COMMENTS

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Jamshid, you really shouldn't waste company time like this

drive safely maybe you can cool down by the time you hit home and take a shower.

Thanks for the "Grade School" level wisdom. LOL! We have heard more originality out of parrots and recording devices than any "observation" you have had Jamshid.

One more thing before I go home

Read your own last comment carefully, word by word. It is valuable writing. After you re-read it, you will find yourself on the other side of the mirror.

It is exactly this that makes you a supreme hypocrite in this site. You complain exactly about the same attitudes and behavior you yourself have been engaging in this site, and done so without any whatsoever degree of shame.

Just like Ahmadinejad with his Norooz speech.

Nope, one more thing left Jamshid!

Yawn!

Q

That's it? Is that all you have left to say?

I am laughing outloud, Q. Your responses are more and more self-degrading in their argumentation, which is fitting for you.

I expected more from you. I am done with this blog and with your childish juvenile responses, not to mention with your public display of self-humilation. I hope you'll have a nice weekend, exactlly the same kind of weekend political prisoners in Evin will be having. 

timothy floyd, I believe the disable function exists

There have been threads (a few of my own) that No longer have the comment form, so no one can comment. If that can be done, then, it is one tool that Javid already has.

Given your own experience, you must realize that there has to be limits. IC already deletes spam, so there's one ceiling already.

Also, I don't know if "Timothy Floyd" is your real name, probably not. But imagine if you were like political candidates, writers or artists. ANYBODY can show up and make a horrible false accusation against you, be completely unfair and crude or just make up lies just because they didn't like the point of view being conveyed in the text.

unfortunately many Iranians have not yet learned to seperate a person from an idea or argument. Instead of finding logical flaws or counter evidence, they attack the person because they simply fantacize about fighting a demon (be it IRI or "Islam" or whatever...) in their heads and the writer becomes that demon. So it get nasty real fast. The most deluded ones don't even realize that's what they are doing. In a comical way, they think attacking or slandering the writer with made-up accusations is actually a valid "answer" to the points raised in the piece.

This is the kind of ignorance we are dealing with here. It is absolutely not unique to Iranians, actually, but it does get particularly nasty in this Iranian community.

Now, we have a choice. We can drive everyone to use fake names and turn this into YouTube, or bathroom wall. The content will surely suffer. Who wants to put their best enlightening ideas, or original research in an "anonymous" blog? That's hours or days of his/her life that is being thrown away with no credit or benefit.

So, what kind of people are we left with? Increasingly the psychopaths with overinflated egos who have appointed themselves "demon-hunters" and cyber warriers and all they want to do is character assassinate others with impunity. These people are easy to spot. They are looking for confrontation and they usually share nothing in terms of their own contribution to the writing. They think of anonymity as a weapon, rather than a common privilege, so they treat it as such and abuse it while deluding themselves into thinking they are doing anything of value for Iran.

We will also have the official propagandists. Its so perfect that one of the early rules in this article says that all paid and nonpaid operatives have to disclose their associations. Propaganda by definition is not honest. It is written for the purpose of trying to achieve a political aim. The site will resemble a collection of paid advertising rather than free exchange of ideas.

Now let me ask you a question. Why don't Iranians disclose their relevant affiliations? We know for example, NIAC members do it. Javid has talked about all his present and former places of employment. In LA, you can't swing a dead cat without hitting an anti-IRI organization. Many Iranians are in them and they are active. Are we to believe none of them operate on IC where they have the exact audience they want? Same could be said of governments including IRI. Wouldn't it at least help if such a request was in writing somewhere just like at Dailykos ?

In summary: unless Javid wakes up and moves toward enforcement of rules like the ones the bigger and better discussion sites have, we will have less and less real/honest articles and more and more propaganda and psychopath character assassins.

Jamshid, what do you mean "masalan" ?

this is your typical response after you have nothing left to say. Having mindlessly engaged in thread-stalking (see above), having started and persisted in the most childish of all arguments you now continue to pretend this is grade school.

It's over! It's time you grow up. We really don't have time for these games.

Well Q I couldn't agree more

Well I Q I couldn't agree more on that point.
In fact I just dealt with it on my Easter blog.I worked on it for 2 days,even tho It was not new to me it took alot of thinking to put together.I didn't really want anyone to comment like you say,as if they were in a Bathroom stall.I thought I might post it as a 'Article' but then I noticed you can still comment on Articles.
So I had to choose if it was worth it to me to explain my belief to Iranians and make it available (In my logic that is) and I choose that it was.
It came down to me accepting that's the way it is here and if I wish to use this forum that frankly,I am lucky to not have been kicked out as it is,that it is something I will have to deal with.
So I waited and yes,some commented and said some things I don't think were very wise for their own sake.Wasn't long and I had to ask myself "Am I causing Blasphemy?" Is this the right thing to do to even give people an outlet to do so? I too,asked myself,why can't I turn off the comments? So I seriously considered deleting it but after a day or two I had some comments that I feel made it worth the while.
I don't know what the solution is,I certainly don't think Iranian.com should shut out opinions.But that's JJ's call.
Sites like Youtube are not monitored but they do have a disable function for comments.
AOL went thru this and shut down it's comment's and moved it's whole Political commentary to -Politics daily.Many,many people do not like it and the main news section does suffer now but they have balanced it with their new site.
Site's do make changes/have ways in order to maintain the general public and I have to welcome whatever the choice is.
I blast out my opinion straight forward like everyone else around here.You know what? I like that but maybe the disable function is a good idea or even just to have the articles be non commentary.
Alot of things aren't my business here and I've gotten the hint but my intention has never been just to have flame wars,tho we are all pulled into them at times.
I think Iranian's suffer from a severe exile but at times it just impossible to be sensitive enough to them to have any impact on communicating a point.They are very hard headed and unconvinceable and as of recently,I don't think the politic's matter's.I think it's too late,Iranian's will be 'the enemy' and they are just proud of it.I'm convinced whatever happens is going to happen,war or hardline sanctions,my blogging won't change a thing.So if you want to cut me off for disagreeing and always throwing in my two cents of aggravation,well I don't have a dog in this race anymore.The guys in office are calling the shots,I have written my Senator- The Chairman of Foreign Relations,a Democrat and the author of the sanctions.(I guess I gave away where I live now for the psycho stalkers.But just to let you know,that's my congressman writing the crap up and believe me,this is a Democrat town..He hasn't responded to 3 of my emails and There isn't much else I can do,I know throwing hate at Rush Limbaugh,Obama,Ahamdinejihad or the powers that be is becoming a senseless waste of time.

Q

sheytoon, masalan moch gerefti, haan?

"Why you didn't quote it!!! ... You cut off the quote right before the word "because"....

Oh my god! Are you serious Q? This is such a juvenile response! It reminds me of kiddy responses such as, "jer zadi! ghabool nist!"

It also reminds me of ex-president Clinton playing with technicalities in his desparate and famous quote: "Depends on what is "is".

Remember that one?

This is beyond pathetic, rather it is sad and depressing, a hallmark reaction of bullies when getting a good dose of their own medicine.

Lucky you, it is Friday. Class dismissed.

desperation can be smelled miles away!

Jamshid,

I was actually refering to your "because" clause...

Yes, that's why you didn't quote it!!!! In fact you cut off the quote right before the word "because"!!! You did that to make clear you were "actually referring" to it!!!

If you're trying to be a comedian, don't quit your day job.

Please... see (and this time read carefully) what I said about grade school being over. It's a simple concept really, no need for a video or anything!

Q

"if you had bothered to read the second part of that SAME sentence, where it says "because" you would see..."

Q, you poor thing. I was actually refering to your "because" clause as my main point. You assume and imply opinions about others "because... [fill in the blank with your usual sophistry]"

It is the "because" part that is always the problem. You are so self-rightouts and self-thankful that you think if it is you who is coming up with the "because", then it must certainly be the truth!

Now, it is THIS kind of attitude that grade school is all about my poor fellow.

But I can see that since you feel the "mobser" of this site (Javid) has left a comment and so he might be checking the comments from time to time, you are behaving really good in this blog, so far. But what about other blogs? Is this not "school grade" behavior?

The bottom line is that I have no problem with what you are suggesting to the publisher, it is your hypocrisy that is bothersome. Example:

"[in IC] the guy would be cursed out and mistreated instantly by a bunch of self-righteous loudmouths..."

To which I can only say, look who's talking. The most self-righteous with the loudest and rudest mouth of them all is complaining. The same person who has actually driven some contributors out of this site with his stalkings and insults...

Here is a video for you that would describe how people might feel about your hypocrisy. Enjoy.

//www.youtube.com/watch?v=p79sfRMe37I&feature=youtube_gdata

timothyfloyd, good point

but aren't all comments opinions by definition?

Some of the nastiest brawls on IC happen on the same kind of blogs that DK publishes. Except here, there are no rules, so it gets nasty, tiresome and uninformative very fast.

You have a good point with "articles" like naked women or funny videos that Javid puts up once in a while. Sure, those comments should be like YouTube. But on other occasions when serious people from serious sectors of society publish here, why should "bathroom wall" comments be tolerated? Doesn't that actually stifle freedom instead of encouraging it?

I recall some time ago, I was forwarded a dailykos article which was about an Iranian American candidate for US Congress. His campaign staff was actually engaged with the commenters and answering their questions in the comment section!

Isn't it a shame, Javid, that this has never happened here and bascially couldn't happen on IC because the guy would be cursed out and mistreated instantly by a bunch of self-righteous loudmouths.

You know very well I'm not even exaggerating.

Chelo-L, Jamshid!

So, it's you who needs to calm down, afterall!

And how do you know that? Could you enlighten us? You make a lot of comments like this, Q. This one is benign, but in many other places, you maliciously imply worst things.

LOL!

If you had bothered to read the second part of that SAME sentence, where it says "because" you would see "how I know." You would perhaps see (no bets) that what you fantasize as "confronting bullies" is actually called thread-stalking as described in the article, which you would have been aware of had you read the article. Since you couldn't even read the post you are replying too, couldn't even read the WHOLE sentence, that's the greatest vindication of my original point.

And once again we come back to the original problem with you which I have diagnosed ages ago:

In my teens, I eagerly enjoyed confronting bullies

Grade School is O V E R! The childhood black and white conception of your surroundings and inflated sense of self-righteousness no longer serve their evolutionary function. Funny, I thought you said you were older and "wiser" before. To be frank and serious for a moment: Be it personal interaction or Iranian politics, you have never mentally moved on and that is a real problem isn't it, my friend?

The Huffington Post,Daily Kos are Opinion Orientated Sites

Whereas Youtube,Aol and Iranian.com are in general sites.

The latter is more self serving publicly.

Just my opinion on the difference.

Q

"I know you didn't read it..."

And how do you know that? Could you enlighten us? You make a lot of comments like this, Q. This one is benign, but in many other places, you maliciously imply worst things.

So, Q, I want to ask you, is it not YOU who is falsifying information? liying about people? implying things about them?

You commit these acts in this site on a daily basis, then you have the audacity to come in here and accuse me of doing them?

You have harassed, humiliated, and intimidated others in this site, so many times, that many people in this very blog are criticizing you for it. There were even folks who left this site because they just couldn't take your and your buddies' insults anymore.

The reason why you are angry at me is because you are so used to bullying and intimidating others and even running them right out of blogs that when you finally meet your match, you don't know what to do about it, in desparation, you revert down to the kind of words I have compiled below (go read them again and ask yourself why do you use that kind of language.)

In my teens, I eagerly enjoyed confronting bullies and turning the table on them and putting them in their place, giving them a good taste of their own intimidation medicine.

Thank you Q for giving me the nostalgic feelings of deja vu. Now go again run to Javid for protection with another of your PSs.

Jamshid, speaking of lecturing others on "reading",

If you had bothered to read the actual article you may have noticed this part. I will bold face some of the parts for you, since you are in love with that function.

I know you didn't read it because you wrote below that you specifically commented to trash me (or some other word that you think hides this activity well).

Jamshid:I wouldn't leave a comment. But to see that of all people, you come in here and complain, was a bit too much to digest or to ignore.

Yes, you frequently think this. Now enjoy.

Thread stalking is defined as having three requirements:
(1) On multiple occasions, one or more commenters follow a community member into diary threads; and,
(2) The commenter(s) posts comments that include false information, personal attacks, lies, or implied/express disclosure of private information; and
(3) The commenter(s) engages in this conduct with the intent to harass, harm, humiliate, frighten or intimidate another poster. This intent may be inferred from the number of times that the commenter follows a community member into threads and/or the nature of the comments posted.

PS. to Javid. As you can see what I have written you on multiple occasions in the past few weeks is coming true word for word. How long do you think until IC becomes YouTube? Think about it.

Dear Vildemose and COP

Naturally we can't moderate these kind of persons! Now we should all go and THANK GOD that this is the West and not Iran, otherwise he would be moderating us by force using chomaagh instead of words.

This particular time however, what ticked me off was this man's incredible hyprocrisy.

Q

maybe you can follow through like a champ and eventually serve as a nice "before and after" example for all to see. The question is, can you do this?

No need for me to do this.

You on the other hand, you need to look a few comments down and read again your own exact wordings from the past (and I have excluded some of the even worst ones), and then ask yourself, does a person who claims to be genuinely concerned about this site's class and status would use such wordings and do so on a regular basis?

Sure he would, he wouldn't see any conflict in doing that, if he is a genuine hypocrite that is.

And that's what bothered me in the first place. It is as though Ahmadinejad comes in here and gives us lectures on how to improve Human Rights in Iran.

Sure Q, sure.

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This is not the same

This is not the same news/commentary as dailykos so similar laws can't apply. For those who contribute, certain sets of rules can be put in place, which in turn might work against the free f. 

Almost all of the commenter

Almost all of the commenters on dailykos believe in democracy and rule of law. No republican rabid right winger reactionary, the likes of Michele Malkin, Pamela Geller of Atlas shrugs (Jaleho, No Fear, Sargord, Q, etc.)... or the people on 'Red state' blog even bother to write or comment on dailykos because they will be kicked out by 'troll rating' system and immediately exposed as the reactionaries that they are in two minutes....unlike IC who requires us to be polite to all kinds of reactionaries...

Q: why don't you submit your essays to dailykos? Do you think they will not see through your self-rightgeousness although they might agree with all of your anti-American rhetorics??

COP and Jamshid: Can you

COP and Jamshid: Can you moderate a rabid Islmo-commie ideologue who wants to impose his/her worldview on the rest of us? Can you moderate a racist teabagger?? Can you moderate an Islamist ideologue zobshodeh in Velayt like "no fear"?? Can you moderate Basijees agenda on this site??j

Jamshid

You can't expect politeness from this bunch. Just look what they're doing to the Iranian people.

Best to ignore the dipstick. 

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IRAN FIRST

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JJ, I am with Q on this one

I know most are guilty of this, me included but it becomes really hard not to get drawn into this tit for tat game when there is no moderation. Its been a few months now that I simply avoid those whose message is to provoke a nasty response but this also has caused me to think of leaving IC as well.

I like your site and fighting to stay on despite all the nasty comments that goes on here.

Mehrdad

Jamshid saying "please" to me, is a good start actually

maybe you can follow through like a champ and eventually serve as a nice "before and after" example for all to see.

The question is, can you do this?

:)

anyway Javid, I really would like to hear your thoughts and hope you can consider what I have suggested here and elswhere and actually make a difference in this site. Many of the rules in this article from a mainstream American source would be "nice to have" on your own site.

Q, please

Try to control your anger which only made you respond with a knee jerk reaction. Calm down. I was just trying to make a point that we can make any site that we contribute to look better, if we start by fixing our own attitude first. You were just too good of an example not to be mentioned. That is all.

By the way, if the rest of my post didn't interest you, then why did you write a whole paragraph in its response?

Anyway, the whole point is, instead of nagging, do something that you have control over it. Something such as correcting your own behavior and possibly even becoming a role model for the rest of us. That would be the difference between the attitude of a spoiled child (nag) and an adult (action.)

The question is, can you do this?

speaking of politeness, Jamshid

has your mother ever told you: "speak only when spoken to?"

Thanks for first of all proving the "zerti" clause in my description below. Second, I refer you to part of the post you missed while rushing to judgement which is sadly typical:

There are no winners in these games (actually there might be, but it will not be you or Iranian.com) because if they are allowed to happen, the only response is and must be in-kind. I strongly believe the reasons I mentioned before are responsible.

The solutions I've described, and ecourage Javid to adopt would go a long way to put a stop to all of this -- the tit AND the tat.

The rest of your post unfortunately does not interest me. You're welcome to "go on" with laughably one-sided complaints ommitting all the "gol kashtan" of you own, things so vile and disgusting as any on this site that make anything in your little "list" look like flowery compliments. I'm not playing this time. But you go on do it all you want and continue to serve as the example I was describing. It saves me having to write more. So I thank you for that.

Q

kal agar tabib boodi sare khod dava kardi... Why first don't you become a bit more polite and then perhaps you could complain about others to the publisher.

If this site follows up with your recommendation, you would be the first person to be banned from this site. All of the things you are complaining about, apply to your own self more than to anybody else.

How many times have you accused someone for being a racist? A Zionist? A soldout "asshole"? A neocon? A nokar? How many times have you expressed your urge to "puke" on somebody because of his views? How many times have you accused innocent contributors for being warmongers? Fascists? Rabbid Zionists? Low racist cowards? Attack dogs? Stupidly narrow-minded? Cheap and disgusting? Bullshit time waster? Lame ass? Iran hater? Rabbid dog? Sadistic animal? Blind neocon fascist? Garbage troll? Retarded ass? Sorry bastard? Old cow? Manic depressive? Savage hooligan? Kaleh shagh idiot? Ball-less hypocrite? Bullshit artist? Brain full of shit? Known asshole shahollahi? foam-in-the-mouth butt-kissing Monarchist?

Need I go on?

And those are only the terms you have used against me, and even after you have relatively become more polite in this site.

And you want to advice the publisher of this site and help make it a more classy site? Can you start with yourself?

I really don't care about the kind of issues brought up in this blog, so normally, I wouldn't leave a comment. But to see that of all people, you come in here and complain, was a bit too much to digest or to ignore.

Javid are you serious?

I am encouraged by this posting and will take a chance again that you are actually serious and concerned about this issue and want a reasonable and healthy respectful site.

My impression has been that you are simpley not interested in such a site which is why IC has gone to the dogs. Knowing you, it's because you are a people-pleaser and just like most Iranians don't really know what "freedom of speech" means. Look at these bannable offenses listed. IC basicaly tolerates all of them presumably for "freedom of speech". Hate, genocide, racism, bigotry, personal attacks, talking about people's real lives, professions, place of employment... all of this happens on IC.

Ironically, the only rule you seem to be following is the one about profanity, which they don't consider as important!!!

And they are right. Policing malicious intent is much more important than policing language.

Many of IC threads resemble bathroom walls, or even worse YouTube threads. You say "their problems mirror ours", but surely you must have noticed that they have much much better results. The reason? They have rules and they enforce their rules. IC, on the other hand thinks this is "freedom of speech."

YouTube comments have even more freedom than IC. But who takes it seriously? Who woule go to YouTube comments for enlightening content? No one! that's the direction IC is headed!

Now, whenever I say this or something similar, a bunch of people zerti show up to say that "we don't need more restrictions." This appeals to you Javid, don't hide it! It associates you with "giving freedom" and you enjoy that position, who wouldn't, honestly? And look at you now, you are asking for "concensus". Ask yourself this, would owners at Dailykos ask users if it's "OK" to enforce some of these rules? That's what you're doing. Surprise! most people don't like any restriction of any kind.

On any given question a group of people, even a majority would say NO to any rules, but it's not up to them. It's up to the site owner as to what kind of site he wants to have. Think about this. How many of your users really think of the bigger picture and the long term benefit of your site, rather than their own petty, immediate selfish interest? Especially those who have no investment in even using a real or at least consistent name. Be honest.

Why would people who are here to relieve their historical "oghdeh", or to get some kind of psychological power rise, or even do literary character experimentation give you an unbiased answer? Sorry to be harsh, I don't mean to be accusatory, but you KNOW these people exist in significant numbers on your site and they are usually the problem.

That's why these rules at DK or any other similar successfull site are not up for negotiation.

Do you ask kids in a classroom what the rules of conduct in a class would be? Would you ask guests at your house if you should have everyone take off their shoes?

Their community functions much better because of these rules, their enforcement and because people accept them. You can't argue with results, look how big they have gotten. Look how influential any such site has become. People take it seriously if you take it seriously.

I'll be honest with you, I want this site to be serious and influential. I want us to have our own Iranian Huffington Post or Dailykos, where I can be proud of being featured and writing more. It hasn't happened yet. Instead I find myself wanting to submit writing elsewhere because I don't want the bullshit childish games that goes on here. There are no winners in these games (actually there might be, but it will not be you or Iranian.com) because if they are allowed to happen, the only response is and must be in-kind. I strongly believe the reasons I mentioned before are responsible.

When are you going to get serious about your own site and what must be a huge portion of your life?

Sorry about ranting.

Helpful guidelines

This is very helpful. The Daily Kos is one of the most-popular sites around. In some ways we looked at their model when setting up the blogs on iranian.com.

Their problems with moderation mirrors ours. There are many out there who feel they have the right to insult, attack, threaten and ridicule other users. We're not talking about Ahmadinejad or Pahlavi. They are public figures and reasonable attacks are to be expected and accepted. But viciously attacking other users for their views is something else -- it's wrong, disruptive and pointless.

Your views on this will help reaching a consensus and building a community rich on ideas and poor on animosity.