Esfand Aashena
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Naturalized Arrogant Citizens!
06-Apr-2011
I was reading COP's blog which by the way is a very good and informative blog and he has written it in a way that we can really compare some of the differences between Saudi Arabia and Iran. In one comment the discussion went towards Haj and if he's going to do it! Everybody is doing it! He mentioned that he is not a believer and a "self-proclaimed" non-Muslim. I don't think that's make any real difference!
It reminded me of a blog I had written for persianmirror.com and thought to post it here again. I do not mean to insinuate this blog is meant for COP, it isn't. With so much discussion about anti-Arab rhetoric which by the way just fans the flames of basically the differences between Shiites and Sunnis or Iranians and Arabs it is worthwhile to consider you may end up having to drink your own sweat some day!
You say all the racist things about Arabs but when confronted you say who? when? where? not me! you got me wrong! Or you dig in and say yep I hate Arabs. Well it doesn't matter what you think, in today's world you are an Iranian and a Muslim until death do you part! What goes around comes around so be careful what you wish for!
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Arrogance is not a US naturalization requirement. I know after you become a US citizen some of your American friends and coworkers say that they expect to see more arrogance and attitude from you, but that is really a joke. You know that right?
It is really annoying to see this kind of attitude from some of our beloved Iranian-Americans. Not just us, when I see another hyphenated American with heavy accent get on TV and express his/her expert opinion on say economy, it is really something when you hear them say; well ______ (his/her country, fill in the blank) is now ahead of “us” in economy in many respects. What we need to do is address _______ (his/her country) role in world economy head on, take the “cow” by the horn “sort of speaking” and don’t allow “them” to ignore “us”. Again imagine seeing that in a heavy accent. Isn’t that annoying?!
The other day I had to again participate in another divorce ceremony where the couple had to use the services of an “Agha” who is an Iranian mullah (most likely an Iranian-American mullah :-), usually in suit and approved by the Iranian Govt to perform religious ceremonies such as aghds, weddings or divorces.
I’ve become an expert witness in these things and am starting to think about charging people for it. You know in these religious ceremonies a minimum of 2 men are required and a man is worth 2 women. Many of our men either don’t care for these traditions or find it beneath them and think they are too “civilized” to do it and ridicule those who do. Our women don’t want to sign their name as half a man either and who can blame them? So yours truly comes to the rescue and gladly sign my name without hesitation. After all it is the couple’s business not mine, I’m only there to help a friend.
Now back to our story. I was in this Agha’s living room with the blessed divorcees and the ex-husband’s brother as the witness. Everything was going well and we were having tea and cookies and waiting our turns to sign these documents which everyone clearly examines as if they are Iran’s response to the 5 + 1 nuclear incentive package. I put up a show of interest but of course I really don’t give a hoot! I even asked Agha about a “clarification” to show everyone how concerned I am and how a simple mistake could cost people their future. Of course there is no mistake and the Agha explains the issue to me while I finish my 2nd cup of tea.
The ex-husband’s brother and I sign our names as witnesses and then it was the ex-husband’s turn to sign who by the way has another wedding coming up which was a topic of a side discussion with the Agha and if he could get a discount now that he was doing his divorce with him too.
Suddenly he rolled his eyes and asked Agha about the part where he was supposed to claim his country of citizenship. Agha told him that he had to say Iran which made the man suddenly jump up his seat and claim he is no longer an Iranian citizen since he became a US citizen and wants to put USA as his country of citizenship. Are you freaking kidding me?!
Agha told him that the divorce will not be valid because only the Iranian Parliament can strip his Iranian citizenship via a ‘vote’ and in order for that to happen he needs to complete an application and send it to Iranian Parliament for action and that could take years and they probably won’t approve it anyway. The guy deflated and promptly complied and said ok if that is the case he’ll sign it, as if he was looking for a justification and the excuse was good enough.
I see this kind of arrogance over and over again from all races and backgrounds. I mentioned this story since we are Iranians but it is really not a positive. It is sad to think you need to worsen your image and consider it an improvement. Stay cool and true to your heritage. You’ll look and sound better.
Update: adding a link to a story in New York where an Asian-American woman was sentenced to indefinite jury duty for making racist remarks, including her own heritage.
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Ariane you're right you didn't get it so you won't get it!
by Esfand Aashena on Tue Apr 12, 2011 04:34 AM PDTEverything is sacred
Counter value?
by ariane on Mon Apr 11, 2011 07:56 PM PDTArrogance?? I don't think so! When you acquire a new citizenship, the only honorable thing to do is to declare yourself a citizen of that country!
How that is considered arrogance is beyond me!
It's ok to be an American when you're plane hopping visa free across the world, but when it comes to honor your citizenship oath and be proud of the citizenship that you have voluntarily acquired, you're accused of being arrogant?
Double standard!
Rea non-religious ceremonies are weird! Aren't they?
by Esfand Aashena on Fri Apr 08, 2011 06:44 AM PDTI'd say rabbi-priest-agha has the older profession. I take it at first the agha said ok you and you are now married. Then later the couple got into arguments and decided to part ways and with no other witnesses they just claimed that they were never married in the first place!
So then they asked for witnesses (not necessarily "expert") and with witnesses came lawyers to supervise! Or was it after during divorce?!
As for non-religious ceremonies sure people can do whatever they want. But compared to religious ceremonies what percentage would you say do it that way? 1%? I'd say even less than that. But regardless what do you think the guests would say?! This is so weird! right?
The more some try to distance themselves from these rituals and traditions, the more this blog sounds reasonable to me!
Everything is sacred
Esfand
by Rea on Fri Apr 08, 2011 06:09 AM PDTWow, it does sound complicated. But at least they allow you to divorce. Which is not the case in my religion. Unless you are rich. If you are, you pay and they annul your marriage.
Lucky, I don't adhere to any religion. Didn't get married in church, par conséquence, didn't have to pay them to get divorced. Hélas, had to pay the lawyer.
In fact, which profession is older, rabbi-priest-agha or lawyer? Or maybe expert witnesses ? ;o))
@VPK, didn't assume anything, I just enjoyed the blog.
Let's see how long before you break your own promise!
by Esfand Aashena on Thu Apr 07, 2011 11:10 AM PDTEverything is sacred
This is my
by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Thu Apr 07, 2011 11:01 AM PDTlast post on this thread. You think whatever you want. History is littered with people who thought the same thing.
BTW: That's exactly what the Shah said also.
BTW I speak 4 Iranian people u can count yourself out if u want!
by Esfand Aashena on Thu Apr 07, 2011 09:33 AM PDTEverything is sacred
Esfand
by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Thu Apr 07, 2011 09:31 AM PDTVPK you're loonier than I thought!
But you are just exactly what I thought. More insults; name calling and so on. I let people make their own judgement of who is using reason and who insults.
VPK you're loonier than I thought!
by Esfand Aashena on Thu Apr 07, 2011 09:28 AM PDTEverything is sacred
Readers: Rea
by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Thu Apr 07, 2011 08:43 AM PDTEsfand speaks for him or herself not Iranian people. Rea please do not assume we all follow these rules; my family does not! When Esfand writes:
Iranian (Islamic) matrimony and divorces are complicated!
There is an assumption that Iranian means Islamic. That is an incorrect assumption. This person is not authorized to speak for anyone but themselves. Add to it the title of this blog. To me self appointed "spokespersons" are just that: self appointed. This is like Maryam Rajavi appointing herself the "President" of Iran. By whose agreement?
I could go and start talking about "Men" think this and that. But it is wrong. We all just speak for ourselves. No more; no less. Keep it in mind.
Well you had said it before.
by Esfand Aashena on Thu Apr 07, 2011 07:50 AM PDTIn one of your earlier blogs you had said you got your diplome riyazi and by that I took it you didn't went through the "new" system. So I figure you were at least 1 year older than me. I'm a few months younger than Prince chubby.
I'm not telling you or anyone what or how you or others "should" feel. I'm just saying what your feelings "sound" and "look" like.
Everything is sacred
Yeah fatherly advise
by Cost-of-Progress on Thu Apr 07, 2011 07:41 AM PDTWhat makes you think you're younger than I am?
You seem to like to dictate what others should feel or believe.... My advise to you is to keep such opinions to yourself. Do share how you feel about the religion of peace though.
it is interesting how people camouflage themselves and all of a sudden one post or comment brings out the truth.
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IRAN FIRST
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فرامرز جان میترسم شهادت رو با شهادت اشتباه بگیرن و شهیدمون کنند!
Esfand AashenaThu Apr 07, 2011 05:06 AM PDT
Rea, Iranian (Islamic) matrimony and divorces are complicated! At your wedding they make you swear to everybody from the holy ghost to the holy Imam that you'll be good and behave! Then at divorce at first the agha (priest) tries to disuade the couple by few words just for the heck of it and when the couple says no thanks, he wraps it up and tosses the couple aside!
Most complicated is the Islamic pre-nuptual agreements! We'll need a separate blog all by itself! Come to think of it Faramarz had a blog about such pre-nuptuals that went awry!
Faramarz jaan, I'll keep you in mind. You never know when a "witness" will be required! I once had to become a witness with 2 other women counting as one man and from start to finish the women were talking about this is ridiculous and so on! They forgot why they are there to begin with! After such scenes I'm shying away from ceremonies where women are witnesses!
Of course some women want to rub it in and will make the agha get signatures from 4 women to make it that much more difficult!
Everything is sacred
اسفند محلل - حلال گر مشکلات زناشویی!
FaramarzWed Apr 06, 2011 06:55 PM PDT
Esfand jaan,
You should seriously consider advertising your services and make a go at it!
First of all, you will meet many emotionally vulnerable women who are looking for a new experience! Secondly, if it is a 3-Talaagheh case, you are obliged to make it right by doing a big favor to the grieving party! And finally, you have visibility to all the financials so you can make a few bucks!
Feel free to call me if you need a qualified witness!
PS. Promise, will read tomorrow again
by Rea on Wed Apr 06, 2011 06:36 PM PDTI might've missed something. Something important.
There may be a hidden message, for the initiated only. ;o)
My dear Mouse
by Rea on Wed Apr 06, 2011 06:29 PM PDTOnly you can write what is supposed to be serious stuff and yet make people laugh. ;o)
Or maybe it's my laughing day.
PS. am about to retire and still laughing my head off, thx. ;o)))
Yup!
by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Wed Apr 06, 2011 12:37 PM PDTMore insults to RP. You find no other faults other than his weight. Then have the nerve to call other people names. Spoken like a true Muslim.
Fatherly advice?! You are probably 1 year older than me!
by Esfand Aashena on Wed Apr 06, 2011 12:33 PM PDTAre you older or younger than Prince chubby?!
Everything is sacred
I like you dude,
by Cost-of-Progress on Wed Apr 06, 2011 12:27 PM PDTbut you have a strange sense of humor.
But hey, thanks for the fatherly advice. I'll try to remember that. And I did contain myself in the bowles of Arabestan. So, I get credit for that.
Here, among cyber homies, I feel I can share...I do, I really feel I can share our short-comings with you guys.
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IRAN FIRST
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Wishing you the best
by farokh2000 on Wed Apr 06, 2011 12:26 PM PDTEsfand;
I respect everyone's opinion and beliefs as long as they don't try to shove it up my ass.
Religion is a Belief and NOT a Race. You can change yours if you are finding faults with what you have been following all your life, it is ok. You are only human and humans make mistakes.
I have never followed any religions but I promise you, you can change it if you like, just don't tell others what to think or follow, as long as they are not bothering you with theirs.
Best of luck to you.
Re: Again too much information is NOT a good thing!
by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Wed Apr 06, 2011 12:16 PM PDTSpoken like a true Muslim. Repress; supress; and silence. No disagreement allowed! Insult and call them racist. Either your way or the highway. I am glad the world is taking action finally.
Esfand
by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Wed Apr 06, 2011 12:11 PM PDTGood! To be denounced by you is an honor I gladly take. I wear your dislike of me as a golden medal. Go tell people what to think. How far do you think you are going to get. Days of Safavids are over.
Esfand
by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Wed Apr 06, 2011 12:09 PM PDTPlease speak for yourself. Are you the appointed King or Queen or the universe? Who gave you a right to tell others what to think? I say *** Islam and all the *** who tell other people how to think.
VPK talking to you is like nailing jello to a wall so I'll pass!
by Esfand Aashena on Wed Apr 06, 2011 12:06 PM PDTEverything is sacred
My religion
by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Wed Apr 06, 2011 12:04 PM PDTIs not Islam! No one is going to shove this *** down my throat. My religion is my business not yours. I will rather go to hell than to Haj.
My grandparents; and parents also reject Islam. We say to Islam: no thanks! My heritage is not Islam. I do not want any of the Abrahamic "religions". No one has a right to tell me what religion to have. Who the heck are YOU to tell me what I should believe in anyway. This is arrogance beyond reason.
Again too much information is NOT a good thing!
by Esfand Aashena on Wed Apr 06, 2011 11:53 AM PDTYes voice your opinion but be cognizant of where you are. If it is just you, me, Faramarz, AO, JJJ and some others sure pour your heart out! Talk against your religion like there is no tomorrow! Perhaps even shed a few tears after we finish 2 or 3 bottles of Stolis!
But if you're in a gathering it behooves you to NOT give too much information! It's not a mouth burning opinion anyway! The world will not come to an end if we don't voice our opinions!
As for ducks it pays "low six figures" so knowing how to quack is big business!
Everything is sacred
So....you do not want me to voice
by Cost-of-Progress on Wed Apr 06, 2011 11:41 AM PDTmy opinion because it may offend some people. Or, is it because most people get offended when they hear things they do not want or like to hear?
As I said, Believe and let Believe - ehatever it is that one believs, or not.
Please leave the ducks out of this.
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IRAN FIRST
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COP jaan if it quacks like a duck it's a duck!
by Esfand Aashena on Wed Apr 06, 2011 11:34 AM PDTSure you're not forcing your beliefs on others but you can be passive aggressive! Are you a passive aggressive person?! LOL!
When you say and presumably say it out loud to friends and family that all religions should be denounced altogether well some people may take it the wrong way! They may think you're not a good person! Now you don't want people to think you're bad, do you? Why would a nice person want people to think he's bad?! That's not nice!
Everything is sacred
Anahid jaan not much difference in a 12 year old & non-religious
by Esfand Aashena on Wed Apr 06, 2011 11:30 AM PDTMy comment was in response to your comment about not believing like a 12 year old. I don't think a 12 year old knows much about anything and can be swayed one way or another from parent to teacher to friend and family and ....
I don't think I'm saying anything in particular that I haven't mentioned earlier so I don't want to duplicate statements. It's just general.
Everything is sacred
Esfand - Progress?
by Cost-of-Progress on Wed Apr 06, 2011 11:21 AM PDTMy personal belief is that it IS progress to denounce religion all together - that's me and I do not F O R C E my beliefs on anyone unlike some other institutions.
I believe in believe and let believe.
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IRAN FIRST
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