I do -- for 2 years

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Jahanshah Javid
by Jahanshah Javid
13-May-2009
 

I was having lunch with my ex-girlfriend in Washington DC the other day and telling her what a nightmare of a husband I was during my marriage. She couldn't believe my stories.

"You should never get married again," she said.

"No kidding," I said. "I came to that conclusion a long time ago. I'm just not made for it."

Honestly, I don't think I'm ever going to get married again. I shouldn't. In addition to not having any of the qualifications to be a husband, there's hardly anything about marriage that appeals to me.

Is it to build a family? I don't want to have any more kids and even if I did, I can't. I've had a vasectomy.

Is it for love and companionship until death do us part? I don't think anything lasts forever, maybe with the exception of love itself, and only the thought of it. To be attached to another person for the rest of my life terrifies me. I need to feel free and any obligation or responsibility towards another person will drive me nuts. Sooner rather than later I will run away.

Which reminded me of one of my favorite topics of conversation. I shared it with my ex as I have with everyone else I meet.

A couple of years ago someone told me, or I read somewhere, that in some state in Germany, they have a marriage law, or they have proposed one, that's quite revolutionary: Marriages automatically expire after two years unless both the husband and wife wish to renew it.

Think about it. You fall in love, get married and live together for two years. If everything goes beautifully, you renew your marriage vows. If not, you go your separate ways.

I still wouldn't get married even if it was just for two years. But I think this let's-try-for-two-years-and-see-if-it-works is a great idea for those who wish to tie the knot. It takes away the "forever" aspect of traditional marriage and ends it without the need for divorce, which can be legally difficult and emotionally devastating. At the same time, those who are still in love after two years and want to continue living together, can do so.

Everyone who's heard this has loved it. What do you think?

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more from Jahanshah Javid
 
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Ananyous everyday

by KouroshS on

I am not in any state of denial and i am not INSISTing in taking myself as a refrence.

 


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Sheesahki

by Anonymous Everyday (not verified) on

I am not trying go anywhere with this. I am simply illustrating my point by using some examples others might be able to follow. I am recounting my observations. Rest assured I am not trying to sell you anything. You are free to believe what you want even if you insist on only taking yourself as a reference.

Anonymous Fish
Thank you. You got my point about the historical and cultural context of this issue. It is baffling the state of denial some people are in.


anonymous fish

sheeshaki

by anonymous fish on

oh absolutely.  the man was (is) expected to select a partner who would support his agenda... his work image so to speak... be a good doctor's wife... etc. etc.  in rural late 20th century america, one might select a wife if she was from good breeding stock.  and YES, the term as used with purchasing farm animals!!!  it really didn't have a whole lot to do with love but advantages of this particular partner over another.   my mom's family are a farming people from michigan.  for the most part, they married for convenience (and in several cases, for the farmland abutting theirs.  except my mom... she married for looooove.  :-)  the only one who left the bosum of the family.  i'm not sure they've forgiven my father yet and they've been married for almost 60 years.

and yes, i was lucky.  it was taking a big chance.  you have noooooo idea...lol.   i think you're just beginning to discover yourself and your partner in 2 years.  and believe me... you're discovering yourself as well.  your own opinions, wants and needs change over time.  if they didn't, we'd all be in a big mess. 

the perfect woman:  ;-0


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AF

by KouroshS on

Most Definitely was the case? again. How can you be sure? Are you just saying this so as to pound me into submission?:)

It certainly is the case, even today that there is pressure on both men and women to make a good marriage. Why would you think that only women are subject of such an expectation. But to address your point, I know for a fact that the same conditions that you brought up apply in the same exact manner to men as well and they are also expected to meed the burden of requirements set by their family their society and their cultural background, which in my opinion creates more trouble and obstacles, and it really gets in the way of having a healthy marriage. 

You say that you went against your core values and beliefs. Well, i'd like to say that you took a chance on this man and hey it worked out perfectly. All marriages are like that and at the end of the day it is a big risk all of us convince ourselves to take.  I love this idea because it simply gives you more time to know one another and get a feel for each others' ups and downs. I love th eidea of Husband and wife as well and the fact that this allows to keep that title makes it look even more fantastic to me.

I am glad that you have managed to maintain your sense of independence and womanness:)

 


anonymous fish

sheeshaki

by anonymous fish on

not to belabor the point... especially in that it is a moot one, but you are way too vague about it "might have been".  it most definitely WAS the case.  "was" being the operative word.  it most definitely is NOT the case now.  except in a very subtle way of course.  there is and i think almost always will be some generalized modus operandi for getting married.  if you go to a particular school for example, it somewhat sets the pace for who you are, what your interests are and who you expect to socialize and interact with in the future.  you will tend to date and/or marry men within those parameters.  i'm obviously older than many of you so i'm relating to an era i'm familiar with.  marriages were perceived to be "good" when it was "socially" agreed that all conditions were met.  good education, good family, good manners.  you can't image the pressure put on young women to "make" a good marriage. 

i think i like the idea of a two (or 5 or 7) year "renewable" marriage.  might not work for me personally but neither does living together.  i see the value in it.  i might even wish i had done the same thing.  but it went against the core of what i believe in.  and call me old fashioned... but i LOVE the idea of husband and wife.  i feel it an honor being his wife.  but if the marriage was not respectful or satisfying to me as a human being, not just a puppet, then i'd be hauling ass big time.  i have no problem being in charge of my own future.  :-)


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Anaymous fishie

by KouroshS on

Well, what you are describing is not really diffferent from A somewhat forced marriage. And again, no i don't believe that was the case. How can you be so sure? IF you are talking about what took place in the 18th and 19th centuries, i guess that some what the trend back then, but come on, our focus is definitely not on those times and their traditions. They did not even have a correctt and reasonable definition for marriage back then now did they?

 


Kaveh Nouraee

Then and Now

by Kaveh Nouraee on

Then: Marriages were arranged.

Now: They're catered.


anonymous fish

chosen or not...

by anonymous fish on

sheeshaki.  you don't think historically that marriages are arranged??  i can absolutely attest that in the US and NOT so long ago (relatively speaking of course), that arranged marriages WERE the norm.  a woman had very little say over who she was going to marry.  and that's just regional.  countries/nations have been joined by arranged marriages.  not to be confused with "forced marriages", arranged marriages have deep roots in europe and the middle east.  but i stress again that this is not the case in modern times.  i'm simply pointing out again that historically, this is true.


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Ananymous everyday

by KouroshS on

 

I don't see where you are going by bringing celebrities into this. The reason why relationships fall apart in the world of celebrities could be many and it may not have anything to do by winning an award at the oscars. I am not denying the fact that an intelligent man or woman definitely needs someone on the same level, But you are the one who needs to go out and be really, i mean REALLy out there to find out for yourself that you are mistaken. You are just pushing this idea and i just do not buy it.

Historically and Culturally??? please do tell me what culture and in what nations's history such trends have been a societal norm? A women can NOT just be chosen if she does not accept to be chosen and similarly a man can not choose if his Love interest dashes his hopes and dreams by kicking him to the curb.

 


Flying Solo

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by Flying Solo on

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anonymous fish

Solo

by anonymous fish on

very good observation.  i agree with the essence of your comment in that behind every good man stands a great woman.  i think even the most successful man would be limited by a inferior mate.  that, of course, goes both ways.

Men can't get an intelligent woman to marry them, otherwise they would.  not sure what you mean by this.  in my personal experience, the majority of my strong intelligent friends are married to strong intelligent partners... men and women alike.  i can honestly think of only one couple where the male is clearly inferior to the female... or vice versa.

i think anon everyday was talking in generalities.  because he is right... historically and culturally, woman have been chosen as partners and historically and culturally have had very little to say about marriage.  it wasn't all that long ago that the majority of marriages were arranged in the US, and of course, elsewhere.  we all know that not to be the case now.

i hope kouroush is correct.  i'm a little doubtful myself but it's encouraging to hear a man actually say it.  i think it's a very bitter pill to swallow... for a man to not feel threatened by an intellectually or financing secure woman.  it's NOT a criticism of men per se but an acceptance of the fact then men have always been promoted as being the superior sex.  it ain't news people... this has been going on since the cave man.  but... progress has been made.  and hopefull will continue! 


Flying Solo

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by Flying Solo on

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Kourosh You need to get out

by Anonymous Everyday (not verified) on

Kourosh
You need to get out a bit more to realize that what I've said has not grown old. Good for you if you are one of those men who do not feel threatened by the intelligence and success of their wives. If that's so you are still very much in the minority. Have you ever wondered why usually the relationship of female Oscar winners falls apart after they have won the award, especially when their partners are left out? Just think about it, I am not imagining these things. What men say they like and what they really want are two different things. An intelligent and successful woman like Michelle for example needs a man like Obama who is equally successful and self-confident. Unfortunately there are not many of those around.

To answer your question if women deserve the men they get. It depends on how free they were in their choice of their husbands. Historically and culturally men choose and women get chosen. So yes, maybe some modern emancipated women deserve the men they choose but you and I know that does not include all women.


Monda

JJ dear..

by Monda on

I second Ebi A. I have been witnessing many marriages that have lasted happily for decades. The trial marriage would work for some couples, true. But I believe that the real ingredient in a prosperous marriage is not much about the piece of paper anyway. Rather, the good marriages that I see, are about commitment to the partnership and strengthening the original bonds, supporting partners in their choices or directions.

Now that I'm here: I don't find zanzalili outdated or dysfunctional. The art is to make it work, effortlessly, for all people involved, nah?

I like your blog topics!


Jaleho

Dear Javadagha,

by Jaleho on

You know gay marriage is allowed in so some states these days. You might consider that, given your GENERAL sentiments regarding men and women, YOU don't need to go against marriage itself!


Javadagha

Great idea, but won't happen . . .

by Javadagha on

This is a great idea.  But in my experience NO woman will accept it.  Women want marriage for financial and emotional security.  Women will do anything to get married.  Also, lawyers will go against this idea.

I was taken to cleaners even after 2 years of marriage, I went along because she was a gold digger, lazy, and all she cared was talk over the phone and shop.  In most marriages that I have seen women nag, sleep more, eat more, complain more, talk more, and shop more.

The majority of men lose in marriage even those who are in it.  I must admit that lazy men prefer marriage (again my experience).

Whoever I am meeting wants marriage.  My luck :-(


Flying Solo

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by Flying Solo on

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MiNeum71

Dear "Flying Solo",

by MiNeum71 on

We are always on the same page, although I am much younger :)))

There is an undeniable pull, but not because of the genetic bond, but because of functional reasons: Children are dependent to their parents´ love in able to survive, this is a sample you can never get rid off (this is the same also to adopted children who don´t have the same blood), so Khoun is only a construct, a convention.

What is this Say it and watch jaws drop?

 


Flying Solo

So we agree:)

by Flying Solo on

MiNeum71,

Sounds to me like we are on the same page then.

Dooste Aziz - you can disown your parent, you can disown your kid. But you can't deny the fact that they are your flesh and blood. It is biology - not religion.

I agree with you that there is no law that says you HAVE to like  your parents because they gave birth to you, or you HAVE to like your spouse because you had a kid with him/her.  Of course nobody should tolerate mistreatment.  But there is the undeniable pull of the genetic bond - in Persian they call it "Khoun".  Again - it is biology - genes, chromosomes, roots etc etc.  You hate a parent, a sibling, a spouse, an ex spouse? Well - guess what - part of that hate lands right back on your court. 

Join us at chat. You'll be amazed at the pull of friendship and love (no marriage certificate required. :)

 

Say it and watch jaws drop.


MiNeum71

Dear "Flying Solo",

by MiNeum71 on

I agree with you completely, it´s not easy to live with someone you don´t (particullary) like. I can leave a girlfriend immediately, but not a wife. I can also leave my parents or relatives. This image of flesh and blood is a very religious and very conservative one, not very intelligent. If I don´t like my parents, I kick them out of my life, why not? If they haven´t been kind parents, then they don´t deserve kind children. I know it´s very difficult to detach from one's parents, but grown up people should be able to do that. And parents can´t always say We gave birth to you ... shit, what´s this? I´m not talking about a bad day or one or two unpleasant situations, but emotionally closed relationships. Let it flow ... 

Marriage is Iranian (also American), but not (Western) European. At least all (100%) the Iranian girls I met are already married or are seeking to marry. But maybe I should start meeting intelligent, sensible and lovely Iranian women ... :)

Marriage is not a life philosophy for lovers, therefore many marriages fail in Europe. Austria, Germany, Sweden, divorce rate nearly 50%. Why? They marry for love. What for? Nobody knows. Marriage and love is a contradiction anyway. Love needs space and freedom to grow, move, flourish; marriage kills this necessary environment.

When marrying for love gets you buried alive ...


Flying Solo

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by Flying Solo on

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Flying Solo

Good point

by Flying Solo on

MiNeum71 -

You are absolutely right.  But nobody is talking about a piece of paper. It's one's word! You give it. You stick by it. You do whatever it takes not to break it.  It's easy to live with someone you love -every day. But I ask you , do you love yourself quite the same every day?  Don't you have off days - sometimes off periods? And do you give up on yourself - just because you are having a bad day. :)

Plus a spouse is family - as much as flesh and blood.  Think on that for a while. How many of us give so much more to a family member we don't particularly like. A difficult mother, an annoying brother etc etc.  Same with a spouse.

Whichever way we choose to conduct our lives MiNeum71 - character comes into it.  As long as we stay true to ourselves, then there is nothing to worry about.  There are no trophies being handed out at the pearly gates for staying in a 'tepid' marriage or for having chased love every which way.  Afterall the only person looking back at you in the mirror is YOU.

Say it and watch jaws drop.


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Ananymous everyday I

by KouroshS (not verified) on

Ananymous everyday

I seriously believe that you read too much into this Inability to handle Intelligence women. You criticize Kaveh and Alip For bringing up a concept that has grown old, Yet you are demonstrating the same exact thing. First off, we don't know for a fact if he will not want her once she starts making changes to her life style. I have to agree with Jahanshah in what he said in one his early posts, that as human beings we change, and that change also applies throughout the course of a relationship. Who knows. he just may welcome than change inhis wife and that may help solidify and re-strenghten the realtionship all over again.

Secondly. It is totally absurd to say that men always deserve the wives they choose! what about women? does the saying goes both ways?
Who could possibly and really know for a fact thatthe person that is being chosen as a partner in a marriage or a relationship, is the righ one until after the passage of a certain lenght of time?

Sadra

What kind of a relationship would that be? Where is opportunity for the couple to really get to know all the details about one another as much as possible, if they keep it inside a bubble? How would they know they are ready to have kids, if they contniue like this? As monogamous as they can be!

I think this is a great idea and it gives both people an opportunity to know exactly what they want from one another and from the relationship. It is not so much about the concept of the "deadline" per se, as it is about being open-minded and honest about their chances and their relationships perspectives. WIthin a couple of years a couple should know where they stand on everything and know what and how they feel so there really is no need for unnecessary pressure.If one is really willing to hold on no matter what, he or she will be forced to examine his/her reasons, given that the other person wants the opposite. If they feel like they want more time, Then that is what they do and take more time.
Of course your idea is a perfect one, Only if it is not being practiced by True adults!


Organic NUTritionist

I love love...

by Organic NUTritionist on

Call me a hopeless romantic, but I believe love and being in love can last for as long as a whole lifetime...


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No way!

by Anonymousnono (not verified) on

sounds to me like 2 year period sigheh!


MiNeum71

Dear "Flying Solo",

by MiNeum71 on

I enjoyed your comments very much. I agree to most of your words.

But (there is always a but) you wrote: ... the function of marriage, which ... has everything to do with character, substance and ooh that dreaded word - commitment. And to my opinion this is totally wrong. Marriage is only a pseudo-commitment, for men a guarantee for sex, for women a guarantee for starting a family. Not more. 

Making effort to have a loving relationship every day without being forced by a paper or any other expectations has much more to do with character and committment.


MiNeum71

Dear "Kaveh Nouraee",

by MiNeum71 on

Sorry, I just wondered how someone could write or believe that bullshit, being read in the article and in the comments.

But anyway, marriage is a relict of the monarchies and later on the bourgeoisie. Today men and women both work and earn money and are independent, so why marrying?

Flying Solo wrote: A smart first wife ... sue for compensation in lieu of 25, 30, 35 years of service rendered: cooking, cleaning, housekeeping, childbirth, child rearing, entertaining, travelling, being on call 24/7 and of course intercourse. Call it prostitution - call it fair exchange ...

If a couple is on an equal footing, no compensations must be sued afterwards, so no contract is necessary. As Flying Solo wrote further: It has nothing to do with love for love needs no contract nor conditions, rules or roles.

Maybe you can tell me, why most of the Iranian women MUST marry. Lack of confidence?


anonymous fish

Solo

by anonymous fish on

your comment reminded me of "first wives club"... a must-see for any new bride... :-0


anonymous fish

t

by anonymous fish on

As to your statement re "go for some new young thang", my observation has been that the better men generally abandon these type of women for a more quality woman, not all too much younger than themselves so to enjoy a sassy, witty, charming woman who is not only good in bed but independent and well rounded.

this at first seems to be contradictory.  if he was a better man, would he have left his wife for a young thing to begin with.  and at what point does he suddenly become "better" and decide he doesn't want the young thing after all, and now wants a more quality woman again.  but if you're talking about a non-married man who first tries the rest, and then wants the best... then fine, i agree with you. 

now.  i go back to the other scenario.  the stay-at-home mom who does provide all those "services" we talk about.  my SIL doesn't do botox...she competes in triathlons.  she doesn't shop for designer clothes... she spends most of her time chasing after 3 boys.  she doesn't have dinner catered... she delivers a PB&J sandwich to my bro when he's on call in the middle of the night.  she doesn't get her nails done... she out there with him on the weekend operating a bob-cat moving rocks around.  she IS financially dependent on him and their marriage DOES work.  and i know for a fact that he has the ultimate respect for her.  he considers her his peer in every way.   it's one of the more functioning marriages i know of.  and it worked for my parents as well.  my mother never felt "less" equal to my father just because he brought home the bacon.  she knew damn well that while it's all fine and dandy to bring it home... someone has got to cook it.  :-))


ebi amirhosseini

Lots of support for "Single" JJ from "Singles' club"..??!!

by ebi amirhosseini on

JJ Jaan

Why not talk about people who lived happily ever after or  "death did part them ",not a court paper?!.Many examples can be found among our parents as well as present generation!.

Yours

22 year old happily married ZZ !.

Ebi aka Haaji