Monda

Call me crazy (and I know

Call me crazy (and I know Kourosh will/does ;) but what emotionally balanced,  sane, self respecting person equates 'giving in' half the time with an 'healthy & happy marriage/relationship'???

Why would i call you crazy? I was not talking within the context of an Unhealthy relationship. I was talking in general terms.

Monda, I completely agree with what you are saying. I definitely vote for resolution over avoidance. But in my experience, a lot of people (men, more so) avoid conflict at any cost not realizing that it just leads to the accumulation of feelings of resentment that at some point will become unresolvable no matter how hard you try.

If I may Jump in here for a sec.  It all depends. Since it is mainly men in our culture, based on my own experience at least, who decide to let it go and "kootah bian" i think many women should recognize the reasons as to why this happens, as opposed to take it to mean that this is necessarily a sign that the "baggage" is still there and it is only a matter of time for things to explode.

Also, I think in our culture as a whole, we shy away from healthy discussion which often involves disagreement and instead of talking and resolving, one side may try to 'appease' by what amounts to 'safsateh'. They often don't realize that this actually offends an intelligent person who believes they have a legitimate objection and if anything, makes them more angry! 

Right and Wrong at the same time. Why should the supposed intelligent person get angry, That was the point i was trying to make at the top.  Appeasing someone does not mean you are trying to shut them up. This should be an automatic conclusion for the "intelligent" party, otherwise nashayad ke namash nahand eenteeleegent... :) That is if their goal is really and truly create a solution to the problem and not just scoring points i.e that i am right and smart but you are wrong and hence by appeasing me you are insulting my intelligence.

 We had a case right here on i.com not too long ago and I couldn't have written the typical Iranian style script any better than it actually went down! But nothing got resolved at the end and people just walked away likely harboring ill feelings. Now if that were to take place in a marriage (and it often does) you can bet that each and every case will show its ugly head later at some point.

No comments:)

No offense to anyone, but I think people who take avoidance over resolution have communication issues, and that may just be limited to their own or their partner's communication skills or may involve issues related to confrontation which they view as necessarily a bad thing and try to avoid. 

Good analysis:) I think younipped it in the proverbial buttocks:)

Avoid "conflicts" at any cost and by any means necessary! LOL

You see we always roll back to the stereotypes. Women "think" men can't express their feelings which is the foundation of a marriage and men think women nag too much! Both equally true! Marriages that "always" avoid conflicts on any and all subjects are in the 50% fail rate category.  BTW the 50% is now increased than 10 or 20 years ago.

In a marriage 8 out of 10 conflicts or arguments are over nothing.  You argue all 10 arguments and let go of the 7 or 8 or more pissing contest arguments. Those are the arguments that you're dammed if you do and dammed if you don't!  Those are arguments about "the feelings"! 

You know these 19 and 20 year olds chit chating on cell phones 24/7 and sending text messages by the second? What do you think they talk about?  They are sharing their feelings and whether or not they are sharing them correctly! Like what did Jason say to Ashley and why Jessica is in love with the wrong man.  They are all "conflict resoluting", in their minds.  They're trying to resolve "things" whereas once they gain more experience they realize they should really try to avoid conflicts in the first place or that Mr. Right or Mrs. Right are the ones who can "put up with you".  The one who can put up with you is in love with you and when "he puts up" with you he is "avoiding a confllict" with you.

Everything is sacred.

They stay at the cost of having a healthy and happy marriage???

Call me crazy (and I know Kourosh will/does ;) but what emotionally balanced,  sane, self respecting person equates 'giving in' half the time with an 'healthy & happy marriage/relationship'???

Monda, I completely agree with what you are saying. I definitely vote for resolution over avoidance. But in my experience, a lot of people (men, more so) avoid conflict at any cost not realizing that it just leads to the accumulation of feelings of resentment that at some point will become unresolvable no matter how hard you try. Also, I think in our culture as a whole, we shy away from healthy discussion which often involves disagreement and instead of talking and resolving, one side may try to 'appease' by what amounts to 'safsateh'. They often don't realize that this actually offends an intelligent person who believes they have a legitimate objection and if anything, makes them more angry!  We had a case right here on i.com not too long ago and I couldn't have written the typical Iranian style script any better than it actually went down! But nothing got resolved at the end and people just walked away likely harboring ill feelings. Now if that were to take place in a marriage (and it often does) you can bet that each and every case will show its ugly head later at some point.

No offense to anyone, but I think people who take avoidance over resolution have communication issues, and that may just be limited to their own or their partner's communication skills or may involve issues related to confrontation which they view as necessarily a bad thing and try to avoid. 

Mouse, if I had to guess by what I've read from you on i.com I'd have NEVER guessed you'd support avoidance! But I like you anyway ;)

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Hi! Mouse,

Thank you for the article link!!!

Delaram Banafsheh (Yolanda)

"Cactus in the Desert"

KouroshS & anonymouse, I have things to say about your comments

and will write some of them here if/when I get time today. 

Monda khanoom

BUt they do! What anannymouse suggests i think is more doable and practical than trying to resolve the situation, since one side may appear reluctant. But at the same time, One downside of Avoidance could be that the women would say to the men (of course it could very well be the other way around too, But whom are we kidding)

"why do you always agree to what i say or what i want? are you not a man?"

Not to mention the Humiliation and  being lectured by friends and family at times...

They stay at the cost of having a healthy and happy marriage.

Otherwise they'd be in the 50%+ that get a divorce.  I wouldn't recommend conflict avoidance to stay in an unhealthy marriage or relationship, which will fail anyway and no matter what.

Conflict avoidance is the key but you have to have the ability and experience to apply it.

Bottom line men and women are just wired differently in so many different ways and areas. So expecting resolutions on different issues is just a fantasy, in my opinion. Ain't happening ;-)

I thought I had seen that report in abcnews at one point and did a quick search for it.  This is not that study but it's interesting:

//abcnews.go.com/Health/story?id=3382746&page=1&CMP=OTC-RSSFeeds0312 

Everything is sacred.

Anonymouse, they stay at what cost?

John Gottman among many relationship researchers have shown, through their longitudinal studies, that many conflict-avoidant individuals stay and experience severe clinical depression multiple times.  I guess it's a matter of choice - if you go by research!

Monda jaan the conflict avoidance group are the 50% that stays

There was a study that showed (of the 50% marriages that don't end up in divorce) the majority of marriages that stay together are the ones where the husbands give in to their wives or otherwise stay away from conflicts. 

This is what works! Unless we want the marriages (or relationships) to fail (go from 50% to 90% failure rate), I'd recommend the model that works.  The rest of solutions have not worked! Anyway, that's my story and I'm sticking to it!

Conflict resolution sounds like a trick question a wife may use on her husband!

PS it's anomymouse or mouse ;-) 

Everything is sacred.

Anonymous,

Those type of partnerships should not even happen in the first place, in my opinion.  In my story though, these partners have been together for 5-6 years and every other aspects of their partnership have worked for them.

KouroshS, thank you for your insight!

and comment to BN. 

vildemose, thanks for the link

It started off alright... I thought it was going into the discussion of beta states :o) 

I believe in conflict avoidance not conflict resolution.

By definition some conflicts can not be resolved and the more you push it or try to resolve it the deeper the hole you (or your partner) is digging! 

Everything is sacred.

BN jaan

First of all I wish you a happy auditioning session:)

I was reading through your comment, When this seemingly minor detail kinda stood out:

We are more sexual and think about sex constantly. That really depends on whom you talk to or which survey or poll result you go by. Frankly i don't think that is true and it is a huge fabrication, That not You, but The "system" has deemed suitable to spread about men as a revealing piece of information about us men. Women think about sex as much, IF NOT LESS, than men.

No matter what, things are changing and are changing for the better. Women are our best mates and our equals. They are our taaje sar and the most important part of all, they are the mothers of our children.

Had you skipped the "no matter" part, I think it would have been more acceptable as a factual statement. Cuz women Can definitely be Evil:) and not exactly our best mates, which makes it necessary to get out while we can. Using Terms such as Taaje sar is exactly soemthing that can turn a relationship "varroone" and be the start of Moseebat. So i would be extremely, Excessively cautious with that.

Monda jan: Great blog and

Monda jan: Great blog and discussion. thanks.

Check out the link below regarding porn:

//kamalifamily.blogfa.com/post-2.aspx

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Dear BN,

     Thank you for your post on Sun Dec 13, 2009 11:17 PM EST.

I like this part:

We hurt but do not show it as much as women do and feel shame when we do things that are wrong.

I hope this part is true:

We are the ones who can love a woman and give our lives to her and to her happiness. The ones who can make them feel like queens. We are the ones who stick around when they are in a bad mood, all cranky,and all crazy and tempremental. We too put up with a lot of shit from them but the difference is that we keep it to ourselves and don't go on bitching about it.

If it is true, that will be very touching!!!!

Thank you!!!! 

Delaram Banafsheh (Yolanda)

"Cactus in the Desert"

shazdeh asdola mirza jan

I just read your post. I am off to a bar with a very beautiful woman. She is auditioning for me and I am auditioning for her. We want to find out if we hate each other or not.

It seems that some women think men are pigs, some think we are bastards, some think we are there just to trick them into bed, some think we are all the same, rotten as hell, made from the same cloth.

What they don't realise, as some one said before, we are fathers, brothers, sons, and also husbands and lovers. We cry and we bleed. We hurt but do not show it as much as women do and feel shame when we do things that are wrong. We however take more chances than women. We are more sexual and think about sex constantly. Not because we go out of our way to do this, but because we are created this way. It is so easy to generalise.  

We are all unique as women are. We really do not differ that much. We are the ones who can love a woman and give our lives to her and to her happiness. The ones who can make them feel like queens. We are the ones who stick around when they are in a bad mood, all cranky,and all crazy and tempremental. We too put up with a lot of shit from them but the difference is that we keep it to ourselves and don't go on bitching about it. 

No matter what, things are changing and are changing for the better. Women are our best mates and our equals. They are our taaje sar and the most important part of all, they are the mothers of our children.

OK Monda jan. How about you Bajenagh? Chat right now?

Every voice counts! Every action counts!

Thanx shazdeh but New University clips put things into proper

perspective for me.  

I am stunned by their energy!

Thank you for your participation here.

Monda jaan: if you want to hear the truth, come to the chat room

No telling others though!

shazde that was a no-brainer

I get that if there has been a looong time then you can even get intimate with women that may not exactly qualify as respectable, intelligent or anything else. Was that BN's point? If so, we all knew That!  

But I thought we were not talking about one night stands or even two nighters.  

bajenagh naghi, what a great timing! :o)

ekhtiaar daareen, majless doostaanass :o)

Clarifying question:  Why is it that you and shazde and perhaps many other men would choose to get close to a woman that they Hate? And then I still wonder about MR and AC, etc.

How about just put love and hate aside, and at least stick to women that you Like?  Are those difficult to come by, where you reside?! 

mannya2001It's always about compatibility even if you move to NZ

I am glad that match-making sites have brought this piece to your attention.

Traditional may work for you but not for another person.  So compatibility in goals and values is always key. (I can imagine)

Yes, maybe and never ... it all depends on how long it has been!

Monda jaan: Ti Jaana Ghoorbaan ... Az Aa Sakhta Soalaan Amana Nava Kodan.

shazdeh asdola mirza jan

Az sobh taa haalaa zire meez ghayem shode boodam. Khoda omret bede baradar. Ina mikhastan man e badbakhto jerro vaajer bekonan o yek loghmam konan. Ghalat konam ke dige man zer bezanam! lol.

bahbah shazde so nice of you to stop by!

Since you reminded us of bajenagh's philosophy, may I ask you a question? How much hate can a man tolerate while having a fantastic time with a woman?  Is there ghahtee yeh eshgh around you men?  Is that why you would even enjoy being with a woman that you Hate?!

Furthermore, can you and bajenagh (namaayandeye aghaayoon) sleep with Anne Coultier, Maryam Rajavi or even Mother Theresa (RIP), And enjoy yourselves?

My question is a genuine inquiry in reaction to the confusion that I have been hit by since I read BN's and now your words of wisdom. I am not being facetious.

باجناق جان: با این همه سن و سال و تجربه، هنوز یاد نگرفتی‌ که،

به جنس لطیف هر چیزی میشه گفت، الا حقیقت؟

به خدا اگه بخاطر معرفتت نبود، میذاشتم همین وسط میدون، تک و تنها بمونی و طایفه النسا تا شام قیامت چیز کوبت کنند! تا تو باشی‌ و راز مگو فاش نکنی‌:

"هزار مرتبه سعدی تو را نصیحت کرد

که راز محفل ما را به مجلسی نبری!"

خود یارو که اصل کار بود، خودشو زد به اون راه که، "ایت ایز نات یو ... ایت ایز می‌".  خوب مرد حسابی‌، تو رو سننه که بیایی صاف و پوست کندشو بذاری رو میز، که جمالشو عشق کن؟

امیدوارم که این واسه همه آقایون و آقا پسرا، درس عبرتی باشه:

"زبان در دهان پاسبان سر است ..."

Absolutely Monda,

I rather like your term, the conflict resolution. Also an excellent point you brought about the fundamentals to be understood. I think in that regard modernity and tradition have two things in common, trust and respect. I don't think for a good relationship whether is modern or traditional these terms change.
Quite illuminating. Thanks very much!

Rendd jan, Conflict resolution rather than conflict avoidance

What do you say?  The first involves creativity whereas avoidance has a passive flavor to it.  What we avoid always comes back to us in another form another time.  I agree with you, conflict resolution is an Art. It is inspired then practiced and perfected until we are satisfied with the result. Right?  

There is no "perfect" relationship.  Only "Good Enough" ones to keep us grounded within our purpose.  

People's expectations do change as they mature, in and out of a relationship. It is not uncommon that partners of either gender change their styles/minds as life paths diverge. This is true Especially with people who enjoy searching for the unconventional. But certain fundamentals should be understood and accepted in each person, such as the capacity to trust. 

Monda jan,

On the side note I thought I bring this up too that:

On the other hand Sophie might be traditional at core and her past is making her to feel too guilty hence reading too much into Farid's behavior.

Bottom line I think couples, having different perceptions shouldn't cause any problem as long as they can avoid conflicts. The art isn't to have a perfect initial compatibility but rather to create it. Avoiding conflict is a
technique. I think there might be hope in their relationship if they learn how to avoid the conflicts.