IRANIANS

My opinion is similar to Souri's with some additions.

There are very few people who enjoy group sex after their marriage.  I am saying this because (a) the timing for the first sexual encounter is very important for a long term committment.  It doesn't matter what the culture is, and the reason is both need to feel secure for the rest of their life. (b) I remembered my coworker who told his boyfriend if he proposes marriage to her in a bar, their relationship will end immidiately.  I thought it makes sense because there will be more drunk men who propose after the boyfriend.  Again, timing is important. 

If it's just about the sex, the man or woman is allowed to ask to get the f**k out of here as soon as they are done.  Please make sure that you will ask the person to leave if you are at your own home and not the other person's home :)

"It's not about what we believe. It's more about how we behave and influence." Comments

عجب گرفتاری صبح اول صبح!

Everything is sacred

قربانیان رها شده

ونداد گرامی

دست کم در رده پستانداران مزاج نر به لحاظ جنسی و در مجموع گرمتر از ماده است  و همواره نرها برای دستیابی به ماده رقابت و ستیز میکنند . انسان  با وجود  همه پیشرفتها  و  تفاوتهای روانی و عاطفی و عقلی باز نمیتواند از قوانین کلی طبیعت یا سرشت بنیادی خود دوری کند . درست است که در جامعه بشری زنها نیز برای بدست آوردن مردان رقابت و گاه حیله گری میکنند ولی آنانی موفق خواهند شد که هم هدف شایسته ای را انتخاب کرده باشند و هم خود برازنده آن هدف باشند . و بدیهی است که هیچ قاعده ای هم مطلق نیست . نمونه تهمینه را هم در این رابطه عرض کردم . ولی تهمینه از کسی خواستگاری  کرده که توانائی های خود و از جمله وفاداری به پیمانش را بار ها ثابت کرده بود . خوب آن کجا و این عزیزم عزیزم و دوستت دارم ها  ، که معلوم نیست چی در چنته و چه سرانجامی دارد  کجا ؟

هزاران هزار دختر و خانواده فریب همین ( اخلاقیات مبتنی بر شرائط روزگار خودمان ) را خورده و زندگیشان تباه شده . البته زمانه اینگونه شده و کار چندانی از دست کسی برنمیآید . من هم این نظر را نوشتم تا شاید دختران ما  بیشتر متوجه خطرات سهمگینی شوند که در کمینشان نشسته .
آن( اخلاقیات) کجا هستند که جوابگوی انبوه قربانیان خود باشند ؟
اگر خوانندگان مایل باشند  سروده مربوط به تهمینه را مینویسم تا ببینند آن گاه چه بزرگی و عشق و زیبائی بوده که ارضای جنسی هم در آن حال و هوا معنی داشته و اکنون گرفتار چه تباهی هائی به نام و نه خود  پیشرفت و مدرنیسم شده ایم .    

تشکر 

رشید عزیز

متاسفانه رابطه بین استدلال شما در مورد تعقیب و گریز و تمنای حنسی حیوانات و این نوشته را متوجه نشدم. در مورد اینکه به سنت ها هم چشم بدوزیم، بله من هم با شما موافقم. ارزشهای رفتاری و اخلاقی ما خوب است شاید ترکیبی از مرام های ناشی از تجربیات مثبت گذشتگان و اخلاقیات مبتنی بر شرائط روزگار خودمان باشد

در مورد  لقبِ روشنفکر مد روز بودن، چون سلیقه شما است حرفی برای گفتن ندارم فقط امیدوارم به احترام خرد نیاکان  کمی دلبازتر باشیم

مرسی از توجه ات

rashid

مهراب نام پدر رودابه است، که ایشان مادر رستم باشند.

Actually, rashid

Females do sometimes pursue males in nature. Such role reversals are not uncommon.

Among birds, spotted sandpipers and the various species of phalaropes show such behavior. In the Phalaropes, the female is the brightly colored one (a fact that was misinterpreted by John James Audubon who labelled the females as males on his paintings), courts the male, and does not participate in building a nest or raising the young. The female Phalarope may court several males, and each will raise her young.

Look up the word, polyandry....which usually accompanies sex reversal breeding strategies.

And no, human rights is not gherti baazi. It's very unfortunate that you feel that way. No wonder Iranians have such a f*cked up culture. 

نه مدرن و نه سنتی درست و حسابی

Like a Virgin...touched for the very first time...

It all comes down to sexual and emotional immaturity both in women and men. Women have a permanent-virgin-wanna-be syndrome and men are extremely dependent to their family's approval, likes, and dislikes.

Collectively speaking, we never grow up in a society or a family cutlure where we are encouraged to openly date and experience romance. So we never grow up to become both emotionally and sexually intelligent adults. Girls have to wait for the right man, and do all sorts of weird things to release their sexual deprivations, and men have to just fuck with no emotions till a perfect virgin is cherry picked (no pun indended) and even then their intimacy belongs in their bedrooms at night time. Rest of the day they are supposed to nag and fight.

Adults should be able to accept responsibility

If a woman after dating a man decides to go to bed with him, I say, good for her. But if she suddenly wakes up in the middle of the night and is filled with remorse for what she has done, then I think she is emotionally immature and she should examine the root of the problem. The responsibility of the intercourse lies not solely on the man’s shoulders but it is based on the mutual agreement they both made to share the ultimate and the most beautiful way for two people to show their interest in each other.

با سلام به جمع خوشفکرِ نویسندگان ایرانیان.کام

خیلی خوشحالم و باعث سرافرازی است که شانس تماس و حضورم توسط مسئولین سایت فراهم شده است تا بتوانم دوباره در میان محموعه وسیع خوانندگان و نویسندگان خردمند ایرانی باشم.

تشکر فراوان از شما عزیزان که همیشه با ذهن انتقادی تان به تلنگرهای کوچک من، قابلیت گسترده تری می بخشید.

ونداد

https://www.facebook.com/vandad.zamaani?ref=tn_tnm...

Insightful piece!

 Perhaps a good way to recognize a modern individual is to see if he/she has sincerely declared independence from socially imposed mores--overlapping in some attitudes, but via his/her own path.  This way we can define a modern society as one where such individuals are accepted.

Not mine, this time :)

Thanks Mahvash for your kind comment. I do pick the images for the articles/poems, unless the writer suggests a good image for his or her piece. Vandad picked this one :)

On a complete different note!

I would like to commend Jahanshah for the most appropriate, beautiful images that he chooses for all the articles posted on iranian.com. This painting is one of those.

I am always more excited to find out about the selected image for my articles than to see them posted!

Thanks, Jahanshah for your nice selection.

Hooshang

You (the Iranian men) are all the same in this regard (I have already mentioned this)

There's no difference between a man  who loose his respect for woman with whom he had sex on the bed (or the kitchen floor) and you with your way of joking around all the way and distract the conversation.

I don't see anything funny about this story. If you do....

Well,  you must check your true belief on this matter.

What I wanna know is, when they go 50/50 for the check?

Souri jaan, please don't project. It all depends on the couple involved (all this being hypothetical that is) and their mutual interests and desire. Kitchen floor, balcony, living room,...?

I am talking from the woman's point of view

If the food is good but then took all in your pocket ( her respect in the case of this woman) then you would never go back there, Hooshang. Believe me!

If its good, you go back

over and over again.

In my opinion

Although I think this story is a bit old and is in its way of fading and getting a new leaf, over years, but I can say both men and women in this kind of story are responsible for having been irresponsible.

I don't believe in the discussion which has been suggested by Faramarz here. We all know that men usually in this position, are fake (sorry) .They pretend to be very open minded and fair (because it feels good to give this image) but in fact, the woman is right. Almost %100 of the Iranian men are in the same basket in this regard.

But also, I think the woman is responsible, too.  First of all, a woman should know exactly what she wants from  the relationship.
Is she only attracted to the man (with  no ultra motivation)? or she  has only an ultim desire to find a long time partner, so she has been trying to attract the man thru sex?
If I were a woman being in this situation, I would never be ashamed of what has happened. A pleasant night is spent. Now, either the man will get up, taking all the respects he had for that woman along with his clothes and gets out of the door, in which case that man doesn't  deserve even one tear or a little moment of reflection, or he will stay in the relationship and take his part of responsibility.

If the relationship stays the same afterward, and the two parties are still attracted to each other and have mutual respect and serious intention for each other, then that relationship worth the reflection and investment in time and emotion....

Otherwise, a good monent has been spent, like a good food in a restaurent but to where you would not  go back again!

Faramarz, I like & agree with your View

As an Iranian woman that is the best way to deal with dating situation whether Iranian men or others.

...

Good to see you back Vandad. I think you and Framarz are  both incorrect. The best way for him to deal with the situation would have been to show her how much he respects and loves her right there on the kitchen floor, if you know what I mean. That approach always takes away any doubts .

As far as a Religious Culture is concerned, some think the our problems with Religion goes back to the pre-Islam period.

//www.aramesh-dustdar.com/

My View

Dear Vandad,

Thanks for your blog and welcome back.

Although the topic of your blog is about the intimacy between the Iranian men and women (and presumably somewhat older ones, since the younger ones are more carefree), the same type of misunderstandings also happens in many other cultures.

I believe that at the core of this problem is a man's and a woman’s different perspective on sex. For many men a sexual encounter with a date is a great conclusion to an exciting night that may have included other activities like going out, dancing, etc. But for many women sex is a special act reserved for a special person and maybe a longer term relationship. And therein lies the source of many ill feelings and misunderstandings. And the easiest way out of it is to blame the other party; “You Iranian men are only after one thing!”, or “You Iranian women are so uptight about sex!” are the frequently heard expressions.

I do disagree with your conclusion that the man and the woman should have sat on the chairs afterward and talked and the man should have taken the time to assure her that he respects her. A woman who feels disrespected because she had sex with a man that she has spent a good amount of time talking and socializing with, most likely has other issues.

In my opinion, the proper way to address this issue is early in the dating process. For example, early in the evening as they are sipping wine and looking into each others eyes she should say, “I am very particular about having sex with men and it takes me a while to get to that point. I really need to get to know you before I open my arms to you. But I promise that it will be worth the wait!” And the man can accept that or just say, “For me making love is a natural part of a relationship and it allows me to get to know you better and get in touch with your true feelings!”

At which point, they ask the waiter for the check and split it 50/50!

...

هستند بسیاری از مردانِ ایرانی که دوست دارند زنِ همسایه را لخت بینند و اما زنِ خودشان چادر و چاقچور کند قبل از اینکه برود نان سنگکِ خشخاشی بستاند.غیرت و ناموس پرستی‌ خروار خروار و اما دریغ از یک مثقال احترام به اولین قوانینِ مربوط به حمایت از زن و حق ایشان .

مذهب و سیاست نیز هیچ نقشی‌ در این امر ندارد،اشکالِ کار در آموزشِ اموراتِ تربیتی و اجتماعی است که همیشه در زندگی‌ ما ایرانیان آن چنان نقشی‌ خاص نداشته اند.حال باز این خوب است،وای به حالِ زمانی‌ که این چنین مردی پایش به فرنگ باز شود و هزار دنگ و فنگِ دگر ... به ندرت میتوان یک خانواده را پیدا کرد که آسوده خاطر در سرزمینهایِ غربی،بی‌ مشکل بتوانند امرارِ معشیت کنند.قضیه از پایبست خراب است و هر چه به غیر از این گفته شود،وقت تلف کردن است و اسبابِ سر درد برایِ دیگران .

وندادِ عزیز،خیلی‌ وقت بود که شما را نمیدیدیم،دلمان خوش شد و چشمانمان خوشتر که باز فرصتی شد تا شما را ملاقات کنیم،به زودی برایتان مطلبی خواهیم فرستاد.

خداوند شما را برایِ ما حفظ کند.

Great Truth regarding Modern Iranian Women

I also have known modern Iranian women in older generation who smoke heavily in order to deal with feeling of guilt, shame and betray when having intimate relationship with men.