WASHINGTON

NIE as is

Admiral McConnel, director of national intelligence, the NIE guys you've based your piece on, in a congressional testimony on Tuesday point blank debunked your entire reasoning.

an_4now: are you kidding me?

Mr. An_4now, take it easy, you are all over the place. History in the context of my post refers to invasion of Iraq in 2003 (AKA Iraqi fiasco as some US congressman called it) //en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2003_invasion_of_Iraq.

Anonym77

“Mr. An_4now the "truth" is that Iranian charlatans leaving in LA have suffering of Iranian people in mind! Pigs fly! and you have learned from history!”   

Could you enlighten me as to what that history is?  What suffering before this revolution are you alluding to, for people to have failed to be concerned about, and for you to have graded their lack of concern, a failure?  Were Iranians suffering from stoning and public hangings?  How about losing limbs?  Systematic torture of students, journalists and thinkers?  Systematic liquidation of political opponents?  Did Iranian women suffer the indignity they are suffering now? 

I have no desire to kid you.  I lived under that regime and know plenty of decent people, not so ready to call people like you charlatans because of their political convictions, who were critical of the system but never suffered from it.  They wanted change, but not upheaval, they wanted freedom of expression, not the death of morality, the plundering of their natural resources, and the loss of their identity as a proud nation, now viewed as a terrorist nation.  How can you permit yourself to be so judgmental about people, wholesale? 

an_4now: are you kidding me?

An_4now says: "whereas these other “Chalabis” at least have the suffering of their people in mind."

Are you kidding me! Have you been following the news. Have you seen what is happening in Iraq?
If the Iraq fiasco had not happened I would have given you benefit of doubt. But no Mr. An_4now, try your bankrupt ideas on someone else!
Mr. An_4now if you and these other Chalabies are so concerned about the suffering of Iranians go topple IRI yourselves, don't con the Americans to do the fighting for you!
Mr. An_4now the "truth" is that Iranian charlatans leaving in LA have suffering of Iranian people in mind! Pigs fly! and you have learned from history!

Anonymous777

“I also did not need to carefully read Nema's article to bash the”

 This is a typical response I get from people who have never read the Koran but defend it.  If you had read this article then you would have known that it was Nima who quoted Bush and not me.  I merely restated what he had quoted to make my point against the other Anonym who, like you, likes to argue without really knowing what he is arguing about.   “And finally Mr. An_4now I don't believe those Iranian charlatans who want the US to bring them to power will reduce the suffering of Iranian people.”   Then what will?  If you really believe that the people of Iran are suffering then status quo will not do.  Come up with a suggestion that is better than their proposal.  You have to do better than to run to the defense of the IRI.  What makes you less of an “Ahmad Chalabi”?  You are over looking so much to defend the IRI, and as I mentioned before, at the cost of sacrificing your human values, whereas these other “Chalabis” at least have the suffering of their people in mind.   

I proudly defend the writer (to An_4now)

Mr. An_4now, I didn't need to read this article carefully before I started bashing your friends that insult the writer for his appearance!!!!!
I also did not need to carefully read Nema's article to bash the warmongers like this guy who admits to disastrous US policies in the region but then he says "...IRI should have been taken down back in 2002 - 2003, one way or another.".
And yes Mr. An_4now, I sure have an agenda to write here. I'll do my best to write against the warmongers of all flavors, specially Iranian ones (Ahmad Chalabi type).
And finally Mr. An_4now I don't believe those Iranian charlatans who want the US to bring them to power will reduce the suffering of Iranian people. On the contrary they will cause more suffering for Iranians, Americans and the people of the region.
BTW Mr. An_4now quoting Bush will not make your arguments stronger, it will just make it more ridiculous. :) 777

To: Anonymous for now. Thank

To: Anonymous for now. Thank you for your cogent, well-argued and scathing rebuttle. Nema's incoherencies and fragmented utterances are on display for everyone to examine and judge for themselves...

To: Anonymous for now. Thank

To: Anonymous for now. Thank you for your cogent, well-argued and scathing rebuttle. Nema's incoherencies and fragmented utterances are on display for everyone to examine and judge for themselves...

Anonym7

Your trail of posts here are incredibly self increminating and not unexpected from people who like to take an uninformed position and defend it at any cost. You admit you have not read the article here but you have jumped into the intellectual brawl because you have an agenda.  Then you accuse others of having their agenda!! “I must confess I haven't even gone through his article carefully! I was going through the comments and I saw those vicious personal attacks and the warmonger mentality behind it and decided to post some comments.”  But the point of the article can be summed up with this statement, quoted from Bush: "Iran was dangerous, Iran is dangerous and Iran will be dangerous if they have the knowledge necessary to make a nuclear weapon." The question is, do you believe the IRI is dangerous or not?  If you state the following: “There are mafia like political forces native to Iran that are much more charlatan than you guys .... they will gobble you guys up in no time!” Then, how can you trust these Charlatans with the knowledge to make a nuclear bomb?  Can humanity trust them? “part of Iran's wealth (specially Oil/gas) is and has been plundered for quit sometime by very well foreign connected mafia. Replacing it by a more explicit foreign connected mafia that at the outset aligns itself with necon/AIPAC etc. is going to make the matters worse.” How does replacing one set of plunderers with another make it worse?  Wouldn’t it make it the same, unless you have more sympathy for one over the other?  Then, you have your agenda too, and are willing to overlook the suffering of Iranians and only consider the aspect of replacing one mafia family with another from your own sympathetic perspective.  If these other charlatans can end the suffering of a whole nation wouldn’t they be the lesser of the two evils?  If it can end the suffering and indignity women are experiencing, torturing of students and thinkers, stoning and political executions, and wholesale brainwashing of new generations of people to become the new mafia and charlatans, then wouldn’t it be worth the price of the material plundering that Iran is experiencing, any way? Your defense of the IRI, much like Nima’s, at the cost of compromising your human values, is indefensible. 

you don't get it (to Warmonger Craig)

Warmonger Carig said: "..but teh IRI should have been taken down back in 2002 - 2003, one way or another."

Warmonger Craig, you are the one who is not intelligent enough to really learn from past several years of miserable failures. Based on your above pasted statement you have learned that Iran should have been attacked instead of Iraq!
Mr. Warmonger Craig, since you don't get it let me tell you that an intelligent conclusion is that neither Iraq nor Lebanon (nor Iran-potentially) should have been attacked.
Also let me remind you that as published in Seymour Hershe's article, your warmonger camp and Israelis cooked up the Lebanon war expecting a quick easy victory to pave the way for attacking Iran. As you are aware that plan backfired (Per US NPR, Hezbollah is now stronger than ever)!
So Warmonger Craig, stop barking up the wrong tree, there is and there was no reason to attack Iran. Let the US and Europeans clean the nasty mess that the Reaganists created during the cold war in Afghanistan/Pakistan (.... to the extent that is possible ...)

Anonym7

It seems pointless to try to continue refuting the things you say, when you just repeat the same things over and over again. I had thought you were at least intelligent enough to engage in discussion. My apologies for the misunderstanding. 

more lies to start another war and ...? (to: warmonger craig)

Warmonger Carig said: "..but teh IRI should have been taken down back in 2002 - 2003, one way or another."
Warmonger Craig says: "..Excuse me, but last tiem I checked I was an "American people" so I have as much right to speak for Americans as anyone does."

Warmonger Craig, I am not in a 'position' to say what you can or can't say. As I said before, you and your neocon/AIPAC bodies are not in a 'position' to judge Iran. You guys are also not in a 'position' to speak for American people, because you have lied, you have committed war crimes, and you have lied more (see (US) Center for Public Integrity c//www.publicintegrity.org/default.aspx)

Anyhow, Mr. Warmonger Craig thanks for revealing the divisions among your camp. Can you be kind enough to elaborate on how you and your former cold war allies, the Muslim fanatics in Afghanistan became such enemies.... , the more division among you reactionaries the better ... for the world and the US.

Re: NR

NR, or I might say doctorjan, thanks for your diagnostics but I am not Nema! I must confess I haven't even gone through his article carefully! I was going through the comments and I saw those vicious personal attacks and the warmonger mentality behind it and decided to post some comments.
Anyhow you haven't yet told me why you are pissed off at my posts. Some slogans and a "diagnostics" is not very relevant to the topic, is it?

to AB

So I guess this is how some non-persian speaking commentors get on here

I've been reading Iranian.com for 5 years now. It's been in teh English language the whole time. Perhaps if you don't want "non-Persian speaking commentors" here, you should recommend to JJ that it become Farsi only?

and bash Iran and Iranian-Americans who are not pro-Bush and his sick
advisor camp.

It's much more fun when Iranians and Iranian-Americans who are prro-Islamic Republic just come here and bash America and Americans in private, isn't it?

What does Bush have to do with any of this, though? The man has 10 months left in office. His successor will not be a neocon. There are no neocons running for the office of President, this year. The neocons are gone - discredited - and they will never be back. Time to come up with a mantra. Republicans are now back to their traditional 3 groups. Libertarians (like McCain, Guiliani), Conservatives (like Alan Keyes, Newt Gingrich), and Religious Conservatives(like Huckabee, Pat Robertson).

Oh, and throw in the bigots too like Pat Buchanon :P

Your guy Ron Paul is best described as representing the "completely insane" wing of the Republican Party. Seriously, did you watch him at any of the debates? I was expected some orderlies from a mental institution to come in and put a stait jacket on him. He should do a guest appearance on "Lost", he'd be great at that. Maybe he could be that mysterious "Jacob" guy in teh cabin?

Again with the anonym7

I don't care what your religion is and I don't believe in any religion
myself.

Right, and I don't think you are talking about religion whne you use the word "Jew" either, just like you aren't talking about religion when you use the word "zionist" or the word "neocon".

I'm none of thoise things, and yet you would accuse me of being all of them because you don't like me. Right?

From your writings you appear to be in Michael Ledden's camp
and that is what matters to me.

Micheal Ledeen's camp? No, I don't agree with him at all. I've been criticizing him for years. I think he's much too optimistic, and I think he's had too much influence over the neocons in the US government. I think the US needs to take a much harder stance against the IRI than what Ledeen advocates.

As I mentioned earlier you neocon/AIPAC
extremists are neither in a position to judge Iran nor in a position to
speak for American people.

Excuse me, but last tiem I checked I was an "American people" so I have as much right to speak for Americans as anyone does.

I think I've mentioned before that Hezbollah murdered friends of mine, as well, so I feel I have as much right to judge teh IRI as anyone does, too. If you don't like it, too bad for you.

I live in the US and know that majority of Americans, even many
conservatives are not with Michael Ledeen and his type.

If you have identified me as a neocon, you obviously have a lot to learn about Americans. I'm a Libertarian. I don't even LIKE neocons. They are much too eager to get America involved in things that are none of our business.

Conservative
Pat Buchanan calls you guys neocrazies and disasters!

Well, Pat Buchanan is a white supremacist and a racist. It must make your heart sing to have Pat Buchanon and David Duke on your side, but I wonder how long it would take them to turn their attention to Muslims, after they get rid of the Jews?

Respectable
Billionaire George Soros

Full stop. Deleting without reading everything taht comes after that part.

Disagreements...

When you disagree with what someone is arguing, do it with respect. Do it with integrity. Do it with hardcore evidence. When engaged in the battle of the minds, there are no personal attacks. The most devastating defeat is when you prove your opponent wrong with FACTS. To do otherwise is to act as illogical as the akhoonds running our country.

Damet garm Nema jaan for your writings and your sense of decency. If only there were more people like you, even with different viewpoints, we'd be much better off.

I may be "dishonest and full

I may be "dishonest and full of half-truths", so expose me! Your empty slogans and jumping all over the place ... "Russia ... China ..." will not do!

Nema: Don't blame me for your underdeveloped cerebral cortex. You have shown in the past (via your blog) and on this thread that your brain does not have the capacity to parallel process information and to analyze abstract/3-dimensional concepts and ideas. You also have shown that you don't care about evidence and facts when they don't coroborate your self-serving agenda almost in all your writings. So, I find it an exercise in futility to waste my precious time to look for information that anyone can easily google.

In your narcissistic arrogance and grotesque ego trip, you've become deaf and blind and you can't see how transparent and revealing you have been ever since you started your "Iraniantruth" blog. You are not interested in truth or Iran. Your main goal is to preserve the status quo (the immoral theocracy) for you and your ilk indefinite use and abuse.

More info on Narcissitic personality disorder:
//www.mentalhealth.com/dis1/p21-pe07.html

I welcome neocons (to AB)

AB you said it so well. These brainwashed retard neocons come here and make fool of themselves not knowing that defending Bush is not an easy matter!
But I must admit I like them to come here and make me laugh. So I am going to welcome them:
My not so dear neocin/AIPAC friends you are welcome!
I specially welcome Warmonger Craig!

There are mafia like (to NR)

yes Mr. NR for once I agree with you, part of Iran's wealth (specially Oil/gas) is and has been plundered for quit sometime by very well foreign connected mafia. Replacing it by a more explicit foreign connected mafia that at the outset aligns itself with necon/AIPAC etc. is going to make the matters worse.

BTW, maybe someone's empty slogans has worked on your naive personality but you will not get anywhere with me by that. You still have not stated what I said or say that "pissed you off". I wrote against warmongers, like this Carig guy who explicitly admits he has wanted a war against Iran as early as 2002, here is his pasted statement:
"..but teh IRI should have been taken down back in 2002 - 2003, one way or another."

Funny and Sad that some Iranians Report on other Iranians

For example:
Serendip, who has her own blog under a pseudonym, reports to anglo neo-con bloggers about what people here write against Bush policy. To me, that screams of desperate. So I guess this is how some non-persian speaking commentors get on here and bash Iran and Iranian-Americans who are not pro-Bush and his sick advisor camp.
Get a life Serendip! Think for yourself!

There are mafia like

There are mafia like political forces native to Iran that are much more charlatan than you guys .... they will gobble you guys up in no time!

And you're part of that Mafia?

You're mistaken. War at this point will only consolidate the power of the Mullah Mafia running Iran. You try to muddy the water by invoking "war" where there is absolutely no threat of war. You wish for War but you will not get it Mozdoor...but that doesn't mean you can rape and plunder Iran indefinitely...Your days are numbered IR's despicable agent.

more lies to start another war! (to warmonger craig)

Warmoner Carig says: "Why don't you just call me a Jew and get it over with?"
I don't care what your religion is and I don't believe in any religion myself. From your writings you appear to be in Michael Ledden's camp and that is what matters to me. As I mentioned earlier you neocon/AIPAC extremists are neither in a position to judge Iran nor in a position to speak for American people.
I live in the US and know that majority of Americans, even many conservatives are not with Michael Ledeen and his type. Conservative Pat Buchanan calls you guys neocrazies and disasters! Respectable Billionaire George Soros is strongly against you national and international disasters! I can go on and on with that list .....
So my crazy neocon friend it is you guys that need to grow up and learn from your miserable failures. You guys need to stop causing more problems for us/US and Iran, and let the US focus on dealing with your old crazy cold war allies (Talibans/fanatics in Afghanistan/Pakistan).

A followup for anonymo7

Mr. Warmonger, as Center for Public Integrity reported, many US
officials lied to pave the way for Iraq war. Those who did that and
their supporters like you are not in a position to judge Iran.

You know the biggest mistake the neocons made?

North Korea has nothing to do with the War on Terror. It's an unresolved problem from teh Cold War that goes all teh way back to 1952.

Iraq had nothing to do with the War on Terror. It's an unresolved problem that goes back Desert Storm in 1991, which was a war over oil and Arab sovereignty.

Iran was the obvious next target after Afghanistan. Prior to 9/11, it was Hezbollah who was responsible for most terror attacks on the US. Not to mention the hostage taking and assassinations that Iranians committed directly against Americans. It wouldn't have necessarliy takenm an invasion to topple the IRI after Afghanistan, but teh IRI should have been taken down back in 2002 - 2003, one way or another.

The neocons got overly ambitious, and decided to "fix" problems from the past while they took care of the problems of the present. And that mistake (that lie) was disastrous.

to: anonymo7

Mr. Warmonger,

If you want to see a warmonger, look in the mirror. I've been in war zones, and have no wish to return.

as Center for Public Integrity reported, many US
officials lied to pave the way for Iraq war.

What does Iraq have to do with Iran? The US does not have to lie to make a case for war with Iran. The IRI violated teh Vienna Conventions and committed an act of war against the US when it sseized the American embassy in Tehran in 1979. A state of undeclared war has existed between the US and Iran since that time. There is no "time limit" on wars. The US can invoke the "hostage crisis" and declare war on Iran right now. And that would be completely legal, and completely justified.

And it's no lie to say that the Islamic Republic has violated the NPT already. Is anyone denying it?

So, where does Iraq come into the picture? Other than you just trying to score some cheap points by invoking an unpopular war? WHy not talk about Vietnam too?

Those who did that and
their supporters like you are not in a position to judge Iran.

Actually, we are. The American people ARE in a position to judge Iran. Who better?

Just so you know, I opposed the invasion of Iraq. Why? Because I thought Iraq would be an un-necessary detour from dealing with an actual terror sponsoring state that HAS committed acts of terrorism against the US - the Islamic Republic of Iran. Iran belonged on the "Axis of Evil" list. Iraq and North Korea did not.

As you are aware as a result of those lies (that is quite an
understatement) your Necon/AIPAC friends have caused many disasters in
the middle east

Why don't you just call me a Jew and get it over with? :P

Americans are not responsible for what middle-easterners do. Is that what you said when you wanted to get out of trouble as a child?

"Mommy, he made me do it!".

When are you going to grow up?

but since I know you could care less about that (in
fact you are probably very happy about that) let me remind you of the
disasters for this country (US):

Trillions of $ of waste, debt and stolen money
Failed or somewhat failed wars
A bad economy

What do you care about any of that? Its good news for you, isn't it?

We've had worse. I've seen worse. The 1970s and the late 1980s weer both worse. You don't see Americans blaming the social chaos in the aftermath of teh Vitenam war on the Vietnamese, do you? Or the aftermath of the Cold War on the Soviets?

We blame ourselves, right? Try it some time. It's not that hard, and it can be good for you.

you are a total idiot.

you are a total idiot. complete lack of authoritative sources and use of logic

To pissed off

Chill the crap out, dude. Put your rear end on ice. By the way, how come no one is flagging this jerk for his filthy language. You don't like this site, then get lost.

extremist warmongers (to NR)

Iranian extremist warmongers are bad for Iran and US. You guys are Iranian versions of Mr. Ahmad Chalabi. You want to get rid of IRI, go do it yourself. Stop conning US. Even if US repeats the Iraqi mistake, everything goes smoothly (????) and they hand the power to you guys, you won't be able to hold it. You guys may think you are smart and by relying on your foreign friends you can run Iran, but you are mistaken. There are mafia like political forces native to Iran that are much more charlatan than you guys .... they will gobble you guys up in no time!
NR, I may be "dishonest and full of half-truths", so expose me! Your empty slogans and jumping all over the place ... "Russia ... China ..." will not do!

It depends

First of all there is no question that it will not be a contest. Contrary to what the Iranian Army wishfully thinks, the Americans will remove all their ships from Persian Gulf and attack Iran from either
Iraq or Diego Garcia deep in Indian Ocean, however its not quite that simple, Iran will take aim at soft targets and Hezbullah may go on some adventures. Add to the mix the fanaticism of all involved, so there is some degree of unpredictability. However just like in Iraq, the people of Iran will be caught in the middle.

Islamic Republic must be destroyed

It's an evil regime and system that must be annihilated from the face of the Earth!

anonymous7: VEVAK or SAVAMA

anonymous7: VEVAK or SAVAMA Agent???

To: Khersambak:

You still are unable to articulate even a shadow of a rational/balanced political perspective. How can you stand for anything politically decent at all, when you endorse fascist mullahs in such a cavalier manner, and display not just embarrassing levels of ignorance, but a thinly veiled inclination for a racist perspective on things political.
You carefully hide your own politics. What is so shameful about your politics that you cannot disclose them in an honest, clear, and courageous fashion?

Why do you mix Interest of Iranian Nation with the Interest of IRI, Your employers????

You're dishonest and full of half-truths. You don't care about IRan or IRanians only the survival of your beloved IR and all the fringe benefits you're receiving from them.

The regime, Islamic Republic of Iran (Not IRAN) is not attempting to acquire nukes for the purpose of protecting the people of Iran, but rather to keep on augmenting their oppressive power against their own subjects as well as against the neighborhood States.

Who will have to pay for this adventurism at the end? The Iranian nation.

People like you will ensure the inevitable nuking of IRan by their short-sided and egomanical vision of the future dominance of the region by Islam. It will never happen. Russia is using the Islamic Republic as her nuclear proxy and this is a very dangerous game that the Russians have started and they will lose, again. Russia will not hesitate to discard the mullahs like a dirty used klienex as soon as it sees fit and they deem the mullahs useless. Iran is being used by both Russia and China against the US to create leverage and neither of those countries will ever allow a an Prosperous, just, peaceful, independent, Islamic nation on their borders...That is for certain. People like you have been intoxiated by the love of power instead of power of love...shame on you.