirkarimi or Lopez I'd hate to see someone convicted based on hearsay allegations by a neighbor specially when denied by the alleged victim. Otherwise any of us may be arrested simply because someone claims our partner said so. 

The much prized video has no value in my opinion. After all Eliana Lopez is a professional soap actress. It would be a trivial matter for her to make a video with any emotion she wanted because she is trained to do it.

PS:

I do know couples who have got in passionate arguments. There are people out there with strong emotions and the strogner the love the stronger the anger. Again I am not saying they are in love because I don't know them. I am just saying it is not beyond the realm of possibilites.

........

Here is the details how Mirkarimi manhandled his wife and shouted "Fu_K you" to his wife:

//www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2012/03/24/BA8S1NP2F2.DTL

It is scary! I don't see love between them!

Dear Yolanda

The blog you quote is "SFGate" which is taken over by POA. That and other political opponents of Ross. I do not consider them to be representative. 

If you read other blogs on SFGate aka Chronicle you will find a strong hard right wing bias. To a level which if true would make SF be more like Orange County. Maybe I am wrong but it is filled with the most vitriolic hatred of both Lopez and Ross.

Hi Yolanda

I really don't know what happened between them. All I know is bits and pieces from newspapers and so on. Much of which now being disputed by the people involved. So let me see what I know.

Yes it sounds like there was an argument and he was mean. I am not even sure whether he manhandled his wife. The bruise could have happened in a number of ways including manhandling. We are probably never going to know.

From personal experience I know couples who say really nasty stuff to each other. But never go beyond it and don't really mean it. They get back together; kiss; hug and make up. Again I really don't know if they love each other or not. But the fact that Lopez is backing him up even now speaks for itself. It should be fairly obvious he is not going to be rich anytime soon. Lopez has to know it so the alimoney argument does not make sense to me.

I figure either she really loves him or feels guilty. 

As for loving his son more that it not a surprise. I admit I always loved my children more than my wife. Maybe that is why she wanted a divorce! The instinct to love our kids is very deep and for good reason. We need it to make the human race propagate.

Love of our partner is not nearly as deeply seeded in us. I know many who divorce but few who give up their love for their kids. Sadly Mirkarimi's father was one such person. Probably why Ross does not want to repeat the mistake. Unfortunately the SF judges have quite possibly deprived him of his right to be with his son. Given that he was not in any way mean to his son this is very wrong.

........

.

.......

Hi VPK,

    There is nothing wrong loving his son more......his problem is that he yelled at his wife and man-handled his wife and caused bruise on her arm in front of his son........he also said to his wife, "You don't deserve to eat!" etc..........it sounds really mean!

What I meant is that he loves his son more than he loves his wife......he has been mean to his wife in more than one occasion! I have not heard him being mean to his son at all!

Yolanda:

But you did not answer my question. You certainly understand what I mean by that question.

Also, no matter how "accidental" the marriage may be, whose place/responsibility is it to end it? Is it the neighbor's?

Where has the "privacy" that you see or hear talk about gone?

BTW, do you think the neighbors will be offered a book deal to write one of those crazy thrillers that some gossip-hungry people will buy?

Duplicate!

Duplicate!

Yolanda

• You are right about Madison and the tape.
• Regarding their relation: None of us know how Lopez or Mirkarimi really feel. But it is very normal for a man to love his child. I know Mirkarimi did not want his son going to Venezuela with Lopez. That is perfectly reasonable. She want Mirkarimi to go to Iran with their son? I have joint custody and neither my ex or I would take our kids out of America without strong approval of the other. I wanted to take them to England. My ex said yes but I could tell she is not happy. So I decided to not go in deferrence to her feelings.
• Regarding his son. What is so strange about loving your kids more? I would hope that he loves his son more than his wife. After all our kids need us more than our partner. They are the next generation 

............

.

Dear readers

Yolanda may be mostly right or 60% right: I don't know. Regardless of how their family does the treatment the family got is abominable. Nobody should get that kind of treatment.

The neighbor pretends to be a friend of Lopez while plotting with the editor of SF Chronicle. The "DV advocates" shed crocodile tears over Lopez while stabbing her in the back. All this in the hypocrisy capital of America. 

I have a lot of personal friends in the "system". People I have known for 30 years or more and watching them approve of this deeply disgusts me. They try to justify it as "preserving the society" while in truth they defy all vestiges of reason.

Yolanda: One question!

What do you think of the Gestapo-style reporting of the "case" to the police by the neighbor(s)?

............

.

When the judge

allowed the tape and the ex he was in trouble and why he plea bargained. Faramarz you are absolutely right. Probably your reason for marriage is also right. However it is very possible she "loves" him now.

Basically I summarize:

• There may be plenty of love between them. At the same time Lopez may have wanted a divorce. I know this happens from personal experience. Love does not mean no divorce.
• I don't believe the charges against Mirkarimi. I think his please was in desperation not because of real guilt. People may disagree but innocent persons plea bargain. 
• I think the judges were very unfair to him. Why? I don't know. Maybe the climate; badly written laws or just that no judge wants to be seen as "soft on DV".

The whole process was an text book version of what not to do. The lesson is: do not trust your neighbors; the police; the judges; the DA and never the DV "advocates".

Sheila, I disagree with your disagreement

Once the judge allowed both the tape of her bruised arm and the testimony of her ex-girlfriend (who also claimed abuse) into the court, it was all over for him. It is true that a top-notch lawyer could have done more for him but his reputation would have been gone as a result of the trial.

I do agree that his wife feels guilty about what has happened to him and is trying to help. But you know, when she says that "She was in love with him, but she did not know him when she married him", I just shake my head. This is not about two teenagers falling in love, the girl gets pregnant and they have to get married.