28 MORDAD

What's the difference?

So what he was a Bakhtiar supporter? What that has to do with her comments about the Shah?

I did consider that she may be pro-Bakhtiar, that's why in many parts of my comment I said "... you, and if not you, the rest of the gang..." 

It would sometimes pay to read carefully what you are reading before going through the trouble of getting into a long/short soliloquy...

Jamshid

Why is the Shah the traitor?

by Kasra
#08 Fri Aug 31, 2007 12:02 PM PDT

First of all, Mossadegh himself said the idea of the Oil Nationalization was Dr. Fatemi's . He never said it was his own idea. Second, Mossadegh was the head of oil commision in the Majles that decided oil should be nationalized. Third, the idea of a Jeffersonian democarcy doesn't even apply to Iran of the mid 20th century. Jefferson's idea of democracy envisioned a agrarian democarcy where small local areas manged their own affairs and dealt mostly with the state with little interference from the Federal Government. Iran's demoractic movement in the mid 20th century was to curb the influence of the foreigners powers and limit the power of the Shah. What Mossadegh envionsed was an independent government led by the Prime Minister. In his vision the Shah only reigned and didn't rule. He had even told the monarch that if he let's the Prime Minister handle the country he (The Shah) would never have to flee. Of course, that wasn't the Shah's ideal and of course he eventually had to flee for good. Also, Mossadegh encouraged the freedom of the press. The Press criticized him constatnly during his tenure. The same can't be said of the Shah after 1953. I don't claim Mossadegh was as democratic as his Western Counterparts, but when compared to the other Iranian Leaders he is very much of a democrat. The fact that the subsequent leaders of Iran, The Shah and Khomeini, never even claimed to be democrats, makes Mossadegh a much better alternative as a leader. One final is that the Shah was not a traitor. He also had the interest of the country in his mind. But the fact that he had been brought back to power with the help of the Americans made it difficult for Iranians to accept him as their legitimate leader.

Why is the Shah the Traitor?

First of all, Mossadegh himself said the idea of the Oil Nationalization was Dr. Fatemi's . He never said it was his own idea. Second, Mossadegh was the head of oil commision in the Majles that decided oil should be nationalized. Third, the idea of a Jeffersonian democarcy doesn't even apply to Iran of the mid 20th century. Jefferson's idea of democracy envisioned a agrarian democarcy where small local areas manged their own affairs and dealt mostly with the state with little interference from the Federal Government. Iran's demoractic movement in the mid 20th century was to curb the influence of the foreigners powers and limit the power of the Shah. What Mossadegh envionsed was an independent government led by the Prime Minister. In his vision the Shah only reigned and didn't rule. He had even told the monarch that if he let's the Prime Minister handle the courntry he (The Shah) would never have to flee the country. Of course, that wasn't the Shah's ideal nad of course he eventually had to flee for good. Also, Mossadegh encouraged the freedom of the press. The Press criticized him constatnly during his tenure. The same can't be said of the Shah after 1953. I don't claim Mossadegh was as democratic as his Western Counterparts, but when compared to the other Iranian Leaders he is very much a democrat. The fact that the subsequent leaders of Iran, The Shah and Khomeini, never even claimed to be democrat, makes Mossadegh a much better alternative as a leader. One final is that the Shah was not a traitor. He also had the interest of the country in his mind. But the fact that he had been brought back to power with the help of the Americans made it difficult for Iranians to accept him as their legitimate leader.

I can't believe the person

I can't believe the person above thought out and typed this whole message!!

Mahshid Amirshahi is and has always been a Bakhtiar supporter. She was in fact said to be Bakhtiar's lady friend and she is suspected to have been the one giving him refuge before he left Iran for France.

It would sometimes pay to check facts first before going through the trouble of getting into a long soliloquy! :-)

Respond to mrclass and and Mahshid

mrclass asks "Why is Shah traitor?" Here is your response mrclass: The shah was considered a traitor, because it was "stylish" and "chic" to be anti-Shah. If you were anti-Shah, you could then consider yourself an "intellectual" with a "deep" mind.  Oh and let's not forget, it would also make you a first rate "patriot".

All these labels would automatically be assigned to you by your own self, after thanking yourself so much for being oh so "intellectually chic". Don't mind if you claimed you were pro-democracy but at the same time were actively and heavily promoting the worst dictator ever, Khomeini, like the majority of the Mosadeghi gang were, proving how intellecutaly banckrupt they were.

The author of the main article, Mahshid, claims:

از روزی که آخوندها در ایران به فکر تکیه زدن بر مسند قدرت افتادند من هم و غمم را متوجه مبارزه با آنها کردم 

Why don't you say the WHOLE truth and say

?از روزی که کمک کردیم آخوندها در ایران به مسند قدرت برسند 

She then refer to "players of the Aryarmeh era" and  says:

خاطیان نه فقط احساس ندامتی نسبت به آنچه مرتکب شده اند ندارند بلکه کم کم گناهان گذشته را هم می خواهند به حساب ثوابشان بریزند

For which sins should they feel remorse? The sin of having made Iran a prosperous country? And what about you, and if not you, the gang of Mosadeghis? Do YOU have any feelings of remorse for paving the way for Khomeini during the revolution? It is you and your gang that is presenting your "sins of the past" as "savaab" to the poor Iranian citizens.

She then goes on and say:

خفقان خودکامگی شاه ما را گرفتار نکبت تامگرایی ملا کرد

Really? How far can your "bi sharmi va veghaahat" go? It was the Shah that brought the mullahs to us? Or were the likes of YOU, and if not you, your gang, who brought the mullahs to us by continuously and fevereshly supporting Khomeini and inviting us to come to the streets and chant against the Shah AND for Khoemini? I was there you know, I can still remember Sanjabi, microphone in hand, with his Mosadeghi entourage praising Khomeini as "rahbare bozorg" and fevereshly inviting me and the others who were present to join the "emam".

She then says:

بازماندگان رژیم آریامهری – با سوءاستفاده از بیزاری روز افزون ایرانیان از حکومت مذهبی و به بار آمدن نسلی بی خبر از تنگناهایی که منتهی به فرمانروایی آخوند شد – در صدد برآمده اند که دوران حکمرانی خود را طیب و طاهر عرضه کنند.

Shouldn't that read:

بازماندگان چبهه ملئ – با سوءاستفاده از بیزاری روز افزون ایرانیان از حکومت مذهبی و به بار آمدن نسلی بی خبر درصدد برآمده اند که خیانت خود را در دوران انقلاب  طیب و طاهر عرضه کنند

She also says: 

 اطاعت بی چون و چرای محمد رضا شاه را از بیگانگان «دوستی دو ملت» می خوانند!

Ms. Mahshid, this statement is not "chic" anymore. Time has moved on and everyone today knows that the Shah was not "moti'e bi choono chera". He was doing everything in his power to liberate Iran from foreign dependency. Unfortunately, you and your gang were completely blind to his stuggles and did not give him a chance. But I must admit that you and your gang did manage to so easily deceive us into believing this none sense 29 years ago.

 She says:

فراموش نکنیم که مردم به استقبال این انقلاب رفتند تا از شر فساد و نخوت خاندان پهلوی و پستی و بی تشخصی نوکران آنها خلاص شوند

No Ms. Mahshi, we have not forgotten. I myself was one of those whom you are refering to, who greeded the revolution so that "we can become free from the Shah's corruption and his servants" as you said in Farsi. Those were my words too. However how I wish time could go back, and I could have a second chance to eat those words and instead "az share naadaanie shomaha va bi tashakhosi shomaha khalas mishodim", ta be in roozeh siaah melat ro nemishoondid. 

Whether 28 Mordad was an uprising or a coup does not take anything away from the fact that your gang, if not you, supported Khomeini, helped Khomeini, paved the way for Khomeini, spread a red carpet for Khomeini and declared Khomeini a Saint and "rahbare bozorg", and in all, not once, not even once, did you or any members of your Mosadeghi gang apologize to the Iranian nation for misleading Iranians, and for their other sins and errors of the past that caused such devastating results. Proving how ignorant and "por roo va talabkaar" you were and still are today.

Hmmm...

Does anyone else here get the feeling that some of us don't know who Mahshid Amirshahi is?

now why is shah traitor?

let me guess for working so hard (12 to 16 hours a day) for over 25 years to make Iran propsperous, modern and great place to live. Every single person including the writer of this cosy share article owens his or her life to the efforst that were done to modernize and create infra structure  under the leadership of shah of Iran. That's right lady: the school you attended, free lunch you consumed, the hospital you went to when you were sick,trips you took to Europe and U.S, your educationm the money and social class that you had all came from the hard work of shah and his father. In fact the father and son created such an instituion that after 28 years of destruction by islamo facist the country is still there and still hasn't buckeled yet.(although it's very close)

Mossadegh was no jeffersonian politican and his vision of Iran wouldn't have been a bit difference than the shah! The idea of oil nationalization was not even his idea, he just resurected it after it got defeated in the parlimant.

Yup we know the gender of leili and majnoon, sad to say we don't know the gender of our so called an-telectual wanna bee.

I thougtht....

Yes, you may be right. You said: "the likes of the shah and khomein are traitors..." But I think, and I may be wrong, but I think it is easy to assume that this statement covers all the Shahis too. And you don't know for sure if Rostam is a Shahi or not.  It seems that he is not, but anyway...

NEVER FORGET!

 I think Mossadegh thought the danger was over. But he wasn't sure what to do. It was confusing situation. He couldn't declare a Republic because the Mullahs would have opposed it. I do know he had told his people that the Shah should be persuaded to come back. As I mentioned before Fatami tried to convince Mossadegh to go after the supporters of the coup and execute them. But he refused to do so. He said I am the Prime Minister of the law. After the initial coup failed, Roosevelt was ordered to flee Iran. HE was told he could be killed if found out. However, he felt " he had to get the job done" and so he stayed. CIA had no plans for another coup. It was Roosevelt alone who planned the second coup. He was the one who got his people to act as Mossadegh supporters on the 27th and cause disturbances. He was trying to destabalize the government.  The next day he sent the Jaffari gangs out in order to deliver the final blow. I don't think he was sure of its success. Later when the time was right he went and brought Fazlollah Zahedi to the scene and put him on a tank as the supposed leader of the coup and the rest is history.

 I like to respond to those who claim we should forget about the 28th of Mordad. It was a shameful day in Iranian History and we should never forget it. I always admire the Jews for never let anyone forget the Holocaust. Whether it's through books or films, they keep the memory of Holocaust alive. Iranians should do the same. As flawed as Mossadegh was he should be dear to Iranians for two reasons. First, he truelly believed in democracy and as the Prime MInister he encouraged the freedom of press. That's what made him unique. He once told a newspaper man " if you don't do your job well we the politicians will be lazy." Second, he did kick the British out and even when they back in 1954 their influence was forever diminished.  We don't know what would have happened if Mossadegh hasn't been overthrown, but the subsequent regime never even claimed to be democratic.

Is it me or is the problem

Is it me or is the problem somewhere else?


I never called Rostam a traitor. You have the text in front of you, show me in which part of my comments I called him a traitor.


The only people I called traitors were Shah and Khomeini and I am still strongly of the opinion that they were traitors.

Re: Dr. Mossadegh and Loy Henderson

That's a likely explanation. However, a point that none of the historians has pointed to --not even Kinzer-- at least to my knowledge, is that Mossadegh and everybody else probably thought the coup was already stopped on the 25th. There were no other attempts on the 26th and the 27th, which added to the surprise element of the 28th. They had just let go to a certain degree and that's probably why their capacity for reaction on the 28th was neutralized.

Tolerance, Mertsi, tolerance

Very intersting thread of comments. Funny, it is totally getting away from the main article. I thought the comments are supposed to be about the main article.

Anyway, after reading the thread of comments that Mertsi started, I must say that Rostam is right, it is Mertsi that began calling "the likes of the shah and khomeini" traitors. And then when Rostam threw it back at you Mertsi, you got insulted. Come on guys... We are living in the US and we still haven't learn anything about tolerance?

Mertsi, it seems that this Rostam dude is trying to talk about unity. He is right when he says that the everyone with ANY point of view is still a citizen of Iran, and if you are truly a democratic person then you should at the very least be tolerant of opposing views. Whether you like it or not there is a good chunk of Iranians inside and outside of Iran that will probably have an opinion different than yours. Calling each other traitor is not democratic.

And it seems that you keep dodging the main issue the guys is bringing up, that freeing Iranians from suffering should have a higher priority than you or I or him liking or not liking Shah Or Mosadegh. What's so wrong about this?

I agree with the sermon thing though. If someone lost an eye in the war, we should all be thankful, but that doesn't make him god. You are ABSOLUTELY right on that. But relax! Calm down! It is SO obvious that the guy was just speaking figuratively and maybe he was trying to say that the person you call a traitor may have many times proven his love for his country and that you should not so easily call someone a traitor. I have to agree with Rostam on this. YOU COULD DEFINITELY OPPOSE HIS VIEW BUT AT THE SAME TIME, YOU SHOULD BE TOLERANT, OTHERWISE NO DEMOCRACY!

Lies? Whose lies?

What you wrote in response to my comments makes a great sermon for a akhund to make to the people of a remote village somewhere in Iran in order to make them weep (maybe you should consider sending it to one of those if you know one).

Anyway, as for answering my questions and other points raised in my comments you tried to dodge them completely and very unsuccessfully I might add. I never called you a traitor (can you not read?) but I called the Shah and Khomeini traitors. Yes that is my opinion and I am entitled to it however wrong it might be. Those comments could not sit well with your democratic mind and you decided to defend them and you called me a traitor instead, someone you have never met or heard of, while the whole world is aware of what Shah and Khomeini did during their rule.

You wrote "Mertsi in his comments titled "Shah? What is a Shah?" says the following: "the likes of Shah and Khomeini will be known as traitors..." This is the first reference to the word traitor in the thread. This is a serious accusation and although I am anti-monarchist AND anti-Khomeini, I do not like to be called a traitor.", I ask you to read all my comments and point out where I called you a traitor? The good thing about the whole thing is that all comments are there for all to see in black and white which makes it almost impossible for the other party to cheat and lie (which of course you so clumsily decided to do).

We were talking about your sense of democratic values and the fact that you were not willing to tolerate my views and started calling me oghdei and traitor. Instead of addressing those issues, you started to make a sermon about the sacrifice and sufferings during the war, loss of an eye and god knows what else. So what? If you went to the war and lost your eye does that give you the right to say and do whatever you please? Isn't this exactly what the Khomeinichis say and do in justifying their actions? They also say that they went to war in order to defend Islam and now they will not allow people to waste the blood of the martyrs by dressing, saying and doing things not accepted by them. You are saying exactly the same thing.

I could go on with a long list of things mentioned in your reply in order to dodge my questions raised in "Banner? Whose banner?". I do not know what your problem (or problems) are but I can assure you that the next revolution/uprising/change will not be carried out under the slogan of "all under the same banner". The past 30 years have been a good education for all Iranians. We had the chance to get to know the political forces and personalities much better because the process has taken so long and the enemy has been so ruthless and crafty . Many of these so called opposition people have shown their true colours which would not have been possible if the change in power were to have happened quickly.

Well I stop here because to be honest I do not think any of the things I mentioned here will interest you at all (I don't know if you even bother to read them thoroughly). So If you decide to reply please refrain from giving me your sermons about sufferings and so forth for I believe I am as familiar with them as you are if not more. In short stop beating about the bush and get to the point.

sorry any one thinks western life can help us...

any one support western life and democrcay over Iran for me I thinks he or she crazy I am ready to get in any btalk show and chyange any one thinks Iran is a rung place and we don't have democrcay in Iran, which I was thinking and I left Iran to canada ...iI hops some one support me from inside of Iranian government bto let me back and get in university or magazine Tv news paper talk to student and Iranian about are life here we just lies about nasty life and are nasty western democrcay,

An angry and chaotic mind...

Mertsi says: "... You started insulting me .... as traitor... " I invite the readers to follow the thread and see who started calling whom traitor. I shall now expose Mertsi's lie.

Mertsi in his comments titled "Shah? What is a Shah?" says the following: "the likes of Shah and Khomeini will be known as traitors..." This is the first reference to the word traitor in the thread. This is a serious accusation and although I am anti-monarchist AND anti-Khomeini, I do not like to be called a traitor.

Next Mertsi says "...So save your sermon for someone who does not know your type better..." So exactly what type am I Mertsi? Could it be possible, just possible, that I am the type that lost an eye in the Iraq war to defend the country? What about the possiblity that I was the type that got thrown in IRI's prisons for almost two years for being anti-velaayate faghih despite of serving in the war? And the possiblity of being beaten, tortured and humilated? Being forced into exile? Would I still be a traitor to my country because you don't like what I believe in? You may say that I am just saying these, but then HOW do you know?

Just read Mertsi comments and you find an angry mind who does not care about Iran, but only for his hatred towards those with opposing views.

And yes, considering the suffering of Iranians, whether that suffeing belongs to those who are rotting in IRI prisons, or those who are hanged, or those women who are rotting as slaves in some arab country, or those who have to work 2 shifts just to pay the rent despite of oil being $70 a barrle, or those who are rotting jobless and sometimes homeless because they have lost their limbs in the war, .... the list goes on, considering all these sufferings, all Iranians, as an act of sacrifice, should set aside their differences and their "oghde", to end those sufferings as their highest prioirty of all.

Dr.Mossadegh and Ambassdor Loy Henderson

I think Dr. Mossadegh trusted the Americans too much. Loy Henderson told Dr. Mossadegh the day before the coup that some of the agitators on the street have attacked foreigners. Mossadegh immediately ordered the police to dismiss these agitators. According to Stephen Kinzer, this was a trick by Anderson to get the Mossadegh people off the street. As the result, the next day the Mossadegh supporters weren't in the street to oppose Shabban Jafari's gangs. The Tudeh also refrained from sending their people to the streets to help. Kianuri claims that he called Mossadegh and offered help, but he refused. The Tudeh has been criticized  lot for their lack of action on the 28th of Mordad. I should also add that the policies and the character of Harry Truman was very different from General Eisenhower. Truman was concerned about Iran, but he was unlikely to authroize a secret coup in Iran. However, Eisemhower had seen the benefits of covert actions during World War II and as the President he didn't hesitate to use it. Stephen Ambrose's Ike spies describes in detail Eisenhower's love for secret operations. Still, he was hesitant about authorizing the coup until July 1953.

Re: Mossadegh's Myth

Good comment, there's a lot of truth to what you're saying about the day of 28 Mordad. Why didn't he call the people to the streets via the radio station while it was still not occupied? What did he and Loy Henderson tell each other on the 27th when they met at his home? There are things that history yet has to answer to.

Mossadegh's Myth

Lol.  Former Secretary of State Albright admitted to the coup and apologized for the actions of the Eisenhower administration for the coup. These Pro- Monarchy groups who deny the coup are in self denial. CIA couldn’t have it done it without help of the Iranians who were bought by cash, but it’s also true that the Mossadegh opponents couldn’t have pulled the coup on their own. They needed the help and the encouragment of the Americans. In brief, the participation of both the CIA and the Iranians was required for the coup to succeed. In the short run, the coup was beneficial for the Americans for 25 years. But in the long term the coup has resulted in 28 years of a bitter divorce-in the words of Ali Ansari- between the U.S and Iran. However, although I admire Mossadegh, we do have to admit he made mistakes. For instance, the dissolving of the 17th Majlis while not illegal was a political mistake. Without a Parliament in session the Shah had a free hand to dismiss Mossadegh and he did. But when Mossadegh’s supporters warned him about this he said “ Shah Joratee in Kar ra nadard.”  Mossadegh had been warned that there were those in the Parliament who had been bought by the Americans and they were trying to undermine him and as the result he dissolved the Parliament in order to prevent any attempt by those deputies to undermine him. Also, on the day of 28th Mordad he didn’t even try to stop the agitations in the street. It was against his democratic make up. The result was devastating.  Overall, I think he was great as an opposition leader in the Parliament. Nobody could touch him in that position. However, as a Prime Minister he was constantly attacked by the left and the right and the British were undermining him all the time. He could never have won. Had he compromised with the British he would have been labeled a “sell out.” But there are those, such as Richard Cottam, who say he had already won by Nationalising the oil and he should have compromised. In my opinion is that his status as a nationalist would have never allowed him to do so.

Remeber who divid us

Just remember, it was not anyone but the west that always divided us and helped destroying our free government. Now IRI is standing up to the west might be a good thing for the future of Iran. That does not mean that we can stop fighting for Rights.

Banner? Whose banner?

I think we experienced that "all under the same banner" thing once and look at the result, so No, thank you very much I do not want to do my "chest beating=sinezani" under a banner which includes those who have/or have shown to be able to murder, torture, oppress and plunder the Iranian people.

<br>
Democracy is a very mouth-filling and catchy word to use when one wants to force one's own ideas on others, you for one were not ready to give me my "democratic right as defined in your world" to express my opinion, however wrong and stupid it might have sounded to you, and now you have the nerve of lecturing me about democracy? You started insulting me and the original writer as "oghdeis" and me as traitor because we did not conform to your your way of thinking and your idea of democracy. If this is your idea of democracy then I hate to see how you treat your opponents once you are in power (this is of course very improbable if not impossible).
</br>
The Iranian people have matured under the Khomeini rule enough to know who is on their side and they do not need me or you to tell them whom they should trust and whom not. So save your sermon for someone who does not know your type better.
<br>
So tell me now, which part of this you don't understand?

</br>

My comments went to the

My comments went to the wrong place, sorry!

Yes you are wrong.

Yes you are wrong in saying that because it is un-democratic and dictatorial to set aside a large group of anti-IRI Iranians and call them s**t. Either include Mosadeghis too, or admit you are as dictatorial as the Shahis. AND you are hearing this from an anti-monarchist. Saying what X believes amounts to s**t IS flaming divisons. My god, if that is not flaming division then what is?

We should be more sensitive to the pain Iranians are enduring in Iran, from Kurdestan to Azarbayjan to tehran and everywhere else. Therefore, we should let go of our differences. We should unite under one banner. The banner of a secular, progressive and free Iran, not the banner of Shah or Mosadegh. The IRI will not be overthrown so easily by just daydreaming about it. We need all our forces combined, that includes the Mosadeghis AND the Shahis and the leftists too, only then we have a chance against the IRI.

What part of this you do not understand?

Re: I love Iran...

Just one question: Who is this hajiagha anyway? Where are people like this brewed? His comments are so ridiculous they don't even need an answer. All I can tell is that I would love to see the day a Canadian goes to Iran and say outloud that Iran sucks and the IRI should be deposed, etc... He'll be shot on the spot! And this idiot dares to complain about Canada?

Oghdei? Who is oghdei?

I do not want to turn this into a mud-slinging match. I think you just proved by your comments who the real oghdei is. Your comments amount to what we call "oghde terekooni".
I wasn't "flaming divisions among Iranians", I was just saying that whatever Shahollahis or Hezbollahis say ain't worth S**t , that all. Was I wrong?

Who is the traitor?

The traitor is you who is flaming divisions among Iranians. The Mosadeghis and Shahis are BOTH citizens of Iran and their rights and opinions must be respected in a democratic envrionment. It is becoming clearer and cleared to me, that the pro-Mosadeghis are as dictatorial and un-democratic as the Shahis.

GET THIS YOU ALL: Iranians today don't want Mosadegh. They don't want the Shah. They certainly don't want "oghdeis" like Mahshid or Mertsi. They want someone who is alive and un-oghdei.

I love Iran and I respect to Islaimc regime of Iran because.....

when I was left Iran as cartoonist and cross border I had so
much stress may Iranian Immigration stop and rejecting me to left Iran
out.....I had dreams after I land in USA, I will working hard and study then I
get to in animation job as artist and publish my editorials cartoons with out
any fear...get married and......after 11 years from 1995 which I left Iran to loss
angels and then Canada, I became homeless in first 2 years , and I never had
any chance to publish my art works or display or sale in Canada....I never had
any chance to working as animator's...I never had any chance to date female and
get married....I never had any chance to be happy in Canada just a
day....because of stupid racism....and also capitalism system in Canada push
are people to be like robot....cold blood and living lonely with ignores ....I should
stay in Iran and be happy for what I had under Islamic regime of Iran my life
story like others Iranian in Iran which they are happy to live under Islamic
regime ...and safe .....I thinks they having right too if some one don't like
to stay in Iran he or she welcome to move out and open room's to some one like
me if I had chance to back in Iran and working for Ghol Agha as cartoonist, or
teaching in Iranian school.....I don't like western life and any one like Shah
or some one like to bring such this stupid system in Iran, free crime, and
drugs and gay married,,, or like in Canada a jungle where rich people and are
government hand in hand fu.....off are by new law and rolls and system they
have every day's....day after day in Canada cost of living going up and up and
TAX...and we can not do any things about....like no place to get complainer
about ...news paper and TV in Canada and are government run by the white
Canadian...where I can companies ...only here on Iranian

hajiagha

I didn't get that... Whose fault?

The author of this article states that the dictatorship of the Shah is the reason why we have the IRI today.

I must object. It was the likes of the author of this article that paved the way for IRI by constantly telling us lies that conditioned the minds of the Iranian masses to turn against the Shah and Bakhtiar and to turn for Khomeini. Now with "por rooyie har cheh tamaamtar" she blames the previous regime and everyone else except herself.

Why Mahshid don't you and the "guilty" and "oghdei" likes of you crawl into your holes and just stay in there and allow the new wave of opposition who is neither pro or anti Shah or Mosadegh take hold? You and your likes brought the IRI to us in the past, and now today you are holding it alive by flaming division among Iranians. When will you stop your sins against the nation of Iran? If only these "por roo" and "oghdei" dinosaurs, Mosadeghi and Shahi and whatever else alike, would become extinct...

Who cares!

Fariborz M.  St. Louis

Lets move on.  The question is what did we learn about the past?  NOTHING.  We like to talk about it and analys and over analys the heck out of it, but we don't learn. 

oh yes oh yes

oh yes we know that Mossadegh was god and when ever he shit, his shit was made if gold we know that. We also know that all the progress that were made in Iran untill 1979 just happend by itself!!!! in fact all good things in Iran happend by itself or may be even mossadegh his grave send powrfull signal but then again every short comming of Iran is shah's fault. That's right! 1400 years of backwardness is all shah's fault. In fact mossadegh had a recepy that would have made Iran far more advance than U.S had he remained in power. (Never mind all his friends and pals aliented him and left him, and beside hezb Tudeh no one was following the guy!)  for the best analysis of that era read ali mir fetros wirintgs and learn some thing. As for 1952 coup well it was a coup so was 1979 coup which has more evidence and you do not need to wait fifty years to find out about it.

Shah? What is a Shah?

I have come to the conclusion that most Iranians (70% under 30 years old) have not experienced the times before the revolution and therefore know nothing about it and do not yearn to have it back. They just dislike the present regime and want to get rid of it and replace it with a democratic alternative. We all know that Shahollahis are not even considered as the remotest of alternatives. In fact the Shahollahis are irrelevant to today's Iran and its needs. So whatever they say or do is not worth a penny and will not change history as it really happened. Nahavandi and his likes can say whatever they like about Dr Mosaddegh but the fact is that Dr Mosaddegh will always be a hero amongst Iranians and the likes of Shah and Khomeini will be known as traitors.

They are simply a stain in the history of our nation, nothing more.