How Useful Are Iranian Know-It-Alls And Their Advice? Part 1

Balatarin
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How Useful Are Iranian Know-It-Alls And Their Advice? Part 1
by JahanKhalili
10-Oct-2011
 

Iranians are probably the best people I can think of, when it comes to appearing to have everything all figured out. In fact, there seems to be some kind of contest between them to look more knowledgable than the next Iranian, judging from what's on Iranian.com

But just how authoritative are Iranians on anything?

Are they even any good at knowing anything about themselves - or even showing curiousity about what's physically located in their own country?

Let's begin looking for an answer to this question with a look at an example from Iran's archeological history. 

In the 1930s, it appears that a German archeologist, Ernst Herzfeld, was instrumental in the discovery of some tablets from ancient Iran at Persepolis, including the famous one inscribed in gold from Darius.

Another German archeologist assisted with the archeological work around Persepolis. His name was Prof. Friedrich Krefter.

//www.persepolis3d.com/krefter.htm 

I'm really just beginning to read about arcehological discoveries in Iran, but from what I'm reading, it appears that not a single discovery was ever made by an Iranian - all of the ones I'm reading about so far were made by foreigners.

I think this isn't a cause for pride for Iranians, that they didn't manage to even discover their own ancient history, and have to go and study foreign books and consult the work that was done by foreigners in Iran, in order to learn about it.

It actually makes Iranians look pretty stupid.

But you wouldn't know from looking at Iranians that they lack anything in their ability to explore or understand the universe, let alone things that were in their own country that they had acess to for centuries but ignored.

Naturally, there are reasons why Iranians never lifted a finger or showed much interest in some burried stone carvings or tombs (except to plunder and ruin them whenever they managed to find them). 

Most Iranians were living well below the level of any type of poverty that most people reading this would even be able to imagine.

People who are barely able to eat well cannot take an interest in stones and broken remains of buildings, or wonder what secrets ancient writing contains, when they cannot even deviate a little bit from the traditions and way of doing things that have been tried-and-true for centuries, and have kept them alive and preserved the one thing that kept them going: their community.

Instead of looking to ordinary Irnaians for evidence of why they didn't do any exploration or inquiry, we would have to look at those Iranians who did have that ability to "play": Iran's elite.

Whatever endeavor that might have been done in the direction of exploring Iran's ancient ruins, should have come from them.

But it didn't.

The responsibility for the failure to take an interest in anything beyond showing off in front of each other, or looking good - or rather better than the next dressed up Iranian - must be laid squarely at the door of Iran's elite: the landowners, the royalty, and the powerful people who perhaps surrounded such figures.

So we're left with this question: have they got it right today?

I don't think so.

Even the richest Iranians - and the ones who fancy themselves to be "Westernized" - are affected by the crap that affected the previous generations of elite Iranians.

They appear to be big on showing off. They think they know everything. They are smug with assurance that they have everything at their fingertips already.

... and they are remarkably conservative - i.e. fearful of doing anything to risk being toppled from their prestigious position by engaging in any unseemly behavior that might strike observors as odd or uncharacteristic of what society expects of them.

In other words, they have none of things that a true explorer would have - and that is an attitidue of "to hell with the world or an audience, this is damned facinating and I want to get to the bottom of it! I can't sleep until I find out what's under this dirt that is covering this half burried stone carving. I don't care if I get my hands dirty or look ridiculous in front of people who want me to justify to them why I'm doing this, or what use it is".

So when Iranians offer you advice about something you intend to do or are doing, think carefully. Don't just accept their pronouncements as if it were gospel.

Look at their cultural attitudes, and ask yourself where it got them. 

Balatarin
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more from JahanKhalili
 
JahanKhalili

I'd better say here...

by JahanKhalili on Mon Oct 10, 2011 04:36 PM PDT

... that I think that politics is irrelevant to this discussion.

People who are driven by curiousity to explore or discover, aren't even interested in politics, and vice versa.

Some current political climate in Iran can only be a distraction - not a help - to interest in things such as archeology.

In fact, given that Iranians are so obsesed with politics, the conclusion readily suggests itself that that is the primary reason for their retardation in advancement in fields like archeology. 


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JahanKhalili

I'm no expert on Iranian history

by JahanKhalili on Mon Oct 10, 2011 01:36 PM PDT

Thank you Mr. Fozolie for your contribution.

So, we have some intelligent discussion at least. 

... anyone who can point me in the right direction, by all means...


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fozolie

We have the perfect saying in Persian for what you describe

by fozolie on Mon Oct 10, 2011 01:33 PM PDT

 

We have a very good saying in Persian which does not readily translate  in English namely: "Alam shodan che assan, adam shodan che moshkel".  I have heard things and continue to hear things from highly educated Iranians which boggles the mind. But what you seek needs time (there are no shortcuts).

I think you will find the situation is changing, not so much outside but inside Iran in particular. I have been encouraged by the attitude of the young people now, who consider revolutionary change in Iran undesriable. As for historical analysis and contribution I have been very impressed by the work done in Iran by the younger historians.

Mr. Fozolie


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JahanKhalili

That May Be, Mr. Fozolie

by JahanKhalili on Mon Oct 10, 2011 01:13 PM PDT

However, what strikes me is the attitude of modern Iranians.

I don't doubt for a moment that Iran's past hasn't fostered any kind of stability or structure that would encourage learning for its own sake.

But modern Iranians don't have to deal with marauding or conquering tribes or armies.

When I was a kid - and this was in the 1980s - I remember exploring a mound that the Mongols had made out of a village or town they had sacked, and finding pieces of glazed pottery.

Get this: an educated Iranian with a PhD was scorning me for doing it - saying that I am acting "childish".

So perhaps the mentality of the great Know-it-All who already knows everything because they have arrived at some station of recognition in that Third World society Iranians have for themselves, does directly stem from the rampage and conquest and rapine and plunder you describe.

However, I find it odd that people living nowadays - and people who pride themselves on being "modern" - still carry the mark of those times. 

Did Iran's history of dog-eat-dog conflict cause Iranians to develop a culture where no one can say out loud "I don't know, let me see and find out" without risking mockery? 


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fozolie

Dear Mr Khalili

by fozolie on Mon Oct 10, 2011 12:50 PM PDT

It seems you are also guilty of rushing to judgments like our countrymen. You seem to ignore the entire Iranian history between the ancient to modern day.

You are also somewhat unkind to the Iranians who tried to change the situation, ignoring the entire history of Mordernists in Iran who tried to bring a change in attitude and revive Iranian culture but failed. The reasons for its failure have a lot to do with the answers you are seeking here. 

Until the 20th century Iran was ruled by tribes who did nothing other than plunder. Please look at the logistics of their armies and you can see the cruelty brought to the populace by their hunger for booty and power. For expample the needs of the Ghaznavi military when moving would leave the countryside desolate (consider the requirements of tens of thousands of men, horses, camels etc).

The rule of the king was absolute and unlike Europe, nobody not  even the 'nobility' have any rights.  There is a romantic view of our history which is not correct. 

The culture of Iranians today is the lowest common denominator. Culture requires continuity which has been particularly lacking in our history.

In a country that the ebb and flow of history has meant its total destruction several times over, the above analysis is too harsh and ignores a lot of history. I suggest you do not limit your reading to just ancient history,

 

Mr. Fozolie


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JahanKhalili

Let's See If We Can Get Some Iranians Out There...

by JahanKhalili on Mon Oct 10, 2011 10:49 AM PDT

... to actually address what's being discussed in this blog post.

Maybe I'm wrong.

If anyone knows better, feel free to correct me. 


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JahanKhalili

Hakim is Anglophile's Favorite Iraqi

by JahanKhalili on Mon Oct 10, 2011 10:30 AM PDT

Anglophile is obsessed with him and can't stop thinking about him, apparently.


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JahanKhalili

Yes, Hakim takes an interest in Iranian archeology

by JahanKhalili on Mon Oct 10, 2011 10:25 AM PDT

... makes perfect sense, doesn't it?

I never thought of it.

Iranians discover things after all! 


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Veiled Prophet of Khorasan

Who is Hakim?

by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Mon Oct 10, 2011 10:23 AM PDT

 

Please tell me I am Just wondering.


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anglophile

Please not another Hakim's copy/paste job

by anglophile on Mon Oct 10, 2011 10:18 AM PDT

  Let the guy talk himself - LOL  

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