AFSHIN

Afsaneh

Afsaneh,

Fine, you insist on comparing the lack of health care with raping of Iranian men, women and children, and equating Clinton with NIAC lobbyist based on that comparison, that is your right to think that way.

Perhaps one day we can get into substantive discussion about Ferdowsi and particularly Hafez that you are rightly fond of, and by citing their words seek out their wisdom on not being adamant and definite about essentials.

Take care.

Healthcare includes preventing terrorism

  If you studied terrorism you would know that.Try 'Terrorism for beginners'

Vildmose youre so out of it

Read and try to comprehend my statement.  Terrorists are in Iraq,When you say we cannot defeat them,that is supporting them,especally when it is so far from the truth.But if you think I give a crap iof you are offended being called a terrorist you are wrong.I will call you a terrorist day and night just as I have been called zionist.I have no fear of calling any Hamas supporter or Hezbollah supporter here - A TERRORIST.If you don't like it,well ask me if I give a hoot./Now go study english

My dear Fred can also stay on the subject...

....by keeping other issues such as Clinton etc. out of this blog. Do you really want to stay on the subject, Fred? Tell us why you are so jittery when Daei, who is allegedly in line with  the cult of MKO, is in the third degree.

learning from Ferdowsi

Lack of healthcare also kills - that's the point I'm trying to make Fred. And 40 million don't have it. A basic Human Right.

But I don't want to digress here - What I love about our "Persian Arts" is that no-one fights over the beauty of Isfahan, the poetry of Hafez, the carpets of Kashan, th Persian cuisine, and the Gardens of Shiraz.

How our Masters coped with adversity: I came to this Blog to see what all the fighting was about. And it was the usual, one person calling the other names - you know all that stuff. All I know is that Ferdowsi and Hafez and Saadi and Rumi - all lived in far worse times - the Monguls used to burn an entire city and move on (Nishapur) and yet, all these Masters, didn't spend their energy on internal fights - who is siding with the Mongols, who isn't siding with the Monguls, who is this - who is that. Ferdowsi put his head down and created the Shahnameh. And let's just, perhaps even  for a second,  learn from that. To do something positive even under the most adverse of circumstances. It's what our Masters did - and the very reason they are called "Masters."

Afsaneh

The Iranian American National Council has 3 well known

enemies:

1.  Mr Dai in this article represents the Mojahedins. This group is under pressure to leave Iraq ASAP hence the pressure exerted from its lobby member such as Dai.

2. The supporters of Israel particulary the Likud party supporters. We have a few of them here on this website organized under the user name Fred. Fred in actuality is made up of at least 2 members who produce two blogs daily in English and Farsi/Persian.

3. The monarchists

The above groups hate the Iranian American National Council for its support of diplomacy in place of Sanctions and war with Iran

It's a free forum Mr Dai

I understand your concern about the balance of the articles for and against the NIAC, but you can challenge every one of them and I assure you that the comment section sometimes is more interesting than the article itself.

As with your objection to NIAC or any other organisation, many including myself would be interested to know why you think their policies are damaging to Iran. Accusation by association is not going to replace a proper critique of their policies. And, if one of their policies is to avert a war on Iran then they have many Iranian's support as we do not wish to see Iran following the same fate as Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya.

Staying on the subject

Afsaneh,

Again, you made a comparison between Clinton and NIAC lobbyist.

I outlined the logical scenario based on your comparison. Now if you want to go into tangent about health care, the shameful lack of it, fine, we can talk about health care. 

However, that has nothing to do about comparing NIAC lobbyist meeting and having friendly relationship with representatives of a regime which tortures, rapes and murders Iranian men, women and children with what Clinton does.

My point, again, is if Clinton met with and had friendly relationship with Americans representing an American regime which rapes, tortures and murders American men, women and children, American people would not be as forgiving as you seem to be when the victims are Iranians.

lesson from America

Fred: I appreciate your response. Do consider the fact that 40 million Americans can't afford medical care, and big swathes of them die way too early of cancer, heart disease etc.  for lack of health insurance. And yes, Mrs. Clinton would talk to the leaders who support such policies. So she should, it's called Freedom. And it isn't Free.

We might disagree here and I respect the fact that you didn't start any personal insults - allowing for the substance to be exchanged.  My observation is that "Politics' is nuanced - the "With us or Against us" mindset in our culture hinders national growth. It's the biggest lesson I've learned from the Americans, and I thank them for it.

Afsaneh

Contributions of National Iranian American Council to Iranians

• Helped remove sanctions on vital online communication tools like MSN Messenger, Facebook, and Youtube to ensure the free flow of information in Iran.

• Defeated a Congressional resolution that would have paved the way for a US-Iran war.

• Effectivty opposed and stopped legislation that would bar every Iranian from entering the United States. 

• Ensured human rights were on the agenda when the U.S. began talks with Iran

• Spurred President Obama to condemn the Iranian government's brutal crackdown on peaceful demonstrators after Iran's disputed election, while refraining from endorsing any political faction.

• Obtained an apology from Fox sportscasters for racially discriminatory remarks against NBA player Hamed Haddadi. 

• Compelled a retraction from Rep. Jane Harman for her statement regarding the "separation" of Iran's ethnic groups. 

• Corrected the National Geographic Society's 8th edition maps to read "Persian Gulf" instead of "Arabian Gulf."

• Ended Monster.com's discrimination against Iranian Americans.

• eliciteted an apology from MSNBC's Don Imus for a derogatory comment about an Iranian airliner crash that killed 43 passengers.

•  Removed offensive and inaccurate portrayals of Iranian Americans in the film Crossing Over.

• Registered thousands of Iranian-American voters.

• Published the first-ever Census of the Iranian-American community.

Question: What have you and Mojahedins done for us but pushing for sanctions and war?

Dear Afsaneh

Iran is under assault, its very existence as we know it (culturally , economically and, literally, lives of tens of thousands of people,)is in peril. There is a clear and easily definable enemy: it's called the Islamic Republic.

Lofty philosophical dispositions; benign affliction to political correctness; and being duped by veneer of democracy that  hides the corporate state (also known as Fascism), can only be afforded by the very good hearted/naive individuals at best - I do not need to mention the worst case scenario.

If the greatest "show on earth," namely, the U.S. election teaches you to shake hands with the Lords of Rape and Torture; all I have to say dear Afsaneh, its so pleasant to live in  la la land.

Mr. Javid: I implore you to state your position on dealings of NIAC with the Islamic Republic of Iran.

Escape: Who are you calling

Escape: Who are you calling terrorists??

Is when JJ and others give

Is when JJ and others give people like Trita/Niac free cybertime, and don't cut down the lies or at least, are doing things covertly...if there is nothing wrong with having a response team, then, why hide it? If it weren't for Mr. Dai's evidence, we wouldn't have known about this info, would we?

This kinds of action ultimately propagates false information at our own peril as Masoud Kazemzadeh points out rightfully so. Mr. Dai you're doing the same thing as NIAC, propagating false information about JJ and IC. Your opinions of JJ are not 'facts', only opinion.

Escape: It's not nice to

Escape: It's not nice to label people. Happy to have a discussion with you and even disagreements - say, over the Iraq war. That's what happens in a Democracy. (Thank you America, for teaching us that.) Randomly labelling people is not called a substantive discourse - and when "substance" leaves the discussion - and we take to personal attacks, that's where progress stops. 

You're right, best to leave this chain, and get back to enjoying our national literary masters - like HAFEZ.

Afsaneh

Clarification

Afsaneh,

You made the comparison, not I. The logic of your comparison dictates the scenario I outlined.

According to published documents, NIAC lobbyist meets and has a friendly relationship with representatives of a regime which tortures, rapes and murders Iranian men, women and children.

Are you saying if Clinton meets with such Americans who do such horrible crimes to American citizens, American people will be as understanding as you are when the victims are Iranians?

You are wrong Mr. Daei, when you say...

ایشان موظف است تا به همان میزان که مقالات و تبلیغات
نایاک را چاپ میکند، بهمان میزان نیز سوالات و انتقادات جدی از این سازمان
را نیز انعکاس دهد.

Neither is Javid nor any admin of anyother site, under such obligation, albeit morally or legally.

Enough of your sentimentality, Sir.

جناب دایی:

حالا حرف شما چیست؟  این را هم تعطیل کنیم؟   راستی
ما چند رسانه برای درمیان گذاشتن نظرات خود داریم؟   من خودم چندین سال در
payvand.com و جبهه ملی مینوشتم.   متاسفانه هیچ کدام از این سایت ها دوام
نیاوردند.   حالا بیاییم و بگوییم این سایت اصلا مال نیاک است.   همین که
این مقاله مبارک با تمام کمی و کسری و از نظر حقوقی در درجه ای بسیار پایین
را چاپ کرده، نشان دهنده چیست؟   اگر چاپ نکند می فرمایید سانسور شد.  
اگر بکند، می گویید برای تظاهر به دمکراتیک    بودن است.
اینکه ما ایرانیان فقط یک سایت برای بیان نظرات خود داشته باشیم خود رقت
آور است.    اینکه، افرادی مانند خود شما،  بجای کمک به ارتقا ان، مشغول
"افشا گری" هستید، خود از بارز ترین دلایل وضعیت کنونی ما ایرانی هاست.  

May we all have good dreams.

Be the change ...

Fred: Mrs. Clinton and other Secretary of States have met with other highly unsavory "regime"-s and regularly at that. It's called "politics." Very surprised that you think "politics" is a chapter out of SnowWhite. It isn't.

Soossan: "ZOO Agents" - that was hysterically funny. Thank you!!

Let's try to leave our despotic mindset behind - that either you are "with us or against us." NIAC is one group, PAAIA is another, set up 10 more - who cares? This is America. Leave the despotic thinking at the door, please.  It's terribly sad to  be anti-despotism, but possess the seeds of the same despotic mind. "Be the change you want to see in the World" - Mahatma Gandhi

Afsaneh

Why do you keep call anyone

Why do you keep call anyone who supports IRI as their agents? Misguided and Misinformed and navies and dumb and brainwashed may be but to keep mentioning that they are agent it is ridicules .....

Should we then call all the right wingers here CIA and MUSSAD Agents?

Should we then call All the leftists KGB agents?

Should we then call all the animals here ZOO agents ? 

 and who the hell is " Dai" running around accusing people especaily our very dear JJ ?

I actually think JJ is SHAH doost  ..... I have not seen that many shah doost that I see on this site on my entire life and I have no objections I am all for lavish weddings : ) 

PS... JJ jan I am just kidding .....  

Yea I've had about enough of Mrs Hafez support for terrorists

But she does fit the Hamas Nailbomb crowd rather well. You articulated it perfect  Fred,whereas today I'm just not n the mood

سوری خانم... گل گفتی‌

Very well put.

اگر تحصیل کرده هامون اینها هستن، که خدا به داد مون برسه و بیخود نیست وضع مملکت اینطوریه و ما ایرانی‌‌ها در آمریکا هیچ صدا یا نفوذی نداریم

This also speaks volume about our priorities and interest. While there is another story on the main page, one about one of the bravest Iranian woman currently in IRI prison or another story about Dr. Baadkobi who was recently arrested by IRI who has got hardly a fraction of attention that this witch hunt is getting. Yours truly as guilty as any one else to pay any undo attention to such gossib and witch hunt.

//iranian.com/main/2011/may/nasrin-sotoudeh

Mehrdad

Unwinnable war -stick to hafez

  and get a update on iraq ,like within a few years.

I am not one for conspiracy theories

but NIAC has more presence on this site than perhaps any other place on the planet aside from its own website.  It may be that NIAC takes advantage of this site and posts stuff.

Also, members of this site seem to be way more "into" NIAC than the average Iranian abroad.  I know people (Iranians) from all walks of life, and 99% of them haven't even heard of Parsi and NIAC.  But on this site, they're all the rage.

Lastly, why is that IC sells our emails to NIAC?  I started getting NIAC newsletters after I signed up here.  The funny thing is that Mr. Dai will start to get them now that he has signed up as an IC member. 

Comparing Clinton to NIAC lobby

“Hillary Clinton might meet with a Right Wing Republican, and she does frequently, that doesn't make her a traitor.”

One can bank on the fact that if the person Hillary Clinton meets with on friendly terms was representing a regime which tortures, rapes and murders American men, women and children, she would have a lot to answer to the American people who don't look kindly on such behavior.

آقای دأعی

۱) همینکه این مقاله شما در سایت ایرانیان دات کام چاپ شده، برای ما گواه اینه که جهانشاه کاملا بیطرفه

۲) شما به جهانشاه انتقاد میکنیند که اجازه دفاع به شما نداده، اما امروز که چنین فرصتی پیدا کردید، من هیچ مطلبی که دال بر دفاع شما از خودتون باشه نمیبینم، فقط و فقط حمله و انتقاد به نایاک ، به کاسمی و به جهانشاه

۳) هنوز هیچ حرفی‌ در مورد موضع شخصی‌ خودتون و رابطه شما با سازمان منحوس مجاهدین خلق (که بار‌ها در کامنت‌های زیر مطرح شده) نزدید. اینجاست که شما تریبون رو به دست دارید و میتونید از خودتون به اصطلاح دفاع کنید، پس چرا شونه خالی‌ می‌کنید؟

۴) من شما رو اصلا نمیشناسم و از هدف و مقصد اصلی‌ شما برای اینهمه قیل و قال بیخبرم، اما فواد خوسمود رو شخصا میشناسم. انسانی‌ بسیار شریف و با خصلت زیبای انسانی‌، بشر دوست و ایران دوست. همینکه این تهمت‌ها رو از شما در مورد ایشون خواندم، خودش برای من دلیل محکمی ‌ست که در مورد صحت بقیه صحبت‌هاتون هم شک کنم، به خصوص که هیچ پایه و اساسی‌ برای ثبوت اتهاماتون هم ندارید که ارائه بدید، فقط تهمت است و بس.

۵) در مورد نایاک هیچ حرفی‌ ندارم که بزنم. هیچوقت نتونستم در باره حقانیت این سازمان تصمیم قاطع خودم رو بگیرم و هنوز هم علیرغم تهمت‌های شما، نمیتونم موضع ثابت و دقیقی‌ در مورد نایاک داشته باشم.

اینجا روی سخنم با شیفته خانوم و ممَد عزیز است:

من با نظر شما در مورد چاپ این مقاله در ایرانیان دات کام، موافق نیستم. به نظر من این بهترین کاری بود که جهانشاه میتونست بکنه. چون در هر حال این مقاله در سایت‌های دیگه چاپ میشد و اقای دأعی از هیچ فرصتی کوتاهی نمیکرد تا این اتهاماتش رو به گوش خوانندگان این سایت برسونه. پس چه بهتر که همینجا باشه تا به طور مستقیم و رادیکال با اینگونه اتهامات برخورد بشه و خواندگان نظر جمعی‌ خودشون رو اینجا مطرح کنند.

جاوید جهان شاه :)

WITH US or AGAINST US

I come to Iranian.com to share our wonderful poet: HAFEZ. Really don't have time to tarnish him with political mudslinging.  Just wanted to say that too many Iranians use the 2 Dimensional - "With Us or Against Us" - line of discourse.  You're either a Traitor or God/King. Some  would say that this is exactly the reason the entire community is spread across 7 continents. I highly recommend changing our community's mental channel to a more 3 Dimensional existence.

Didn't 30 years living in the West teach us anything? Hillary Clinton might meet with a Right Wing Republican, and she does frequently, that doesn't make her a traitor. After elections in the US - they all shake hands and get down to the business of running their country. And many argue that the last time the US used the "With US or Against US" mantra, it landed itself in an inwinable war in Iraq.  I highly recommend evolving from such  mindsets - for the good of all Iranians.

Thanks Iranan.com for allowing for all of us to meet, including AfshinAzad.

بابا خایه مالی‌ هم حدی داره دیگه!

He told you himself that "nothing is sacred!"

Mr. Daii is presenting certain documents which at least point to some communications between this site's owner and an organisation which has been on occasions taking side with islamist regime of Iran. Now weather Mr Daii's conclusions are correct or not is another isuue and as such should be topic of debate. Slandering Mr Daii  does not improve the site owner's case, not in my eyes at least!

Somebody even called Mr Daii an "MKO member"! Now if I come out and say this person itself is a known paid agent of the islamic regime, signing under at least half a dozen user ID's, stalking and  slandering anybody who takes a firm and articulate stance against the islamist regime, my comment would be flagged and deleted and I'll get another email from admin, probably!

The point is, the fiine line between the people who are paid to come and comment on this site an behalf of the islamist regime (yes, the one with the deepest pockets...), and the rest of us who come and say whatever crazy stuff we want to say should be clearly drawn and identified. We say things because we believe in them, the paid folks say things through their multiple user ID's because they are paid to do so.

vasallam, naameh tamam!

"Personal business must yield to collective interest."

دوستانی که انتقاد من از جهانشاه جاوید را نادرست میدانند

از سال 2007 که گزارشات  و مقالات زیادی در مورد نایاک منتشر شد، طبیعتاجامعه ایرانی کنجکاوانه به این مسئله می نگریست و بدنبال کشف حقیقت در این رابطه بود. سایت ایرانیان نه تنها کمکی به روشن شدن این مسئله نکرد بلکه با چاپ مطلبی طنزآمیز به مسخره کردن من و دیگر منتقدان نایاک پرداخت و طی چهار سال گذشته، هیچ سایت و نشریه و رسانه ای باندازه ایرانیان دات کام به انتشار مطالب نایاک و ارائه تصویری مثبت از این سازمان نپرداخته است. ایشان در بحبوحه انتقادات هموطنان ازنایاک، دروبین بدست به نایاک رفت و با گرفتن دهها عکس از کارمندان این سازمان،تصویری فوق مثبت از آنان ارائه داد.

این حق جهانشاه جاوید است که سایت خود را در هرجهتی که مایل است بکشاند. حتی میتواند آنرا دربست در اختیار نایاک قرار دهد و ازانتشار چند بلاگ و کامنت های انتقاد آمیز از نایاک نیز خودداری کند. طبیعی است دراینصورت کسی سراغ سایت نمیآید و برد رسانه ای اش کم میشود.

انتقاد من از جهانشاه جاوید این است که اگر این سایت ارگان رسمی و یا مخفی نایاک است بسیار خوب حرفی نیست. در غیر اینصورت، ایشان موظف است تا به همان میزان که مقالات و تبلیغات نایاک را چاپ میکند، بهمان میزان نیز سوالات و انتقادات جدی از این سازمان را نیز انعکاس دهد. ایشان یکبار نوشته بود که اتهامات در مورد نایاک به دادگاه رفته و تا زمانیکه دادگاه پایان نیافته ایشان به تریتا پارسی اعتماد کامل دارد. یعنی نایاک میتواند هرچه خواست در سایت ایشان بنویسد و امثال من که کم نیستند چون حرفشان از اتهام یا دروغ پراکنی فراترنمیرود، جائی در این سایت ندارند.

مسئله من یا دیگران با نایاک اصلا شخصی یا عصبانیت های احساسی و عقیدتی نیست. اولین کسیکه در مورد تریتا پارسی مطلب نوشت پرویز صیاد بود. محسن مخملباف نیز در واشنگتن تایمز ایشان را لابی رژیم ایراندانست. اهمیت مسئله در اینجاست که نایاک و تریتا پارسی در ردای نمایندگی جامعه ایرانیان از نفوذ زیادی برخوردار است و فعالیت هایش در زندگی من و شما و هموطنان در داخل کشور اثر میگذارد زیرا لابی نایاک بطور جدی روی سیاست آمریکا در رابطه باکشورمان موثر بوده است.

بنابراین، من، شما و جهانشاه جاوید وظیفه داریم تا به کشف حقیقت کمک کنیم و ایشان در مقابل خوانندگان سایت وظیفه دارد تا دو طرف داستان را نمایش دهد. کاری که ایشان نکرده است. بسیاری از دوستان من بلاگ خود راثبت کرده اند که هیچگاه به صفحه اول نیامده است. از ستون وسط سایت میگذرم که هیچگاه به بالانس مقالات و گزارشات چاپ شده توسط نایاک نپرداخته است.

از نایاک که بگذریم به همکار اصلی این سازمان یعنی لابی باصطلاح ضد جنگ بنام کاسمی میرسیم که با پوشیدن قبای دروغین صلح طلبی، وبا پز مبارزات ضد امپریالیستی، چهار سال تمام به جمهوری اسلامی سرویس داد وگروههای چپ و مترقی آمریکا و انگلستان را فریب داد. البته خود این گروههای آمریکائی نیز مقصرند زیرا همیشه بازی اینگونه افراد را میخورند و هر دیکتاتوری که جیغ ضد آمریکائی بکشد، قند در دل این باصطلاح چپ های آمریکائی آب میکند.

نگاهی به این چهار سال گذشته بیندازید و ببینیدکه وابستگان این صلح طلبان دروغین و سازمان کاسمی مثل اردشیر عمانی، عباس عدالت،فواد خسمود و ...چگونه در سایت ایرانیان دات کام آنهم در ستون اصلی، بطور تخت گاز به جولان دهی می پرداختند. هموطنانی که هنوز به وابستگی کاسمی به رژیم ایران شکدارند به این دو  سند نگاه کنند (See"TehranGathering" and also see a "document on CASMII")  

من اصلا از سهم خودم که چرا به من حمله شده وایشان اجازه دفاع به من نداده میگذرم و مسئله ای نیست. من به این حملات عادت دارم.بگذار من را بازهم نئوکان و نوکر اسرائیل و هیزم بیار جنگ جهانی سوم و چهارم بخوانند.حقیقت بالاخره نمایان میشود.

قصه طولانی شد. با پوزش از دوستان

ارادتمند حسن داعی

Another revelation about JJ

He always goes commando.  

Responses

• Mahmoudg: I agree 100%. I see no reason why JJ should pnot allow NIAC to post. This is freedom of speech in action. NIAC gets its say and others respond.
• In a free nation we are all able to form our peaceful organizations. NIAC may be a front for IR. But it is peaceful and has not broken any laws. Therefore it is perfectly alright for it to do whatever lobby work it want.
• I really want to see Reza Pahlavi form an organization to bring us all together. This will be the organization that I am dreaming of.