Was Salmon e Farsi a traitor?

Salman

was a traitor. It does not take a Ph.D. nor do you need to be Einstein to know this. The guy hated Iran and is directly responsible for downfall of Sassanids. The greatest power of Iran since Achemaneshian.

You dont need PHD to know

You dont need PHD to know that salman was a Traitor..........

just to make something

just to make something clear, salamn farsi was NEVER part of any iranian army. he spent his young life away from any military, and he lived and lost his youth away from iran. he diud not leave his family home because of a woman, he left his family home because he was attracted to christianity, and his family did not accept that. he lived initially as a christian, and only later accepted islam. if anyone are the traitors, they are the ones who are lying bout his life, namely the questioner, and every other salman basher out there. did he fight against hte persians? yes he did, thatis because truth always fights against falsehood, and wins. he wasn't about nationality or all that bullshit thsat you ignorant fools are about. he is about upholding of what is truth. he fought against a pack of lies. and yes he won, and you people lost and are still losing as i see that most of you are insane.

daryush: You're one of the

daryush: You're one of the most ridiculous islamist living in the US. How rich have you gotten because of the mullahs? What kind of crimes have you committed in the name of Islam and IRI? Your feverish support of the IRI speaks volume. I hope the DHS is watching you.

Not a real figure

Salam Farsi is not a true historical figure. He is a recycled version of Mani, many of whose ideas were incorporated (stolen) in what later became Islam, and the myths surrounding it. Just like Muhammad, probably an arab army general involved in some sectarian feud within arabia proper, and other such "people". Islam is a mixture of pagan arab myths, heretical christian sects and mani ideas compiled later and retrospectively attributed to people who didn't exist who didn't have any connection to it.

forgery in the name of history

anonymous111, the text and counter-text you presented is actually a fabrication of history, but not a fabrication of ancient history.

Such an interaction did not happen between Omar and Yazdgird. The document has been ridiculed by tons of modern historians including Edward Said, Dabashi, Nasr, and many others who say the text showed up in the late 80's as a reaction to the islamic republic of iran and has no historical evidence.

it is not found in any historical book, and its source is not even cited. it was created as either a joke or a reaction to islam in the 1980's, and yet you fools take it as truth.

the language spoken in the farsi translation of yazdgirds speech is more of 1980's polemics against Islam, rather than what would have consisted in a dialogue 1,400 years ago.

So nice try. Next time try to use sources that actually exist, rather than using sources that are forgeries (and such open forgeries too. haha).

The Islamic Army at the

The Islamic Army at the gates of Tisphoon:

636 The Arabs defeat the Iranians at Qadisia. 637 . The Arabs take Ctesiphon (Tisphoon).Tisphoon was burnt by the Arabs to the ground including all of its historical sites, libararis, and records.

Today's Islamic troubles really all began at this point in history.
Text of the ultimatum from Omar Ibn-Khat'tab the Calif of Islam to the Iranian Sovereign Yazdgerd III]

Bism-ellah Ar'rahman Ar'rhim
To the Shah of the Farsi.
Do not foresee a good future for you and your nation without your acceptance of my terms and your submission to me.There was a time when your country ruled half the world, but see how now your sun has set.On all fronts your armies have been defeated and your nation is condemned to extinction.I point out to you the path whereby you might escape this fate. Namely, that you begin worshipping the one god, the unique deity, the only god who created all that is. I bring you his message.Order your nation to cease the false worship of fire and to join us, that they may join the truth. Worship Allah the creator of the world.Worship Allah and accept Islam as the path of salvation. End now your polytheistic ways and become Muslims that you may accept Allah-u-Akbar as your saviour. This is the only way of securing your own survival and the peace of your Persians.You will do this if you know what is good for you and for your Persians.Submission is your only option.Allah u AkbarThe Calif of Muslims Omar Ibn-Khat'tab

[What follows is response of the Persian King.]

In the name of Ahura Mazda the Creator of Life and Wisdom.From the Shahan-Shah of Iran, Yazdgerd.

To Omar Ibn Khat'tab the Arab Calif.

In your letter you summon us Iranians to your god whom you call "Allah-u-Akbar"; and because of your barbarity and ignorance, and without knowing who we are and Whom we worship, you demand that we seek out your god and become worshippers of "Allah-u-Akbar".How strange that you occupy the seat of the Arab Calif but are as ignorant as any desert roaming Arab!You admonish me to become monotheistic in faith.Ignorant man, for thousands of years we Aryans have, in this land of culture and art, been monotheists and five times a day have we offered prayers to God's Throne of Oneness.

While we laid the foundations of philanthropy and righteousness and kindness in this world and held high the ensign of "Good Thoughts, Good Words and Good Deeds", you and your ancestors were desert wanderers, who . . . buried your innocent daughters alive. How dare you Arabs who have no regard for God's creatures, who mercilessly put people to the sword, who mistreat your women and bury your daughters alive, who attack caravans and are highway robbers, who commit murder, who kidnap women and spouses, presume to preach the worship of God to us, who are above these evils?You tell me to cease the worship of fire and to worship "Allah-u-Akbar" instead! We Iranians are by the light of fire reminded of the Light of God.The radiance and the sun-like warmth of fire exuberates our hearts, and the pleasant warmth of it brings our hearts and spirits closer together, that we may be philanthropic, kind and considerate; that gentleness and forgiveness may become our way of life,and that thereby the Light of God may shine on in our hearts.Our God is the Great Ahuramazda. . . .

We are nothing like you.We, in the name of Ahuramazda, practice compassion and love and goodness and righteousness and forgiveness, and care for the dispossessed and the unfortunate.But you, in the name of your "Allah-u-Akbar" commit murder, create misery and subject people to suffering! Tell me truly who is to blame for your misdeeds?Your "Allah-u-Akbar" who orders genocide, plunder and destruction, or you who do these things in his name? Or both?You, who have spent all your days in brutality and barbarity, have now come out of your desolate deserts resolved to impose, by the blade and by conquest, the worship of "Allah-u-Akbar" on a people who have for thousands of years been civilizedand have relied on culture and knowledge and art as mighty supports.

What have you, in the name of your "Allah-u-Akbar", taught these armies of Islam besides destruction and pillage and murder that you now presume to summon others to your "Allah-u-Akbar"?Today, my people's fortunes have changed. Their armies, who were subjects of Ahuramazada, have now been defeated by the Arab armies of "Allah-u-Akbar".And they are being forced, at the point of the sword, to convert to the god by the name of"Allah-u-Akbar" and offer him prayers in Arabic since your Arabic god only understands Arabic.I advise you to return to your lizard infested deserts. Do not let loose upon our cities your cruel barbarous Arabs who are like rabid animals.Refrain from the murder of my people.Refrain from pillaging my people.Refrain from kidnapping our daughters in the name of your "Allah-u-Akbar".Refrain from these crimes and evils.We Aryans are a forgiving people, a kind and well-meaning people. Wherever we go, we sow the seeds of goodness, amity and righteousness. And this is why we have the capacity to overlook the crimes and the misdeeds of your Arabs.Stay in your desert with your "Allah-u-Akbar", and do not approach our cities; for horrid is your belief and brutish is your conduct.

Yazdgerd Saasaani
Shahshah of the Persian Empire
For the Farsi text click on this link:
//kavehsara.com/Yazdgerd.html

P.S. In less than 100 years, Muslim warriors conquered lands for Islam from Persia to Spain. Muslims then pushed further into Europe. Their incursion into Western Europe was stopped in France. Their invasion from the east was finally halted at the gates of Vienna
//crf-usa.org/bria/bria20_1b.htm

al-tabari

al-tabari was a sunni persian historian who wrote in arabic. he was actually not pro-arab, and even though he was sunni, he did not have much good to say about the "rightly guided caliphs" (abu bakr, umar, uthman, etc.).

He presented history from the sources that were available to him, and the science of history present at the time.

You wrote:

"but piousness became the "Emir of Persia" and took residence in the Royal Palace of Ctesiphon after the Arab victory over Persians?"

But then you claim al-Tabari wrote:

" He did not own a house, but instead rested under the shade of trees. He used to say that he was surprised to observe so many people spending all their life for the lower world, without a thought for the inevitable death which will take them from the world one day."

And while I hate to make this analogy, but you claim Salman betrayed his country by siding with the "Arab" enemies (you are racists by the way, we are all from one human family, from One God), against the Persians.

How many Persians (Iranians) do you know today that would help the US/Britain/Israel attack against Iran? They are usually the same ones that bash Salman. Yet they are the first to attack Iran with the wolves of the world.

Ironic, no? 

Hey mama, what's up?

What kind of infatuation do you have with quantum physics? Could you come up with another example the next time you're replying?

"Why are we, Iranians, so gullible and the same time phony?"

The answer is because we have people like you.... Are you sure that you
are not Haji Agha?

Re: Dariushabadi

You and the IRI are the traitors for bashing IRAN and its people. Islam has not given Iran independence, it has given Iran misery. It is you, and I mean YOU, as in Dariushabadi, who is raping Iran.

Dariushabadi

Paul Wolfowitz called and asked that I respond to your comments. Being a neocon soldier, I obviously had to obey and respond!

The topic was a historical and not a political one. I for one will not be drawn into a political debate as that is neither my interest nor intention. That being said, there is no denying history, sir. It is what it is, and no amount of insult, name calling and screaming will change it. If you have historical accounts that differ from what I have stated please provide them and include your sources. If you have sources that show that Persians rose up against the Sassanid Empire, dropped their weapons and did not fight the Arab invaders, please provide your sources. To that end, I suggest that you read "The History of al-Tabari, Volume XIV, the Conquest of Iran", State University of New York Press, 1994. Al-Tabari was pro Arab and essentially quotes all Arab sources in his writings, but even though he liens that way, you can see the resistence of Persians to the Arab invasion. Also, as I have said in the past, in addition to reading linear history, one has to also use deductive reasoning to reach conlusions that are not readily apparent in historical texts, as history is often written by the victors and is not always what it ppaers to be on its face.

Also, for a general overview of the various phases of Iran's history, you can check out a website that is put together by Khodadad Rezakhani's called www.iranologie.com. It's a pretty good summation of the various chapters of Iran's history...although I don't think that it talks about wars, but I am not sure. Khodadad an I have had our disagreements on this site, but he appears to be a good, knowledgable Iran historian and hats off to him for his efforts!

You are the traitors

You are all the traitors for bashing Islam, when the enemies of Iran are bashing Islam just so they can beat the drums of war and get their own people to support a war against Iran and kill millions of our people.

You are the traitors, you are the enemies of Iran for bashing Islam like the neo-conservatives, the evangelicals and the republicans.

Have you even realized that you and the neo-conservatives are one and the same? You both want Iran that is subservient to the US (like at the time of the Shah), and Islam is what stands in your way. Islam is what keeps Iran in the region as powerful and independent.

You rather Iran be like the Arab states, SECULAR AND A PUPPET. You are all vatanforoosh.

Unfortunately you cannot have one or the other. Even Turkey which is secular and doesn't want to be a puppet is now struggling away from internal collapse because the countries economy is struggling because of EU restrictions, etc.

Give me a break. WE NEED INDEPENDENCE and ISLAM has given Iran that independence since 1979. The regime needs to be reformed, not removed so that you warmmongers can come back and rape the iranian people in the name of secularism and dictatorship (shah-han-shahee).

SALMAN FARSI THE TRAITOR

Anyone aiding an enemy is traitor, Arabs were enemies of Iran so if Salman helped the Arab invaders then he was for sure a treasonous traitor. So are all the revolutionaries traitors for their shameful support of Khomeini, the most evil and notorious enemy of Iran, as we can see from the daily fruits of the Islamic revolution. Also the Mojahedin Khalq (MEK) are traitors for helping Saddam Hussein kill Iranians during the Iran Iraq war. In conclusion technically Salman and MEK have many similarities.

John Carpenter: You Have Got To be Kidding Me!!!!

Shabbanoo "married" Hussien?!!!!! Are you serious? Shahbanoo was three years old at the time of she was captured by the Arab invaders. She was given to Ali as war booty and was carried off to Madina. She was then kept in the Ali household and was given to his son Hussein as his wife when she was twelve. I don't think that the poor girl had a choice!!!! As far as Yazdgird's son "son" is concerned, I really do not recall reading about him, but at the time of the Arab invasion Yazdgird was not more than 20 years old. How old could his "son" have been (even if he had a son)? I don't think that he would have been okd enough to "convert" and "abandon his claim to the Persian throne"!!!!!!

Also, the kind of psuedo-history that you advocate is the Arab revisionist nonsense about Persians "overthrowing" the Sassanid dynasty that we have heard time and time again. History tells us otherwise. Read my previous comments below. Also, read some history. Persians fought the Arabs for at least three years, in multiple battles and in multiple geographic locations, culminating in the battle of Nahavnd which took place almost two years after the battle of Qadissiyeh. Even after the loss at Nahavand, which the Arabs called Fath-al-Fotooh (victory of victories), the Persians atill fought the Arabs in Khoozestan under the command of General Hormozan.

Iranians are awake now; Islam was a mistake for Iran

We Iranians are for Iranian culture and heritage with acceptance of modernity.

What about Shah'Banoo

Shah'banoo married Mohammad's grandson. Imam Husayn married Yazdegird III only daughter. Yazdigerd III only son converted to Islam. That was the king after Yazdigird III death. Was the last crown prince who converted to Islam and abandoned his right to the monarchy and the Sassanid dynasty also a traitor. Keep in mind, most Iranians converted. It wasn't betrayal, it was an overthrow by Iranians of a system that did not work. The Sassanid dynasty, Zoroastrianism was an impediment to Iranians of the time. The first converted to Sunni Islam and then later to Shia Islam. And today, it is very different from 700 A.D., 1600 A.D. and so on. Let us deal with 2007.

Salman was a philosopher from a rich family in Iran. He left Iran to search for God. Could you blame him? Iran in the 600's AD was boring. And he was from a very wealthy family. Probably more wealthy than the ancestors of anyone that visits this site. So, before you pass judgement on Salman Farsi or Roozbeh, maybe you should learn more about him. He is not that interesting. His life would be similar to Joseph or Moses in the Old Testament. Moses and Joseph are heros in the Old Testament. Maybe, Salman should be an Iranian hero.
Let us face it are you attacking a faith or politics/economics?
Please be specific. The Safavids were Shias. The Seljuks were Sunnis.

Janghayeh ZARGARI

Traitors are ruling Iran , RIGHT NOW

Would they prefer that Iranians discuss Salman or Them?

no need to think about that answer, right?

So, Lets fast forward in the time Tunnel now:

Salman....Safavid....Mosadegh...Shah.....Khamenei:

Good . Today is December 12 2007 

Now that we are at it...

Could you tell me if "Leili" was a male or female?! I heard also rumors that Plato was indeed gay. Could you guys check on that!

True answer is:

4) He is dead.

1,300 years ago, mind you. This means that

a) There is no way at the moment to know for sure. All you can do is speculate. As such,

b) It does not matter.

Move on.

More Clarification

Just wanted to clear a couple of errors. I just remembered that Kobad, II's sisters were Pourandokht and Azarmidokht (not Irandokht). Also, at one point, I referred to Kobad, II and Kobad, III. That is an error as well. There is no Kobad III.

Clarification of Previous Comment

I just want to clarify my comment below. As you can see by my comment, I am not a fan of Salman. But truth be told, while he was an important (perhaps even a motivating factor) in the Arab’s advance on Persia, he was obviously not the main reason. The Sassanid Empire was in trouble, but not because of its “decadence” as Arab historians post Islam have propagandized. The whole notion of the Sassanids being decadent implies that Arabs, in turn, were noble, pious people who “rescued” the people of Persia from this monstrosity that was ruling them. The Sassanid dynasty was in trouble not because of decadence, but because of internal conflict. Yazdgird III was only in power for about 4 years when the Arabs began their assault. He was 19 or 20 years old. Prior to him taking the throne at 15, the Empire had gone through several rulers in a period of a few years (4, I think) after Kobad II, the last “stable” (for lack of a better word) king before Yazdgird II. The first being Mehr-Hasis, who ruled on behalf of a two year old son of Kobad III. Then a Persian general assassinated Mehr-Hasis, killed the boy king and took over reign in Persia (I think that that general’s name was Shar-Baz. But I’m writing all of these from memory from books that I read quite a long time ago, so forgive me if I get the names or the dates wrong). The general himself was then killed by his own troops after two months as punishment for unjustly taking the throne (his body was actually tied to a horse and dragged in the streets of Ctesiphon). After him, two of Kobad’s sisters, Pourandokht and Irandokht ruled as kings (yes we had female kings (or queens?)), both of whom died in a very short period of time (one of natural causes it is believed and the other probably assassinated). After all of these events, Yazdgird, III, who was being raised in obscurity in the old Persian capital of Istakhr was brought in and made king. Naturally, due the weakness of the central government, there were multiple rebellions all around Persia which the teenage king had to deal with. It was against this backdrop that the Arab assault on Persia took place. Any objective observer can therefore see that the deck was stacked against the Persians. So, we should not blame Salman, or any other individual, for the Arab victory, but we should look at the totality of circumstances in a historical context.

Worship of the enemies of Iran

It is sad to see how some of my own countrymen devotingly worship Iran's enemies. Be it Salmane mal'oon, or Ali or hossein, and today khomeini.

I cannot comprehend how this attitude of "khod bakhtegi" is nurtured and developed in them. They have taken our country hostage.

I mean think about a jew for example ending up to worship Hitler.

Stop brutal suppression of discussion about Islam

As soon as topic of Islam surfaces, usual suspect crowd of suffocating voices and discussions show up!I am not surprised. This brutal suppression has been happening in Iran for last 1400 years and we are still witnessing it in Iran and now all over the world.
This is what I have for you Moslems, either engage and have answer for all bullcraps you have been spewing out or just shut up and allow truth speak for itself.
Remember that internet can not be savagely crushed with force of sword and bomb. Now, we can safely without being lashed, stoned, jailed, flogged, tortured, raped, and killed talk about Islam cult or any other cults.

Salmon e Farsi was Muhammad's mastermind in devising this Islam cult. He is a traitor and creator of the most barbaric cult in history of mankind.

Mad because of unrequited love!

Salman had fallen hopelessly in love with his uncle's daughter but was refused her hand because he did not measure up to expectations.
Afterwards he became crazy, left Iran and started to wander the ancient world and went to places such as India etc. in order to drown his intense sorrow. As they say travelling helps soothe depression.
Once he met Mohammad he was a highly learned person who had seen most of the world of that time which was worth seeing and had accumulated lots of experience. For instance Islam was a kind of synthesis of previous religions speaking in broad terms from Zoroastrianism to Juadism to Sikhs etc.
He saw his contribution to the attack on Iran as an opportunity to exact revenge for having been refused his eternal love and been left emotionally crippled.
Mohammad was married to Khadijeh who was a wealthy woman trading with the Romans. The Persians had blocked all major trade routes to the East for Rome. The Romans got to know the Arabs by trying to get to India and East by circumventing Iran.
So all the circumstances were right for Salman to get back to Persian elite (he was one) and also to make a name for himself.

Salman Farsi

To all of you who praise Salman, can you please tell us why a man who apparently had no ambitions but piousness became the "Emir of Persia" and took residence in the Royal Palace of Ctesiphon after the Arab victory over Persians? Can you also tell us why he was not a traitor when he was one of the high ranking officers under Sa'ad in the battle of Qadissiyeh against his countrymen?

Sources: Bukhari & Tabari- Actually, for those who immediately ask for sources in order to discredit (but strangely, never ccite your own sources) here is a description from Tabari quoted from the following website (which is pro-Salman!!!) //www.naqshbandi.org/chain/3.htm:

At-Tabari recounts that in the year 16 A.H. the Muslim army turned to the Persian front. In order to confront the Persian king at one point the Muslim army found itself on the opposite bank of the great Tigris River. The commander of the army, Sa`d Ibn Abi Waqqas, following a dream, ordered the entire army to plunge into the rushing river. Many people were afraid and hung back. Sa`d, with Salman by his side, prayed first: "May Allah grant us victory and defeat His enemy." Then Salman prayed: "Islam generates good fortune. By Allah, crossing rivers has become as easy for the Muslims as crossing deserts. By Him in whose hand lies Salman's soul, may the soldiers emerge from the water in the same numbers in which they entered it." Sa`d and Salman then plunged into the Tigris. It is reported that the river was covered with horses and men. The horses swam and when they tired the river floor seemed to rise up and support them until they regained their breath. To some it seemed that the horses rode effortlessly on the waves. They emerged on the other bank, as Salman had prayed, having lost nothing from their equipment but one tin cup, and no one having drowned.

They went on to take the Persian capital. Salman acted as spokesman and said to the conquered Persians: "I have the same origin as you. I shall be compassionate toward you. You have three options. You may embrace Islam, then you will be our brethren and you will have the same privileges and obligations as we. Or you may pay the Jizyah tax and we will govern you fairly. Or we will declare war on you." The Persians, having witnessed the miraculous crossing of the Muslim army, accepted the second alternative.

Salman Al-Farsi was eventually appointed governor of that region. He was the commander of 30,000 Muslim troops. Yet, he was very humble. He lived from his own manual labor. He did not own a house, but instead rested under the shade of trees. He used to say that he was surprised to observe so many people spending all their life for the lower world, without a thought for the inevitable death which will take them from the world one day.

What a great Iranian!!!!

Traitors have come and gone . . .

First off, with no due respect shashedam be on (s) ke badaz ismeh on madar jendeh mohammadeh bachez baz gozashtee.

Now, moving on to the issue of Salmon - Persians had exhausted their resources with repeated Wars with the Roman Empire. This was not a flaw in their politics, but a reality as the Romans continued to push deeper into their territory. Salmon was an opportunist who had seen the written in the "sand" and changed sides to benefit himself.

Does that make him a traitor? Yes, but "mobedans" of those times or the Sassanian Mullahs were traitors, also.

Don't forget the Arabs only held Iran for 200 years, compared to 800 years they held Spain. But, look at Spain - most evidence of their Islamic past wiped clean. The real traitors were and are the Iranian Arabzadeh like the c&*ksucker above that adopted Islam as their own. (s) tou konet!

If you believe in payback, I suppose the Monghols were our payback - as, Ghangis said in the Samarkand Mosque while on horseback, I have come to punish you for not being good "muslims" by your God.

It is time for another payback!

dariusabadi

the sane voice among the cacophony of secular Iranians.

Books please

Can anyone with a strong opinion, either way, about Salmon list all the books that he/she has read about Salmon and the history of the time?
Could you please list the book names and authors?

If you are passing an opinion about a quantum physics problem, shouldn’t you have taken some courses in quantum physics?
Why is history different?

Why are we, Iranians, so gullible and the same time phony?

salman al-farsi

so if not for salman al-farsi, Iran will be the greatest nation on the face of earth where the aryan men could drink and fuck and be civilized. If not for Salman al-Farsi, Iran will be an utopia for Aryans and we could easily befriend the western world and live like them.

cut the crap will you.

Instead of calling him traitor,try examining your beloved Shah.

Traitor

he was a traitor, pure and simple.!