Synopsis of what must/must not be in post IRR Constitution - Your input will help

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Synopsis of what must/must not be in post IRR Constitution - Your input will help
by Hovakhshatare
25-Jan-2010
 

As part of a viral campaign/education process and in conjunction with ongoing Constitution effort initiated by David ET, this synopsis is intended to provide a quick scan for all those who know or should know what the Iranian movement is all about. It specifically targets populations within Iran...

The simple idea is most 'regular' people will not read a full detailed constitution as reading and grasping it is a task. However, the assumption is Iranians intuitively & by experience know what they want and need. This synopsis, along with upcoming short version of constitution and the full version work hand in hand to ensure when we get to post IRR state, there is sufficient exposure to these concepts such that a religious group in disguise of democracy, or other opportunist have less of a chance to trick and manipulate people into voting for another disaster. These are not blue prints but informational and educational. Other processes and steps will follow and will update along with others who are working along the same lines.

Here is a general list and post your changes I will clean, translate & post:

-Neutral on religion, or lack thereof, and no cultural or historic references to religion either

-Basic Iranian human rights (can add a short list)

-Rights of children (including education, shelter, labor & basic needs)

-Iranian as a blanket term for all Citizens of Iran independent of tribal or other background

-freedom of expression, association & media

-All associated with current regime (not directly associated or accused of a crime) excluded from any formal position for X (20 or so) years

-exclusion of clergy and religious affiliates and organizations from government & social offical roles or contributing to them

-Innocent until proven guilty and due process of justice as a pillar of judiciary system

-Accountability of all leaders and institutions of the govenment to people or their duely elected representative (checks & balances)

-Equality of opportunity to engage in commerce, arts, science.....

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Hovakhshatare

Version 1.1

by Hovakhshatare on

·         Neutral on religion, or lack thereof, and no cultural or historic references to religion either

 

·         Basic Iranian human rights (can add a short list) 

·         Rights of children (including education, shelter, labor & basic needs)

·         Iranian as a blanket term for all Citizens of Iran independent of tribal or other background

·         freedom of expression, association & media 

·         Freedom of information- Government, commercial & social activities with appropriate delay for defense matters

·         All associated with current regime (not directly associated or accused of a crime) excluded from any formal position for X (20 or so) years

·         exclusion of clergy and religious affiliates and organizations from government & social official roles or contributing to them

·         Innocent until proven guilty and due process of justice as a pillar of judiciary system with elected and independent high court

·         Government of the people for the people- Accountability of all leaders and institutions of the government to people or their duly elected representative (checks & balances)

·         Equality of gender & opportunity to engage in commerce, arts, science.


David ET

good summary points divaneh

by David ET on

I also think peace with other nations as the basis of the constitution is very important (unlike IR)

FYI : The points you brought up were all addressed in my proposed draft in detail

e,g: The drafted Preamble says:

:....  We the people of Iran and our government shall respect the independence and integrity of other countries and shall not engage in internal affairs of other nations. Our government shall promote peace with all nations and countries of the world.


MM

Dear Ali Mostofi

by MM on

I, as a member of a minority in Iran, know that the culture I come from is  slightly-largely (depending on one's perspective) different than what is percieved in Tehran as the accepted culture.  Even the ghormeh-sabzee that we cook is different than the one consumed in Tehran.

What I need the central government to do is to acknowledge the diversity of the cultures in different regions and let it be as that.  King Cyrus, 2500 years ago, in his historic cylinder acknowledged the diversity of cultures/religions in the areas that came under his rule and never tried to impose a centrally-derived culture/religion until we came under "the you know who" rule.

If you start to impose your definition of a culture/religion, you will have a civil war at hand with many minorities opting to separate.  We need to concentrate on commonalities rather than our differences.  Human rights, starting with King Cyrus and ending with the current declaration is a good place to start with.


Hovakhshatare

divaneh,FOI is a good addition. I'll add for update version

by Hovakhshatare on

later today.

Judiciary is there but I'll fine tune with your addition.

Respecting neighbors territorial integrity, is more suited for full constitution, in my opinion. It will be a first though, as I'm not aware of any country that states this in a blanket fashion. We after all have lost several territories and may want to re-stake our claim.


divaneh

A little suggestion

by divaneh on

This may have already been covered but just in case it’s left out:

- Independent judicial system and a fully elected high court.

- Respect for her neighbours territorial integrity (perhaps the first country to declare so).

- Freedom of information, covering all government commercial and social activities with immediate effect. Defence with an appropriate time delay.

 


Hovakhshatare

Dear Alimostofi, I think some issues are getting mixed up here

by Hovakhshatare on

This thread is not a substitute or repeat of David's and my blog text clarifies it. Protecting Iranian culture is not the objective or intent of this. These are tactical steps in support of a specific objective. namely, to prevent islamists and other opportunists from fishing in muddy waters. To spread information and context to as many people as possible, about what a secular constitution should or should not contain in general terms, provide a list that helps them crystalize the ideas and think and internalize it. Those interested in full detail are welcome to read the pre-amble for which we are composing a short synopsis as well. I intend for the list I am proposing in this blog to be clear, simple, concise and contained within one page ideally, and two at most.

Lets walk before we run. 


David ET

Dear Ali

by David ET on

To prevent duplication please find your reply in the original blog where the draft in question was posted:

//iranian.com/main/blog/david-et/interim-constitution-secular-republic-iran


alimostofi

Re: Dear Alimostofi

by alimostofi on

And I repiled to you there ET. 

Here is a copy

Ba Dorood ET

Ironically ET, just because culture is the fundamental bedrock of any country, some old nations, like UK, do not have a constitution.  And on the flip side, the new nations do.  France for example suffers greatly from too much political interference in its old ways.

Some things are best not written.

So the question comes to mind, as how best to defend that which is Iran, or Iranian.  Well the best answer to that question is, to have the best Iranians present to interpret the events and make sure that there is no democratic vote being presented that effects the culture of Iran.  In the UK it is called Common Law.  I am not saying we should be like UK, but the law must be based on real events, and not theoretical suppositions.

As for the calendar.  The Iranian calendar is the most accurate in the world, and there is more to it than just saying the first day of Spring.  The calculation of the time of the event is very important, also the leap year calculations.  The moment at which it started based on the Declaration of Human Rights is not really that viable, as The Kiyanians and Pishdadians were practicing human rights 10k years sooner than CTG.

There is more to this. 

 

Ali Mostofi

//www.alimostofi.com

 


David ET

Dear Alimostofi

by David ET on

I do not usually like to duplicate conversation from one place to another, but since the blog you addressed is not featured yet, to properly address your concern, I re-post my reply in original blog here too:

I would appreciate if you give some examples of what specifically you propose in the constitution , in order to preserve Iranian culture and what you define as Iranian culture ? I did not understand the specific intent of your suggestions.

Please also note that Iran consists of various and rich cultures, ethinicities etc and any specificity can be used as a cause to undermine another culture within Iran. (e.g. Persians in center, Azeri's in north west, Kurds in East, Arabs in South, Turkmens's in North East, etc etc)

We must be craeful about violating human rights under the banner of cultural cleansing as it has happend in other countries and Iran.

As for calender, that is my suggestion which is really focusing on the human rights as the basis of our calender and not how old the nation is? Also it is using first day of spring as the first day of the year.


David ET

Hovakhshatare

by David ET on

In addition to the Preamble here are some of the higlights of the drafted constitution that can be summarized :

Article 2

The Republic of Iran is a system based on beliefs in:

  1. Territorial Integrity, Independence and Sovereignty of Iran.
  2. Government of The People, By the People and For the People
  3. Full separation of Religion and State at all levels without any exceptions
  4. Freedom of Expression and Assembly
  5. Justice and fairness in legislations
  6. Implementation of the constitution and just laws
  7. Gender Equality
  8. Full guarantee and legal protection of human rights.
  9. Conservation and improvement of environment
Article 4

In the Secular Republic of Iran, the affairs of the country must be administered on the basis of public opinion expressed by the means of elections, including the election of the President, the representatives of the National Consultative Assembly (Parliament), members of Provincial Councils of Governors, Provincial, City, Region, District and Village Councils, Governors, Mayors and alike or by means of referenda in matters specified in other articles of this Constitution. Article 8

The government of Iran is secular and there shall be no official religions or ideologies. The government of Iran shall remain independent of any religious institutions and influences. Government shall not promote any specific religions, ideologies or personal beliefs. In order to secure the Separation of religion and the state, the secular constitution of Iran strictly prohibits participation of any religious based groups and parties in all local, regional, provincial and national institutions of the government. This would also extend to anyone who holds a religious title or leadership, clergy and alike. Religion and religious groups will have freedom to practice their religion peacefully. Individuals within the government may have personal religious preferences but they cannot enforce any religion based laws and restrictions.

  Article 9

Secular republic of Iran observes no official religions for the country. Secular in nature, everyone in Iran is treated the same, regardless of their religion or lack of it. All religions within the limits of the law and without limiting or violating the guaranteed individual and human rights within the constitution are free to perform their religious rights, and to act according to their own canon in matters of personal affairs. The individual and human rights as guaranteed by the constitution shall always prevail and take precedence over religious and ideological preferences and beliefs.  

Article 15

All citizens of the country, both men and women, equally enjoy the protection of the law and equally enjoy all human, political, economic, social, religious and cultural rights within the scopes of the constitution.

The powers of government in the Republic are vested in the Legislature, the Judiciary, and the Executive powers, in accordance with the forthcoming articles of this Constitution. These powers shall remain independent of each other.

Article 18 The investigation of individuals’ beliefs is forbidden, and no one may be interrogated, taken to custody or imprisoned for holding a certain belief. There shall not be any prisoners of conscious or political prisoners

Also can you explain your comments little more as it is not clear to me :

"-All associated with current regime (not directly associated or accused of a crime) excluded from any formal position for X (20 or so) years"

This seem to be to wide and many who lived in Iran one way or another were working in the official channels. On the first glance I think such matters must be left to future judiciary and the constitution should not be used to cause a blanket generalization that can be abused by one group against another.


alimostofi

As I mentioned at ET's

by alimostofi on

As I mentioned at ET's page, this constitution is devoid of any referrences to the essence of what makes Iran Iran - namely the culture of Iran.  The root of all nations is what their culture is.  That is their identity.

There needs to be provisions for defending that.  Not a word has been written about it.  Once you have written what Iran is; what it is it that you are defending; what is out of the realm of democracy; that cannot be subject to a vote, then you have defined Iran, and the freedoms in it; be they political, religious, or otherwise.

 

Ali Mostofi

//www.alimostofi.com

 


Hovakhshatare

با اقدامات خود نشان دهيم که قطاع سکولار ... به صحنه بيايد؟

Hovakhshatare



Quote from Dr. Nooriala's article featured on home page  

با اقدامات خود نشان دهيم که قطاع سکولار جمعيت ايران در چه اندازه هائی می تواند به صحنه بيايد؟ 

      بديهی است که اگر جهانيان ببينند که واقعاً در سپهر سياسی ايران کسانی ـ کسان بسياری ـ هستند که حکومتی سکولار را طالب اند و اتفاقاً بخش تحصيل کرده و روشن جمعيت ايران را نيز همان ها تشکيل می دهند، مسلماً در سياست گزاری های خود تجديد نظر خواهند کرد. در نتيجه، چگونه می توان تنها در خفا و با پسله کاری خود را سکولار دانست اما حاضر نبود در هيچ «عمل ِ» اجتماعی ـ سياسی شرکت داشت؟