hirre

But "lobbying" is a dirty word in our community

Groups connected to the lobbies the author mentions have tried to shut down all doors of influence for Iranians, one of which is the Iranian communities ability to lobby.

Our community is in the process of being convinced that "lobbying" is dirty. I'm not even talking about lobbying of NIAC or PAAIA etc. Even the people who spend all their time railing against these groups never once propose starting a lobby of their own. The conversation is always that these groups must be stopped, and nothing is put forth as an alternative, least of which lobbying.

I am bad at writing codes houshang

I design and build HW. I believe VPK here is the SW expert. maybe I should  team up with him and put technology in service of the masses... 

"Personal business must yield to collective interest."

yes VPK, I must had met a "different group"

The folks I had the pleasure and honour of meeting and knowing through my own relatives (as much as a 12 year old kid gets to know these folks, through their writings and their behaviour...) were indeed vastly different from what you have in mind. I am very sorry that you think these guys, despite all their mistakes, were no better than mollas, because that is simply wrong. 

"Personal business must yield to collective interest."

Rozbeh jan I think you're refering to '88, I was refering to '81

forces of left

I am not so sure they were any better than Mollahs. Forces of left I met were inflexible; undemocratic and stubborn. Very much "my way or the high way" attitude. Maybe you folks met a different group but I did not.

G. R.

MEK was doomed from the beginning both under Shah and IRI. They never had a chance violent or not. If they used violence they would have been wiped out. If they didn't they still would have gotten banned.

Their ideology did not have a receptive soil in Iran. Yes the members deluded themselves. But in reality the Mollahs at that time were far more popular and organized. 

Nor do they support today thanks to their idiotic leaders. I don't know why people even mention them. Forget MEK and put your energy somewhere it might bear fruit; or do nothing. 

There is a counter arguement to what Houshang says.

The counter argument is That the regime (khomeini himself) had decided to kill all the political prisoners, due to the effects of the disasterous war and what all these experienced political activists would do once released (not armed struggle, but through organising the dissatisfied masses, who could clearly see the ideals of revolution going down the drain...). There is credibilty to this counter arguement. because the left wing political prisoners who were also murdered in their thousands, had rejected MKO's methodes of armed struggle, and indeed, some in Tudeh party had supported the regime...

I say it was a sad fact of life that forces of reaction (khomeini and VF) won over the forces of progress (liberal, left and progressive religious). It happened before in Nazi Germany. It was a war that people lost and their enemies won....

The question is, have we learned any lessons from this tragic episode of our countries history to apply to what is happening around us today? At times I doubt if we have. 

"Personal business must yield to collective interest."

Simorgh

The MEK should have retaliated agianst the Iraqi security forces that attacked Camp Ashraf.

I second HTG: are you out of your mind? MEK had no standing in Iraq. If they "retaliated" they would be killed to the last person. Is this your idea of sanity? We got more insanity on right; left and middle on IC.

Camp Ashraf is on Iraq territory and USA has made Iraq sovereign. No nation will allow a foreign military force like MEK on its land. IRI or not MEK had to get. And if you want IRI brought down MEK is the worst option. 

It was too early to engage IR in armed struggle, it was a trap

Oh, I Get It!

Wha I meant was the kind of nonviolence NIAC is advocating: Going to bed with the mullahs! I do not believe in violence of any kind and neither does the majority of Iranians. It's the regime that uses violence against people. Does arming people amount to violent reaction to regime's atrocities?

Hooshang Jaan:

Could you elaborate? What part of what I wrote contradicts what you have said?

GR & Simorgh, you people are out of your minds

Some older folks might still recall speechs by Beheshti (the real brain behind khomeini) the leader of Islamic Republic Party, saying over and over, how he likes to engage Mojahedin in armed confrontation, and finish them once and for all.

In other word armed struggle before its time was a trap set up by Beheshti & Co. waiting for the right idiots to jump in to it, and Masoud did. And you after three decades still don't get it.

Jojeh Morghi, have you seen any footage of Mojahedin's "Forough Javidan" operation, how they had all these columns of troops, and how it was all wiped out in less than ten minutes. Have you ever held a gun in your hand? Why do I get this feeling you'll be the first one with feces in his trousers when a bomb is dropped? 

The MEK should have

The MEK should have retaliated agianst the Iraqi security forces that attacked Camp Ashraf. Maleki is the puppet of the IR terrorists and only serves to do their bidding. If the MEK hit back then then it would give Maleki a strong message that taking orders from Tehran is a terrible career decision! 

Closing Camp Ashraf was a mistake. It is an excellent operational place by which to launch any attack on the IR. By all means get rid of Rajavi but bring a new team in to use the place.  

The MEK could actually make it worse for him given that he has to hold the country together in the middle of the civil war between retarded Sunnin and retarded Shiites. 

Nonviolence: A Recipe For Failure!

Right after the revolution, seeing their organization's support base grow by the day, MEK leadership decided to go noneviolent. The leadership told the members not to react to regime's goons acts of violence against them. It wasn't until thousands of the organization's members had been arrested and hundreds lynched that the leadership declared war on the regime. Noneviolence in the context of the present situation in Iran which is as bad as three decades ago, is tantamount to defeatism. NIAC cadres can continue with their divisive policies and rhetoric as long as they like. Enjoying so little popularity among Iranians worldwide only proves how wrong and counterproductive their policies have been.

NIAC is not a lobbying

NIAC is not a lobbying group. It pictures its members on Capital Hill givin the impression that they are lobbyists and persuing the interest of its 'grassroot' supporters. 

However, when it comes to declaring their interests (now that everyone knows they are on the IR payroll) and when it comes to paying tax they become an 'Educational' organisation.

 When militry action takes place and the IR money dries up Trita Parsi and his bandwaggon of IR stalwarts will be begging in  the street for food vouchers  and houndouts. 

Forget "gut feelings"; read the facts about NIAC

And you'll see that this "Iranian-American" organization has a President-for-Life and original founders who were none of them Iranian-Americans. That its President acted as a liaison between the IRI's UN envoy, Mohmammad Javad Zarif, and members of Congress. The primary purpose of this organization, as conceived by Trita Parsi, Bob Ney (former congressman now in jail), Hooshang Amirahmadi, Roy Coffee, Dave di Stefano et al. was to normalize relations with the IRI so that more business opportunities could be opened up with the mullah's regime and to oppose sanctions as an obstacle to such profitable ventures. The presence of a number of individuals from the Tehran-based Atieh Bahar consulting firm (e.g. Namazi, Reza Marashi) in key positions with NIAC is just one reflection of its central and founding purpose.

VPK jaan: as a highly educated person you are…

It is wise to do a bit of a research and make your arguments based on facts.

Here is a bit about NIAC leadership.  Take a look and let me know which one is on the "mission to champions Islamic causes"?

Likewise, it should be noted that I despise Israeli policies towards Palestinians not that I am a Muslim but a caring human being.  There are far too many, including many Americans, who share the same feeling and are not Muslim. 

Lastly, do a bit of a research and let us know if can point to some facts that has help you draw your conclusion here

“And I deeply resent an "Iranian" organization doing it. If you want to go for Palestine then call yourself a Palestinian lobby be honest.”

NIAC Staff and board of Directors:

//www.niacouncil.org/site/PageServer?pagename=About_staff_board

Reza Marashi
He came to NIAC after four years in the Office of Iranian Affairs at the U.S. Department of State

Kevin Cowl
Cowl’s background includes over 20 years of management and leadership experience in nonprofit and educational organizations in the United States and abroad

Nobar Elmi
She came to NIAC after serving as the Legislative Liaison for the Texas General Land Office

Jamal Abdi
Abdi joined NIAC’s team following his work in the US Congress as Policy Advisor to Representative Brian Baird (D-WA).

David Elliott
Before joining NIAC, David interned at the Center for Strategic and International Studies Middle East Program and the American Embassy in New Delhi, India

Lily Samimi
Before joining NIAC, Lily lived abroad for nearly six years. She returned to the United States in June 2010 after working in Bilbao, Spain for the Spanish Ministry of Education as an English Teacher where she educated young Spanish professionals and adolescents on English language and culture.

'Hambastegi' is the main key to victory 

Mehrdad

VPK on NIAC

I don't want to get between Vilermose and Mehrdad. But do want to put in my voice. In my opinion NIAC is making a big mistake. It has potential but is wrong headed. It has chosen to be an "Islam" centric organization.

It champions Islamic causes like taking on AIPAC. It puts Islam focused people in high positions. This is a mistake and distances it from nationalist Iranians such as me. I want a nationalist lobby group. Not one that is Islamic in nature. 

Mehrdad is being honest about his feeling toward AIPAC. My gut feeling is NIAC leadership shares this but will not say it. I do not share this view. I do not want to get in the middle of Arab Israeli war. It is not my fight and I don't want it to be. I had a discussion with someone who told me "all of us Muslims should be involved". Well I am not a Muslim and don't want to be involved. Keep the Israel fight out of my business. As long as people put that on the table I am out! In most clear terms: I will not support Palestinians against Israel. It is not my problem and I will not make it mine. And I deeply resent an "Iranian" organization doing it. If you want to go for Palestine then call yourself a Palestinian lobby be honest..

Vildemose jaan: arguing in good faith.....

I can assure you it has not been due to lack of good faith on my part.  I showed my good faith by politely pointing to your less than polite conversation in which you accused my support of NIAC as “hot air” or when I asked your to convience me with other then your gut feeling, then now accusing me of attacking you and your stands.

We are obviously missing each other by miles, so let’s leave it at that. 

“All we have is our words and those describes who we are”--- Mehrdad

'Hambastegi' is the main key to victory 

Mehrdad

Dear Bavafa: As usual

Dear Bavafa: As usual biased irrelevant semantics...You don't agrue in good faith. You have already made up your mind and attacking me and my stance won't improve NIAC's miserable performance...

 Nonviolence means avoiding not only external physical violence but also internal violence of spirit. You not only refuse to shoot a man, but you refuse to hate him. ~Martin Luther King, Jr.

 A state of war only serves as an excuse for domestic tyranny.--Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn.

Dodging?????

Dodging what?

I was not set out to refute your statement, I was merely looking to see if there was based on facts and if so, to educate myself and alter my support.  The chip rather falls on your shoulder for the fact that you did not provide any thing in that regard.

Now, if you are for an honest and unbiased discussion, we can certainly have that.  But if it is for blame game and one-sided rhetoric , then I respectfully pass.

  And here is where I draw my conclusion about the appearance of  blame game: 

Your rather ingenious statement about my support for NIAC as a result of their attack on AIPAC as “hot air”

Or

 Accusing hostile approach towards AIPAC when you cannot provide any tangible examples and as conceded based on gut feeling.  Likewise, I have not seen much overture from AIPAC to NIAC, so lack of any approach/ communication and condemnation of it should go both ways, I condemn both for not reaching out to each other.  Unless you think those rules should not apply to one side but the other. For you to know: My utter contempt for AIPAC is twofold and has nothing to do with NIAC.  In fact I am not aware of any attack from NIAC vise a vie AIPAC.  My disgust for this group is partly based on their biased and full support for the apartheid policies of State of Israel which I strongly condemn.  And the other part is for being an instrument of creating  a war-mongering  atmosphere in US and driving this nation to support war against Iran. As for NIAC’s approach and their achievement, they still remain the most influential Iranian-American in Washington.  If you know of a more influential group, you can name them so I research and possibly lend them my support.

'Hambastegi' is the main key to victory 

Mehrdad

Dodging

Dear Bavafa: You have not refuted my statement whether based on gut feeling or otherwise. Has NIAC communicated  with AIPAC in order to resolve and reach out to them for correcting/educating whatever NIAC perceives as their wrong doings? Does NIAC want to solve problems or just attack AIPAC??

Attacking AIPAC will not solve anything. Why not try to have a mutual discussion where both sides can air out their grievances?? what is wrong with that.

I find your support of NIAC just because they attack AIPAC and really are full of hot air as we have withnessed with their non-acomplishment of any of their goals as unproductive, perhaps reflecting your visceral animosity toward the state of Israel.  why not change approach and try a peaceful, non-critical and unbiased approach with the "enmey" as you and NIAC perceive AIPAC to be.

Why Is NIAC afraid of reaching out to AIPAC if they really want "peace" and are really anti-war as they claim???

NIAC's approach has not yield any results. In fact, their fighting words has created more hostility and misunderstanding and loss of credibility...

What NIAC is doing is nothing but harming the peace they pretend to be seeking with their counterpart...

NIAC can still be an instrument of peace if they changed their tactics...I looke forward to seeing the leadership's  hostile approach to AIPAC changes into a Conflict resolution process through communication and understanding.

Vildemose jaan: Do I understand this correctly then…

That your assertion was based on gut feeling and not some actual event that took place that at least that you are aware of?

To expect me to provide evidence of something that has not happened is unreasonable at best.  It sort of remind me of when Bush was asking Iraq to proof they don’t have WMD.

As a foot note, gut feeling is quit important and it is OK to relay on it, though one cannot expect to change other’s mind, solely based on gut feeling.

  Based on what I have read (obviously not just IC) and followed their progress, initiatives and involvement, I have not found any thing to point and confirm your gut feeling.

'Hambastegi' is the main key to victory 

Mehrdad

And do we know, factual as

And do we know, factual as oppose to gut feeling, if they oppose or resisted any communication with AIPAC or Israel?

Dear bavafa: No, if you have anything tangible and concrete to refute "my gut feeling", please provide your verifiable source and I will be more than happy to stand corrected.

 A state of war only serves as an excuse for domestic tyranny.--Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn.

Simorgh5555

"If Mr 'Hirre' had the interest of Iran at heart he would be publishing a
blog marking a centenary of the massacre but like most of our useless
leaders..." blablabla...

I couldn't care much less for arabs, palestines etc, islam, IR etc etc.... if you want to live in the past, fine, but the goal of the topic was to realize that lobbying works and iranians need to engage in it, Bavafa & the rest got the point...

"Here is an exhibit of Iranian anti-semetism disguised as legitimate
criticism of Israel and proof of Iranians brainwashed by Islamic
Republic propaganda." blablabla

Instead of thinking like Bavafa and the rest, you are yelling like an emotional beast. You need to stop reading between the lines and start reading the actual lines...

Dear OnlyIran: I am failing to see your point …

My point was that we ought to work to create and support groupS that can represent us in Washington.  You call it potato, I call it potaato.  Lobbying group or not, they have my support till a better, more organized and more powerful group present itself.

Vildemose Jaan:  Who is their “real object of their grievances” and is this based on some [tangible] facts and evidence, gut feeling or hearsay?

And do we know, factual as oppose to gut feeling, if they oppose or resisted any communication with AIPAC or Israel?

I am at the time/junction to send my year-end donation to my supported groups and any facts you can point me to that backs your claim, I will be re-considering the donation and support.

'Hambastegi' is the main key to victory 

Mehrdad

are all Shi'ites or Muslims supporters of VF?

The notion that all Jews are AIPAC supporters is not correct.  There are alternative pro-Israel/anti AIPAC Jewish organizations with a different point of view, e.g., The J Street - Wikipedia

 VPK: I couldn't agree

 VPK: I couldn't agree more..IF we are truly seeking peace, we need to talk to our so-called enemies...otherwise we will have an accidental war. It's ironic that NIAC promotes open communication and "diplomacy" between the US and IRI agents but not with the real object of their grievances.

I think we have enough hatred and posturing and warring rhetoric to last us a life time. It's time to make peace...

A state of war only serves as an excuse for domestic tyranny.--Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn.

It's important to

It's important to understand that many of these lobby groups have Israel and israelis/jews as its number one priority, then America and americans, and perhaps after that the rest of the world..

That is why I have been advocating to join them. Iranian lobby should work with AIPAC not against it! There is nothing AIPAC wants that is not resolvable with Iran. They do not try to take our territory. Nor is there a fundamental problem.

If Iran were to get an intelligent regime it would ally with Israel. Arabs rename Persian Gulf; fine with call the "occupied territories": Judea and Samaria. Iran has two potential allies: Armenia and Israel. There is nothing worng with taking both.

I appreciate help NIAC gave Mohammad Javad Zarif (IRI UN envoy)

in setting up liaisons with US Congressman. No one speaks for Iranian-Americans better than the IRI's UN envoy and the Atieh Bahar consulting company in Tehran, several of whose members have been involved in key positions within NIAC.