MOJAHEDIN

For Islamic democracy & Rajavi in same breath?!

        What are you smoking bro? ;-)

No Brother for me either

Please keep that title for your Basiji brethrens.

You Can Call Me Al (or better MM)

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=AsEjsIbWq88

Sorry, Cockameini (...mami) is already reserved for Khomeini and Khamenei

Salman

Please do not refer to me as "brother". I am not your brother; MM may speak for himself. My brothers are loyal to their people who do not support MEK. You may repeat you statements all you want.

But at the end this is about MEK and criminal activity. How would you feel if your family were the victims of their bombings. How about the Kurds and Iraqi Shia who got killed by them. 

PS, I already said I have no problem with different ideas. From Islamic to Marxist all should be allowed in a democratic Iran. But murderers; bombers and traitors are not. I supplied the definition of Traitor; Murder and bomber are self defining.

When I hear cockamamie

I am reminded of a gradually increasing list of usernames, the latets additions are brother VPK and now you brother MM :))

For an Islamic democracy

SF

In the US, we use cockamamie to refer sometimes to Khomeini and other times to Khamenei.  Which one did you have in mind?

How did you feel when you watched Babak Khorramdin get betrayed to the Khalifeh and get slaughtered?  But, I tell you Rajavi is no where near Babak Khorramdin in our respect.

Salman

• Let us assume Mokanna was disfigured so what? It is not physical beauty that makes a man or a woman. It is what is in your heart and your deeds. Mokanna tried to free Iran of Arabs. Salman and as you pointed out Afshin both were traitors. What kind of a man works to destroy his own nation. Just because he is mad at his father: a spoiled brat. You so admire the real Salman. It is no surprise that you also approve of MEK. 
• Popularity is very important. Yes 40% of Northern Ireland are Catholics and let us say only half of them support IRA. That is still 20%. Plus they have strong support among the rest of Ireland. MEK does not have even 1% support in Iran. They have some 3000 members in Iraq. Let us say there are 10 times as many others outside Afshraf. That is still no more than 30,000. Compared to the 70-80 million Iranians that is still so tiny as to be irrelevant.

Hezbollah on the other hand is very popular among Shia in Lebanon. Some Christians also support them. Therefore they are included in the political system.

More cockamamie replies by brother VPK

I told you didn't I 

Firstly, since when stating a historic fact that Al- Moghane (masked prophet of Khorassan) used to cover his face becuase he was ugly and disfigured is an inslut but calling Sslman Farsi a traitor (among other titles) is a compliment?

 Only a cockamamie logic can come up with such nonsense.

 Secondly, popularity is and has never been the basis. In northern Ireland only 40% are catholics and 60% are protestants and a tiny minority are other religions - so you are wrong as always. IRI is not even popular among the catholics o what are you talking about my masked brother. Oh, sorry brother I forgot that you suffer from cockamamia!

 For an Islamic democracy

ham1328

Do you like to debat yourself? Pose a question like "when did you stop beating your wife". Then answer yourself! As a matter of fact many of us normal anti-MEK Iranians have jobs. I got to work every day.

Last night I worked until midnight on my real job. The non political job that pays my bills. Today I expect for work for about 10 hours. I am also raising several children with a little help from my ex. Unlike MEK I do not get paid by either AIPAC or Saudi. Nor have I once got paid by IRI. In fact as I told Arash I am on their sh*** list. If IRI wants to do anything for me they could send me an email via IC. Let me know and I will go down to DC to their interest section. Pick up my payment and be on my way :-) I asked a while ago that they send me a Qum rug. But they never did. Not even a bag of pistachio from Rafsanjani. So I am out of luck; no payment. They have not even given me back my confiscated family home. 

Responses

So far I get thrse lines of response supporting MEK:

• Salman: Insults about my avatar. The usual line about how Mukanna was ugly and so on. Dude: it is my avatar!
• Salman: Comparing MEK with IRA or ANC. In those ceases both movements had massive popular support. The MEK has no popular support. I explained already when there is popular support there may be need to accommodation. Why should any Iranian government IRI or post IRI accommodate MEK? They have no popular support hence no reason to support them.
• Abgosht: Blatant support for MEK. As Mehrdad says at least he/she is honest. So I give credit for honestly. But repeating "Rajavi can" does not make MEK good. This sort of brain washing is one of MEK problems.
• Some others: Claim we should forgive and forget. I say why? No nation forgives criminals. The USA has no statue of limitation on murder. When one commits treason;  one gets tried. Plain and simple.
• Some say IRI lacks the courts: I agree. I say let Rajavi cult free the Ashraf prisoners. They can decide. Some may get resettled in other nations,. Some go back and take their chances with IRI courts. Some may live in exile until there is a post IRI government then go back.

In short: it is not up to any individual one of us to decide the fate of MEK. Nor is it up to USA or EU or UN or anyone but Iran. The people of Iran through a post IRI government are the only ones to do so. Together as a whole a post IRI government may decided what to do. My vote has been: try and punish the leadership. Pardon the rank and file. Some may get light sentences depending on their rank. The MEK should be banned and dismantled for good.

Other political parties may be formed that include the same ideas. But not the baggage of treason and murder. As I said I have no problem with a Marxist or Islamic party. As long as its leaders have not committed treason or murder or bombing.

Cockamamie logic of brother VPK and a few others

look brothers and sisters if you want to argue just for the sake of argument, and have no better thing to do in life, please be brother Javid's guest and argue till kingdom come. But the word Cockamaimie must have been created for your type of debates.

Brother masked man,

Why do you just insist on a losing line of argument.  Your veil or mask has not only covered your face (Al-Moghana'e  was so badly disfigured he feared people would get frightened by looking at his face, so he masked it) but it has masked your brain from understanding a simple logical fact.  I have noticed that many other users of this site have noticed this side of you as our friend "oon yaroo" believes yor are an ayatollah!! Poor you, what have you said to deserve such as stature?!! The answer is cokcamaimie brother,

Let me educate you a little brother. There is a country called the United Kingdom of which there is a part called Northern Ireland. The Irish fought against the Brits for more than 150 years. After separation of southern Ireland (the present republic of Ireland) the northeners wanted to join their southern neighbours too (yes yes  before you come up with another cockamaimie point, I know they were cathloics and protestants, but this is beisde the point). The Irish Republican Army was created and they fought against the Brits in NI all that period, The IRI has killed 100 times more English civilians and military personnel than the MKO (MEK) can ever dream of beating their record in a hundred years (bombing. assasinations, armed combat against the British soldiers). They were Traitors par excellence!!

But in 1998 the political arm of the IRA, called Sien Fein started their  involvement in a process which was sealed under the Good Friday Agreement  which eventually saw members of the political IRA becoming integral members of the British Parliamentary democracy.

Now, if one of the worlds most notorious terrorist movements and the world's oldest parliamentary democracy can make peace, renounce violence and become part and parcel of British democracy then the MKO and any truly democratic government in Iran CAN and MUST be participating in the future of  a democratic Iran.

Now my Cockamaimie masked brother I am sure you will never give up your cockamaime arguments because you are not, despit your Zorasterian pretentions, seeking peace, you are seeking blood and this is a disease that there is not known cure for it. Oh the name of the disease ? It is called: Cockamamia :))) 

 For an Islamic democracy 

Is anybody in NIAC ashamed of defending IRI?

I don't think so, they all make a great living off of this cult like regime.

Abgousht: At least you are

Abgousht: At least you are not ashamed to overtly express your support for MEK.

As a few of other folks who are exhaustively defending this cult, yet ashamed of expressing their admiration and alignment openly.

Anyway, the scenario that you are describing may or may not happen. If it does happens however, it will describe what the expression in Farsi "az to chaleh darmadim o oftadim to chah"

'Vahdat' is the main key to victory 

Mehrdad

P.S. Of course if you are being sarcastic about your suggestion then my apologies in advance for not getting the sense of humor. When it come to betraying Iran and Iranians, I will lose all my sense of humor.

Veiled Proph. of Khor....

You are too pessimistic. You need to be an optimist.

Repeat after me:

Yes, MKO can!

Yes, Rajavis Can!

Yes, we can!

Abgousht

You are dreaming. Picture this: I buy a 1 $ lottery ticket and win 1 billion dollars. Then donate it to the poor and all poverty is vanquished from the world. Then Martians land and solve all our problems.

Dude, who are you kidding here. If Rajavi were to take over the whole of Iran will be Camp Ashraf. Plus no one will accept them so various regions will rebel. Do you think Kurds will accept Rajavi as "President"? There will be a massive civil war. Asymmetric warfare and Iran will look like Iraq or Afghanistan. Disintegration will be very possible. Rajavi would not give a damn. As long as they get to rule Tehran guarded by American troops. Just as Karzai never stepping out fearing the people.

Au contraire, a Good Idea!

Picture this, first MKO will be delisted and form the interim government of the Democratic Republic of Iran (DRI) . Next, the US government will impose an airtight land, sea, and air embargo and sanctions backed up with military threat. Then, through a series of covert operations, the higher echelons of the IRGC will be subdued resulting in the demise of the supreme leader, his close circles, as well as the president. Once the old government decapitated, Masoud and Maryam Rajavi will take a once in a life time triumphant flight to Iran and head the new government. A new constitution will be drafted. The new governmental branches will be established backed up by a new army. A few hundred thousands of mullahs and relatives will quietly disappear into the air. And the rest is history where all Iranians will live happily ever after.

Don't worry mustaches and scarves will disappear too?

نگران مجاهدین نباشید

ANC

Is a very good example. In that case the "White" government did a "truth and reconciliation" process. Where a general amnesty was declared. This is done when the "other" party is either too popular or powerful. It does not mean they are not guilty of some actions. It means that it is not realistic to prosecute them. Besides their leader Nelson Mandela is a decent peaceful man. He paid his dues by years of prison in South Africa.

MEK is neither powerful nor popular. Their leader Maryam Rajavi is neither decent nor peaceful. She has been living in luxury in France and never took one risk. Therefore no Iranian regime will be obligated to pardon her or MEK. The only way would be for UISA to occupy Iran and force MEK down Iranian throats. It will be a repeat of the Mossadegh fiasco. Which to this day haunts US Iranian relations. Does USA really want to force an unpopular group on Iran once again.

Ones's logic is the other's fanaticism

ANC attacked South Africa's government and white community but now they rule that country.

One's traitor is the other's liberator!

 For an Islamic democracy

Another example

In Spain the Basque group ETA is considered terrorist. Because they attack targets in Spain. The same group is not considered terrorist in France. Because they do not attack targets in France. 

The fact that France has no problem with ETA matters not in Spain. In the days of wild west criminals regularly crossed state lines to escape justice. Because a murder in one state was not a criminal in another one. After the central government remedied this they started to cross borders to Mexico. To this day we have Nazi criminals living in Latin America. They are not prosecuted because their crimes did not happen in those nations. 

Salman

Do you understand logic or don't you? The American definition says a traitor to America has to owe allegiance to America. MEK do not owe allegiance to America. Therefore cannot be traitors to America. They are supposed to owe allegiance to Iran. They attacked Iran on Saddam's side during the war. Therefore they are traitors against Iran. What amazes me is the inability of people to understand simple logic. Or maybe I should not be amazed after all they did see Khomeini on the moon.

Re: Hezbollah

There is no party I know of named Hezbollah in Iran. Now if some group wants to open up a party and call it Hezbollah I have no poblem. As long as:

• Their leadership has not committed treason.
• Their leaders have nut murdered Iranian.
• Their leaders have not bombed Iranians.

It is not the name or ideology but people of MEK and their actions.

Traitor by whose justice?

Yours or a demcratically represented justice system bother. Remember, US is not Iran my dear masked brother. Besides the US is about to delist the MEK so if its is OK for the US, according to your own example, is OK for Iran :)

 For an Islamic democracy

Salman

MEK is an organization led by Rajavis who are criminals. Having them in politics is like having the Mob run candidates. No nation allows traitors and criminals to go free. The US {a democratic nations} has this law:

•  2381. Treason: Whoever, owing allegiance to the United States, levies war against them or adheres to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort within the United States or elsewhere, is guilty of treason and shall suffer death, or shall be imprisoned not less than five years and fined under this title but not less than $10,000; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.

Why should Iran be any different in its laws? The MEK took up arms against Iran in the war with Saddam and are hence traitors. Why should Iran be required to allow traitors to run for office.

Hezbollah is not even an Iranian party. It is a Lebanese party and therefore not a matter for Iranian politics. Do you get it or need I repeat myself.

Amir

The two you mentioned are the ones caught with their pockets filled and admitted.  May be more to come.  For example, here is a brief history of MEK and Trita Parsi - MEK also tried to recruit Bob Ney.  While Ney initially agreed, and took $4,000 from MEK members in 1995, he shortly thereafter changed his mind (total of $204,000 over a span of three and a half year period, from April 1993 through November 1996 were spent) after talking with Trita Parsi (an intern in Ney's office) who described the MKO as an Islamic cult hated by ALL Iranian factions.  Under Trita Parsi’s influence, Bob Ney became an avid opponent of the MKO and he even identified the MKO contributor, Alireza Jafarzadeh, on Fox news and demanded his removal.  MEK has remained a sworn enemy of Trita Parsi since then.

I am very sympathetic to the plight of the MEK foot-soldiers.  The majority (up to 70% according to the Rand Report, page 18) were captured due to fraudulant recruiting practices.  Please read page 18 of the report for yourself.  They are Iranians who were promised the world and now have sub-level existence.

Why should we, Iranian-Americans, look at what EU has done for guidance.  And, why should we leave these Iran-related decisions to others to dictate to us.  Let's, as an Iranian-American faction, decide for ourselves and let our politicians know what we want, with or without NIAC.  Again, my old research boss used to tell us: "You need to say what you want to do, or else you will be told what to do".

In a future democratic Iran ALL parties must have a say

I am really at loss to understand why and how a democratic process can exist or succeed without full participation of all political parties, even Hizbollah let alone MEK.

 For an Islamic democracy

MM,

I didn't say that Bahari was "anti-Iran", just that the claims he makes (and are echoed by NIAC) about "MEK sympathizers" running around in Iran throwing Molotov cocktails during the 2009 protests are unsubstantiated, and I think very suspect. I never mentioned Ebadi at all. Two of the folks who have recently been apparently discovered as paid to speak for the MEK are Howard Dean and Wesley Clark -- neither are neocons (and perhaps may actually be described as "anti-neocon"). Robert Torricelli, who is in the picture with Maryam Rajavi, is not a neocon. Some of the the European politicians supportive of the MEK include Socialists. On the other hand, Michael Rubin is a prominent neocon opposed to the MEK. I'm not saying there aren't neocons who support the MEK, just that there are many exceptions to this accusation. I do agree with your suggestions about cleaning up the MEK in a major way, including sidelining the Rajavis and opening up Camp Ashraf (but not allowing it to be assaulted again with even more loss of life).

Amir Agha: We will agree to disagree

Delisting, as currently they are without any change in direction, leadership or ideology, is the first step in legitimizing them as MEK that many IRANIANS have known and rejected for decades now.

'Vahdat' is the main key to victory 

Mehrdad

Dear VPK, the only friends

Dear VPK, the only friends Saudi's have are those who provide them cover for their ABSLOUTE dictatorial and border-line barbaric way of life

And frankly to expect and use any advise by Saudi king is to endorse that barbaric regime.

As you have rightly said, Iran has many enemies, not only at home (IRI) but also in the region and far.

Divide and conquer has proven most affective specially in a third world countries such as Iran and other ME countries that mistrust has been high and education low.

The sad part is that creating division among Iranians seem to be on the high priority and many of us knowingly or unknowingly participating and playing our part.

I hope we can break that cycle.

'Vahdat' is the main key to victory 

Mehrdad

Amir

Irregardless of the impression that Maziar Bahari or Shirin Ebadi are now "anti-Iran" because of their interviews with NIAC, the fact remains that most US supporters of MEK are either neocons or have been paid up to $25000 to speak on-behalf of MEK.

We should instead talk about under what conditions should the MEK be de-listed from the terrorist list.  Besides the good suggestions in Aynak's blog, my personal preferences are 1. for the top level MEK (*) to retire / go away, and 2.  the MEK open up the camp Ashraf doors and let the foot soldiers to decide what they want to do.

(*) I consider the MEK top level those who remained married when Rajavi declared that all MEK members should divorce their spouces and remain celibate.

Bavafa

De-listing the MEK does not entail support for their ideology, which I have described on Iranian.com as "lousy Islamist leftist" or their past collaboration with Iraq. I find promotion of a "deal" between the U.S. and IRI and opposition to meaningful sanctions against the IRI to be far more wrongheaded and counterproductive policies than the removal of the MEK from the U.S. list of terrorist entities (which has already happened in Europe anyway).