Misc

Jaleho

What the wikipedia article hints at is not in the Torah. This is what the Torah says (Ezra 4:3-7):

3 But Zerubbabel, and Jeshua, and the rest of the heads of fathers' houses of Israel, said unto them: 'Ye have nothing to do with us to build a house unto our God; but we ourselves together will build unto the LORD, the God of Israel, as king Cyrus the king of Persia hath commanded us.'
4 Then the people of the land weakened the hands of the people of Judah, and harried them while they were building,
5 and hired counsellors against them, to frustrate their purpose, all the days of Cyrus king of Persia, even until the reign of Darius king of Persia.
6 And in the reign of Ahasuerus, in the beginning of his reign, wrote they an accusation against the inhabitants of Judah and Jerusalem.
7 And in the days of Artaxerxes wrote Bishlam, Mithredath, Tabeel, and the rest of his companions, unto Artaxerxes king of Persia; and the writing of the letter was written in the Aramaic character, and set forth in the Aramaic tongue.

Which evidently shows the problem still persisted through the time of Ahasueres and Artaxerxes as well, and that is the time when the letter writing by Samaritans to Persian kings had started. What the article mentions without a source is among the usual practice of Midrash that tries to take any hint of the Torah and make a story out of it that usually has little or no historical basis. Of course you can dispute the Torah itself as you did, but the Torah is the source where all this comes from. The Midrash is way less reliable and so using one and casting doubt on the more reliable one is not rational, wouldn't you say? Wikipedia is not always a reliable source, does not always provide the correct context for the claims it makes. Boasting about things without the having the background is also not well advised.

A mullah in Iran: "This Year is the Year of preventing the Youth

The impetus for such anti-Iranian propaganda is the new movement inside Iran toward the great return...

mullah in Iran: "This Year
by swp (not verified) on Sat Nov 08, 2008 07:00 PM PST

A mullah in Iran: "This Year is the Year of preventing the Youth to convert to Zoroastrianism

امسال سال جلوگیری از جوانان شیعه برای زرتشتی شدن است!

//news.gooya.com/didaniha/archives/2008/02/06...

Iranian Cleric: "People Loath the Clerics"
It is always better from the horse' s mouth:
'In the beginning of the revolution, the clergy had a lot of respect amongst the people, but some of the clergy haven't conducted themselves well and have abused their position and therefore are no longer looked up to by the people, I am worried that the Baseej [IR Militia] may end up the same.' ISNA reported Hojjat-ol-Islam Mahmood Doaii saying this during a seminar of Baseej and the Media held in Mashad.
Doaii added, 'Sadly I have to admit this, although there are some clergy who are pious and shy away from wealth and power, but the enemy's plots have resulted in the population loathing the clergy. Now the enemy is trying to do the same with Baseej'.
//www.isna.ir/ISNA/NewsView.aspx?ID=News-1225...

Zion and sickofislamists

Zion, regarding Cyrus and the jewish temple, I know for you Torah is the word of God, but for me it is another book which has some history mixed with some Jewish-oriented myth, a good chunk of which is borrowed from previous philosohies like that of Hammurabi, and ancient Egyptians, Indians, Zoroastrian...and other ancient cultures. history is history. Here is section from wikipedia for you:

Religion

The only known example of his religious policy is his treatment of the Jews in Babylon. The Bible records that a remnant of the Jewish population returned to the Promised Land from Babylon, following an edict from Cyrus to rebuild the temple. This edict is fully reproduced in the Book of Ezra. As a result of Cyrus' policies, the Jews honored him as a dignified and righteous king. He is the only Gentile to be designated as a messiah, a divinely-appointed king, in the Tanakh (Isaiah 45:1-6). However, at the time, there was also Jewish criticism of him after he was lied to by the Cuthites, who wanted to halt the building of the Second Temple. They accused the Jews of conspiring to rebel, so Cyrus in turn stopped the construction of the temple, which would not be completed until 516 BC, during the reign of Darius the Great.[36]

And sickof, Toofan addressed me a post in which he brought up Hemmurabi. My comment was an answer to him. But, I am glad that you learned a thing or two about another ancient King except for Cyrus the Great.

Disgusting anti-Semitism : Even a blasphemy in Islam!

HA's trash talk is an example of disgusting anti-Semitism, which funny enough would be a blasphemy in his own Islamic dogma!

All the successful minorities have been used, abused and prosecuted throughout history; and that of the Jews has been a recurring nightmare. Now, when such minority tries to defend itself by crushing its enemies; funny enough they are invariably portrayed as demons! Say why would the Achaemenid Jews rise in the Purim to defeat the people who were conspiring to kill them? Why would the Israelis fight the combined Arab armies bent on wiping them out? Why can't these people just sit still and wait for us to finish them off, and rid the world of their demonic menace??!!

As for the Islamic point of view, at the time of Xerxes (pre-Mohammad), the forceful defense of the god believers (the Jews) against the non-believers (the Magi) would have been a sacred act sanctioned by the almighty. So why would a self described Islamist take issue with that? Plain and simple: it is disgusting anti-Semitism which is now playing in Iran, abusing even the glories of the Achaemenids, that they consider TaGhoot! 

Arash M-K

Jaleho: I must admit, you're

Jaleho: I must admit, you're good at conflating topics to make your points.

No one is denying Hammurabi's contributions. Why are you using Hammurabi to discredit the contributions of pre-Islamic Iran???

Grow up.

The Golden age of Islam is a Myth:

Jaleho: How many times do we have to debunk your assertions.

The Golden age of Islam is a Myth:

Read the comments.

//iranian.com/main/2008/golden-age-persia

The Myth of Golden Age of Islam
by sickoflies (not verified) on Thu Oct 30, 2008 03:50 PM PDT

..."From Spain the Arabic philosophic literature was translated into Hebrew and Latin, which contributed to the development of modern European philosophy. In Egypt around the same time, Moses Maimonides (a Jew) and Ibn Khaldun made their contribution. A Christian, Constantine "the African," a native of Carthage, translated medical works from Arabic into Latin, thus introducing Greek medicine to the West. His translations of Hippocrates and Galen first gave the West a view of Greek medicine as a whole.

The "golden age" of Islamic art lasted from AD 750 to the mid-11th century, when ceramics, glass, metalwork, textiles, illuminated manuscripts, and woodwork flourished. Lustered glass became the greatest Islamic contribution to ceramics. Manuscript illumination became an important and greatly respected art, and miniature painting flourished in Iran. Calligraphy, an essential aspect of written Arabic, developed in manuscripts and architectural decoration.

In the exact sciences the contribution of Al-Khwarzimi, mathematician and astronomer, was considerable. Like Euclid, he wrote mathematical books that collected and arranged the discoveries of earlier mathematicians. His "Book of Integration and Equation" is a compilation of rules for solving linear and quadratic equations, as well as problems of geometry and proportion. Its translation into Latin in the 12th century provided the link between the great Hindu mathematicians and European scholars. A corruption of the book’s title resulted in the word algebra; a corruption of the author’s own name resulted in the term algorithm.

The problem with turning this list of intellectual achievements into a convincing "Islamic" golden age is that whatever flourished, did so not by reason of Islam but in spite of Islam. Moslems overran societies (Persian, Greek, Egyptian, Byzantine, Syrian, Jewish) that possessed intellectual sophistication in their own right and failed to completely destroy their cultures. To give it the credit for what the remnants of these cultures achieved is like crediting the Red Army for the survival of Chopin in Warsaw in 1970! Islam per se never encouraged science, in the sense of disinterested enquiry, because the only knowledge it accepts is religious knowledge.

the Moslem Empire inherited "the knowledge and skills of the ancient Middle east, of Greece and of Persia, it added to them new and important innovations from outside, such as the manufacture of paper from China and decimal positional numbering from India." The decimal numbers were thus transmitted to the West, where they are still mistakenly known as "Arabic" numbers, honoring not their inventors but their transmitters.

Furthermore, the intellectual achievements of Islam’s "golden age" were of limited value. There was a lot of speculation and very little application, be it in technology or politics.

At the present day, for almost a thousand years even speculation has stopped, and the bounds of what is considered orthodox Islam have frozen, except when they have even contracted, as in the case of Wahabism. Those who try to push the fundamentals of Moslem thought any further into the light of modernity frequently pay for it with their lives.

The fundamentalists who ruled Afghanistan until recently and still rule in Iran hold up their supposed golden age as a model for their people and as a justification for their tyranny. Westerners should know better.""

So what?

So what Xerxes had a Jewish wife named Esther?
So what Xerxes had a Jewish Minister named Mordekhai?
So what Madonna and a bunch of other nutty Hollywood types have picked up Kabbala?
It doesn't add up to a hill of beans.
The movie "300" detailed the life of Xerxes. Xerxes was not the compassionate person people thought. Esther being Xerxes wife does not really matter. Xerxes had many wives. And from the movie "300" we can conclude Xerxes like Alexander the Great had many Husbands also.

iranian.com, what's offensive "Barack Wins" ad doing here?!!!

What is the message? That Obama is terrorist?!!!

A note on Cyrus and the second temple

It so happens that Cyrus the great did in fact order the rebuilding of the second temple. He also ordered all his vessels to provide money and means for such an enterprise. After the death of Cyrus, the Samaritans and other inhabitants of the land used the chaos that preceded the reign of Darius to write to warn the empire of Jews and their efforts to build the temple. The Jews wrote and reminded the king of Cyrus' decree, it was searched and found and Darius approved the continuation of the building of the Temple that was completed during his reign.
Just to set the record straight. The rest of your Islamist diatribe is comprised of the same level of ignorance, but we let it go, since it is not worth it to waste any more time on your likes.

Sickofislamists,
I have no hope left for the State Department. They would probably hire him at some level. ;-)

Idiotic Comparisons to make excusses for Islamists

The comparison of this idiot by some Islamist apologist to AIPAC and Dershowitz is just as idiotic as this idiot's claims that Persian Kings were jews.

It amazing how some Islamist apologists always talk about "IRI's great accomplishments" in "woman's rights" in "its car industry" in its great "weapons industry" and "its great stock market" yet they put down the Persian Empire's accomplishments and compare them to "Hammurabi".

These islamist apologist have nothing to say when confronted with the fact that Hammurabi's great doctrine of "innocent until proven guilty" has now (3000 years later) been changed to "guilty until proven innocent" under the leadership of Islamist IRI.

Dear Toofan,

I find it amazing that some Iranians discard all of the great achievements and contributions of the greatest Iranians UNDER Golden age of Islamic Empire, the fathers of almost all sciences, algebra, trigonometery, medicine, pharmacology, astronomy, the gretest poets and philosophers....they discard all of the contributions of OTHER ancient Empires and constantly talk as if there was nothing in ancient or reccent history except for Cyrus the great!!

I beg you pardon, but the Hammurabi that you're looking down at, is the king who a thousand years before Cyrus the great invented the Hammurabi Code which was the cornerstone that not only Cyrus the Great but the Jewsih Torah itself got all of its rules from!

Just go to any western or the US Capitol or US Supreme Court to see their humble recognition of Hammurabi as the father of law and creator of "innocent until proven guilty".

For those who go to British museum to see Cyrus cylinder, please visit the Louvre for the huge cuniform of Hammurabi's Code of Law a thousand years before Cyrus.

AND, Cyrus was another military power of ancient times who defeated the more decadent Babylon and his freeing the Jewish slaves brought them under HIS OWN dominance. The Jews who love Cyrus for letting them go to their promised land (one of Persian Empire's satraps) also complained that Cyrus did not allow them the construction of second temple. They had to wait for Darius' reign where many of Persian Empires satraps  were becoming broke becasue of amount of gold and silver he demanded, including the once great Babylon.

Sorry, as much as in our history books Cyrus the Great is picked out as unique, in the rest of the wrold Persian Empire is considered just another great Empire of the past, AND for most of the world, Cyrus the Great is no match for Hammurabi!! 

FYI/EVEN THE GERMANS GET IT !

As Germany marks the 70th anniversary of the Kristallnacht anti-Semitic riots, Chancellor Angela Merkel said all Germans must act against racism.

//news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7718201.stm

zion: I agree. I think this

zion: I agree. I think this guy should be known to the state department and Pentagon too.

RE: Jaleoh

Jaleoh
"This guy, forgets that in Persian Empire, the "freed" Jews from Babylon became just another group of people who paid their taxes to the Persian Kings instead of their former slveholders! Just like many other groups who were part of the Empire, that part of land of Canaan, was a small district of the Persian Empire dear, not vice versa!"

They were freed from slavery, and were allowed to go where ever they wanted the records show. No one had anything to say about their religion. Jews were not taxed for being jews during persian ruling. So if your comparing Cyrus to Hammurabis treatment of jews, or Cyrus to Arabic Caliphate ruling, you seriously need to read history my friend.

All Cyrus wanted was tax and soldiers from each "state" to guard the boarders and upkeep a local "federal" government. The regions were allowed to have their own rulers and own religion beliefs as long as they off course, were loyal to Cyrus. In return, one had stability, economical growth and scientific progress that got slashed into bits and pieces after Alexander the animal came into the picture.

AIPAC should recruit this idiot!

He sounds like the far right AIPAC members and Alan Dershowitz who claim nothing in the world is done without Jewsih power and blessing. They must perpetuate that image to continue the $trillion that Israel has been stealing from American taxpayers on that account alone!

Dershowitz, the minute that it became clear that the two "similar in deed, opposing in party" candidates offered to American people as usual, Hillary and McCain, have no chance of winning... all of a sudden became an Obama supporter! Let it be clear that no candidate in the US will become a president without the blessing of the AIPAC!

Yes, AIPAC is a powerful lobby, but its power is overestimated (thanks to people like this fellow), and the power is fading rapidly thanks to the new culture reflected in the US by works of people like Mearsheimer and Walt who broke the taboo of criticizing AIPAC and showed that its power is counter to American interest. That culture is on the rise, not what this fellow advertises!

This guy, forgets that in Persian Empire, the "freed" Jews from Babylon became just another group of people who paid their taxes to the Persian Kings instead of their former slveholders! Just like many other groups who were part of the Empire, that part of land of Canaan, was a small district of the Persian Empire dear, not vice versa!

mroe interesting clips

Dr. Abbasi discussing civil liberties with students:

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmTWaVZUgfg&feature...

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=E91amDyvsqw&feature...

One can easily counter his arguments, but these are his beliefs and the main arguments the IRI has or religious parties would have if we lived in a plural political landscape in Iran, and one could chose between a secular party and tudeh.

This guy is one of the main military and political dvisors of the IRI today.

Bigotry and "jAvid Shah" (to Kadivar)

Kadivar_jAn, much of the bigotry we see in Abbasi existed during Shah's time as well. I am not sure if you grew up in Iran but I did, and I grew up in a city with a strong Jewish community. In fact During Shah's time not only reactionary religious people but also some "modernist" pro Shah or pro establishment had this type of bigotry. I wish a simple "jAvid Shah" would resolve the bigotry ....
How is princess of Transylvania doing?

Iranian kings were jewish!

I absolutely agree with one of the commentators that the only way the Islamic Republic can survive is to "belittle Iranian culture".

Although some of the stories he is reffering to are true in books like Torra or Bible about Esther and Mordukhay but I have know idea what kind of doctrate he has( perhaps the same type as Mr. Kordan`s) but the greatest archeologists still haven`t even been able to prove that if Jesus was a real person or Moses or so on and so forth. stating and relying on such books that from one side the Islamic Republic deny their originality and question their origin but simoultainiously accepts the sotries that could or could not be true within those books as a source, is indeed questionable itself.

I mean even if Esther`s story is true, that doesn`t make 1500 years of kingdom all jewish or even one generation jewish.

By the way, since Iranian kings were much more truthful and justful than supposidly Islamic rulers today(they cannot even imagine such a thing and perhaps think of it as a sin!) it is possible that some Iranian kings were jewish as long as they were Iranian.

Even in todays Israel, Iranian jews over there have their iranian culture and identity and practice it ever so proudly, and I remind this Doctrate that this phenomenon is TODAY and not 2500 years ago, if todays Iranian jews are proud to be Iranian even though Islamic republic has left no pride in all of us , why wouldn`t the old time jews that were saved from slavory by Kourosh and once again saved by Khashayarshah be proud to be Iranians.

Mr. Abbasi, you are on a wrong path so are your owners. Perhaps you need to be saved of slavory yopurself!

Just to spice the debate a little

Instead of attacking his mistakes and punchlines, his ideology is more interesting to hear out.

Im not defending this man, he is Irans version of Bill Kristol, Wolfowitz etc, I disagree with him on many points, BUT he is a veteran, he has fought at the front line while many of you bombing him with cheap comments here fled to the US when Iraqi french fighters armed with american weapons and Russian tanks crossed into Iran, is a brilliant guerilla warfare strategist, and he does love his country, he is just seriously misguided and very religious.

If we wish to change Iran, one has to take in to the calculation men like abbasi. He gives voice to millions of conservative Iranians who wont jump crying "Pahlavi Pahlavi". And they represent a challenge for creating an open secular society.

People should learn what men like his is saying so that they can counter his and his followers arguments one day when they actually meet them.

If the link doesnt work, check this out: //www.liveleak.com/view?i=ded_1214411325

Abbasi attacking IRI politicians for iranian girls being trafficked to Dubai:
//www.youtube.com/watch?v=Feh_nSwCOk0

Hassan Abbasi on U.S. plunder of Iraq:
//www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RNujEBKQMw&feature...

Hassan Abbasi praises Ferdowsi for preserving Persian:
//www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKZiDNPnndo&feature...

Hasan Abbasi on Western exploitation of Islamic world:
//www.youtube.com/watch?v=weCXdHJj5q4

My Good Friend has a Message For Abbasi

Agha "Dr." Here is an Answer to You From A good Friend of mine.

RE: an expert

The only way these people can rule iran is to belittle iranian culture and history, and shift all the contributions of iranians to islam and demonize whatever relates to pre-islamic period. Even they know that Islam cannot stand on its own merits after the past 30 years.

Interestingly, I heard the same words from an islamist in tehran this past summer that 2500 year history of iran is nothing but a jewish invention. Now I know where it came from.

As for his comments about Madonna, etc. I bet he watches her all the time. I saw a full-fledged mulla, who passionately talks about fatima zahra, would break his fast in ramadan and move on to drink alcohol and smoke taryaak before washing his alcohol-smelling mouth for his nightly prayers. These people are deceiving hypocrites. Lying is the only tool of the trade that they have.

an expert

he's definitely an expert in "madfoo shenaassi" and if I see anymore of his clips I am afraid I might be too familiar with that field too... I am sure he's seen all videos of Madonna and Britney spears as an excuse for his material reseach and drooled all over himself.

It's sad to see how he takes shots at the greatest Emperors of Persia.

Party Gal whatcha doing to me girl? LOL  I'm going back to listen to my music and get his nasty voice out of my head.

IRANdokht

I wonder who is more idiot..s,,,

that idiot hezbollahi (abbasi) who preaches nonsense or those sitting and listening to his islamist propaganda...

Dear Anonym7,

It was just a joke. Take it easy.

Questions regarding your Suggestion (to Zion)

Zion_jAn, what does this bigot have to do with new president elect's potential direct talks with Iran?
We say in Persian "was Leili a man or a woman?" i.e, what was the story?
BTW, as someone asked you before are you a man or a woman?
Sincerely,
your old friend anonym7

Suggestion

I think this video was posted here once before a while back. Anyway, I suggest he should be allowed to accompany the Iranian delegation for the upcoming talks without preconditions that was promised in the preliminary round. He can provide the attendants with the important historical context that is usually missing in such talks. Who knows, the president-elect may get to learn a thing or two and be enlightened.

Mosalman=Nadan-Zumbi

In anirani terroris ke kherad nadarado [aghle alah]darad paas zende moordeh asst...Yaak Iran va 999 Doosh man.

an extremist's reaction to the other extremism

What this guy is saying is definitely appalling. Personally as an Iranian I am proud of the Jewish heritage of my hometown and its people .... However I believe this kind of extremism is an expected reaction to the extremism in the other side, the extremism that even Israeli government can't control, see for example:
//article.wn.com/view/2008/10/22/Israeli_troo...

Gooz be Shaghighe che rabt dare??

Mozoo sare chi bood aslan?? Dasht rajebe Khashayar shah sohbat mikard, ye ho resid be Madonna va David Beckham, o in harfa...

No wonder Obama doesn't want the IRI to have nukes

Iran's global war curriculum:

//www.ecomtrade.co.il/eMall/Shops/1559/imgbank/Policy%20Paper%20English%20FINAL%20(Ge0-Political%20Affairs%20Proof).pdf