zan o mard mard o zan

Balatarin
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Rosie T.
by Rosie T.
28-Jul-2008
 

When I entered this blogging community last October people often used to ask me "Why Iran?" It's strange. Nobody ever asks me that anymore. They just say "Rosie, you're one of us."

But they used to ask me that question a lot. And there were so many reasons why. But they were all really part of one big reason, like so many facets of one brilliant diamond..And so it was very hard to answer. But one of these facets of this diamond was linguistics.

                                      *     *         *

You see I'd studied no few European languages to greater or lesser extent. Germanic, Romance, Slaviic. And of course they all have relationships among them. And for quite some time I'd wanted to study a more remote Indo (Aryan)-European language to see what whispers perhaps still remained of our collective memory from when we were all one tribe wandering the great steppe of Eurasia, over five thousand years ago. So since so many other facets of the diamond were already shining, I thought I should learn Persian. And so I did.

And the first whisper I heard of those collective voices was when I learned the words zan o mard. Mard was simple. Mard, mordan, marg/martyr, mort (Fr. death), mortal, morgue. Man, he who dies.

Zan was little more complicated. Zhena (Russian, woman), gyn -- (Greek, as in misogynist,gynecology), gen -- (Latinate, as in generate). Hence, woman, she who creates, who gives life.

Zan. Zendegi. Mard. Marg.

And so the collective whispers told me that we are different. Man--finite, limited, enclosed, bound for mortality, death. Woman--open, unlimited, infinite, undying because creatrix of all life.

Zan o mard. Mard o zan. We are different, these ancestral voices whispered

Yes, we are different. Or are we?

                                        *      *       *

Digging deeper beneath these depths, it is impossible not to see that this "difference" between the essence of zan and mard parallels exactly the Chinese Taoist symbol of the yin/yang, its underlying principle of all that is. The yin--female principle, open, formless, undefined, soft, circular, weak, water. The yang--male principle, closed, finite, formed, straight, hard, strong,stone.

They are different.

But in Taoist cosmology what is essential is that the yin/yang both contain the other. And are destined to become one another. Because this is the way of the Taoist, And the Tao is usually translated as The Way. This containing of opposites is perhaps most evident in the martial arts, the greatest of which is tai chi. . Where the one who can surrender comppletely is the srongest fighter. It is the way of least resistance. The Tao is they Way of Strength in Surrender, of opposites embracing each other. eternally, in endless flux.

zanomardozanomardozanomardozanomardozanormardozanomardozanomardo

                                   *      *         *

There are parallels of course in biology. The sexual cells of the embryo after conception are still undifferentiated. And as we age, we begin to acquire the characteristics of the other sex through hormonak changes. And in between, if we are lucky enough to really be able to surrender to the act of love, there too we become each other.

                                    *           *          *

I hate generalizations about any group. Ethnic, national, religious, political, etc. I hate them because they cause hate. And hatred is always a form of war. But most of all I hate generalizations about sexuality, homosexuals are this way, heteros that, men are from Mars, women from Milwaukee.. Because we generalize and categorize and hate to have power.

And our deepest feelings of powerlessneess (impotence--poder in Spanish, both to be able to and power) I believe come from inadequacies we feel about our sexual identity. Because we are different. But in reality we embody each other and both in an endless cycle of flux. .So perhaps our categorizations about sexuality are at the root of all hatreds. Because hatred is a play for power. And sexuality is perceived as power.

And there is nothing uglier than the gruesome war between a man and a woman for power trapped in polarization, in difference. When a man becomes hard and silent as stone, and a woman wet with hysterical (hysteria-Greek, wandering womb, think hytorectomy).

                                      *      *          *

I thought I'd fought out these wars since my youth, first with men and then within myself and both.  And I really thought I'd won them to a large extent. And achieved some balance in flux, integration. So I odn't really understand howt it could happen to me at the coming of the completion of a half century of life, I could succumb to such roles, categories and polarization. Thie old war game of we are different. Is it perhaps because I'd really made so much progress that it was time to face a far greater contender than I had ever faced before? Or is it simply that all the victories I thought I'd won over zan o mard mard o zan within and without were never victories after all? That I was mistaken all along.?

I don't really know.

All I know is you have been my greatest contender.  And I've been fighting a war I didn't want to fight. The ugliest of wars I'e ever seen, of a man gone hard and silent as sstone and a woman wet with vicitimization. And the more I say the less you hear and the less you say the more I hear. And it's all so typical and so cliched and so guresome so bloody and it's all just deafness anyway.

Yes you've been a most fearsome contender. As silent and ugly as stone..

And I concede complete and utter defeat. I can no longer fight this war

And I realize it is time to go back into myself and once again face the zan o mard mard o zan within me until they embodiy and embrace each other in an endless cycle of flux. I must fight this war deep in me. Hear its whispers and cries deep in me. It is lonely and frightening to go in once again but there is nothing, nothing on earth or in hell as fightening as your silence of stone.

Yes, you've been by far my greatest contender.

* * *

I have lost. I give up.

I surrender.

Which I suppose must mean I have won.

In a way.

Balatarin
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Jeesh Daram

Zan and Zendehgi

by Jeesh Daram on Tue Jul 29, 2008 12:59 PM PDT

Dear Rosie,

Zan:

is from the Pahlavi root "Zan", "a female human being, a mate of the man".

Zendegi:

is from the Pahlavi root "Zindakih", "to be alive, to exist, to get by, to survive".

-----------------------

Your curiosity in etymology of Persian language is admirable and please continue. Persians always get fascinated with anyone that speaks their language even if it is a few words, they always laugh and have good time around that person. This is the way to win Iranian hearts and the British spies were masters of that and continue to be and perhaps the Americans are the least savvy so far on how to penetrate Iranian hearts and that is why they always have to rely on feedback from their British ally. Now one would say "Jish Daram does not leave the British alone" and so true...

Please continue your study of Persian and with your mastry of English language you seem to have no difficulty.

 

Now, thanks for your compliments, my 15 minutes of fame was sure good for my eqo. Now I can go and make some afternoon tea. Hoever, I am in no way an expert in Persian language nor an etymologyst, should I die today, no one will write that on my grave. I want it to say, "Here lies a man that made a few people chuckle"...but then again inscribing so many words will cost a lot and most likely they won't even write that. I am willing to simply settle with a smile icon: :)

 

Best Regards,

JD

 

 

 


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ebi amirhosseini

Re : Souri Ebi.....

by ebi amirhosseini on Tue Jul 29, 2008 12:57 PM PDT

Your majesty's wish is my command !!.

Dear Rosie,I did,tnx,no holes in it,I left you a comment there.

Best wishes


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Souri

Rosie jan/Nazanin

by Souri on Tue Jul 29, 2008 12:44 PM PDT

Rosie : Who is this poet/psychiatrist person ? Are you talking about JD ?

Who is the " Poet' ? not Sha'er ?

Nazanincanadai/TheMrs : Would you stop harassing people please ?


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default

Dear friend..

by Anonymous* (not verified) on Tue Jul 29, 2008 12:32 PM PDT

On your last paragraph:



zan o mard mard o zan - it shouldn’t matter, what is counted is humanity. Our life begins as is handed to us, and sometimes is interrupted with a burring flame unexpectedly while we’re passing by... Each of us has our own shares of failures, incapacities, and pains. So gradually we should understand the LIFE by itself doesn’t guarantee happiness, but self-knowledge, recovery, and resilience might...

So nazanin, don’t go back into yourself, ignore the whispers within. Fight the loneliness and frightening moments, and not surprisingly look at the others’ struggle with war, disease, famine, poverty, injustice and... list goes on!
My friend, please use your writing talent to overcome whatever is holding you back...

I have enjoyed your persuasive and passionate writings. :)


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ebi amirhosseini

RE:Interesting analogy- Dear JD-II

by ebi amirhosseini on Tue Jul 29, 2008 12:31 PM PDT

Avestan dictionary - I

mañtâ [man] 5 (root Aor. mid. 3/1) to think: contemplated, intended, projected (k393)

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

(mwd) = Cologne Digital Sanskrit Lexicon (cap) = Capeller's Sanskrit-English Dictionary (otl) = Cologne Online Tamil Lexicon (cpd) = Concise Pahlavi Dictionary

1 (cpd) zadan zan [MHYTWN-tn' < A & mh2@; ztn', zn- | M zdn, zn-, N zadan, zan-] hit, beat, strike, smite. 2 (mwd) zaN cl. 1. 10. P. %{zaNati} , %{zaNayati} , to give ; to go Dha1tup. xix , 35. 3 (mwd) zAn (for %{zo}) , only in Desid. A1. %{zIzAMsate} , to whet , sharpen Dha1tup. xxiii , 26 (cf. Pa1n2. 3-1 , 6). 4 (cap) zaN , C. {zANayati} w. {vi} grant, give, pay off. 5 (cpd) zan [NYS8E < A ns8h; zn' | = M, N zan] (pl. -a1n, -i1n) woman, wife. 6 (cpd) zan zanisn v. zadan.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

(mwd) = Cologne Digital Sanskrit Lexicon (cap) = Capeller's Sanskrit-English Dictionary (otl) = Cologne Online Tamil Lexicon (cpd) = Concise Pahlavi Dictionary

1 (mwd) mArg (properly Nom. fr. %{mArga} ; cf. %{mRp}) cl. 1. 10. P. (Dha1tup. xxxiv , 39) %{mArgati} %{mArgayati} (ep. also A1. %{mArgate} ; pf. %{mamArga} Gr. ; aor. %{amArgIt} ib. ; fut , %{mA7rgitA} ib. ; %{mArgeSyati} R. ; inf. %{mArgitum} R. ; ind. p. %{mArgitvA} ib.) , to seek , look for MBh. Hariv. R. ; to search through ib. ; to seek after , strive to attain MBh. Var. BhP. ; to endeavour to buy Katha1s. ; to request , ask , beg , solicit anything from any one (with abl. of pers. and acc. of thing , or with two acc.) MBh. Ka1v. &c. ; to ask (a girl) in marriage S3atr. ; (cl. 10. P. %{mArgayati}) , to purify , adorn ; to go (?) Dha1tup. xxxii , 74. 2 (cpd) marg [mlg | M mrg, N marg] death. 3 (cap) mArg, mArgati, -te ({mArgayati}), pp. {mArgita} track, hunt, [[-,]] (cf. seq.), seek for, strive after, ask, request (2 acc.) {pari} = S.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

(mwd) = Cologne Digital Sanskrit Lexicon (cap) = Capeller's Sanskrit-English Dictionary (otl) = Cologne Online Tamil Lexicon (cpd) = Concise Pahlavi Dictionary

1 (cpd) mard [GBRA < A gbr@; mlt' | M m(y)rd, N mard] man.

---------------------------------------------------

man (n.) O.E. man, mann "human being, person," from P.Gmc. *manwaz (cf. O.S., O.H.G. man, Ger. Mann, O.N. maðr, Goth. manna "man"), from PIE base *man- (cf. Skt. manuh, Avestan manu-, O.C.S. mozi, Rus. muzh "man, male"). Sometimes connected to root *men- "to think" (see mind), which would make the ground sense of man "one who has intelligence," but not all linguists accept this. Plural men (Ger. Männer) shows effects of i-mutation. Sense of "adult male" is late (c.1000); O.E. used wer and wif to distinguish the sexes, but wer began to disappear late 13c. and was replaced by man. Universal sense of the word remains in mankind (from O.E. mancynn, from cynn "kin") and in manslaughter (q.v.). Similarly, L. had homo "human being" and vir "adult male human being," but they merged in V.L., with homo extended to both senses. A like evolution took place in Slavic languages, and in some of them the word has narrowed to mean "husband." PIE had two stems: *uiHro "freeman" (cf. Skt. vira-, Lith. vyras, L. vir, O.Ir. fer, Goth. wair) and *hner "man," a title more of honor than *uiHro (cf. Skt. nar-, Armenian ayr, Welsh ner, Gk. aner). The chess pieces so called from c.1400. As an interjection of surprise or emphasis, first recorded c.1400, but especially popular from early 20c. Man-about-town is from 1734; the Man "the boss" is from 1918. Men's Liberation first attested 1970.

"At the kinges court, my brother, Ech man for himself." [Chaucer, "Knight's Tale," c.1386]


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default

Rosie, There doesn't seem to

by AnonymousTheMrs (not verified) on Tue Jul 29, 2008 12:17 PM PDT

Rosie,
There doesn't seem to be any validity in how you are relating words together. Stick to a language you are familiar with please. And when are you leaving?


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Rosie T.

Souri Ebi and Poet I just wanted to thank you all and

by Rosie T. on Tue Jul 29, 2008 12:01 PM PDT

Ebi I'll look into it with Jish. I swear to god I had no idea he was such a scholar. If I had I would've picked his brain a LOOOOONG time ago. You see how little we know about each other and the categories and generalizations we make not only about groups but individuals?  I just thought Jish was...a satirist...see?

\

PS Ebi I REALLY wish you'd go back to Samsam's blog and check out my historical reply to you. There are probably holes in it too. I also had one of my "hysterical" rants in ti but you know how stressed out I've been and and well in a certain way I'm not so sure it's a BADS thing to see someone fll apart here inpublic...it humanizes the technology doesn't it?  and that's always been my hope..up til know our technologies have been INHUMAN.

Souri...I haven't forgotten about that e-mail.

Poet/Psychiatrist--I like especially oneness is not unity and compassion is not cruelty.  That was EXACTLY my confusion about the dynamic between me and my "you". So common with women...


  •  
Rosie T.

Jishi-san, I can't pssibly do this the justice it deserves

by Rosie T. on Tue Jul 29, 2008 11:55 AM PDT

because as Maz says I'm in a pay-by-minute I'net cafe as Maz knows, but Ididn't know you were an etymologist.  I wish I had.  JJ and Maz always told me that while your writing is very good in English it is OUTSTANDING in Persian. I wish I could read it. My Persian had reached intermediate level by two years ago but I haven't TOUCHED it since escept here in transliteration and I even lost my dictionary!  So what is mart?

Please answer me today if you can and also tell me about "zendegi/zan",do you think that is also wrong? I do have things to say about it but first tell me mart and about zan/zendegi/zist. 

Please try to answer by today or tomorrow because I really intend to be offsite for quite some time after tomorrow. I'm like that. I'm a person who needs deadlines and so forth, structure, to make decisons that are hard to make. We can continue the discussion by e-mail  if you like, I intend to stay in contact with people by e-mail but I REALLY must take a break from this site for a while and I need to say tomorrow is tomorrow, I said two weeks after Q encouraged me to stay, and tomorrow is two weeks.

Thx

Robin
Robin


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ebi amirhosseini

RE:Interesting analogy- Dear JD

by ebi amirhosseini on Tue Jul 29, 2008 11:25 AM PDT

With all due respect for dear Rosie:

So true JD.I'm bewildered too!.If it is a joke or not ! :

"Mard was simple. Mard, mordan, marg/martyr, mort (Fr. death), mortal, morgue. Man, he who dies" !!??.

No academic/linguistic truth in it ( as far as my limited knowledge in Avastan & Pahlavi languages can help)!.

Maybe somebody,somewhere claimed to know about the ethymology of this word that you & I are not aware of!?.

Best Wishes

 

 


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Souri

Dear JD

by Souri on Tue Jul 29, 2008 11:17 AM PDT

Good analysis ! I really liked it about: kare and koreh and korreh..etc!

It comes form the problem of the Persian language with the " vowels'...we
don' t have as many " vowels" included as we need in our words.

BTW, now that you are registered and entitled as a " real friend" of mine
!!! Can I include you to my inbox contact ? So I will send you regular
email I send to all my close friends (I want to get back some in
return) donnant donnat !! Ok ?


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Jeesh Daram

Interesting analogy

by Jeesh Daram on Tue Jul 29, 2008 10:59 AM PDT

Hello Rosie, good discussion and subject

I am a bit confused however.

How did you reach the conclusion that words Mard, Marg and Mordan have common roots?

Mard comes from the old Persian languague Pahlavi and the root of the word MARD in Pahlavi is "Mart".

 

Mordan (death) on the other hand comes form the Pahlavi root of "Murtan" and another word for death (Marg) comes from the Pahlavi root "Marg". While similarities between the words Mort in French and Murtan in Pahlavi is understandable, but how did you come up with the relationships between the words Mard and Marg (Man and Death)?

Allow me to only guess that perhaps someone or some readings gave you the understanding in an unrelated example that the past tense of the word death in Persian or "mord" is exactly the same as the word man in Persian or "mard". Persian is full of these words that without a phonetic sign one can make a mistake in reading them or interpret them.

To give you an example the words Butter, globe or sphere, the country Korea, the one who is deaf and a young mule are all written exactly the same. One has to know these words to pronounce them correctly in a sentence, or if they have given phonetic signs:

Kareh= Butter

Korreh= young mule

Koreh= Korea

Koreh= Globe, sphere 

Kareh= that person who is deaf

 

Thanks,

JD

 

 


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Rosie T.

To tell you the truth Maz what happened is that I wrote this

by Rosie T. on Tue Jul 29, 2008 09:46 AM PDT

VERY late last night and it wasn't quite FINISHED, I'd posted it to take a short break and I ran into a friend, and since I haven't been featured for so long and it was so late at night no one was going to see it (except maybe the Euros), I didn't think there was a rush for me to finish it.  When I came back it was featured so now I can't finish it or it'll be unfeatured and that is something I CANNOT afford to have happen right now!

PS What about kiss and kos?  (sorry unrelated, kos is Arabic).And did you ever see my piece called "You Love and Kill"? You must've. It's in my tracking (can't post links...)


  •  
Mazloom

to kill or to kiss that is the question

by Mazloom on Tue Jul 29, 2008 08:55 AM PDT

Rosie,

I understand that your computer has crashed and you use an Internet Café to write your comments and blogs at a great financial burden to you, and I appreciate all your hard work.  I also understand many spelling and grammatical errors in this blog is caused by trying to finish it in a hurry.  Aside from those errors, this is a great piece of writing.  I wish I had more time to write, but I’m at work and my employer only pays me enough money to work part of the time, but not all of the time, so this is the part that they don’t pay me enough.

After reading this blog, I now have a better understanding why men kill and women kiss!  And why women kill and men kiss after they kill.  And one more thing, did you know kill, kiss, k$r, k#s, and k##n are all related words.  Yes, thousands of years ago, not nowadays, men used their male stone yang thing, straight, hard, and strong to rape and plunder, and after they killed they were remorseful and they tried to kiss and make up.

Well, I am sorry I killed you.  I want to kiss you now.


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Souri

Nazy jan

by Souri on Tue Jul 29, 2008 05:19 AM PDT

I read your comment and enjoy your writing as always. It's full of nice feeling and good intention for our dear Rosie. I think exactly the same.

Although, I could never bring all this on the keyboard, as you just did it  so beautifully, as always.

Rosie, my friend : I do agree with all Nazy just told you. Actually it's so complete, that there's nothing I can add to this.

Wish you the bests chances in life.


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Rosie T.

Nazy,

by Rosie T. on Tue Jul 29, 2008 02:52 AM PDT

the you in the poem is one specific person. 

Only one. 

No one else.

 

Robin


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Nazy Kaviani

Az Zan Be Zan

by Nazy Kaviani on Tue Jul 29, 2008 02:07 AM PDT

Dear Rosie/Robin:

This is a beautiful piece of writing, teaching me something new. Thank you for your feelings, your thoughts and your words. I don't want to be ignorant of the feelings you describe, but I don't understand all of them. To whose silence are you referring here? Anybody specific, or the silence of all readers? As one of the readers, I have read almost everything you have written. I have seldom left a comment, because for the most part I am a silent reader; I had nothing to say or add, really, and I don't like to leave empty compliments and greetings as comments. You are one of us, that is true, I believe. Maybe a little louder and a lot more eloquent, but you have become one of us. If ever my silence as a reader has hurt your feelings and made you feel defeated, I am sorry. If I have completely missed the message of your post today, again please forgive me.

You have picked a prickly and confused lot of people to befriend at this time of history, Robin. My fellow Iranians could be hard and skeptical and suspicious and angry, while most of them miss and hurt and long and suffer for Iran. While by upbringing and tradition we are polite and warm in person, when anonymous, we may say things about what haunts us and hurts us and pains us, causing the same to others, I should like to think, completely unintentionally.

I don't see defeat in your emergence and participation on this site. I see triumph, because you became one of us, only with better English skills and a sometimes different view, but still one of us! You said you would like to leave for a while, and I don't blame you, for each and every one of us get so tired sometimes that we may consider the same. The difference, however, lies in what is an option, a choice, for you to come and to join us or to leave, and the rest of us who were born into Iran, do not have that choice, so stay we must. I should hope that the love and humanity you have at least sometimes experienced on this site will lead you back to us, where a knowing mind and a feeling heart is always a great addition and an asset, whosever's that heart is and whatever kind of birth certificate its owner might possess. "One of us" is always welcome back, Robin.

You did not fail but you are free.


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Dear Rosie

by Dr. Freud Is - Dr. Freud Isn't (not verified) on Mon Jul 28, 2008 09:34 PM PDT

Losing is not winning
Winning is not losing

Man is not woman
Woman is not man

Appreciation is not defeat
Defeat is not appreciation

War is not peace
Peace is not war

Beauty is not ugliness
Ugliness is not beauty

Surrender is not victory
Victory is not surrender

Sanity is not madness
Madness is not sanity

Content is not anguish
Anguish is not content

Self-destruction is not destiny
Destiny is not self-destruction

...

Anxiety is not obsession
Obsession is not anxiety

Oneness is not unity
Unity is not oneness

Clarity is not confusion
Confusion is not clarity

...

Healing is not sickness
Sickness is not healing

...

Understanding is not love
Love is not understanding

...

And finally,

Compassion is not cruelty
Cruelty is not compassion

...

That's all you need
That's all you'll ever need

Therefore,

Mediatate on it

Till,

You're freed

Nothing More
Nothing Less

All Else Will Fail


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