Bijan A M

One of these days.....

I will retire and find more time to engage in debates (which is one of my passions).For now I have to settle for sporadic appearances.

Dear Benross; Wow…, you nailed it. You are absolutely right in suggesting that not all who protest for freedom have the same understanding of what is meant by freedom. As I have suggested in some of my previous posts, I am of the opinion that a moderated and watered down Islamic doctrine will never lead to a real freedom. The only path to real freedom (Secular democracy) is thru eradication of theocracy. There is no such a thing as mild/moderate theocracy (same as, there is no such a thing as “half pregnant”).

 You are probably right about the flaw in my thinking. The optimist (Or should I say the gullible) side of me hopes that at least some segments of those who have risen against the barbarities of the IRI, (be it in support of Mousavi or Karroubi) will see the true meaning of freedom without the clutter of ME conflict. IRI’s efforts to interject this conflict into the mix to get the opposition’s focus off their goal, has to be stopped. This is by no means an indication of insensitivity towards what’s happening around the globe, but, these happenings have nothing to do with our fight for true democracy.

Ben, you are either a philosopher or are well qualified to be one, and I mean it in the most complimentary sense. Thank you very much for your post.

Faghan, do you honestly understand your own jibberish….What are you talking about? Are you trying to say that the struggle for freedom from IRI should wait until there is a universal peace around the globe and dogs don’t go after cats because scientifically we all have to be in harmony? What a bunch of …. Sir, why don’t you take a few sleeping pills before you go to bed.

Shotor zadeh, I debated whether to ignore you or not, but your comment is so off base and irrelevant that it would be injustice to you if it is ignored. Why don’t you listen to your mentor (Hazrat-e shotor) and post only if your comment is relevant. You have posted the same stuff 100s of times on many occasions.  So what? Did I ever engage with you? I already said you are the winner of this debate. Let’s assume Israel is everything you say she is. What can you do about it? How can you change it? Think about it a little before you answer. Listen to hajagha, he is wiser than you.

 Thanks again to all those with relevant contributions.

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Stop posing as a victim

Your gig is up! In fact it's been up for many years now. Israel is the most hated country in the world according to the last poll they took. Don't blame that on muslims. Do you know why?

Because it's Israel who is doing the killing, maming, destroying, occupying, cheating, lying, bombing and deceiting.

It's Israel who is pushing United States to attack Iran. It's Israel whose file is in United Nation's Security Council for war crimes. It's Israel whose leaders are afraid of traveling to other countries fearful of being arrested for war crimes they committed against innocent civilians. Don't you read the news? Or read it selectively? 

It's Israel who has occupied and enslaved Palestinians. It's Israel who has more than 200 atomic bombs. And you come here and defend this criminal regime and call us all kinds of name. Stop posing as a victim, your gig is up.

Science Vs. Fantasy; Bijan

As educated as you seem to be, your effort to isolate the historical issues in our region from the current situation within our Iran is futile.

Social phenomena exist due to scientific reasons; science in turn is an inseparable entity.

The whole thing exists as a package. Forgive me for my over-simplistic explanation.

Being stuck to one's childish view of forty years ago or, more might, and only might, be a sign of arrested development. ( no disrespect intended)

Bijan

You all, please help me understand the flaw in my line of thinking. Since I believe in reality and hence in existence of Israel, many on this site define me as a Zionist. That’s fine (whatever that might mean), but please tell me what is your solution?

Dear Bijan, the flaw of your line is that you think they are with us in the fight against reactionary thoughts and for freedom. But they are those who revolted against modernism and civil liberties and they are perfect example of why the modernism movement in Iran failed to extend the civil liberties to freedom of speech and political expression. They are part of reactionary forces. They are part of the Islamic regime and they will never join us for a united force against IRI. And exactly like Khomeini, Rafsanjani and Ahmadinejad, they do it in the name of Iranian nationalism and independence. Until yesterday, they had 'imperialism' to demonize and feed their paranoia. Now imperialism is showing a happy face and can't be demonized. Luckily there is still some other delusional 'enemies' left at large to feed in their paranoia and their fear mongering propaganda. AIPAC has a powerful influence in U.S and as Mohamad Reza Shah justly once said, their policy is not beneficial to the state of Israel. But this is American politics and has nothing to do with our concern. We seek support wherever possible for our interest. We may shoot and fail, but as Iranians fighting for a free Iran, this is our intention. Now there are some who are gathering 'facts' about some nobodies who blogged in, say 2003, that U.S has 'chosen' his man to put in power in Iran. This to a paranoid mind has more value than any rational thought. To them, fabricating an 'enemy' is not just a lie, it is a necessity because they can only define themselves by defining an 'enemy'.

Now Bijan, back to the main issue of Israel, I'm sure you know this story even if it's not within your age frame, but I recount it for the younger generation. They should know and remember this story.

About forty years ago, there was a football match between the national football team of Iran, and national football team of Israel, in Amjadiyé stadium of Tehran. I was only a kid back then, very enthusiast in supporting my team, almost like everybody else. During that match, Iranian supporters were chanting 'Heil Hitler'. As a school boy, I only knew about Hitler that he was the bad guy in American war movies. During that match, I was also told that the Israelis don't like that guy at all. So I thought it was a smart move to chant 'Heil Hitler' and get under the skin of the Israeli team. You know, the usual psychological warfare in sport events, in a very 'bon enfant' manner in my mind.

In 1979, as a young man, I was revisiting this memory in my mind over and over, asking myself why I couldn't see that coming. But now, we KNOW what is coming out of this and we won't let this to happen again.

BTW, if I remember correctly, we won that match... thanks to Hitler. 

.... so Bijan

So you and Zion never advocated what you guys called "limited" war and "strikes" against Iran? .....

No reason to dwell on that if you say you don't have that view ... or you don't remember having that view...

For the nth time....

The main point of my blog is that in my opinion the freedom movement in Iran is and should be independent of the conflict in ME. I am also expressing my opinion and my sense of reality that fighting will not bring about justice in ME and any true change toward fairness and justice should and will initiate from within. The same way that Iranian freedom will come from within and not by foreign invasion.

Q, again you are engaging in a battle of words and diverting the main object of my blog. I am not prepared and do not care to tangle in your un-ending and unrelated debate which as usual your only objective is to win (even if downdeep you agree with the other side).So, I’m going to save my time and give you the winning trophy. You are right. The oppressed people of Palestine should fight until the very last Zionist soldier is thrown to the sea. Are you happy now?  But, please don’t tie that to Iranian fight for democracy. Have a great evening.

Mola, I have also nothing more to tell you. Like Q, you are right. I am hallucinating. The fight should go on. Kill every one of those bloodsuckers (if you can). Then you’ll have peace. End of discussion.  Sweet dreams.

Kharmagas, can you please post something semi-coherent? Where the hell did you get this idea that I have advocated war? You know, I’m beginning to think that you may suffer from the same “must win” disorder that Q is suffering.  It must be contagious.

Kourosh khan, as usual I appreciate your concise and to the point comments. Thanks.

Shepesh aziz, please tell that to our molla loghati (Q) who ostracized me for the way I tried to convey the same point as you have observed about this site. Thank you for visiting my blog and thanks for your comment.   

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Bijan Am

I agree with you wholeheartedly.

To many of the commenters here this is not about what solutions are out there that actually have a chance to make something happen and work, It is about finger-pointing and irrelevant accusations.

When it comes to the iran's internal politics. It is outrageous that there are people who want to see their "green" movement progress at any rate, knowing and seeing in broad daylight what is happening to all those who initiated this movement, Yet jump at your throat at the thought of favoring a more swift and radical and perhaps even more effective option of removing the mollah through force, and call you zionists and warmonger! Most of the discussion is spent on how to differentiate a zionist from a non-zionist, instead of finding something that works For the love of god.

They should be reminded that it their sick attitude of sitting and watching from miles away the innocents being killed and arrested. hoping that the likes of Mr. Karoubi or mousavi who have the iranians's best interest at heart by the way (LOL) will accomplish miracles... eventually... as in another 30 or so years,( Ignoring the fact that the arrest rate for their followers have been jacked up tremendously, in recent weeks. which means  that practically and technically they can not move a muscle.) is more akin to warmongering and wasting time, at the same time.

 The fighting approach has been tried for 60 years and has not succeeded. What is wrong with letting the internal forces in defense of humanity give it a try. I know this sounds unkosher within our mentality of pride and selflessness, but it may be the poison to drink for the sake of our children.

Very true.

Bijan, of course I know what you mean,

that's the whole problem. I know too well.

But do you know what I mean? Did you get my point? It does not look like you got any of it.

You mean to say that we are unnecessarily distracted by the Israel issue on this site. That we should "accept reality" and not talk about Israel anymore. This could be good advice only if the person who says it has a good grasp of reality himself. When that person is so far off the mark in the premise, this advice lacks crediblity, and it appears misleading and insincere.

You are wrong. In fact "this site" is not obsessed with Israel, even though it is a very important issue directly impacting Iranian lives. This is proven below. And this is a very important point. Let me tell you why:

I called your words "delusional" because that is exactly the definition of the word: seeing things that are not there, making judgements based on a self-constructed atmosphere of exaggeration and falsehood. This is percisely the MO of Israel supporters, many of whom are the reason you "feel" like there is too much discussion on Israel.

This delusion is dangerous. Not only because it is not a reflection of reality but because it can lead otherwise sane people into doing something stupid. That is what we perceisely do not want in the ME from anyone, but especially the ones who can blow up the whole place with nukes.

Now, it is ironic to read a lecture on "reality" from you when you even refuse to acknowledge the least bit of exaggeration from your point of view. Your subsequent advice becomes a contradiction rather than common sense.

I believe we can communicate and exchange ideas, but only if we are willing to let go of wishful thinking of conspiratorial hallucinations and acknowledge what is real and what is not. That happens to be, coincidentally, what is also required for justice, without which there can not be peace.

"Atal Matal TooTooleh..."

Said Hazrate shotor.

"What are you doing hajagha?" I wanted to know. 

"Practicing Logic according to agha Bigan" Said he.

"Why? may I ask?" Asked I.

"He lives on a different planet" Said he.

"And what planet is that?"

"Planet Zion, where all the Zionists of this world live. It involves denying the existance of tens of thousands who were killed by them, millions more who were made into refugees..."

I had to stop him. Hajagha has a heart condition: "It's OK Hajagha calm down.."

He continued: "While these same so called "Chosen People" sued Europeans for the slippers they had left behind during the WW2. Their foreign minister is a money laundrer who is under investigation by police, their ex president is a rapist, their ex prime minister is waiting for his jail sentence..."

I left the room, he couldn't stop himself.

Bijan

My comment that ticked you off was mainly to point out your support for preemptive war against Iran ... I added the Zionist to it, to further differentiate between your type of war advocate and a typical Iranian war advocate.

When someone as a pro Israeli (or Zionist) advocates war against Iran I don't like it but I understand it, however when a typical Iranian advocates war against his/her own country I view him/her as a collaborator (e.g., MEK's Jafarzadeh)....

NOW you tell me, if you prefer to be like Jafarzadeh!?

BTW Bijan, Soros says "I am not a Zionist, nor am I a practicing Jew, but I have a great
deal of sympathy for my fellow Jews and a deep concern for the survival
of Israel."  ... even if he is Zionist ... there are only a few others that I respect as high as Soros.

Dear Ahmed from Bahrain,

Where and when did I ever argue or question validity of what you try to display? I am not saying that I accept your view point for what you present. But, I will not stand here and defend whatever the Israeli government does. Believe me, I am as disgusted and heartbroken for the fate of those Palestinians as you are. But, my point is that what does it take to stop it? Many might say the Palestinians have to fight it indefinitely until the justice prevails. I say, that moment will never come with fighting. I say both sides are better off accepting reality and settling at any price and letting the future generations free of hate settle the scores (if by then there is a score to settle).

The fighting approach has been tried for 60 years and has not succeeded. What is wrong with letting the internal forces in defense of humanity give it a try. I know this sounds unkosher within our mentality of pride and selflessness, but it may be the poison to drink for the sake of our children.

 Thanks for your comment.

I Apologize…

for being late in attending to my blog. I posted it late last night and been in meetings all day. Sorry…

Samsam jan: My friend, thanks for visiting. Your comments are always appreciated. I have always respected you as a true Iranian to the bone….Take care

Faramaz Khan, the man who says it like he sees it. My whole intent in posting this blog was to separate the debate over Iranian struggle for freedom and democracy from the politics of Israel and ME. Thanks again for your comment.

Q, Sir, why do you have to be so difficult all the times? Why the insult? Without a doubt you understand what I mean in my opening statement, but as usual, as I have witnessed in your other debates you nitpick on some semantics to derail the main focus of the debate.

If you want to insult, go right ahead, you don’t need to scramble for some nonsensical reason to do so. Have a good day.

Ms. Ansari, thank you for your friendly advice and thoughtful post which I feel has accentuated my blog. I believe while “nuclear Iran” is intertwined with the middle-east conflict, the freedom movement in Iran is completely independent of this conflict and those who try to link the two (through nationalism or other agendas) are doing disservice to the movement. The freedom fighter’s slogan as you posted says it all "Na ghazzeh, na lobnan, jaanam fadaaye Iran." I would probably modify this as:  "Na ghazzeh, Na esraeel, na lobnan, jaanam fadaaye Iran.". Thanks again for your contribution.

Kharmagas, you didn’t have to post Mr. Soros quote to make your point. You still have not clearly answered my question about “two-state solution”. Let me tell you why I insist on getting your answer. It would tell me how realistic you are about the prospects of peace. I assume by posting Mr. Soros quote you support a two state solution. If that’s the case why don’t you debate along that line rather than Zionist this Zionist that….By-the-way, Mr. Soros is also a Zionist and so is Mr. Chomsky (But they are good Zionists…).

Would you also Pleeeeeease post something original without leaning on the likes of Q or Mola....?

Mola, I hesitated a lot whether to engage in an exchange with you or not. You are so far out in the left field that it’s almost impossible to establish a meaningful dialogue. Go ahead, hang on to your attitude. It might bear fruits some day (I really doubt it though). It has not in the past 60 years, but, who knows? Some day you may be able to kill enough of them to get your land back. Make use of your shotor and your shotor’s kids. Strap some bomb with remote detonators and send them over there. But, wait a minute…….I hear hazrate shotor is telling you something: “Agha, you go first, we’re right behind you”.

Have a safe journey!

So, anyone who speaks the truth

is branded IRI, Islamofacist, Araboo, anti-Semite or some other derogatory mark of the beast. Thus they are dismissed as manics.

A little self reflection may do well: Try seeing this doco: its 50 minutes but it explains a lot:

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=N294FMDok98&feature...

And Bijan jan, If you truly want to live in peace with Palestinians, then try some fact finding and reconciliation. Ignoring million refugees, wiped out villages, demolishing homes, check-points, killing civilians randomly and imprisoning anyone who voices objection against illegal settlements on account of being anti-Semites, is not going to do your cause justice.

Some truth is hard to stomach:

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4gymxY2zM8

Religion plays a part in this. Letting go of the chosen race and victimhood mentality is the first step. We are all equal in humanity and if you believe your god to be the creator of all then he has created inferior people, in which case his own creation reflets his faulty craftmanship. Therefor he is not a perfect god and not worthy of worship. Besides no one has monopoly on victimhood.

Be Happy as you are.

Ahmed from Bahrain

kharmagas, ahsannat ahsannat

Well said.

Hajagaha sends his best, although he tries to stay away from your painful stings.

Has Hazrate shotor seen the new map of ME?

Mola says: "Why not give them Iran's oil fields too?"

Mola, US/Israel/AIPAC have no eyes on Iranian Oil!!!!? That is why their idea for sometime has been remapping the middle east ... that way they can get what is now Iranian oil from some Banana republic that they setup. 

"Lets start from the beginning..

according to agha Bijan"

1. Genocide is OK if it's done by the chosen aka Zionist Jews.

2. Lets forgive the Israeli regime and people for the on going Genocide of Palestinians.

3. Confiscation of other people's land is legitimate if it's done by Jews.

4. Lets not talk about Palestinians because if unifies the Fascits Israelis...."

I was about to complete my list when Hazrate shotor interrupted me and said: "Why not give them Iran's oil fields too?"

"Ahsannat, Ahsannat Hajagha, you solved this problem too" Said I.

Can't reason

with Islamo-fascism. That's been proven for 30 years and close to 1400 before that. It's their cult or none.

By the way, yes, Israel has nukes and can destroy Iran, but I ask you mullah lovers again: That is only a concern if your monkey face "president' keep threatening them with his stupid remarks.

But you know what? The Islamic Repressive Regime is itching to start a war, so they can secure yet another 30 years of misery in Iran.

Put Iran First - Not Pals, not other arabs, Only I R A N, Only Secularism.

Bijan, Let me start with a quote from George Soros

George Soros says: "I am not sufficiently engaged in Jewish affairs to be involved in the
reform of AIPAC; but I must speak out in favor of the critical process
that is at the heart of our open society. I believe that a much-needed
self-examination of American policy in the Middle East has started in
this country; but it can't make much headway as long as AIPAC retains
powerful influence in both the Democratic and Republican parties. Some
leaders of the Democratic Party have promised to bring about a change
of direction but they cannot deliver on that promise until they are
able to resist the dictates of AIPAC. Palestine is a place of critical
importance where positive change is still possible. Iraq is largely
beyond our control; but if we succeeded in settling the Palestinian
problem we would be in a much better position to engage in negotiations
with Iran and extricate ourselves from Iraq. The need for a peace
settlement in Palestine is greater than ever. Both for the sake of
Israel and the United States, it is highly desirable that the Saudi
peace initiative should succeed; but AIPAC stands in the way. It
continues to oppose dealing with a Palestinian government that includes
Hamas."

... and we'll go from there, I am glad I motivated you (at least partially) to write this.  

Half our of your life

Half our of your life and $1.75 will get you a cup of coffee at Starbucks.

By the way, CEO of Starbucks is a Jew and sends $$$ to Israel. 

Bijan

Thank you for your candid blog.  There are only one or two people who keep posting news items about Israel and there are very few, but persistent, people who keep wanting to make everything about Israel.  I think if you don't generalize things about all of this site your point would come across a bit more effectively.

I believe Iranians inside Iran these days mean what they said:  "Na ghazzeh, na lobnan, jaanam fadaaye Iran."  Iranians do have a lot of compassion for Palestinians and their displacement, but their compassion for Palestinians does not necesarily mean contempt for Israel and Israelis.

Everyone talks about who and what is an "existential threat" to Israel.  Certainly Ahmadinejad, the illegal and moronic president of Iran has done a lot to bring this kind of thinking to the forefront.  Talks of an imminent attack on Iran by Israel, unfortunately, have now turned Israel into an "existential threat" to Iran.  I believe this to be the source of a lot of heated discussion around this site and around the world.  This madness has to stop on all sides if we are to avoid a catstrophic encounter in the Middle East.

I believe muslim extremism has brought nothing but hate for Islam worldwide.  One could argue the same about Zionism which has brought hate to jews.  Extremism brings out blind devotion to the point of suicide bombings, etc. on one hand and hate and retalliation for that ideology on the other.

I think it is only through civil and articulate dialogue such as this that we can help defuse extremism and blind devotion and hate on this site and in this world.  As a community we all have a lot to learn about effective and productive debate.

to anybody interested in "logic"

Faramarz and Bijan, Thank You for wasting half an hour of my life. I just went and read through all 16 blogs that are featured on the front page.

Other than this one, the only reference to Israel is in Fred's blog as part of the acronym "AIPAC", which is not the same as Israel. And that's from Fred, who has stated many times he is a supporter of AIPAC.

It is clear that you are both delusional. But for the sake of any logic-minded reader, I will go out of my way to demonstrate how off the wall you really are:

by Shorts on 10/07/2009 - 19:24

by bajenaghe naghi on 10/07/2009 - 13:41 (10 comments)

by Manoucher Avaznia on 10/07/2009 - 09:35 (one comment)

by farnad darnell on 10/07/2009 - 07:35

by Fred on 10/07/2009 - 04:51 (2 comments)

by alimostofi on 10/07/2009 - 03:28 (3 comments)

by Jahanshah Javid on 10/06/2009 - 21:33 (3 comments)

by nahidi on 10/06/2009 - 21:24 (5 comments)

by Nazy Kaviani on 10/06/2009 - 19:43 (22 comments)

by Sharareh Golshani on 10/06/2009 - 19:26 (2 comments)

by freenet on 10/06/2009 - 16:35 (one comment)

by Shorts on 10/06/2009 - 13:44 (4 comments)

by Azam Nemati on 10/06/2009 - 12:00 (3 comments)

by FG on 10/06/2009 - 11:43 (4 comments)

by Anonymouse on 10/06/2009 - 08:10 (4 comments)

by Jahanshah Javid on 10/06/2009 - 04:25 (11 comments)

Naturally, when someone makes an outrageously false claim, like this:

There is not virtually a single blog or news post on this site that does not have the word “Israel” in it.

Which is easily proven false, one has to wonder what kind of delusion and paranoia such a person lives under. How knee-jerk defensive, and ideological does one have to be to exaggerate to such a comical degree?

Israel is a country that is capable of destroying Iran with its nuclear weapons, it is the best friend of the world's most powerful country which is also anti Iran. It has threatened to attack Iran many times. If you don't think this is important, you are even more delusional than previously demonstrated. Again, since I'm dealing with delusional people, I'm sure clear evidence right in front of your eyes does not count for anything.

But I nevertheless did lose 30 minutes of my life, in order to demonstrate to readers who I'm dealing with. You can go ahead and call me illogical all you want. But some half-baked ideas need only one line to refute.

Dear Bijan, the first one to prove my point

It did not take long for one of the dozen or so IRI supporters to rush to write something (no matter how illogical) in opposition to your post.

Since the content of your blog is tough to refute, he had to resort to the pathetic 1 liner.

Demonstrably delusional

sorry, Bijan, could not read past the first sentence:

There is not virtually a single blog or news post on this site that does not have the word “Israel” in it.

Dear Bijan

I am sure you have noticed that supporters of IRI are hard at work lately to keep subject of Isarel and Palestine at the forefront of discussions on this site, attempting to simulate an atmosphere in which generality of Iranians cares more about Palestine than Iran.

Where in truth, majority of Iranians inside and outside Iran care infinitely more about Iran than Palestine and anywhere else for that matter.

This is the tactic used by the Islamic regime since its inception.  It will not end until the filthy regime is no more. 

Unfortunately, level headed posters such as yourself need to remain vigilant to counter the garbage these posters (there is no more than a dozen of them but they are super active on this site) disseminate on the internet. 

Simple

Bijan ;

This is a site tailored for Arabo Ommaties. You can kinda look at it as a senior citizen centre for retired Ommaties (Khaaneh Salmandaneh Ommatie ;::). Add to it a few Toudeii stateless traitors & the herd of anti Kiaan/ Iran and what you got is the unholy alliance of  schizophrenic ommatie parrots  whose common rallying grounds do always manifest in hate for True Iran,the women, common sense,logic, the Jew, any thing Medeo-Persian,America , the west and while at it the whole white race ;)..ohh I forgot, Micky mouse too..

So then it,s no surprise that you see these so called reformists(Bani Abbass activists among diaspora) ,commie  & re-invented freedom fighters even in the middle of  "their anti khamenei & not iri ,green movement" blame Ahmadinejad's fabricated Jewish creed & ancestory for 30 yrs of IRI crimes. As you see old habits never die.

Cheers pal !!!

Path of Kiaan Resurrection of True Iran Hoisting Drafshe Kaviaan //iranianidentity.blogspot.com //www.youtube.com/user/samsamsia