Iranian of the Day

MG jan

Big Blunder ? what big Blunded? Did you not see what happened and how each and every single one who were out on the streets were put in the bottle never wanting to come out again or be sent somewhere else instead of the bottle? What is with The wild fantasies??:)

People in iran do not need and want a spark of any size and intensity to cause anything. They want much more than that. I hate to say this, since i reall respect your logic and wisdom, But The "subtelties" of "maximalists" here is an extremely inappropriate and misguided analogy. I mean, Unless of course you are applying that to people other than the ones on IC. since when it comes to those in iran, Mostly, are sick and tired of playing around with words and concepts and wasting time. You get what i am saying Playa?:)

 I think bahmani is a die hard fan of The brazilian team and that is where the yellow thingy comes from. Right B man?:)

G. Rahmanian

Hezbollah? That's the only one I can think of.

Parham:

Guess which organization brandishes yellow flags. Is Bruce implying something, here?

What is urgently needed in Iran is the slightest, and I mean the

slightest opening of the political scene.

Let us recall that IR's big blunder back in 2009 election was to let people freely campaign for two weeks before the voting, and mistakenly thinking that after those two weeks it would be able to simply put the people back into the bottle. That's not exactly what happened, as we all know.

Regardless of the reformers intentions (and their desire to maintain IR in a modified version) even now three years after election, a most simple act of freeing these three persons could provide the spark to ignite the big fire, and SL and his gang are very much aware of this fact. 

Ofcourse such subtleties are always lost to "maximalist" ideological minds. Not that we have any such persons here on IC ofcourse, godforbid!!!

P.S. Yeah Bahamni, where did you come up with that color?

P.S.S. Most succesful protests I've been to always had a multiplicity of colors present in them, they had the traditional national tri-colors, monarchists royal flag, red flag, the green flag,...Now, that's unity in diversity, and our ultimate solution.

Bruce, where did you get

Bruce, where did you get that yellow from?

Well at least they got one right!

I just can't lose sleep over Mousavi.

Maybe it's because I can remember what he was.

People Of Iran! When the SL picks Ahmadinejad and Mousavi and tells you to pick the one you like the best, it's not a choice!

You are only picking a lottery winner who gets to call Khamenei , "Master".

Also Green is only the color of Islam. It just happened to be the color of Mousavi's campaign. It's not the color of the green in the Iranian flag, and it certainly was not the color of the resistance movement.

The true color of Iran's resistance movement was yellow.

To read more bahmani posts visit: //brucebahmani.blogspot.com/

two separate issues

Even though I believe Moussavi was guilty of participatng in crimes of 1980s in Iran, I have no problem asking for end of house arrest for him and others. He was put under house arrest for resisting the cheating in 2009 elections and his house arrest is part of the IRI's oppression against 2009 movement in Iran. As such, we should ask for end of his arrest. Now, when we have a free Iran, he will probably be put on trial.

Dr. Mohandes

It's fine to disagree. Hopefully we can continue this discussing in the near future.

vildemose

That comment was not meant for you. Thanks for reading.

totally exaggerated statements

Abarmard.

You can not possibly be farther from the truth of the matter. 

Sure! we have supposedly been successful in gaing deeper insights on our traditional values and own culture, but to no avail! Where are the tangible benefits? Why are there strict repressive measures in place, so that when someone dares to voice a new approach that to some degree might come across as having a hint of dissent, are applied and executed to the harshest possible level?

What is the god damn point of realizing these so -called values when you can not act up on it in a positive and procductive manner? I guess we need that just for the sake of realizing them. 

I could not believe my eyes reading your assertion that it was only during shah's reign that we had the misfortune of witnessing a single elite category of people to advance as high as they did. Wow . I guess it is"social equlity" all over the place in iran. Not a damn sign of eliticism and the benefits and kick backs that come with it.  I must be blind then.

of course he has to be freed, so

that he can be arrested, transported to prison, tried and imprisoned for some proper charges.

The day some of us learn how

The day some of us learn how bad it is to have killed people, or to have closed your eyes on it, will be a good day.

Why the double standard? What's the meaning of UNIVERSAL ?

It's either unacceptable to have any political prisoner or not?

My presumption is that everyone who has commented on this thread up to now is opposed to jailing of people based on their political ideas. So what's with this double standard?

Some people here sound like: "Of course we hate to have political prisoners , but Musavi deserves it!"

This is exactly the kind of mentality that got us here.

There are hundreds and thoudands of other political prisoners in Iran that get much worse treatment than Musavy and deserve our collective support a lot more than any former official of IR. And Musavy is responsible for massacres of early 80's when he was the Prime Minister. Having said all that, now that he is a political prisoner himself, regardless of what we think of his background ( and I for one have been opposed to him all my adult life) he deserves to be freed.

Ofcourse in a free and democratic Iran all former officials of IR shall be held accountable for their crimes. But for now our collective task is to raise the issue of political prisoners in Iran and ask for all of them to be freed.

That means all of them (the ones we agree with, and the ones we don't agree with). Unless we adopt a universal approach to this issue, we're not any better than IR itself. Cheers

G. Rahmanian And of course,

G. Rahmanian

And of course, I only said "if only for his statements about the 1988 mass killings". You are right. One could also count his support for continuing the war when it could have ended and Khomeyni decided it shouldn't.

Bavafa

Imagine Adolf Eichmann in the same situation. A civilized crowd might wait to take him to Nuremberg (for example), but it certainly wouldn't elect him as President -- or prisoner of the day for that matter!

And people, do NOT come up with the "but Khomeyni killed tens of thousands and Hitler hundreds of thousands/millions" argument. There is no real difference as long as you're killing or mass killing.

 Abarmard: As usual you

 Abarmard: As usual you cannot connect the dots...The articles I posted were not for you to begin with. I know you too well to know that you will never comprehend the connections...

A state of war only serves as an excuse for domestic tyranny.--Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn.

Laws in socially backward nations

When one talks about laws in socially backward society by bringing examples of European based nations, then consider this as a hint of reality:

-Europeans had gone through gradual modernity in their societies for hundreds of years. Their art had gone from classic to romantic, passing various stages until it reached modern and neo modern era. If you see savage mentality in Western society, it is not because they did not have social growth, their culture has been based on militaristic and capital, where promotes slavery and superiority to other beings.

East and Iran is not the same. We have more humane culture and behavior; we were stuck in classic age for centuries and socially did not grow. Industrialization was a big factor in keeping Iran and other Eastern nations under control. That's why we are socially not grown.

US population had come from Europe. Granted that they were savages in many sense but the core understandings of social modernity was embedded in their mindset.

In Iran, only during short period of Shah in 1975, a class became empowered that were westernized, and after the revolution the society began questioning its traditions. Gradually but surely the Iranian society has gain some understanding on its own based on its own values and culture.

Do good laws and good system matter? Absolutely, but recall my example about Zahedan and a woman that was set free. That was the Iranian society a few decades ago. We have come a long way in a short period. That includes our art and literature, in decades we have travelled 100 years.

well, well, well, I was waiting for this, but as they say....

گذار پوست، به دباغ خونه می‌رسد.

 AN summoned to

 AN summoned to testify:

 //www.nytimes.com/2012/02/08/world/middleeast/iranian-parliament-summons-ahmadinejad-to-testify.html?_r=1&partner=rss&emc=rss

A state of war only serves as an excuse for domestic tyranny.--Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn.

Mash Ghasem,

I don't doubt that a number of political prisoners have been released by the IRI due to international pressures (which I support). But, for every one that is released there are many, many more whom the IRI does not yield to such campaigns and keeps them locked up in jail (in other words, the fundamental root cause is left untouched). The key is getting at the root cause of political prisoners in Iran, namely the existence of the Islamic Republic itself. 

Parham: That reality...

Need to be determined in a [just and fair] court of law and not IC court.  He may very well be held responsible and guilty for his past deed, but only an irresponsible and mob mentality nation will hold someone guilty without a fair trail

'Hambastegi' is the main key to victory 

Mehrdad

Parham:

Let's not forget accountability for the war crimes committed by the regime. Example: Sending underage kids to war fronts!

One thing about Mousavi is

One thing about Mousavi is that even if he were to be released under a democratic system, he'd surely go to real jail immediately for his role(s) under the Islamic Republic, as there will be a load of people who will accuse or incriminate him. So don't hold your breath you all. There are quite a few barking up the wrong tree here.

Honestly, I think he would be recognized as guilty if only for his statement(s) about the mass killings of 1988. So it's not a matter of liking or not liking such or such prisoner/person under arrest, but a matter of simply being able to see/grasp reality.

social evolution and laws

 //www.worldacademy.org/content/society-individuality-and-law

 social evolution you say:

Tue Feb 07, 2012 at 05:51 AM PST

A state of war only serves as an excuse for domestic tyranny.--Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn.

Shifteh must have touched a nerve!

All the site warmongers seem to be here in full force to attack her.

Maximalist nonsense and INSTITUTIONALZATION OF DEMOCRACY IN IRAN

Amir Jan, I assure you there have been more than a handfull political prisoners in Iran that HAVE BEEN FREED DUE TO INTERNATIONAL PRESSURE, AND THE HEAVY COST THAT HAS BEEN CREATED BY INTERNATIONAL CAMPAIGNS TO FREE POLITICAL PRISONERS.

Case in point MR. Mahmoud Salehi, a labor activists from Kurdestan. The specific reason for IR to free Mr. Salehi was IR's desire to become a memeber of ILO (International Labor Organization). At that juncture Iranian labor actvists were able to raise the issue within ILO, which resulted in ILO's official protest to IR, and IR release of Mr. Salehi.

But more important than tactical concerns, what we need to learn to understand and internalize is the fact that there should be NO POLITICAL PRISONERS IN IRAN. NO ONE SHOULD BE IN JAIL BECAUSE OF THEIR IDEAS. IF we could pass this one little step, then we might be, just might be, one step closere to having an institutionalized democarcy in Iran.

You can call for the ALL political prisoners to be released, you

can sign all the petitions you want, you can "proclaim your solidarity", you can "highlight their plight" -- but none of these actions, which may be noble but are essentially "feel good" measures, will reduce the imprisonment of the IRI's political prisoners by one millisecond. Let us be honest with ourselves: nothing short of regime change (which means strangulating the Khomeinist terrorist tyranny) can do that.

Harpi-Eagle

You have a point. I am not 100% sure that he is the one who either killed, ordered the killing, agreed with the killing or anything in that nature. I am not sure so I am not going to make a statement about it. I just tried to put things in prespective, because not everything is as black and white. I recall that he was concerned with economic situation during the war as a prime minister who was challenged by all sides from Khomeini's group, Khamenei's and people like Khalkhali...Other than that I am don't know anything about him.

We need laws that are enforceable, Not false evolution

by Abarmard on Tue Feb 07, 2012 02:05 PM PST

Read the article. It was only less than 50 years ago that the most progressive democracy in the world used to lynch its own citizens.

 //www.dailykos.com/story/2012/02/05/1061724/-Posters,-billboards-and-white-privilege?detail=hide&via=blog_1

If all the civil rights laws are removed from the American society by  reactionary forces such as teapartiers and Gingrich souther constituents, we will see lynching, slavery, women right to vote, women right to reproduction, discrimination based on gender, race, income will rear its ugly head even in America in 2012.

Evolution is a mere mirage that will never happen in Iran as long as there are always reactionary vocal and powerful religious minority (even in America through church) will systematically and precise calculation will counter even the smallest movement toward englightement.

A state of war only serves as an excuse for domestic tyranny.-hleksandr Solzhenitsyn.

What's so hard to understand about UNCONDITIONAL SUPPORT FOR ALL

political prisoners in Iran, regardless of their background, ideas, gender, nationality,...

Untill and unless we get two simple points:

1) Freedom of Speech

2) Unconditional support for ALL POLITICAL PRISONERS

We shall always be stuck in the Dark Ages.

Not sure why, but I'm reminded of this song by Elvis Castello, enjoy

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RVDQgVxprE

Subliminal Propaganda!

"I would just like to remind all of us that none of us have any position or credibility in the real political scene of Iran."  

The above statement demonstrates how successful the regime in Tehran has been in propagating one of its most subversive subliminal messages. 

To repeat this message as often as it is being forced on readers and contributors on this site, is a flagrant manifestation of either a lack of understanding of its implications or calculated complicity with the regime in silencing the voices of millions of Iranians living in diaspora.

Most Iranians living in exile in diaspora, have not chosen to do so wilfully. They have been forced to live away from their beloved country as a result of the undemocratic and inhuman policies of the Islamists in power in Tehran. 

To millions of Iranians living in diaspora and inside Iran, Mousavi, having served as the Prime Minister of the Islamist regime for eight long years, represents one of the darkest and most repressive chapters of the post-'79 era in our country. 

Let's not forget, even for a fleeting moment, that Mousavi is adamant to take Iran back to the so-called, Khomeini's "Golden Era!" He has, more than once, stated his fixation with the bloodiest years of the rule of the Islamists. 

Leniency towards such policy upheld by the likes of Mousavi, constitutes a dangerously erroneous assumption that Mousavi and his ilk are reformed revolutionaries, while entailing an act of treachery with regards to the aspirations of tens of millions of Iranians yearning for democracy and democratic freedoms.