Misc

Islam is a misunderstood religion?!?

The people who misunderstand Islam are Muslims. For many of us it has become clear that this was a faith created by a delusional man born at the right time and the right place or for humanity's sake born at the wrong time and wrong place!

If you want to master a subject you learn both sides of the argument. Muslims would do well learning their true history.

The true Martyrs of Islam are the innocent childeren of Bani Ghariza whose 700 fathers, brothers were beheaded and their mothers, sisters and themselves were sold to barbarians who raped, abused beaten them for the rest of their poor existence.

The martyrs are our ancestors who had the same fate, many of whom had to take an exodus to other lands.

Do not mix Sufism, and beauty with the deeds of Mohamad the pedophile, the manifestation of evil.

What came after him was the beauty and sophistication of our nation being echoed in his time.

Sufism is based on Mithraism, and schools pre existing Islam.

It cloaked itself in Islam or it would not survive.

If you are a Muslim then I'm sorry your feelings are being hurt, but you have to learn the truth about your faith in the same way as the Aztecs who sacrificed humans did!

JJ do you really believe

JJ do you really believe what you are arguing for? You are taking on all these critism from all these good people and haggling with them for what reason?

Is there any insult in any shape or form (poem, movie, poster, etc.) against Islam that you WOULD find offensive? If so, give an exmaple. I'm curious to know if you'd consider ANYTHING offensive to Islam.

If you consider NOTHING offensive then let your good readers know so they can understand they are debating a lost cause with you.

Challange :Which part/phrase is not accurate?

Put your emotion aside, listen to it one more time and let every one hears you out, with reason(s)(if possible) which sentence or statement is not correct.

THIS IS A CHALLANGE TO ALL WHO OPPOSE THIS VIDEO/CLIPPING.

please do not use rhetoric. Just use fact.

if you agree with even one sentence, please be honest and mention it here too.

p.s. When Muslims quote from Qoran or Sharia that none Muslims (now exceed more than 5 billion)are "Najis" "pigs" and "infidles must be killed" etc, what should they feel?. Are these correct sentences? are these sentences worthy of a relegion advocating peace and harmony?

Anger aside, all she says are naked truth

After reading all these previous posts, I can tell that no one offered any counter point to the subject of video and poem.

Anger aside, all she says are naked truth. Why should Iranian become "Gholam Ali" or "Gholam Hussien"? Or, why should Iranians be ruled under Sharia law? Where is shame?

you're funny! i like

you're funny! i like you...may Allah bless your soul.

Try This

If the harsh side of Islam bothers you, try the peacefull side of it. See glimpse of in following link:

//youtube.com/watch?v=hqhNPY882kE

You have a choice in free world;
Free your self from arrogance - Love to live and live to love Allah, for if you love Allah, you will love Allah's creation, including all human race.

Who?

Who is the poet and who is the person who recites it?

Equal Opportunity Forum

Many of us are fans of Shah/Khomeini/Stalin/Banisadr/Bush/Arafat/Pishevari/Q/Mossadegh/

RezaShah/Redwine/JJ/Ali P/Ghavaam-ol-saltaneh/Teymooreh lang/Alborzi/IRANdokht/Azarin/...

and some of us are outraged by one or several of the above ( or what they stand for) and hate it with a passion. The forum allows us to express it, while having to watch our own views and opinions trashed by others. That's the price you pay for freedom.

"Nothing is sacred" means I, an average Joe, am as much immune to being questioned and accused and insulted, as everybody else -and everything else, such as a religion - is.

And I solute JJ for standing his ground.

I agree with most of what

I agree with most of what she says, but some of her words are too extreme. Islam has brought us more misery than good, specially in the past 30 years. I wish Iran had remained all Zoroastrian, that is the true religion of Iran and Iranian.

Azarin Sadegh - A Word Of Advice

You have to understand one thing: When one hates another person, the person that hates is much more affected in a 'negative' way than the person who is being hated.

I have read many of your comments and blogs in the past. I must say that I sense a certain feeling of 'darkness' about them. By that I mean severe 'unresolved' issues.

I want to encourage you to focus on the 'positive'. Dwelling on the negative only 'exacerbates' the darkness.

I know that you are being moved more by the 'darker' aspects, but that ultimately will not help you to bring about a sense of 'balance' into your life.

I hope that you take what I have mentioned here as a form of 'positive' feedback for yourself. I know that we Iranians in general have a tendency to be cynical, and somewhat skeptical, of others when they tend to be positive towards us. I want you to know that my intentions are none other than to be 'helpful' to you.

Best of luck to you :)

Re: Jahanshah Javid's illogical explanation

JJ, I expected something better than this from you:
"So you think this poem has appeared just out of the blue, just to hurt you an "millions of Iranian citizens" for no reason?"

Do you think an obsurd and hatefull clip like this really moves the corrupt leaders anyway? Of course NOT; It only has hatefull effect on regular people who love their religion - the religion that gives them happiness, good feeling and peacefull life. If some leaders come and do some corruption in the name of God, I expected you to be able to hit back on them rather than Islam.
YOU and people who propogate HATRED messages like this are the other end of the stick of crime against humanity by creating a media for some to blindly go and take a shot at 100's of millions of people who dearly love true message of Islam.

Do you really think the idiots who made this clip are actually the people who got butchered or tortured by Islam? Most of these idiots are people who have lost their identity and all they care for is getting their share of Iran's wealth, just like some corrupt leaders we currently have in IRI. I bet you these people will even butcher and torture worse if they get in control.

ALl I'm saying is that neither you nor these people who ade thsi clip are after human rights. If you were, you would not see to wash the blood by blood. Creating harmony, tolerance and peacefull coexistence CAN NEVER be achieved by propogating Hatred!

I do not see any difference between maker of this clip and a rapist. Why do we have to abuse freedom?

I hope you publish my comment.

Peace for all humaniy;

beautiful poem but false!!!!

this is indeed a nice poem by a well versed person...this would persuade some of you guys that don't know much about Islam...but guys...if you only knew the truth...you would realize that this poem is nothing but a false hateful racist anti-iranian peice of trash that blongs to trashcan not your hearts and ears...young sons of alot of tearful muslim mothers have died to keep your country in one peice...how could you insult and hurt your own people like this? why? in the name of unity? in the name of progress? in the name of "rooshan fekri"...why do yo do it??? your hate for islamic republic does not justify you to put on a trash like this...you know how we muslims are in love with our religion...more than you can imagine.

Well said Jahahshah

Well said Jahahshah. I want all moslems to honor all Iranians' wish for Iran being a secular progressive and democratic country.

to Jahanshah Javid

your argument does not make sense...this poem is insulting Islam, not the Islamic Republic...there is a big difference...so, it doesn't make sense to compare this poem to how many people the islamic republic has insulted through the years...IR has a different account that true Islam...

To Ali: Blame

Ali, yes, this poem is directed against Islam and its leaders. OK it's offensive to believers and some of them have complained about it on this page (and many have not, by the way, and they are all either Muslims or born Muslims).

But let's put this on a scale: Which is more offensive and damaging to Islam? This poem has been viewed by about 8,500 people on YouTube since Jan 30 of this year. Let's say by the end of the year, 10 times that number see it.

Now compare that to what the Islamic Republic and its leaders and fanatic followers have done in the name of Islam. I don't think I need to enumerate what crimes they have committed.

Now which has been more offensive to Islam and religion? One person's poem or what the Islamic Republic itself has done in the name of Islam?

It is no secret that since 1979, many have been turned off and disgusted not only by what is committed in the name of Islam, but religion in general.

If I was a believer, I wouldn't blame an enraged Iranian poet, or Salman Rushdie, or a Dutch right-wing moron, but rather those who claim to represent my religion.

When you make any religion or ideology your banner and you commit numerous offenses and crimes against humanity on a daily basis, don't you think that religion or ideology suffers as well?

Do you think the American people are going to reward the Republican Party for what this maniac Bush has done? Do you think the Middle East is going to embrace democracy after the genocide committed under its name in Iraq? Will Zionism win hearts and minds for Israel's occupation of Palestinian lands and killing and enslaving Palestinians and Lebanese in all these years? Wasn't communism discredited for the millions who died and suffered in the USSR?

And cheraa raah e dooree bereem... wasn't the monarchy repudiated as an idea and institution because of the abuses of the Shah(s)?

When Islam mixes with politics and takes over the administration of a country and its leaders justify everything with this or that verse in the Qoran or on the basis of the traditions of the prophet and the imams, what do you expect? You want this poet and MILLIONS of other Iranians to say bah bah what a wonderful religion?

I was looking at this photo essay and I noticed an Islamic saying on the entrance to a zoorkhooneh in Tehran. (oops... my mistake... it's not a zoorkhooneh... but just for the sake of argument, let's pretend it is). That doesn't offend a soul. Never has, never will. But take that and all the verses in Qoran and use it to force the hejab on half the population, kill and torture in its name, disqualify citizens from political activity because they are not Muslim/pro-IRI enough, and and and... then you have a huge problem on your hands. THAT damages Islam and offends TRUE believers, not a poem.

Iran United????????

Is this some one's idea of uniting iranians??? this is so funny. Some of you guys have so much hate in your hearts that is blocking your reason and minds. First of all...you know how we muslims feel about our believes...no religion or nation is so stuborn and in love with their prophet and emams than arabs and iranians...Muhammad is our Pride, and Ali is our light, and Hossein is our dignity...our path is Hossein's path...death is better than life with no dignity...we showed to the world that this is not just some random idea we have...we showed the world that emam hossein's heart beats in our chest...we showed to the world that we love our country and we will fight till we die...and you islam haters...you think iranians are not real muslims...you wish that they weren't but sad for you because they are...even the ones that oppose the current governement are majority muslims...we are smart enough not to judge islam based on what ignorant people do in the islamic republic...atleast we have that much wisdom...the truth is, Islam is love...Islam means submission to the will of Allah...i don't know if you could find a more pure and more profound idea than that...i have search for it but i have not come accross a more beautiful description of reality that " there is no god but Allah, the mighty, the creator of you and me...we can only be truely united with Allah's grace in mind...and any other path leads to no where other than racism, false ideologies, hate, and materialism...the greatest of iranian poets Rumi, glorfied Ali, "as ali amooz ekhlaase amal"...guys, instead of bashing Islam, please try to learn the true islam...read the Koran, read hazrate Ali sayings, and think about their meaning in terms of your own life...their teaching are pure light, peace, love, and of course hate for people that have turned their backs to God, almighty, like the poet of this poem...this poet would not dare to show his/her face and identity...and i'm glad he/she wouldn't...because it would be too bloody messy! we are all iranians, kurds, azaris, persians, lor, arab (kuzestan)...and our true strenght is love of God...submitting to him...working on his path...serving our people and our nation...I agree...islam is not all about kissing each other and showing love to one another...because based on human condition, there is also hate and trasgression...so, Islam teaches us that in the face of enemy we should fight and not sit on our asses...we should fight for the pleasure of God...with strength and with faith in our hearts...becaue of this messeage we have kept our dignity...we fight with all the arabs and europeans and americans and russians during the 8-year war...we kept our pride, we didn't give one inch of our country to the enemy...this is the true nationalism...not just empty words, true action..."Az Ali (AS) amooz akhlaase amal" Rumi

re: Azarin Sadegh

I like your honesty but I don't agree with you hating Islam.

I hope that one day you would see the light and stop hating.

to Healed

Good for you to be healed :)

But let me be clear. I could be called an atheist. A real non-believer. And what I would like the most in a work of Art is to be moved by its beauty, or by the way it provokes an original idea (that in a sense could have been mine, but I had never succeeded to express it so openly, and so eloquently.)

So honestly, this "hateful" poem moves me more than your poem, since it talks about a shared feeling, something I’ve known before, but I rather forget just to keep my sanity. Not because my feeling was wrong or baseless, but because I felt helpless fighting against its darkness. Because to fight against the evil, you have to turn to evil yourself.

Azarin

در سوره" روم"

در سوره" روم" پيامبر , بخوانيد "خدا" آنقدر خوشحال ميشود كه ايرانيها دارند توسط رومها شكست ميخورند. از نوشته هاي بعضي از ايرانيها در اينجامن فكرميكنم ا يرانيها از پيروزي پي در پي اسلام و اعراب همانقدر خوشحالند كه پيامبرشان نويد داده بود .

...

اقا جان ، اسلام خوب هست يا نه ، به ما مربوط نيست.هر كي اسلام ميخواد ، بره يك كشور اسلامي!به ما چه مربوطه!

هر كسي كه مذهب رو به ايران ترجيح بده ، ايراني نيست و به زودي تكليف ايران فروشها معلوم خواهد شد.

Islam fast growing religion

weak up and smell the coffe. it is the fast growing religion very soon the whole EU will be muslims never mind Iran

Nefrin......

My suggestion to everyone is to read the Koran First,before you are making any judgments about this poem and the poet.Please read it you will be surprised what we have been dealing with all these years!!

Re: CS

It is funny that you enjoy the poem so much and are so anti-Islamic. Yet at the same time you display the flag of Iran (Green-White-Red) for your avatar which is the colors of an Islamic nation. Almost all Muslim nations have those three colors in their flag and you can check around if you don't believe it.  I bet you didn't know that, did you?

The answer to your questions are Yes to the first (- Do I have too western view of Islam? ) and No to the second (- Would I feel the same way if I lived in Iran?).

The Western nations have allways been against Islam and even pre-Islamic Iran. Just watch the movie 300 and you see why. Europeans and their American cousins have allways hated Persia and Iran. After the surge of Christianity in Europe and the rise of the Crusaders, they even hated Islam and Iran/Persian more than ever.

If you still hate Islam, then you might want to use the light blue for your avatar flag. That is the color of the flag of the nation of Israel. And ohhhhh believe me, they hate the religion of Islam for Iran.

What hatred?

I fail to see any "hatred" in this poem. "Opposition" to Islam, yes. "Exposing" Islam, yes. But "hatred", no.

It is every Iranian citizen's right to oppose Islam and to want another religion for his country. The fact that Iran is 95% moslem doesn't mean a thing. Remember that Iran was 95% Zoroastrian before it became moslem. Did Salman Farsi and his gang cared about or respected the fact that Iran was 95% Zoroastrian? No, they did not.

But I keep forgetting that fanatic moslems believe they can do onto others exactly the same things that they criticize others may do to them. They also beleive that they can prosecute, oppress and use violence against other faiths including ex-moslems, and the reaction of these oppressed individuals should not be anger, but a big smile on their face.

All these Islam bashing that you see is what you fanatic moslems had sowed with your own violence and hatred. You have only yourselves to blame.

It is time to move on. Iran needs a new religion or religions, only because Islam is un-reformable, otherwise, I would be for a reformed version of Islam.

I challenge all fanatic moslems in here to set Iran free and let ALL religions including Islam preach their faith without fear of persecution. Instead of Islam's sword making the decision, let Iranians' minds make their own decisions based on what they read and hear.

Under these circumestances, I guarantee you that in only two generations, Islam will become a minority religion in Iran. However, you fanatic moslems know this. Hence the use of violence against all other religious minorities who would dare to convert moslems.

But how long can this continue? How long the point of your swords can keep others at bay and help you hold on? Not forever, as eventually, "mind" will overcome "sword", and good will overcome evil.

The issue here is only one thing: Islam being un-reformable. Otherwise, the majority of these Islam bashers would be in the camp of "true moslems for a reformed Islam". I have said many times that this un-reformability is the ultimate nail in Islam's coffin. this flaw is not other people's fault.

I only regret that I am so close, but will just not live long enough to see the conversion of Iranians from Islam.

These kinds of hateful

These kinds of hateful expressions are the clear syndromes of an ill NAZI mentality emerging from within a fraction of the Iranian society. Nothing is more dangerous than nationalism being used as a tool of hatred.

We should put a stop to it before it grows spreads any further.

عربها صدبرابر

عربها صدبرابر اين از ايرانيها متنفرند, منتهي ما چون فكر ميكنيم خيلي عزيزيم تا توسط عربها كاملا نابود نشويم باورمون نميشه .

Azarin Sadegh

Perhaps this could help bring some perspective to things:

//iranian.com/main/blog/shaer/abandoning-...

Enjoy :)

Unintentional secularization

The Islamic Republic was after Islamizing Iranians but instead is increasingly witnessing the opposite taking root. This poetic opinion is just one of many manifestations of the Law of Unintended Consequences. It is not out of the realm of possibilities to foresee a time when the ancient Islamic republic is credited for its unintentional wholesale secularization of Iran.

Hatred is a great source of inspiration, but...

I think most of us (at least people from my generation) have been consumed by our hatred. Something so harsh and so violent that burnt most of our humanity and empathy toward others.

There might always be a valid reason behind our deepest emotions, but still it is not going to help us to heal our falling skin and repetitive nightmares.

Even if I feel this hidden pleasure listening to this poem, but still I wonder how would I survive if I were going to burn again.

Azarin

The neo-intellectuals are being born

The Mojahedins's evolution was very interesting. This group of Islamic-Leftists after the Iranian revolution, turned into a cult, the cult that is neither Islamic or Leftist. The evolution of intellectuals is also going the same route. These guys who were based in Berkley and Washington DC, used to direct all the opposition to Shah, but now like the Ruskies, see that Iran is becoming an independent (all be it struggling) country , with no role for the so called intellectuals. They are putting out one naked bigoted provocation after another in the name of intellectualism and freedom of speech. The idea is to dehumanize the Iranian populace, at least know that this was part of the neo-intellectual propaganda.