Amir Parviz for secular monarchy

Faramarz, I often think about the innocent, unarmed people that

got killed.  "Left behind" is not fair.  What happened is the shah was ordered out of Iran by the USA, and the shah was in no position to go against the capitalist world or the USA all united against him.  The same capitalists, usa who Irans generals followed to their deaths.

You have a selective mind, shah wouldn't have had cancer and died in 1981 had he not been given cancer years earlier and killed like several other of this top advisors in the same way.  Why blame a man and hold a gripe against him based on the blame, when in all fairness he was the object of a betrayal and the victim of a cold blooded attack or do you just not get that after all these years???? Clearly he had a succession plan, but his life was cut short as was his right hand man and his personal doctor. 

"It was all about him" is untrue on so many levels, Your comment is not rooted in reality or understanding of what was going on, close your eyes and continue with your current way of thinking.  If you want some good ideas, you know who to ask. : )

"he thought that Hazrat-e-Abbas would cure his cancer." not true, if that was the case he would not have had his son to personally video tape his last operation in Egypt from which he did not come out alive.  You have lots of blame for the late shah.  He knew what he was up against, with no illusions.  He made an assumption, which was that the USA can betray him but that will be the biggest mistake for them as they will lose Iran eventually and they can not afford that for their own survival.  I'm sure he had could have had no idea how right history would prove him.

Shah himself got killed.  Sure he wanted to confront 1979, but he could not as a king of all the people.  Had he not been a king he would have joined those many that would resist and lose everything, that is what happens when your friends are so stupid as to betray you and spend a war budget in creating propaganda against you with the aim of agitating you society.  It worked, even after the shah was the leader that gave Iranians the happiest most successful renewal and best memories in their recent history.

Amir Parviz Khan

At some point you have to come face to face with the reality that the late Shah was sick and dying and with or without Khomeini he would have been dead by the summer of 1981, a year and a half after he left Iran.

The man did not leave a succession plan behind. It was all about him. And he thought that Hazrat-e-Abbas would cure his cancer. 

And he got a bunch of good and honest people who were left behind killed.

You may want to think about the families of those folks.

Che too dahani khordim

Va bazia hanooz ke hanoozeh daran too dahanemoon mizanan bedoonikeh agleshro dashteh bashan ke che mikonand.

//www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=Zgy0wmu6NKw&v...

Chi misheh goft az democratamoon.

On what happened in 1979 and what was not the reason.

//www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=Zgy0wmu6NKw&v...

Rea on gdp

Iran is actually getting worse off every year, it used to be the 9th richest country in the world headed to being the 5th during the management of the late shah.  So Iran is regressing and that is compounded (made double worse) by a doubling of the population.  So iran has less money and more people.  The salary of a steel worker 35 years ago is what it is today, yet prices have gone up alot.  Russia's momentum is positive, that is it is climbing up in the world in terms of gdp, in 10 years time at the current rate, they will be the 5th wealthiest country in the world and their people the 15th wealthiest (it always takes time for distribution when growth is so rapid etc). 

These are big differences between having a knowledgeable leadership, run by educated and patriotic people who serve others and dictatorships who serve primariliy serve themselves.  That is why Iran lost out big in removing the shah, he was serving the people and by definition was no dictator, he did a better job than iranians could by serving themselves, the late shah was helping iran develop to the point where we could have enough educated people to build the institutions that allow other democratic changes to happen gradually. 

We will need to unite this way as Iranians one day after the democrats/yeltsin lovers, have weakened iran sufficently and the people have learned what works for them and what does not, my only concern is if they leave anythig behind that one can work with, or will they cause iran to disintigrate.  Based on the ideas of people like vpk and he can keep them forever, we may see the USA yet get an opportunity to break up iran, which can only happen if it follows a weak path, based on no capability or system for progress like the shah was able to develop and Putin is doing very well. 

amirparvizfsm

I may be a victim of propaganda but I know the Slavs well, trust me. 

Had to speak my mind about Putin and Russia, that's all. Otherwise, it's your blog, it's about Iranians, so I'm leaving the stage humbly. :o))

Look, VPK

Of kors, Russians are better off today than they were under Yeltsin.

In Iran, people are also better off today than they were 20 yrs ago (GDP per capita, HDI, etc). That's only natural for two countries rich in natural resources.

But my beef with this blog. Apart from lashings and public hangings, where the hell is difference btwn Russia and IRI?

Dear Rea

I don't know all that much about Russia. But from a very naive point of view it seems they are better off than with Yeltsin. The GDP is V shaped. With Yeltsin it went straight down with Putin straight up.

I know he is a bit of a dictator. But given the Oligarchs maybe you need a dictator? I don't mind people getting rich by work like Bill Gates or even Warren Buffet. However the Russian Oligarchs just bought state assets dirt cheap. Why should they?

Iran is a totally different situation. People have been asking for a political voice for 100 years. Frankly I think Iran has more a democracy tradition than Russia. Hence a better chance it will work. Still democracy without a bill of rights is dangerous.

Many places have oil and gas. Not all fare well

Others have different assets, minerals, rivers etc, in the end you have to make use of what you have in the best way for your society. Look at Iran and tel me we lack!!!!! There is something really holding Iran back, from within and with out.

Putin-Medvedev-Putin-Medvedev rotating model is not the one to recommend

why exactly?

Have you forseen the results of it?  Have you considered who their opposition is?  I just get clearer that the idea that democracy can be used to harm the society just hasn't set in and may never, especially when their is no capability for it.

Yet the idea that there are these deeply power hungry corrupt repressive leaders are just doing this for their lust of power for some reason has set in, no matter how patriotically they serve the interests of their people, mostly far better than a democracy could in the exact same circumstances.  This view of dictator, repression, corruption is not just one of ignorance it is the Propaganda you are a victim of.   These guys are Serving, and doing a good job, The truth regarding corruption and lack of genuine choices, (unless you are rich) full of coercion and manipulation is truly the problem of the Empire of the West, not the east.  Now that the East has embraced conscious capitalism they are not what they once were.

"Putin who successfully redirected his country... "

Bachushka is lucky he has oil n gas. 

Otherwise, he's done nothing for his country so far except building his personality cult and making himself bigger than he really is. And stuffing his pockets and pockets of his "yes master" at the expense of poor old Pjotr.

Even if at one stage, I give you that, a "despot éclairé" may have been a necessity in order to preserve country's territorial integrity, the 21st century with it's high tech made Putin and his likes somewhat outdated.

So, Putin-Medvedev-Putin-Medvedev rotating model is not the one to recommend.

Cheers.

Responses

We all get to do something and have some bit to do. If we take the approach of "I am unable to do anything" nothing gets done. One of these days IRI will be gone. I have my proposals and others may have theirs.

You throw them all in and see what gets support. 

A few other things:

• The 8 year war was absolutely Khomeinis choice. There is no way to "mastmali" it. He would have kept it going if not forced to drink the poison and go to hell where he is rotting right now.
• War: Russia had its own problems like 8 years of a drunk named Yeltsin. A very corrupt man who gave away all of Russian wealth to a bunch of thieves. By the supervision of Harvard ***holes.
• I am not sure Iran needs democracy so much as freedom. They are not the same. Democracy is an ill defined term. Freedom means I get to not be hassled for what I wear; or religion. That I get to do business and run it within a sane set of regulations. That my home is not confiscated because of trumped up charges. A democracy without a bill of rights is worse than a benevolent dictatorship.

I think it is very simple to get America on our side. Make a mutually profitable deal with them. The more difficult thing is to get Israel on board. But it is also very possible. America needs someone to keep order in the region. It used to be Iran and may be so again. Israel needs a friend and a partner which Iran may be. Offer them those plus oil and they will be hard pressed to say no. Before dismissing this tell me what ideas do other people have. I see no choice but a deal with America.

No doubt sanam is gettng educated & at our expense.

I wouldn't have any problem if her only value was she does anything the local emam tells her to do, nor would I be upset if her son was a doctor or graduated high school, but he's probably one of our ambassadors today with out any qualifications at all (his chagoo kesh days for the basij doesn't count).

This is not snobery, its valuing education and requiring people to have somethig to give, before they serve, not just being friends with george bush etc.  So many of the people that lead Iran during shahs time were educated in Irans Universities, with parents that were like my sanam, yet they got degrees in law etc and they were a large basis for Irans success.

No doubt sanam is gettng educated & at our expense.

I wouldn't have any problem if her only value was she does anything the local emam tells her to do, nor would I be upset if her son was a doctor or graduated high school, but he's probably one of our ambassadors today with out any qualifications at all (his chagoo kesh days for the basij doesn't count).

This is not snobery, its valuing education and requiring people to have somethig to give, before they serve, not just being friends with george bush etc.  So many of the people that lead Iran during shahs time were educated in Irans Universities, with parents that were like my sanam, yet they got degrees in law etc and they were a large basis for Irans success.

No doubt sanam is gettng educated & at our expense.

I wouldn't have any problem if her only value was she does anything the local emam tells her to do, nor would I be upset if her son was a doctor or graduated high school, but he's probably one of our ambassadors today with out any qualifications at all (his chagoo kesh days for the basij doesn't count).

This is not snobery, its valuing education and requiring people to have somethig to give, before they serve, not just being friends with george bush etc.  So many of the people that lead Iran during shahs time were educated in Irans Universities, with parents that were like my sanam, yet they got degrees in law etc and they were a large basis for Irans success.

Democracy based on the society we have today

Isn't going to be the medicine we need.  Not to be accused of using unrealistic fears, but I see it as completely legitimate that the disintigration of iran is a real possibility if we go towards democracy and the inherent corruption/lack of accountability and mismanagement it will create for a country with no capability to realize such a system, this will kill the patient, not help it. The real task infront of Iranians is in my view tough, especially considering how badly iranans misunderstood the late shah and can't see what a deeply harmful act his betrayal by the USA was for Iranians who too many till this day have little idea how good he was for Iran.

89 years (USA) - and poor "Sanam"

Let's just agree to disagree on "war" and "sanctions" that Iran had, and Russia didn't. "It was all Iran's fault" vs "It was all the West's fault." The truth is most likely somewhere inbetween. 

USA: But the US - did take 89 years to stabilize its Union. From it's Revolution, via a very bloody Civil war - it took almost a century for the country to become these United States. (Revolution: 1776; end of Civil War: 1865)

And a little note on the comment that your naneh or "nanny"/Sandm - is probably running Iran, ie. ignorant, less educated people. Do you think the people flocking to the US on ships, were the Upper Classes? Did they fly here on Concord, or maybe Business Class? If you do, do think again. Americans, you scratch a simple one or two generations, are all "Sanam" the naneh. Meaning, snobbery does not create great nations. I do agree education is important as compliment to democracy. An American friend - herself a doctor - sent me information that Iran now (with all its challenges) is producing  more women doctors, than the US. She was baffled!! I still have to go and check her sources, but wouldn't be surprised. So, maybe "Sanam" is getting more educated! 

The war and sanctions etc were and are a direct result of the

governments policies and its stated goals.

The Iraqi's went to get peace after a short period, yet the IRI made other choices.  Honestly there is no defending a stupid IRI by saying other systems wouldn't have done better, the lady that used to look after me as my nanny "Sanam" is probably running Iran Right now.  Just way off for a govt that has so many bright people and so much money from oil.

Honestly, I don't have anything against you, I may even like you as a person and I hope you make a future Iran your home, where people will have the possibility to enhance their lives and the ability and help they need to create value and value what they create (my definition of Freedom). Your view based on your information and understanding is why democracy just isn't the right approach for iran from scratch, iran can not be more democratic for a long time and it is not with force or peoples wish, it is based on education and freedom and institutions.

The war went on for 8 years & killed hundreds of thousands

Because of Emam Khomeini's refusal to make peace after 1982 and his desire to overthrow Saddam, "liberate" Karbala and to march from Karbala into Qods. That is the main reason that the war went on for another 6 years after Iraqi forces had been largely expelled from Iranian territory in 1982 and after Iraq offered peace terms to the IRI, which Emam refused. The vast majority of deaths and destruction occurred during the years 1982-1988, when Emam finally agreed to "drink the poisoned chalice".

Tough to decide whats Best for Iran, above our own preferences

I think we'd all love for the USA and others to be the friends of Iranians or at least not motivated enemies.  That may not be up to you. Whatever Iranians do it needs to be with widespread support from the start with the highest good of Iran and the world as the primary goal.

Has the west served the highest good for the world?  During their rule of the planet we have had the greatest number of extinctions of species in the history of the planet. //www.pbs.org/wgbh/evolution/library/03/2/l_0... is that something we support whole heartedly?  

89 Years (USA)

Sanctions and War.

WAR: Russia didn't have an 8 year war with one million dead. Look at what the Iraq war has done to the Economy of a superpower (US) - let alone what it must have done to the economy of Iran. Aside from economic damage - the human damage cannot be underestimated, either. At least the Amerians only got 4,000 of their own killed - Iran had 500,000 (half of the million) killed.

SANCTIONS: Russia didn't have 30 years of sanctions. 

89 Years - And... the USA: Oh -- and America itself? From it's "Revolution" - via a very bloody Civil War - the official number is: 89. It took the US 89 years to stabilize into a "Union".

Regardless of who might be in power in Iran - add an Internationally funded 8 year War, and 30 years of Sanctions - to any "leader" of your choice for Iran - or for any country, for that matter -   and in my humble opinion, their challenges would be identical. That doesn't take away from "personal responsibility" that I agree with you on - but I am living in a US that is currently recovering form a decade of War. To expect Iran, with infinitely more casualties (500,000 vs. 4,000), a much smaller economy, and 30 years of sanctions to boot - to jump right back on the bandwagon - surprises me.

Western democracy is the ability to choose based on

coercion, manipulation and deceit, if we don't have a better system than that, democracy will not have a life in Iran or at least a chance.

from transparency report. at google //www.google.com/transparencyreport/

Google
experienced a 71% jump in UK government and court requests to remove
content from its web search, YouTube and other services.

The figure relates to the period between January and June this year compared to the previous six months.

The search site said it received 65 requests for a total of 333 items to be removed over the period.

Google said six of the requests related to videos on its
YouTube site that raised national security concerns. Twelve were court
orders linked to defamation, privacy and other issues.

So give people a choice but keep them in the dark and select what you let them know???? That ladies and gentleman is not good enough.  And the UK is far better than the USA as a place to live in my opinion, having experienced both.

The anti-shah and anti-autocracy arguments would have my support if you could show me something better for Iran, I think the shah did his very best and was ot perceived correctly by Iranians at all, he worked for the health and well being of Iran and was defeated by Iranians holding views like yours, honestly a pity, at least you explain why you feel the way you do Kh, Kh, Kh not that I agree with you, Shah served iran well in my opinion and achieved the most good, for the most people that Iranians have ever seen in their history.  Reality is Putin is in the process of doing the same now.

Amirparviz

VPK read this 10 times to get that oil is not the root of our complex problem,

You have a right to your opinion and I respect that. But please do not tell me what to think. I am old enough to think for myself. I do not want USA to bomb Iran but that is my business. We are never going to get along until we respect other peoples opinion. Who gave you the right to tell me what to think? I like you and respect you. But don't put yourself above me. You do not know what I know and don't know. Please respect my right to my own views.

I never said oil is the root of our problems. But I don't think USA is out to "keep us backwards". What do they care if Iran is advanced or not. They got far bigger problems than Iran when it comes to competition. No matter how far we get we got 80 million people. China and India together have almost 2 billion people. It is pretty stupid of America to keep Iran back while giving China gets a pass. When it comes to opium most of it goes to the West not Iran.

We are not as important as you think we are. Some Iranians think the universe revolves around us. It does not. If we do real well we may be able to get a few high tech jobs no more thant 1/20 of what China gets.  By the way I have no idea what your definition of feeedom is. By no means are Russia or China free. If you mean economic prosperity USA gets no benefit from a miserable Iran. Misery results instability which America does not want for any place.

Putin

The reason he got to power in Russia is because of Yeltsin. I agree with Ayatoilet. It is not the path to democracy. I don't agree it is the path to hell. That was Yeltsin with his incredible evil and corrupt regime.

Russians just got fed up with so called Democracy. They needed to clean house and Putin is it. But in time they will need real Democracy. The problem is that you do not get it by just voting. You need an informed electorate. A fair system of campaigning not  the one in America. Plus time for the ideas to settle in. Just having people vote with no idea what they do is asinine. People in Iran voted for the VF in 1979 as well. That kind of Democracy is garbage. It is what brought Hitler to power.

I agree that Russia is not a friend of Iran at all. If I had to pick I would pick America. But of course none of them are really our friends. It just happens Russia is worse. We are by ourselves and might as well accept it. 

I disagree

The Russian path is the road to hell. Iranians have been fighting for democracy for over 100 years - it is not a new fight, and it is not a new concept for Iranians. Those institutions entrusted with preserving democracy constitutionally (the mullah [Supreme Leader] in our recent case, but also the Shah in the previous case) ended  up undermining the very democratic system they were supposed to supervise. That does not mean that Iranians can not be responsible democrats but that they put their faith in the wrong "person/s".

Putin has done the same, he has undermined the faith Russians have put in him and re-established a security apparatus that has consolidated power in Russia in his hands. This will NEVER lead to democracy in Russia - without a wholesale shift (i.e. conflict/ revolution). Putin's system, like a virus will self-perpetuate until it is killed and removed from the body.

The Chinese model is completely different. THe Chinese people, have basically agreed to for the sake of economic prosperity to first tackle economic reforms, and later (much later) deal with political reforms. Ordinary Chinese people are proud of that...and are complicit in this strategy - if some of their intelectuals are not. I have travelled extensively in China and that is my personal observation.

Based on the U.S. and Western Style democracies, it seems to me the fundamental flaw in Iranian institutions (or constitutional thinking) is that they entrusted the democratic process within ONE person - rather than a jury of competent individuals with no political affiliation. i.e. in the end it is the Supreme Court in the U.S. that rules on electoral issues, or in Britain it is the House of Lords. While lords in the UK are technically appointed by the Queen, in fact it is the Prime Minister (and Parliament) that actually provides the list. And these bodies are made up of competent and independent jurists (i.e. lawyers) with decades of experience and judgements. This means when they are appointed their true colors are visible or evident to the public or parlimentarians that appoint them...and thus the democratic system preserves itself by appointing those that support the tenets of democracy. And it is NOT one person but 12 or more jurists that are appointed. They can pick one wrong person, but not 12 morons.

Iran's system today, basically self-perpetuates tyranny by puting the department of interior within the jursidiction of the Supreme Leader. This department in turn supervises elections and supervises candidate review (qulifications) and as we all know (a) disqualifies candidates the Leader does not want, and (b) riggs election results. And there is no real system for appealing the rulings. An appeal to the council of guardians is useless - they are all selected by the Supreme Leader and generally run unopposed for elections.

The system can only be fixed if the Council of Guardians is truly independent and not part of the preservation of the theocracy. If there is no bloodshed, it can be changed very easily to conform to a system that will "preserve democracy" - but this means removing power from a single man (either the Supreme Leader or the Shah).

THe required change is to remove the department of interior from supervising and managing elections. An independent board must be charged with that process - whose members are appointed by Parliament only. And, once the guardian council is properly elected, it should provide a way to appeal eny electoral issue. 

So I completely disagree, autocracy will not lead to democracy. Autocracy will manipulate the system so that it preserves itself. 

The simplest way to establish democracy in Iran, is to have the electoral process managed and supervised by an completely independent board - outside of the ministry of interior. THAT my friend should be the singular task ALL IRANIANS rally behind.

I say no to Autocracy of any form. Putin is a disgrace. Putin will fall on his own sword. The Russians have NEVER had anything decent to give Iranians - they have invaded us, taken our land, and undermined our democracy in ways MUCH WORSE than the Brits or Americans. The only difference is they did it secretly. And by the way, they still have an underhanded role in Iran's current political dynamic. Putin is an enemy of Iran.

OUR NATIONAL SHAME IS MISGUIDED

It is because Iran is in the grips of a true tyranny, the hezbollahi
regime in Iran is not Iranian culturally.  It is a corrupt authority,
rooted in poor/uneducated/miseducated class of people that the UN watch
dog reported had executed 300 people in secret with no trial during the
begnning of this year alone!  IRI was imposed on Iran because we were
almost independent and to steal our freedom, it was cynically brought in
the name of human rights by the west using the people of iran (who had
very little leadership or wisdom as to what was going on). 

This is a very very important point.  We need to hand back the Shame to
Americans, British, Israeli's and French for their dispicable and
shameful acts in bringing the IRI and defending them for all these
years.  The majority of the families of people murdered in the Pan Am
flight over lockerbie, said they felt meghrahi was innocent and all the
evidence pointed to "the hezbollahi party in Iran" under khomeini's
orders, but the free media and the west concealed all this in order to
keep the IRI for 32 years now.  They love what khomeii and the IRI did
for them and the shame is entirely theirs to bare, not a people that
were deceived, manipulated by the main stream media and then coerced at
the point of torture by the thugs they unleashed on the people of Iran.

Siavash300 read this 5 times and get into your head what the USA wants
for Iran and stop asking for them to bomb iran, VPK read this 10 times
to get that oil is not the root of our complex problem, it is a
geopolitical one and our freedom is not up for negotiation, they do not
want it, the same way they don't want it for Russia and China.  Yet we
need to learn from russia/china and make it our goal.  Freedom first, ie
National pride, economic growth and development and stability security
all before democracy.  Or else we'll get none.