Sic Semper Tyrannis

Anonymity isn't really safe commenting

It merely passes on the "danger" (what danger is there really?) to someone else. I this case technically, civilly, legally, anonymous posts are the responsibility of the publication. In this case the site owners.

Anyday now, someone is going to anonymously post something about someone that is defined as libel, and the victim will speak to a lawyer, and the lawyer will find out who owns the site, and how much money they have, and do some math and decide to sue. Anyday now.

My suggestion which isn't going over too well, is that we self regulate according to libel laws, to avoid that. One way the keeps my mouth careful is by using my real name.

While what was posted about Dabashi isn't what I think is libelous, you ever know, it is not the intent, it is the effect, and I would hate if someone like Dabashi decided to sue this site.

Better to have a standard of excellence and responsible reporting, so that this does not happen. That's my point.

Now, if you all who support anonymity want to continue to throw stones at elephants while hiding from behind the trees along the roadside, I guess I will have to concede your right to do so.

But someone could eventually get really really hurt and pissed off, from the harmless stone throwing.

Thanks Hamsade for your comment addressed to me

It is true that if people use their real names and blog against IRI, they may get in trouble but the more people use their real names, the risk goes down, that includes facebook also, no more becoming Irani and Parsi.

My position on use of real names is a nuianced one. There are arguments from sides. I happen to agree with some arguments that Bahmani has but then I can see cases that it might be better not to use real names. Any way, IC policy allows use of other names so that is what it is. Thanks.

Hamsadeh-e-Gerami

In English it's called "beating around the bush" or "avoiding the subject by introducing a red herring into the discussion."  In IR parlance, it's called "safsateh," which, in and on itself, is a great Islamic art form.  

anahid, you're making it

anahid, you're making it more complicated than it is.  if there were two choices: 1) you take an action (that is not criminal such writing a blog) anonymously without recourse, 2) you take the same action with a potential of punishment (years in jail or paying off an authority 1/4 million $), which one would you take?  it's about rationality.  would you risk not seeing your child for a few years for writing a blog against iran and travelling there? 

if you have difficulty understanding this rationality, then we should just learn to agree to disagree.  you can also watch the first minute of nazanin afshin-jam's video on kadivar's blog to get the message: //iranian.com/main/blog/darius-kadivar/voice-voiceless-nazanin-afshin-jam-tedxvancouver

concubine,  the point is not about gaza and libya.  the point is that iranians and palestinans are not in a three-legged race to reach their freedom.  iranian problem has nothing to do with the oppression in tibet either.  i'm sure you can understand that.

LOL!!!

 Who is to say that Mr genius Dabashi himself, doesn't post all over the internet anonymously and anyway why should this genius care about some username called Anonymous Observer or his given name,let's call him Mr Hossein-Abbas Mazandari*, who didn't even go to Columbia! 

*sorry, AO! ;) 

 I have my own reasons for wishing to use an anonymous username. 

Anyway, why is there a no fly-zone in Libya and not one in Gaza, ey? (That's a Dabashi question, not mine. I just want to angoolak around a bit. ;))

I think I have an argument in

Favor of not using real names. Let's say that I write this poetry book and Iranians invite me to their gatherings so among all other things, I can introduce my book and sell some copies. So every one is nice to me and vice versa. Now fast forward few years and I write blogs making fun of same Iranians who invited me to their mahafel. In a case like this, I think it might be better if I don't use my real name.I really don't know about this real name versus fake but above scenario does seem like a case for not using real names.

bahmani, it seems that you

bahmani, it seems that you have a comprehension problem.  i travel to iran regularly. put 2 and 2 together.  now, did you have time to think about why the oppression of iranians cannot (or should not) be separated from the palestinian problem.  hint: subject of the blog.

reply to "comments":

If it's therapy how come we're not getting better? My point in all of this is:

1) anonymity allows you to slip into a false sense of security in which throwing stones from behind a wall becomes too easy to slip into slander and libel. If you don't like someone's position, or disagree with them, the adult, educated, responsible thing to do is vocalize your arguments and stand behind them. Usually this is done personally. It makes the opponent you are trying to criticize respect your argument. Anonymity is the coward's way and almost always ends up being rude.

2)Anonymity does nothing to further our collective struggle for freedom in Iran. By being free and accountable and standing up with our names here, we are counted and accountable to that struggle. YES, this makes it difficult to go back to Iran often for fun, but occasionally out of necessity to see family and so on. But life is hard. It is especially harder when you put off doing the hard things, and deny your own struggle for freedom.

Living outside of Iran, and not proudly standing up for the right of Iranians to be free from this shit they are living under now, by showing your own bravery to use your own name, is the height of hypocrisy, stupidity, and illogical chickenshit behavior. And I simply don't get why outside of Iran, we are still allowing unelected unauthorized tyrants to make us afraid.

Hamsade: Using your real name in Iran

DUH! that's even more the reason to do so here! If you cow tow to the tyranny inside Iran and shut your mouth here, who wins? They do! All the more reason to standup, speak your piece (civilly with a good argument against why you disagree with Dabashi etc.) and hold your head up in spite of the real oppression that takes place in Iran.

By continuing to be anonymous here, of all places, you allow the oppressors to win.

Comments dear ,

No Worries  ..... I just thought your quoted statement on sex has nothing to do with this topic ...... It came out of no where ......  But that is just me 

others seemed to get what you were talking about ..... I didn't ....

I am using an Online ID but this has not changed my thoughts and the real me ..... I would say the same things no matter what .....

I am a scientist and people occasionally search for some published scientific papers with also my name on it ..... I do not see any reason those people end up reading everything that I post on line and get involved in every single discussion that I have ...

I also think Bahrami is brave and i have stated why ......

I may not be as brave as him when it come to dealing not only with IRI but with those anti muslims and or racists Iranians who have threaten me on this site on many occasions..... These people are capable to do anything  ....... same fanatic radicals as IRI !

Hamsadeh Jaan

Well, as a vegan, I can assure you that I do NOT go to Iran In quest of 90 cm kabobs…not even 20 cm ones.  I travel there to visit my frail and sick uncle, whom I love dearly.  But you are quite correct in pointing out the hypocrisy and the obvious double talk in bahmani’s comments, where he points out the obvious in the student situation and tries to hide it in the discussion on “anonymity.” In any event, I can  respond to your question about the mixing of Palestine and Iran by Dabashi since bahmani refuses to do so.  There are several reasons. 

The first and most obvious one is that he’s trying to take advantage of the publicity that is generated by the events in Iranto push his real cause, which is the Palestinian issue.  As an Iranian (sadly)—and a pseudo-pundit on Middle East issues--he has had the opportunity to worm himself into the spotlight again following the events in Iran.  So, that’s why you see this weird situation being created, wherein he has no choice but to at least talk about Iran just so that he can be on TV while he advances his cause.  Hence, the ridiculous green chafiyeh.

Second, he has to be all out and be “kaseyeh az ash daghtar” now that shit has hit the fan.  He has no choice.  He needs credibility to stay relevant (good luck with that).  I mean, not too long before the 2009 elections, he was hosting Mohammad Javad Zarif at Columbia.  Now, he has had an epiphany and has realized that the IR has been a brutal regime for the past thirty years.  So much for being a genius by the way.  Was he too dumb to realize the implications and ramifications of legitimizing a brutal dictatorship by giving a civilized platform to its representative?!!  Anyway, now he has to go all out and try to show that he’s really not what he has been for the past 30 years.  He loves democracy in Iran…perhaps it’s just that he was too enamored by the Israel-bashing that was coming out of the IR to say anything bad about them for three decades.  So, while he really can’t let go of his real agenda--the Palestinian cause--he has to talk about Iran just to that he has some semblance of credibility.

There was one other reason too, but I forgot…sorry.  Been too busy today.  I’ll leave another comment when I remember!!

Incidentally, this whole thing about him being a “genius”  is so laughable.  Are we to worship at the altar of all “geniuses?”  You know who else was a genius?  Ted Kaczynski.  Ivy League credentials and all.  I actually had the distinct pleasure of meeting one of his victims a couple of times. Nice man.  Kind of odd though...  seeing him trying to hold on to papers with his prosthetic hand and have a cup of coffee at that little coffee shop at the corner of Church and Grove.  I guess that’s what happens when a “genius” sends you a mail bomb that explodes in your face.  Not suggesting that Dabashi is that nuts, but he did try to legitimize a regime that did much worse things to Iranian citizens, some as young as 12.           

SK jan

I think you were surprized about my example in "radical honesty".  And, I think it was only because of its sex related subject.  There are SO many things are going on behind a few minutes action.  I think the below link/article is interesting to view such a subject in a more exagerated way in a court level.  I hope you could access that article.

"A Batty Case of Harassment

Anahid, Yes. That's exactly what I meant.

comments, I am not sure I understand

Your last comment addressed to me correctly. I think you mean that the reason that I use my real name is so I get credit for my poems. That is not the only reason. I do think every user's case is different but I happen to agree somewhat with what Mr. Bahmani says. I can't quite feel comfortable about people who do not use their real names to criticize those who use their real names. There is something wrong about it. But then there are more important issues regarding Iran and the world so I am not prepared to spend my time arguing my case. Besides, Mr. Bahmani writes some arguments in favor of using real names. Again, I am not part of IC admin so even though my preference is using real names, obviously I must feel somewhat comfortable with status quo on IC or I would not be here.

ATT: SK and Anahid

SK: if you are so much in the favor of real names why didn't you come up with your real name?  You had a reason that you prefered to come up with a name that reflects your gender.  But, I have my reasons that I didn't want to give an idea about my gender in prior to someone reads my comment.  My first statement about "radical honesty" was about RADICAL honesty.  I just finished that book and thought it was okay not to be honest all the time.  The example was about "RADICAL" honesty that I copied from that book, which makes sense in the use of "real name" subject.

Anahid: I think you are using your real name since you can't dedicate your work especially poets without taking the credit of your real name.  This makes sense.  I addressed the rest of your comment in the previous paragraph to SK.

Jenab Bahmani :)

So far I see that you are playing with words: "responsibility", "stand up", "personal problems", "mardi bia bazi" and so on.  I think you showed too much of yourself in this theraphy session.  However, I am getting curious to read more about what you write or have to offer in the future comments.

اگه مردی برو

اگه مردی برو ایران و بی‌نام یا با اسمت رو پیراهنت توی خیابون‌ها (یا کنار کارخونهٔ پیف پاف) عربده بکش.  بدون که توی ایرون زهر مار هم نمیدن به باد دماغ‌های لاته خور اینترنتی‌. وضع ایران با بگو مگوی من و تو حل نمیشه دادا.  برو حالتو بکن و خوش باش.

Anonymity removes responsibility

As I am sure you can now tell, I'm not a fan of anonymity. Since Iran and Iranians are still not free (yet) I will conveniently choose to blame anonymity.

Since you're smart, prove me wrong.

Additionally when we are accountable for what we say, I think we tend to see far more substantive (not vitriole) commentary.

Anonymity merely excuses unfair slander and defamation. If someone is too afraid to use their real name for fear of backlash or admonition or retribution, they've got far far bigger personal problems, and probably shouldn't be wasting their time posting on a website.

Maybe it's me. I'm just over the whole throw tomatoes from the sidelines tactics. Mardi, bia to bazi.

comments, i think bahmani

comments, i think bahmani really gets what you're saying.  i think that is or he wouldn't have said the following in another thread today (just replace 'students' or 'iranian students' with iranians):

"oppression of students in Iran is very high on the security policies in Iran so when it becomes easy for Iranians students to come and go and do their political sheytooni, when they come home for christmas and summer vacation, there will be a reaction."

i just don't know with all the chelo kababs in this country, why he thinks that the only reason some of us travel to iran is for 90 cm kababs.  maybe he's just trying to win an argument for the sake of it. some us have even gone there while visiting family and graveyards ended up joining the masses in the streets during protests, those chickenshit protests.

i don't mind that bahmani is a hardcore dabashi fan.  but since he's realized dabashi's genius by taking his class, listening to his speeches, and perhaps even read his books, he just can't articulate why the iranian cause and palestinian cause are inseparable.

signed, hamsade ghadimi :)

Anonymity vs real name to Bahmani.

Why did you primarily bring up this subject? 

I think those with straightforward/expected life history are more prone to indicate their real names, or they have a good reason to come up with their real names. I hope you will discover better support for your anonymity comment.

 
"Anonymity doesn't protect you from others, it hides you from your true self. The day that everyone uses their real names on this site and stands up and speaks their minds, we will all be free."  "stand up" ?  Have you seen Gheisar recently?  If I wanted to speak up my mind, I have been dead/dysfunction by now, or spending some more physically defined times for political reason when I was 14 in Iran.   I wish it was because of human right reasons that I am pursuing now.  Can you make people better listeners because you are using your real name?  For me and almost all others your real name is as anonymous as others.  I only realized that Bahmani is your real name because you brought up this subject.  This is almost the only source of my communications with non-family Iranians. 

"I've seen them come and go and trust me, there is nothing good that has ever come of anonymity"  I am not one of those.  I have been here longer/as long as you.  But, I have several big gaps, and simply forgot my user name/email address.  But, still, I believe that you will see a "real you" when you don't come with your real name as long as you bring your thoughts in writing.  I am sure everybody has tried anonymity, but the reason that they prefered the real name is not quite clear.    p.s. we are not enough people to play group-games so well said about Dabashi!  

Civility, passion, anonymity

Based on my own opinion of Dabashi, I refused to accept the cheap critique of him by AO. I use my real name, and I speak out against ANYTHING I think through and find that, yes by golly I still feel strongly enough to speak out about that. It's called thoughtful objection.

That being said, go listen to one of Dabashi's presentations and tell me he's utterly ridiculous. Which is what AO suggested without, in my opinion, ANY merit. Again, you can disagree with D if you want, but you cannot discredit D's intellect and qualifications.

It is absolutely awesome that we have passion about things like the position of D vs our own thought on the matters and challenges that we find ourselves presented with these days. Love it. But let's do it civilly, or with enough ammo in the details, to completely bury a fucker, please.

I do my own fair share of ridicule, but I try and back it up with sheer facts. This was just a plain ambush and assassination of D by AO. for what seems to me like personal reasons.

Look, I have been around a long time, the 15 on my avatar is the years I have been writing here. I've seen them come and go and trust me, there is nothing good that has ever come of anonymity. All it does is lengthen the time it takes for us to come together and stand for what we all know we need to stand for.

Anonymity doesn't protect you from others, it hides you from your true self. The day that everyone uses their real names on this site and stands up and speaks their minds, we will all be free.

Until then, we're just chicken shits, trying to have our 90cm kabab in Tehran, while we throw "anonymous" stones at "authority". How sad!

مهدی اصلانی و ايرج مصداقی

AO, Just in case, the backgrounds of the two ex prisoners of the islamist regime who spoke so loudly against Mr Dabashi in your link:

Eslani: a Member of fadaiian Khalgh, a very "lefty" kind of Organisation ! Mesdaghi: A member of MKO, no need for introduction!

From what I know, both were too busy fighting shah and mullahs throughout their lives, to jump on a plane to NYC and earn themselves a "PhD" in god knows what and get a teaching job at columbia teaching who cares what!

Thanks for the links. You convinced me for sure.

 "Personal business must yield to collective interest."

While we're asking questions, one more Mr. Dabashi

Mr. Dabashi why, of all the countries in the World, have you chosen to live and work in the "war mongering, predatory empire i.e. the United States?"

Please keep in mind that I'm not suggesting that you shouldn't have the right to live anywhere you choose, but it does somewhat smack of the height of hypocrisy on one hand to enjoy the freedoms, security, convenience and comforts that country offers and on the other to hold it in such palpable contempt that you feel compelled to denounce it in such vigorous terms, does it not?

Question for Mr. Dabashi

Here's a quote from an article that Dabashi wrote for PBS (yes, he has wormed himself in everywhere as an "Iran expert) back in October, 2010:

 "The conundrum we face today is of a very simple but potentially debilitating nature. On one side we have a brutal theocracy run by a band of militant and militarized warlords who have no regard for human decency and systematically maim and murder their own citizens; and on the other stands a predatory empire (the United States) and its colonial outpost (Israel), continuing equally systematically to demonize any country or clime of resistance to their warmongering. Facing this conundrum, many Iranians who deeply worry about their homeland have opted to remain silent about the criminal atrocities of the Islamic Republic for fear of fueling the fire of warmongering that has now targeted Iran after it has destroyed Afghanistan and Iraq. On the other side of the spectrum are those among Iranians so incensed by these atrocities, or else tempted by political opportunism, that they bashfully or happily side with the worst neocon chicaneries in the United States, aiding and abetting in demonizing Iran, for they think a U.S.-led military strike is the only way to get rid of this theocracy. In the middle stand a few of us categorically and constitutionally against any sanctions or boycott of our homeland, economic or cultural, or any covert operation and above all, and a fortiori, any military strike by Israel or the United States against its territorial integrity, and yet not letting the Islamic Republic off the hook for its criminal atrocities over the last 30 years."

 //www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/tehranbureau/2010/10/the-space-of-philosophy.html

Aside from pointing out the fact that he's trying to once again intertwine Iran and Palestine, I also like to ask Mr. Dabashi a question: 

Tell us Mr. Dabashi, if this government has been committing atrocities for the past 30 years, why in the world were you hosting its ambassador at Columbia before the June, 2009 election?

 //iranian.com/main/news/2010/10/29-10

Did the whole "30 years of atrocities" thing not matter at that time?!!! 

Comments, HG and Anahid

I think that the issue needs to be looked at in a broader context.  I believe that the way it is discussed here is patently unfair and selective in prospective.  If there is to be an absolute identity disclosure policy whenever there is a critique, or even an attack on a public figure on IC, then it should be applied across the board—including to the many blogs, videos and articles on Reza Pahalavi. It should not just be applied to pieces on people whom the administrators of this site (and/or their posse) adore, admire or emulate.  As it stands, this site allows anonymous blog postings, and if that is the case, one blogger should not be singled out and put on the spot for doing something that everyone else does.  I just think that in this specific blog, the charge is being thrown around as a red herring…that’s all.  I say this because people who are demanding identity disclosure on this thread have never done so on other blogs on IC where other public figures were attacked.  In fact, they have, at times, participated in the lynching themselves.

HG – Just to follow up on your point, I think that Dabashi is actually using the publicity that is generated by the unrest in Iran as a platform to push his favorite cause: the Palestinian issue.  Otherwise, why would he be talking about it at every gathering (or even video-as you posted) that has to do with Iran?          

Example.

If I come up with my real name, I will have to automatically take a stand at every subject.  The real name becomes my image including my gender, age, skin color, etc., and I have to act like a role model all the time considering my profession and etc.  I am that “careful*” person in real world, but I don’t want to be the same person in here. 

I am against “radical honesty”, but I’d like to be thankful to Iranian.com, and express my feelings as well as logics.  For example, I believe in sexual orientation (i.e. homosexuality vs. heterosexuality) as something that people were born with that and realized it sooner or later. 

But, I see all gay/lesbian images on the media as destructive.  The physical appearance and an individual’s behaviour usually don’t have to do anything with one’s sexual orientation.  All stereotyping are wrong including men with too much attitudes, men with too much muscularity physics, and women with too much muscularity abusive power and so on.  Even too girly Paris Hilton doesn’t have the attitude of some gay men that we see on the TV.

p.s. (1) careful*: I am not talking about my masturbations with others at work!

p.s. (2) should I give a damn that some people didn’t like my comment since I am not here with my real name?  Will I feel threatened to travel to Iran and whatever happens after that?  Will I feel threatened that my son, wife and myself are harassed and discriminated at our work/schools in here (THE FREE US!).

Dear comments, about use of real names

IC policy presently lets people to have user names besides their own names. Also sometimes, people's conditions are different. As you noted, there are different sides to an argument and it is good to be able to discuss them all. It is also important for people to share content.If for some peole, not using their real names helps them contribute content more easily, then that is good. As far as people who use real names getting free publicity, that is true. But many don't or have not used this free publicity to make any money from it. However, yes, they do get free publicity. So maybe second part of your comment wa not bad but your confrontational tone in how you wrote it, was the problem.

i'm with you 'comments' on

i'm with you 'comments' on the issue of anonymity.  anyone who speaks derogatory of islamic republic with his/her real name and also travels to iran risks detainment, injury and/or having to post a non-refundable bond of $250,000+.  this is a fact.  there are internet offenses that have been successfully implemented in iran on innocuous actions by iranian citizens.  part of maziar bahari's punishment was a 6-month sentence because one of his facebook friends had posted the famous picture of ahmadinejad seemingly french-kissing another guy on his facebook wall.  another point on anonymity: anyone who is knowledgeable with administering survey instruments can tell you anonymous respondents are more truthful than those whose identities are known.

i too will not play the group game 'comments,' that's why i have to go with 'anonymous observer' on the issue of dabashi. anyone who cannot speak of the plight of iranians against the burtal islamic regime without tying it somehow to the palestinian cause is, for the very least, dishonest and duplicitous.  at most, they're agents or apologists for the regime (i'm not suggesting he is).  i have not yet heard a direct response to this charge except that "he must be a genius because he's a professor at an ivy league school."  and geniuses must be always right because they're geniuses.

My comment was about "the

My comment was about "the usage of real name" as I clearly mentioned.  I followed some other comments in this subject, which happened to be about the use of real name.

However, I don't think that we can come with an example and ruin all right doing of a person at present.  I am with Bahmani in this case.  Sorry guys that I am not playing group-games in this website.  But, I assure you that I don't love you less :)

Anahid: you are so right :)  The first paragraph is in contradictory with the second :)  But, both are informatives.  I am not ruling a government!  I feel free to express my both sides of ideas.  There are usually both sides to a story. Usually, but not always. 

Thanks COP & Shemirani

You know...I was watching C-SPAN a few days ago, and on there was a review of a book written by an American guy and a couple of sprouting"Iran expert" (yaaawwwwn) wannabes.  I guess the book was a compilation [their opinions] of the so-called "Green Movement" and what they thought we should think of this "movement."  And to give legitimacy to their"opinions", they had this perennial imposter, Dabashi, give a speech and praise their ground breaking book.  So, I decided to watch it for its inevitable comical value.  And HD did not disappoint.  A minute into his speech, he started talking about Israel grabbing Palestinian land and tried to relate that to the "Green Movement."  It just became surreal at some point.  Luckily, he announced that he had another “event” to attend and kept the sermon short...but boy...what a freak show...