Roozbeh_Gilani

Propaganda

Roozbeh, I am a firm believer that a message should be analyzed independent of the messenager. On IC, we see a lot of good issues raised, but the authors and the people who raise the issues are attacked, instead of discussing the merrits of their arguemnts.

However, in this case it is not a matter of who is speaking but a matter of the message. There is both verbal and nonverbal contents to this video. There is no question that the message is a promotion of the same old communist, "proletaian revolution",  "the working class unite" bla bla bla, with pictures of the masses looking happy with their flags marching toward their Utopia. This is the main message of this video and yes I do think it dilutes and discredits any claim for concern for the working class!

RG: Yes Iran. Well done.

RG: Yes Iran. Well done. Words matter. And in action you are all Iranians first. We take care of Iran for all purposes. Culture first. Now call me a Star gazer nutter with no brains.

Ali Mostofi

//twitter.com/alimostofi

ali: I did in the title of my response, read again.

Now just for you:

Iran, Iran, Iran

Happy now? :)

"Personal business must yield to collective interest."

"communist propaganda"??!!

No, I dont see it that way. Even if this was produced by some communists, what is your problem with the key message, support for independent workers unions in Iran? unless you believe all iranian workers are communists and as such deserve what they get! 

"Personal business must yield to collective interest."

RG: you never mentioned Iran

RG: you never mentioned Iran in your reply.

Ali Mostofi

//twitter.com/alimostofi

yes, they are Iranian first.

No I dont think like a hezbollahi!

You need to understand that without massive and organised participation of the industrialised working classes in opposition movement, the islamist regime would simply not go. So support of organised working class movement is support for overthrowing the islamist regime and it's replacement with a secular democracy...

"Personal business must yield to collective interest."

Communist Propaganda

Roozbeh, how can you say:

 "Dont allow your dislike  of socialism to prevent you from backing the just demands of the iranian workers, asking for independent from islamist regime,  trade unions."

in response to Ali discussing socialism when you video is 1000% communist propaganda, produceed by hardcore communists, with all the communist imagery, music and the whole shabang!!! This video is not about workers, it is about promoting an ideology, ie commuism. And communism just like Islam is another ideology promising Utopia and delivering hell!! So I have to agree with Ali.

Roozbeh: Iranian workers are

Roozbeh: Iranian workers are Iranian first and workers second. Or do you think like Hezbollahis, they are workers first and Iranian second. Is ideology more important than culture?

Ali Mostofi

//twitter.com/alimostofi

alimostofi: this blog is about trade unions , not socialism.

Dont allow your dislike  of socialism to prevent you from backing the just demands of the iranian workers, asking for independent from islamist regime,  trade unions.   

"Personal business must yield to collective interest."

Socialism is a myth worse

Socialism is a myth worse than religion. .....

I cannot believe that after all that has happened in the world, we still have people raving on about socialism. Oh that old chestnut. It was the biggest con ever. Government services do not work. Private enterprise does. There are areas where government needs to be involved but it needs to be audited. No political ideology is going to keep bad services.

Ali Mostofi

//twitter.com/alimostofi

Saying that you are being

Saying that you are being practical implies that you want to do something. You think that talk is cheap. But how are you going to do anything without thinking and agreeing about it first. What are you united on? Labour rights. Oh so is that within The Hezbollah Party in Iran's doctorine or something else? What happena to Iranian culture if it happens to be against your ideas?

Ali Mostofi

//twitter.com/alimostofi

Hooshang agreed again on "vahdat kalameh" thing

I was not around then as an activist due to my age, but the mere terminology smells of Rat. 

A united "anti fascist front", focused on achieving basic democratic rights and climate which would allow the growth of working classes unions and organisations is something I was referring to in another blog, which unfortunately got burried under the background noise of the blog......  

talk later..

"Personal business must yield to collective interest."

You're TALKING about freeing Iran, we're actually WORKING

towards that goal.

There's a big difference between mere talk and typing awasy in the cyber-space, and actualy having a (long-term, large-scale) plan of action and taking practicall, pragmatic moves every single day to acheive the goal of freeign the land.

It's called Praxis. Look it up.

...

RG, I hadn't seen them before. Really don't know who they are, yet.

But hey, the more the merrier.

Yes the level of workers' struggles in Iran is on the rise.

Let's see what  will happen with this one.

A key mistake of the '79 Revolution was that majority of the Left kept, pushing workers' demands to the side while paying more attention to petty-bourgeoisie and non-working class elements, in the guise of a fictional 'National Unity,' and Vahdat Kalameh and all that garbage.

We shall be especially aware that such a mistake will not occure again. Workers' demands and organizations come before any other social group or formation, be they 'secular,' 'monarchist,' 'republican,' 'self-appointed socialist leaders,'....

We are talking freeing Iran

We are talking freeing Iran first. Once you have Iran you can think of everything. Cart b4 the horse.

Ali Mostofi

//twitter.com/alimostofi

What you 'do' in here is very irrelevant to workers' struggle

in Iran.

To obtain workers' basic freedoms and have a decent life is not 'utopian' but pragmatic and practical. Every civilized people in the world recognize it as such. Apparently the workers in have obtained this minimal degree of civilization. The same can not be said about others who consider acheiving workers' basic rights as Utopian. The approperiate name for that is Third World Peasantish! Dohati Jahan Sevomi.

Hooshang, ignoring the fortune tellers for a moment...

I was wondering What  you think of this organisation. Frankly I had the same question as you had. According to the clip 5 french workers unions are backing this organisation, and I saw something similar from UK's transport workers union a few weeks back...

I very much agree with you about the complex nature of Iran's working class movement. One thing for sure, workers protests are on  the way up at an unprecedented level and rate...

"Personal business must yield to collective interest."

HTG: I believe the work we

HTG: I believe the work we are doing here, fending off irrelevant commentaries about utopias that have taken the Iranians off course is paramount.

Ali Mostofi

//twitter.com/alimostofi

Iranian workers have actually organized two key, independent

syndicates Bus Drivers and Sugar Cane workers. When there's a slightest political opening we shall see tens and hundreds of such independent labor formations in Iran.

Alimostofi, where as actvities of you and likes of yours are limited to posting notes in here, those couragoues workers have risked their lives, families and everything in their struggle to acheive theri goals and obtain their rights. 

Don't beso arrogant, ignorant, in dismising people's struggle in Iran. Educate yourself on the Workers' Movement of Iran.  

There is organized, and

There is organized, and overly organized as in NK. Iranians couldn't organize a pissup in brewery.

Ali Mostofi

//twitter.com/alimostofi

here is the link to the solidarity committee..

//icworkers.blogspot.com/2011/05/solidarity-committees-in-support-of.html

"Personal business must yield to collective interest."

Who's "Solidarity Committees with the Iranian Workers' Movement"

Never heard of them before.

Iranian Labor movement is a bit more complex and complicated than most other countires.

To begin with in Iran we have at least three types of Workers' Organization:

-Workers' Councils,

-Syndicates,

-Unions.

Needless to say each of these forms have therr own unique dynamics, resources and limitations.