Reza 41
dieffrence is few zero ,which means nothing
به زبان فارسی
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Did GOD had spoken Arabic to persian prophets ?
28-Mar-2009
In Quran and bible God had repeatedly highlighted one of most important criteria of his Messengers would be that, speaker of the GOD's word, would be the one who is speaks its own tribe and people,in other word not someone outsider who learn to their language.as we read in Quran 14:4 وَمَا أَرْسَلْنَا مِن رَّسُولٍ إِلاَّ بِلِسَانِ قَوْمِهِ لِيُبَيِّنَ "we have not sent prophet except whom speaks his own people language", or we read also in Q41:44) وَلَوْ جَعَلْنَاهُ قُرْآنًا أَعْجَمِيًّا لَّقَالُوا لَوْلَا فُصِّلَتْ آيَاتُهُ أَأَعْجَمِيٌّ وَعَرَبِيٌّ
if we would have not sent Arabic Quran in your language, you would have protested, saying : Ajami words for Arabs ?
of course GOD has sent Mohammad(pbuh) as his final and for all people of the world Q7:158 قُلْ يَا أَيُّهَا النَّاسُ إِنِّي رَسُولُ اللّهِ إِلَيْكُمْ جَمِيعًا , tell all people of the world I am a messenger for all(no exceptions)
therefor, GOD Almighty , has made that clear for all of us, whom bringing you a message from GOD 1- should be in familiar and clear and understandable form of language , no Ajami message for Arabs ,vice-versa, no Arabic message should go for Ajams, couldn't be more clear and transparent than that.
some argue that ,GOD said this just for Arabs, well, no ,than GOD would have not say "tell them you have message for all, criteria of messenger to be local, makes good sens, people would learn and understand fast and spreading word it faster, why GOD would want to do 1-lie in Quran(saying some thing ,doing something else later)2- put hard Arabic word in front of Persian who at the time were 98% illiterate ,people who have some feel of historical antagonism toward to Arabs any way.
therefor , it is hard to believe GOD would want to apply one law to Arabs and not to other benefit , some they argue Arabic was a same as Persian or was once all was same, to their answer we all can go back read and literature from 165 years back , except some governmental sycophancy letters and documents which hard Arabic mixture word were used to pleas reverent level of king , the rest are very much is same as today Farsi speaking if we speak Arabic today they were speaking than, how ever divinely changes need divine alert ,although we can all guess but we cant speak for GOD , we can not find any where in Quran that GOD has future plan change.
than ,reasonably we should not or "can not" accept claim other wise,
some smarts they may subtly put many plane and ad some numbers together ,or bringing unknown word with their own hand writing to eyes of our naives and ordinaries which until today not even want to translated those divine scriptures(at least not in to Farsi), and keeping this magic box close mystery and all they do speak highly and exaggerate the unknown content for their adherents and every one who they proselytizing, but GOD ,don't need to go their long distance, if they write 20,000 books GOD doesn't need bring 20,000 reason to expose them, all he does is allude few words, Persian say (AA'ghel ra eshareh-e -bass).that's all it need.which inshallah if you ponder and contemplate in above verses he allude,you'll realize. so our Bahais friends Iranian or other should understand , there should be more reason and answers to so many contradiction they face every now and than which they never find right answers for them, independent search for true(if is not just a word) should put them in good position to ask and get reasonable and rational answers from their leaders .(hopefully not be satisfied with advise of reading a few monajat (pray) to seek of understanding their own)
peace Reza
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And you are a schmuck!
by NUR on Sun Apr 12, 2009 11:18 PM PDTWhat makes someone like me an expert on the history of your national religion is 1. because I have a Jewish pedigree from my maternal side (in fact the Jews of Hamadan are descendents of one Rabbi Joseph of Hamadan who helped compile the Sefer ha-Zohar); 2. I actually have studied this material on a university graduate degree level; 3. besides other languages, I taught myself how to read Biblical Hebrew as well as Aramaic; 4. I have kept abreast of the scholarship as well as 5. the archeology and 6. I have read a thousand times more Disneyland books on the history of the Israelite peoples than you. In fact there is a senior Lubatvitcher rabbi here who says that if I'd only leave my present religious committments and drop my faith and join them, he would personally see to it that I would be fast-tracked through the Yeshiva system and into the rabbinate within a few short years! Obviously I have refused him, but since you mention it, that's what qualifies me and thoroughly disqualifies you.
And if you want to talk about the laying of foundations, first, look due West into Misraim and then due East into Iran for the real foundations of Judaism. Ancient Egypt and Mazdaean Iran are the proverbial mother and father of the Jewish religion as well as monotheism from start to finish. I also happen to believe that the true Joseph of history could well be the monotheist Pharaoh Akhenaten and that the historical Zarathustra (based on the scholarship of Mary Boyce) definitely came before the historical Moses and maybe even Abraham.
Now did you want to talk about the Khazars?
" In the 7th century CE, the Khazars founded an independent Khaganate in the Northern Caucasus along the Caspian Sea. Although the Khazars were initially Tengri shamanists, many of them converted to Christianity, Islam, and other religions. During the eighth or ninth century the state religion became Judaism. At their height, the Khazar khaganate and its tributaries controlled much of what is today southern Russia, western Kazakhstan, eastern Ukraine, Azerbaijan, large portions of the Northern Caucasus ( Circassia, Dagestan, Chechnya), parts of Georgia and the Crimea."
AOR
NUR or is that Taarik?
by Mehdi Mazloom on Thu Apr 09, 2009 05:00 PM PDTYou have an Interesting theory about the origins of the European Jews.
let look at it a bit closer, then use common sense to derive a palatable conclusion.
a). It is fact that, Jews in ancient Israel had indeed lived in where the present state of Israel exist.
b). After their famous rebellion, their Capital city of Jerusalem was destroyed along with their second Temple, and in 73 ACE they were force expelled from their land to all over the ME & Gulf region, Africa and Europe.
For over 1900 years Jews were systematically persecuted by the Christians throughout Europe. That is also a fact to which "professor" like you won't deny.
Now you claim that, most of those Jews were converts.
Now for god sake, why would any rational person, chose to abandon his safe haven as Christian (or any other denominations) and chose to convert into Judaism and subject himself / herself to persecution.?
Where does it make sense for a persecutor chose to be persecuted one. Jews are not masochists, nor the are know to be idiots.
Yourself admit that, you had belonged to a mere 200 year old religion of Bahai. After which you chose to abandon it, and had joined a more obscure and less know religion.
My question is, what makes a dinky ginky individual like you any expert on the most ancient and well established religion in the ME region. A religion which had laid the foundation to two (Christianity & Islam) other great religions.
You are no NUR, you are as Taarik as your blizzard and convoluted theories about other groups. You think by reading some Disneyland books, it makes you an authority on a given subject matter.
The only think I could think of people like you is. You know little about everything, and nothing about one subject.
Faryarm does not know me
by NUR on Thu Apr 09, 2009 12:33 AM PDTJenab-i-Agha (+ Ba Ghayn), I already responded and several of the comments were deleted straight away by the censor. But note that Faryarm does not know me. He is re-circulating a piece of libel your Bahaim friends have circulated before many times elsewhere from a mentally ill person who has done this sort of thing before with others as well. Furthermore, I am not preaching any gospels here or recruiting for any cause, other than to be in the face of people like you and your Bahaim friends. And I've got my support where it counts, FYI.
And as for the original inhabitants of occupied Palestine, they are in fact the Arab Palestinians which the latter day Khazar convert European Ashkenazim occupiers are oppressing and killing. Also there is in any case no legitimate Israel until the coming of the Messiah who establishes it - that is, unless you wish to fess up to your Baha'i affiliations and admit Husayn 'Ali of Nar/fire as your messiah and that of other Zionists like yourself.
413
[Comment and time of posting recorded in the event of deletion by the censor of this site]
NUR, any comments on Faryam's post?
by Mehdi Mazloom on Wed Apr 08, 2009 12:18 PM PDTJenab e' agha Nur. It looks your friend Faryam who knows you personally had spilled the beans on you. Also it does not look, you have too many followers to your gospels.
Any comments or replies to defend yourself.? Lets see you dancing and singing the blues of righteousness and balleika of anti-Bahai tirades.
One more item. You refer to Israel as "occupied Palestine". Yes, it is occupied by the decedents of its original Jewish inhabitants, whom were forced out of their land in 70 ACE.
"No one fights dirtier" - Juan Cole
by NUR on Tue Apr 07, 2009 09:47 PM PDTProfessor Juan Cole, February 23, 1999:
"There is nothing to be puzzled by. Right wing Baha'is only like to hear the sound of their own voices ...Obviously, the world is so constructed that they cannot in fact only hear their own voices. They are forced to hear other voices that differ from theirs. This most disturbs them when the voices come from enrolled Baha'is or when the voices speak of the Baha'i faith. The way they sometimes deal with the enrolled Baha'is is to summon them to a heresy inquiry and threaten them with being shunned if they do not fall silent. With non-Baha'is or with ex-Baha'is, they deal with their speech about the faith by backbiting, slandering and libelling the speaker. You will note that since I've been on this list I have been accused of long-term heresy, of "claiming authority," of out and out lying (though that was retracted, twice), of misrepresentation, of 'playing fast and loose with the facts,' and even of being 'delusional.' I have been accused of all these falsehoods by *Baha'is*, by prominent Baha'is. I have been backbitten by them. This shows that all the talk about the danger a sharp tongue can do, all the talk about the need for harmony, for returning poison with honey, for a sin-covering eye, is just *talk* among right wing Baha'is. No one fights dirtier than they when they discover a voice they cannot silence and cannot refute."
//www.fglaysher.com/bahaicensorship/Cole71.htm
See, www.juancole.com
&
Sourcewatch article, Baha'i Faith
[Note the posting and time of the posting of this comment is recorded and the page saved in the evident of the deletion of this comment by the censor of this site]
More on NUR's very sad life story...
by CAUTION DETOUR AHEAD on Tue Apr 07, 2009 05:49 PM PDT//iranian.com/main/blog/faryarm/early-heartfelt-message-about-nima-wahid-azal-nur-old-friend
Finally, NUR's coming out of the closet can be found at...
by CAUTION DETOUR AHEAD on Mon Apr 06, 2009 08:25 AM PDT//iranian.com/main/blog/faryarm/source-watch-0
DETNUR
No shame...you answer first
by NUR on Mon Apr 06, 2009 01:33 AM PDT1) Who are you and what is your real name?
2) What creed or organization do you belong to?
3) What position do you occupy?
4) Are you now or have you ever worked on behalf of the Baha'i Internet Agency headed by Matthew Weinberg at the Baha'i World Center in Haifa, occupied Palestine?
5) Why do you see the need in hiding behind a pseudonym and masking your identity?
6) What are your goals to that end?
7) What is your primary motivation in ascertaining logistical information about my group?
8) Are you a sayanim and work for Mossad?
9) Is your organization attempting to manufacture consent through fictitious and exagerrated narratives about persecution in Iran?
10) What would you consider your motivation to that end?
11) Is your organization attempting to foment international discord and lobby for a pre-emptive military strike on Iran?
12) What is your position on the current policy of President Obama in wishing engagement with Iran?
13) Do you believe that Baha'ism should replace the national religion in Iran, and is your organization attempting to replace the mullah's theocracy with a Baha'i theocracy?
Don't get frustrated. Just answer the questions. Looking in the mirror of your organizational duplicity and Stalinism can't be that bad. Or can it?
See Sourcewatch entry, Baha'i Faith.
NUR - It is now clear that you are ashamed to answer these Qs
by CAUTION DETOUR AHEAD on Sun Apr 05, 2009 08:16 PM PDT1) How many people in your group?
2) Are you a clergyman in this group?
3) How often do you meet?
4) Where do most of these people live?
5) Is this group growing in numbers or dwindling? How do you know? Any references you can site?
6) What are the goals of this group?
7) How does this group organize itself or does it have a community?
8) Is this group recognized by any organization or civil or international body?
9) Is this group persecuted in Iran or elsewhere? If so, can you reference any evidence to support this claim?
10) What would be considered an achievement for this group?
11) Could you tell us some of the principles of your Faith?
and finally...
12) Why don't you answer these basic questions?
Even if you don't have a reference to cite, it would good to at least tell us the basis for the answers.
DETNUR
Your answer same as before...
by NUR on Sun Apr 05, 2009 07:50 PM PDTNone of your business.
Now answer a few of mine,
1) Who are you and what is your real name?
2) What creed or organization do you belong to?
3) What position do you occupy?
4) Are you now or have you ever worked on behalf of the Baha'i Internet Agency headed by Matthew Weinberg at the Baha'i World Center in Haifa, occupied Palestine?
5) Why do you see the need in hiding behind a pseudonym and masking your identity?
6) What are your goals to that end?
7) What is your primary motivation in ascertaining logistical information about my group?
8) Are you a sayanim and work for Mossad?
9) Is your organization attempting to manufacture consent through fictitious and exagerrated narratives about persecution in Iran?
10) What would you consider your motivation to that end?
11) Is your organization attempting to foment international discord and lobby for a pre-emptive military strike on Iran?
12) What is your position on the current policy of President Obama in wishing engagement with Iran?
13) Do you believe that Baha'ism should replace the national religion in Iran, and is your organization attempting to replace the mullah's theocracy with a Baha'i theocracy?
Don't get frustrated. Just answer the questions. Looking in the mirror of your organizational duplicity and Stalinism can't be that bad. Or can it?
See Sourcewatch entry, Baha'i Faith.
NUR - Come out of the closet and answer these questions !
by CAUTION DETOUR AHEAD on Sun Apr 05, 2009 09:38 AM PDT1) How many people in your group?
2) Are you a clergyman in this group?
3) How often do you meet?
4) Where do most of these people live?
5) Is this group growing in numbers or dwindling? How do you know? Any references you can site?
6) What are the goals of this group?
7) How does this group organize itself or does it have a community?
8) Is this group recognized by any organization or civil or international body?
9) Is this group persecuted in Iran or elsewhere? If so, can you reference any evidence to support this claim?
10) What would be considered an achievement for this group?
11) Could you tell us some of the principles of your Faith?
and finally...
12) Why don't you answer these basic questions?
Even if you don't have a reference to cite, it would good to at least tell us the basis for the answers.
DETNUR
Haifan Baha'i Propaganda: CAUTION NON-BAHA'IS
by NUR on Sat Apr 04, 2009 08:27 PM PDTSen McGlinn in Iran during Khatami's time? That is bizarre. How could Sen McGlinn who is a transplant New Zealand hippie in real life raising two kids, and living off the Dutch welfare state, and who can barely make ends meet, afford an actual trip to Iran at any time! Obviously this is a confession of his being deputized by some body to visit Iran for whatever capacity otherwise Sen McGlinn could barely afford the shirt on his back let alone afford to go to Iran during Khatami's or any other time for that matter!
Start HERE (Sourcewatch): //www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Baha%27i_Faith
See as well, BAHA'I INTERNET AGENCY, //www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Baha%E2%80%99i_Internet_Agency
SECTS OF BAHAIS: A Taxonomy of Baha'i Sects, //www.sectsofbahais.com/
&
Documentary film by independent Israeli film maker Naama Pyritz:
BAHA'IS IN MY BACKYARD
//video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2877478116441126906&hl=en-AU
-
US NSA (US BAHA'I NATIONAL SPIRITUAL ASSEMBLY) vs OBF (Orthodox Baha'i Faith)
Recent court victory by the Orthodox Baha'is, and the suit brought by the Haifan Bahai organization against them:
//trueseeker.typepad.com/true_seeker/court_case.html
Judge's decision
//www.truebahai.info/court/139-opinion.pdf
**Appellate hearing (Feb 2009)***
//www.ca7.uscourts.gov/tmp/LF1FFZY0.mp3
-
BAHAI Tactics & Techniques - CAUTION NON-BAHAIS
"Slanderous Vilification" = The Baha'i Technique - Ad Hominem, Libel, Slander, Demonize, Scapegoat, Ostracize, Shun, Banish, Backbite, Defame, Vilify, Discredit, Smear, Revile, Suppress, Attack, Bully, Intimidate, Threaten, Malign, Blackball, Deceive, Coerce, Silence, Harass... etc., etc.... CAUTION NON-BAHAIS
1. As far as possible they hold back from responding
2. Then they claim no knowledge of the given issue by feigning
ignorance
3. After the exposer has exposed they will try to divert to secondary
and totally peripheral and irrelevent side-issues
4. The exposer is then painted as someone with an axe to grind,
biased, deluded (while they, the bahaim, still have not responded to
the main issue exposed)
5. Next they relate mental instability and insanity to the exposer,
i.e. shoot the messenger
6. Then, the last tactic, is to wheel out several dubious personas on
the scene who claim to be neutral non-bahai observers who then begin attacking the exposer as well as the issue exposed while supporting the bahais and their issues as so-called non-bahais
-
THEORY OF BAHA’I LYING & EQUIVOCATION
See Susan Stiles Maneck,
//bahai-library.com/bsr/bsr06/62_maneck_hikmat.htm
WISDOM AND DISSIMULATION IN THE BAHA’I WRITINGS: The Use and meaning of Hikmat in the Baha’i Writings
Quote
"In many cases hikmat calls for the apparent suspension of a Bahá'í principle in order to ensure the protection of the Faith."
-
BAHA'I ADMINISTRATIVE IDOLATRY & STALINISM
QUOTE
"We don't want to be like those people who want to see God with their own eyes, or hear His melody with their own ears, because we have been given the gift of being able to see through the eyes of the House of Justice and listen through the ears of the House of Justice." - Bahai Counselor Rebeque Murphy
To hear this section of her talk go to:
//media1.bahai.us/tab/Highlights/Sunday/30_Counselor_Murphy_Rema...
-
BAHAI NOTIONS of FREEDOM of CONSCIENCE according to EX-UHJ member DOUGLAS MARTIN -- Monday, September 23, 2001
//www.fglaysher.com/bahaicensorship/DMartin.htm
Quote
"We have inherited a dangerous delusion from Christianity that our
individual conscience is supreme. This is not a Baha'i belief. In the
end, in the context of both our role in the community and our role in
the greater world, we must be prepared to sacrifice our personal
convictions or opinions. The belief that individual conscience is
supreme is equivalent to "taking partners with God" which is abhorrent to the Teachings of the Faith."
//www.bahai-library.org/talks/martin.watson.html
NOTE especially, S.G. Wilson,
BAHAISM AND RELIGIOUS ASSASSINATION The Muslim World vol. 4, issue 4, 1914
&
BAHAISM AND RELIGIOUS DECEPTION The Muslim World, Volume 5, Issue 2, 1914-1915.
at,
//wahidazal66.googlepages.com/babidocuments%28westernsources%29
See as well, BAHAISM AND THE BRITISH
//bahaisandbritannia.googlepages.com/home
BAHA’I CONTROL ON THEIR ELECTORAL SYSTEM – EXPOSED (Structural
features of Bahai Stalinism)
//groups.google.com.au/group/talk.religion.bahai/browse_thread/t...
-
In
Ma'idih-i-Asmani, vol. 4, page 355
//reference.bahai.org/fa/t/b/MAS4/mas4-355.html
Translation by Wahid Azal (Jan. 7, 2009)
Chapter 11
The Critics of the Cause of God (munkirin-i-amru'llah)
The Ancient Beauty in the Tablet of Habib from Maragha, which begins with "H B hear the call of God from the direction of the throne by the protective signs/verses (bi-ayati muhayyimin)..etc." they [i.e. Husayn 'Ali Nuri] enunciate the command (mi-farmayand) [i.e. state],
By God, the Truth, whomsoever criticizes it [i.e. Baha'ism], [which is] possessed of the manifest, the brilliant, the high and the perspicuous excellence, it behoveth him to ask his mother [yanbaghi lahu bi-an yas'al min ummihi] about his origins [or 'state', i.e.'hal', meaning he should inquire his mother about his legitimate conception – trans.], for he shall return to the nethermost hell [asfal al-jahim]"…
In Promulgation of Universal Peace p. 322 the following is quoted by 'Abbas Effendi from a prayer by his father, cf. THE BAHA'I FAITH AND ISLAM (ed.) Heshmat Moayyad (The Association for Baha'i Studies: Ottawa, 1990), p.23
O God! Whomsoever violates My Covenant, O God, humiliate him. Verily whosoever violates My Covenant, erase and efface him.
-
See as well,
//www.bayanic.com [CLICK tab BAHAISM]
CAUTION NON-BAHAIS
why in Israel
by senmcglinn (not verified) on Sat Apr 04, 2009 02:42 AM PDTAlborz has explained how the Bahai world centre ended up in Israel: basically because Baha'u'llah was first expelled from Iran (he went to Baghdad, then ruled by the Ottoman empire), and then imprisoned by the Ottomans and sent eventually to Akka, at a time when the area within the walls was being used as a prison, the fortress being the "high security" department.
Alborz said: "As an example, the House of the Bab in Shiraz, a pilgrimage site for all Baha'is, raised to the ground."
He means it was razed. Iran (and the House of Baha'u'llah in Baghdad) would be a major pilgrimmage site for Bahais, but as you have seen on this list, the anti-Bahaism in some quarters is so virulent that it is simply not safe. I've been to Shiraz, but I did it very discretely, and in Khatami's time.
Intellectual points?
by NUR on Fri Apr 03, 2009 02:16 AM PDTSince when has pointing out the blatantly obvious that your Eretz Yisrael is a rogue, illegitimate, militarist apartheid state and colonialist enclave in the Mid East not scored intellectual points where it counts? Why don't you get out of your molly-coddled Zionist bubble and gauge world public opinion about IsraHELL. Better yet, speak to some Torah Only Jews and let them tell you that the existence of IsraHELL is scripturally illegitimate as well.
Also I have read the history of Jerusalem and the Jews going back 4000 years - probably know it better than you do - and I do not believe that latter day descendents of Khazar converts to Judaism (aka Ashkenazi Jews) legitmately constitute the original Israelites.
As for comments about the Bahaim gardens, obviously you are a Bahaim yourself, and the fact that you use a handle like Mehdi Mazloom only reinforces the fact!
Long live Palestine!
413
NUR - Thanks for the lecture
by Mehdi Mazloom on Thu Apr 02, 2009 12:53 PM PDTI am an Israeli and a Jew. On my original question, I asked about the Baha'i, to learn from an intellectual level about this sect - not to read senseless "IsraHELL", or be insulted.
You wrote:
In fact I felt far closer to the Pure Spirit in Jerusalem, both at the Dome of the Rock as well as the Wailing Wall, than at Haifa-Disney at any time.
I was alluding to the beautiful gardens in Haifa. You could be more rational then comparing ancient rocks (Al Aqsa & Wailing Wall) to world renowned gardens. Just about every person who visited these garden agrees, it is one of the wonders on earth.And if you label this place as "Disneyland", Mecca & the Vatican could also be lebeld Disneyland", and tourist centers.
While it is your absolute propagative and right to believe in any religion your wish to follow. Engaging in venomous tirade against Jews or Israel will not score you too many points on the intellectual circle.
Thanks you for the lesson. alborz was generous enough to educate me on that topic.
In regards to your comment "Zionist occupiers", I would suggest you to read the history of Jerusalem and the Jews in this region going back 4000 years.
NUR - Help yourself by answering these questions....
by CAUTION DETOUR AHEAD on Thu Apr 02, 2009 12:30 AM PDT1) How many people in your group?
2) Are you a clergyman in this group?
3) How often do you meet?
4) Where do most of these people live?
5) Is this group growing in numbers or dwindling?
6) What are the goals of this group?
7) How does this group organize itself or does it have a community?
8) Is this group recognized by any organization or civil or international body?
9) Is this group persecuted in Iran or elsewhere? If so, can you reference any evidence to support this claim?
10) What would be considered an achievement for this group?
11) Could you tell us some of the principles of your Faith?
Don't get frustrated, just answer these questions. Looking in the mirror can't be that bad. (or is it?)
DETNUR
The Hanging Gardens of Haifa-Disneyland: REVEALED
by NUR on Wed Apr 01, 2009 10:03 PM PDTDear Mehdi,
Like you I have also visited the hanging gardens of the Baha'i religious theme park located at Haifa-Disneyland. Three times in fact. I have to say that the contrived glitz, razzamataz and glamour didn't impress me very much at all. The utter fakeness of the whole place is sickening. In fact I felt far closer to the Pure Spirit in Jerusalem, both at the Dome of the Rock as well as the Wailing Wall, than at Haifa-Disney at any time. And this was many years ago in the '80s before I formally ran out of this cult in the '90s. I will say this also, if anyone truly wishes to have a genuine, otherworldy experience of the Divine through architecture, go to Isfahan and stand under the middle of the dome of the Shah Abbas mosque and gaze up for a while; or go to the shrine of Imam Reza in Mashhad, or the shrine of Shah Ni'matullah Wali Kirmani in Mahan, outside of Kirman, and look up! But stay away from Haifa-Disneyland in Zionistan if you wish to experience the Living Spirit through architecture...
Now as for the question: the Bahaim world center (WC) is located in occupied Palestine, i.e. IsraHELL, because the Bahaim founders were exiled there from Edirne on the Black Sea by the Ottoman authorities in the late 1860s. The Baha'i founder, Mirza Husayn 'Ali Nari Baha', made a claim to being the Promised One of the Bayan. Mirza Yahya Nuri Subh-i-Azal (as the Mirror of the Bayan) rightfully rejected him. Husayn 'Ali Nari and his partisans then unleashed a wave of violence, assassination and murder against Subh-i-Azal and his partisans, and even manufactured a fake pamphlet attributing it to Subh-i-Azal claiming in it that Subh-i-Azal and his partisans wished to overthrow the Ottoman state and set themselves up instead. Due to this the Ottoman authorites took Husayn 'Ali Nari, his family and the majority of his partisans, together with a handful of the partisans of Subh-i-Azal, and exiled them to Acre, Palestine; and took Subh-i-Azal and his family with a handful of the partisans of Husayn 'Ali Baha' and exiled them to Cyprus. The Ottomans sent representatives of the opposing party with each of the respective parties so that they would spy on one another. Now Haifa is only across the bay from Acre, and so when Abbas Effendi and his step-family fell out in the 1890s over leadership, Abbas centered his activity in Haifa, and his step-brother Mirza Muhammad 'Ali in Bahji which is only a few kilometres away from Acre. Until the 1950s the 'Abdu'l-Bahaists/Abbas Effendi faction of Bahais had no legal access to Bahji so this is how the Baha'i world center (WC) ended up being headquartered there.
Now much of the lands on Mount Carmel in Haifa-Disneyland were bought in the 1950s at low, pittance, rock-bottom bargain prices by Shoghi Effendi, i.e. the successor of Abbas Effendi. The original property was quite modest and small. But when Palestine was formally occupied by the Jews in 1948 and many of the local Palestinians fled as refugees and did not return, when they failed to return by 1950 the IsraHELLi government of Ben Gurion began passing absentee landlord laws through the Knesset which then facilitated the auctioning off of people's homes on Mount Carmel to Shoghi Effendi and the Baha'is. I will underscore this once more: Much of the Baha'i properties on Mount Carmel were originally properties of local Palestinians who subsequenly failed to return after the 1948 war for various reasons; or when some of them did return years later it was already too late for them to reclaim their homes through IsraHELLi courts.
Amongst other reasons, one of the reasons why IsraHELL refuses a unilateral right of Palestinian return to Palestine as a final settlement with the Palestinian authority, is precisely over many of these properties on Mount Carmel the Baha'is have constructed their Disneyland-Las Vegas complex over! Haifa-Disneyland (which in a few aspects is actually even subsidized by the IsraHELLi government) brings in hundreds of thousands of tourist dollars to the IsraHELLi economy per annum. Obviously it is not in the best interests of the Zionists to do the right thing and return the properties of these Palestinians the Baha'is stole for bargain/basement prices after the consolidation of Al-Nakba in 1948!
One more point: The Baha'is claim that the shrine they have constructed on Mount Carmel to be the shrine housing the final remains of Siyyid 'Ali Muhammad Shirazi, the Bab. This is not true and can very easily be proven not to be the case. The final remains of the Bab are still in Iran in an undisclosed location known to the Bayanis alone. On the other hand, there is good, solid evidence to prove that the remains the Baha'is claim to be that of the Bab is actually the final remains of Mirza Bozorg Nuri, i.e. the father of Subh-i-Azal and Mirza Husayn 'Ali Nari.
Finally, indeed NUR is not a bahaim nor is remotely connected to the pestilence that is Bahaism, alhamdulillah rabb al-'alamin!
413
Bahai Gardens surround Baha'i Holy Sites...
by alborz on Wed Apr 01, 2009 10:30 AM PDT... which are places where the exiled and imprisoned founder fo the Baha'i Faith was sent to by the Qajar and Ottoman rulers, decades before the formation of the state of Israel. Baha'u'llah's ascension took place in 1892, some 50+ years before there was an Israeli state. This fact is purposefully ignored by the Iranian authorities when charges are brought against the Baha'is. You will find a comprehensive response in the following letter in Persian and English.
//bic.org/areas-of-work/persecution/prosecutor-general-iran-en.pdf
//bic.org/areas-of-work/persecution/prosecutor-general-iran-fa.pdf
The remains of the Bab, after His execution in 1850, in Tabriz, was also discretely kept by His followers until it was entombed on Mt. Carmel in 1909, in Haifa. This NoRooz marks the 100 anniversary. The Shrine of the Bab, with its golden dome, is now the focal point of the Baha'i Gardens, in recognition for the Bab's love for gardens and light, both of which He was derpived of during in His imprisonment.
//news.bahai.org/story/704
The question that you asked is a reasonable one however, when put into its historical context, and the shift in time is applied, it does becomes moot.
Additionally, some of the most Holy sites to the Baha'is were destroyed by the Islamic Republic. As an example, the House of the Bab in Shiraz, a pilgrimage site for all Baha'is, raised to the ground. The following link will show images of this Holy Site and its destruction.
//question.bahai.org/002.php
Finally, NUR is not a Baha'i.
Alborz
Nur - Baha'i in Haifah, Israel.
by Mehdi Mazloom on Wed Apr 01, 2009 09:27 AM PDTI have visited the Baha'i center and its world renowned gardens in Haifa, Israel.
Can you tell me more about it. Why is it located in Israel, and not in Iran?.
appreciate your reply.
YES! He did speak in Arabic.
by AK (not verified) on Wed Apr 01, 2009 04:24 AM PDTمهندسی زبان فارسی در فرهنگ نويسی داريوش آشوری
داريوش آشوری در درامد کتاب فرهنگ علوم انسانی به درستی ياد می‌کند که ضعف قوه انديشه علمی و تحليلی ايرانيان، سبب مهم ناتوانی در پديدآوردن زبان علمی فارسی معاصر و در خور خواسته‌های دانش و فرهنگ مدرن است.
فارسی در قياس با زبان‌های فرنگی، مانند انگليسی، فرانسه و آلمانی، در قلمرو زبان فنی و اصطلاحی درمانده است. اما اين وضع امروزين نيست. با ورود اسلام به ايران زبان علم و فلسفه تقريباً در انحصار زبان عربی افتاد و فارسی‌زبانان برای انتقال مفاهيم دقيق، عربی را به کار بستند.
عربی زبان عقلانيت ايرانی
زبان فارسی، اگرچه به همت شاعران و عارفان و تا اندازه‌ای تاريخ‌نويسان، مايه ادبی خويش را نگاه داشت و پروراند، از توانايی دستگاه درونی خود برای بيان مفهوم‌ها و انگاره‌های علمی بهره نگرفت و بر اين بنياد، در قلمرو علم و فلسفه، زبانی ناکارامد، کند و کژتاب شد.
شناخت و انديشه غيرادبی و غيرعرفانی، بيشتر، بر بستر زبان عربی شکل گرفت و زبان فارسی، زبان شور و حال ماند
//www.bbc.co.uk/persian/arts/story/2006/03/06...
The Baha'i Faith Its History & Teachings - William M Miller
by NUR on Tue Mar 31, 2009 10:26 PM PDT//www.fglaysher.com/bahaicensorship/archives/Baha'i%20faith%20and%20Its%20Teachings%20by%20William%20McElwee%20Miller.htm
Truth be told
by NUR on Tue Mar 31, 2009 10:20 PM PDTCAUTION DETOUR AHEAD, I will consolidate your answer in one simple answer without a single detour:
NONE OF YOUR DARN BUSINESS!
413
Tell me NUR!
by CAUTION DETOUR AHEAD on Tue Mar 31, 2009 04:55 PM PDT1) Tell me how many people in your group?
2) Are you a clergyman in this group?
3) How many in this group?
4) Where do most of these people live?
5) Is this group growing in numbers or dwindling?
6) What are the goals of this group?
7) How does this group organize itself or does it have a community?
8) Is this group recognized by any organization or civil or international body?
9) Is this group persecuted in Iran or elsewhere? If so, can you reference any evidence to support this claim?
10) What would be considered an achievement for this group?
Short answers that don't take a detour would be best.
DETNUR
Samsam Jaan
by Anonymous Observer on Tue Mar 31, 2009 08:36 AM PDTMavali...very nice. I had totally forgotten about that word. These nit wits are indeed mavallis. They became mavalis of the "seyyeds" (masters) 1400 years ago, and are still mental zombie mavalis of the same masters, albeit in Iranian garb.
Don't worry though, my brother. You and I, and those like us, are parts of the silent majority. Persian nationalism has awakened because our people have now seen the true face of the ommati barbarism that for 1400 years has been wrapped in pleasant smoke screens. Our day will come, and on that day these omaati losers better watch out.
Payandeh Eranshahr!
AO, r v there yet ; )
by SamSamIIII on Mon Mar 30, 2009 07:39 PM PDTSometimes you are left with the choice of either laughter or scottie to beam u up away from such mavalii mentality. cheers pal!!!
//www.iranianidentity.blogspot.com/
//www.youtube.com/user/samsamsia
CAUTION NON-BAHAIS
by fatimeh nematolahi (not verified) on Mon Mar 30, 2009 07:18 PM PDT"...There is no conscience with them.."
we are all halal meat to them.
see for yourself,
//www.google.com/url?q=//www.islamisnotw...
//www.google.com/url?q=//www.topix.com/f...
//boingboing.net/2007/05/06/iraq-kurdish-girl...
//www.apostatesofislam.com/media/stoning.htm
//www.amitiesquebec-israel.org/texts/stoning....
//www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-eas...
God Spoke to Me...
by Definite Representitive of God (not verified) on Mon Mar 30, 2009 07:03 PM PDTand said: these are all non-sense, and all claiments are false. Judge religions by their deeds, not by their claims. And all abrahamic religions are tools of deceit, oppression, thievery, and murder.
Israelites were told by their god that you are chosen and land of phelestines were yours. So they went and fought phelestines for many many years.
Then god of Jesus told his followers that jews betrayed my son and go get rid of jews or else I will get rid of them when I return.
Then god of Mohammad told his followers to convert to islam, and the rest are all infidels and should be eliminated.
So it seems that this god of moses, jesus, and mohammd knows no craft except murder and even in that regard he lacks courage to personally act and get rid of all that he does not like and has to delegate all the murders to a bunch of rabbis, monks, and mullas.
Such a murderous, discriminating, hypocrite, and coward god does not deserve any following or listening to.
As Khayyam said:
Qomi motofakkerand andar rahe din,
Qomi beh goman fetadeh dar rahe yaqin;
Mitarsam az aankeh baang ayad roozi,
Kay bi khabaraan raah nah aanast-o nah in.
CAUTION NON-BAHAIS
by NUR on Mon Mar 30, 2009 06:27 PM PDTStart HERE (Sourcewatch): //www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Baha%27i_Faith
Then see, //www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Baha%E2%80%99i_Internet_Agency
and
//www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Bah%C3%A1%27%C3%AD_Computer_And_Communication_Association
See, SECTS OF BAHAIS: A Taxonomy of Baha'i Sects, //www.sectsofbahais.com/
&
Documentary film by independent Israeli film maker Naama Pyritz:
BAHA'IS IN MY BACKYARD
//video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2877478116441126906&hl=en-AU
-
US NSA vs OBF (Orthodox Baha'i Faith)
Recent court victory by the Orthodox Baha'is, and the suit brought by the Haifan Bahai organization against them:
//trueseeker.typepad.com/true_seeker/court_case.html
Judge's decision
//www.truebahai.info/court/139-opinion.pdf
**Appellate hearing (Feb 2009)***
//www.ca7.uscourts.gov/tmp/LF1FFZY0.mp3
-
BAHAI Tactics & Techniques - CAUTION NON-BAHAIS
"Slanderous Vilification" = The Baha'i Technique - Ad Hominem, Libel, Slander, Demonize, Scapegoat, Ostracize, Shun, Banish, Backbite, Defame, Vilify, Discredit, Smear, Revile, Suppress, Attack, Bully, Intimidate, Threaten, Malign, Blackball, Deceive, Coerce, Silence, Harass... etc., etc.... CAUTION NON-BAHAIS
1. As far as possible they hold back from responding
2. Then they claim no knowledge of the given issue by feigning
ignorance
3. After the exposer has exposed they will try to divert to secondary and totally peripheral and irrelevent side-issues
4. The exposer is then painted as someone with an axe to grind,
biased, deluded (while they, the bahaim, still have not responded to
the main issue exposed)
5. Next they relate mental instability and insanity to the exposer,
i.e. shoot the messenger
6. Then, the last tactic, is to wheel out several dubious personas on
the scene who claim to be neutral non-bahai observers who then begin attacking the exposer as well as the issue exposed and supporting the bahais and their issues as so-called non-bahais
THEORY OF BAHA’I LYING & EQUIVOCATION
See Susan Stiles Maneck,
//bahai-library.com/bsr/bsr06/62_maneck_hikmat.htm
WISDOM AND DISSIMULATION IN THE BAHA’I WRITINGS: The Use and meaning of Hikmat in the Baha’i Writings
Quote
"In many cases hikmat calls for the apparent suspension of a Bahá'í principle in order to ensure the protection of the Faith."
BAHA'I ADMINISTRATIVE IDOLATRY & STALINISM
QUOTE
"We don't want to be like those people who want to see God with their own eyes, or hear His melody with their own ears, because we have been given the gift of being able to see through the eyes of the House of Justice and listen through the ears of the House of Justice." - Bahai Counselor Rebeque Murphy
To hear this section of her talk go to:
//media1.bahai.us/tab/Highlights/Sunday/30_Counselor_Murphy_Rema...
BAHAI NOTIONS of FREEDOM of CONSCIENCE according to EX-UHJ member DOUGLAS MARTIN -- Monday, September 23, 2001
//www.fglaysher.com/bahaicensorship/DMartin.htm
"We have inherited a dangerous delusion from Christianity that our
individual conscience is supreme. This is not a Baha'i belief. In the
end, in the context of both our role in the community and our role in
the greater world, we must be prepared to sacrifice our personal
convictions or opinions. The belief that individual conscience is
supreme is equivalent to "taking partners with God" which is abhorrent to the Teachings of the Faith."
//www.bahai-library.org/talks/martin.watson.html
NOTE especially, S.G. Wilson,
BAHAISM AND RELIGIOUS ASSASSINATION The Muslim World vol. 4, issue 4, 1914
&
BAHAISM AND RELIGIOUS DECEPTION The Muslim World, Volume 5, Issue 2, 1914-1915.
at,
//wahidazal66.googlepages.com/babidocuments%28westernsources%29
See as well, BAHAISM AND THE BRITISH
//bahaisandbritannia.googlepages.com/home
BAHA’I CONTROL ON THEIR ELECTORAL SYSTEM – EXPOSED (Structural
features of Bahai Stalinism)
//groups.google.com.au/group/talk.religion.bahai/browse_thread/t...
From Mission Problems in New Persia, 1926, p. 83, 87 & 89 quoted by William McElwee Miller in The Baha'i Faith: It's History and
Teachings, 1973, p. 289.
"...There is no conscience with them [ i.e. the Baha'is], they keep
to no principle, they tell you what is untrue, ignoring or denying
undoubted historical facts, and this is the character of both the
leader and the led...As to morality and honesty, the whole system has proved disappointing...I have been in contact with many Baha'is, and have had dealings with many and have tested many, and unfortunately I have met not a single one who could be called honest or faithful in the full sense of these words..."
Dr Sa'eed Khan [was] a highly-respected physician...who had as a
doctor treated the second widow of the Bab, and had for a lifetime
known intimately both Babis [i.e. Bayanis] and Baha'is in Tehran and
Hamadan.
See as well,
//www.bayanic.com [CLICK tab BAHAISM]
Ommati Losers
by Anonymous Observer on Mon Mar 30, 2009 11:25 AM PDTسمسام جان قربان دهنت. یک مشت امتی ذلیل شده افتادند به جون کشور کورش و داریوش و میخواهند که ما را از آنچه که بردهٔ عرب شدیم بیشتر بردهمان بکنند. جمع کنید این روضه خونی را و بروید برگردید به همان حوزهٔ علمیه خراب شده که ازش امدید. کسی نمیخواهد که این اراجیف را اینجا بشنود.
where is the money!
by Butshekan (not verified) on Mon Mar 30, 2009 06:49 AM PDTYou should worry about what God is saying rather than what language is used and focus on the message vs wether anyone can produce writing styles that are purely subjective.
This is the root cause of all problems. Not getting the message but constant boasting and no real application yet an unreal critisim of what language the truth is being given rather than the spoken truth itself.
Arabic was purely cirmustantial as simple as that. you can write a book about it and at the end you will be farther from the truth.