This is why Israel will bomb Iran!

Yes indeed.

You are right. She is just parroting the stuff she has heard from the usual loudmouth gang. I just don't see her capable of listening to reason and changing her mind. Maybe when she grows up later and starts to act like an adult. Let's hope so.

Dear Zion

I honestly don't think Niloufar knows what she is talking about. All I have seen so far is buzwords used by the likes of Galloway and Finklestein.

I hope that by challenging his/her positions, maybe she/he will learn something out of this. It is always good to know the other sides argument- even if its out of touch with reality.

Dear Asghar

I guess this is the best we'll ever get when she wants to sound "reasonable", alas there is still no argument to find. Can you see any argument in her vitriol?
You see all we did was to "deny" the facts, that is, her positions.
Very logical, no?
How about this "fact" here:
'True that internal Israeli politics are far more open that Iranian ones when it comes to Jews EXCLUSIVELY'
Unfortunately for her, and fortunately for the palestinians, this "fact" is just a shameless lie. All Israeli citizens are equal before law, Arab or Jew, Druze, Samaritan, Bedouin. There are many Arab MPs in Israeli Parliament, there are Arab judges in the supreme court, Arabic is one of the two official languages... .

I don't know, don't you get the distinct image of a spoiled angry girl stamping her foot on the round and repeating her impossible demands until she goes blue? I do. :-)

Lets Try Again Niloufar

You specifically stated that Zionism goes against the tents of
Judaism and Torah. These two "gentlemen", including me, 
asked you for specific proof from the Torah  since you made this
claim. Can you please give us the proof of this from the Torah or
Jewish text since you made this claim. We know of one tiny Jewish
sect who says what you say. Other than that, do you specifically have
any proof? 

Not all Zionists are religious fundamentalists. Its a tiny
fraction- unless you can give us specific numbers to prove your
point. You seem to amplify the small issues with tiny sects of
fundamentalist Jews and tiny sects of anti Zionist Jews to make your
grandiose claims.

Zion gave you specifics as to why you are wrong. You have not
countered with specifics to show otherwise. 

Thank you for calling me a simpleton. However, I think that your
analysis is "simpleton" for equating Zionism with
Fundamentalism. You can bark as much as you want by giving as the
typical loony left propaganda of
Zionism=racism=apartheid=imperialism........Its just not consistent
with the facts on the ground. Both sides are as guilty for what is
happening to them (the Palestinians and Israelis have both made huge
mistakes. For you to place the burden entirely on one side with such
disgusting rhetoric just proves how close minded you are. 

As to your point 3- You total missed the point. Who cares that
they paid 3 times or the dual containment crap. The point is that
this regime says marg bar Israel for 30 years, is now involved in
direct anti semitic propaganda, holocaust denial, elders of Zion crap
and at the same time would purchase weapons from them and welcome
mossad agents to visit them when they need weapons.  

As to the following" True that internal Israeli politics are
far more open that Iranian ones when it comes to Jews EXCLUSIVELY
(over 10,000 Palestinians in Israeli jails). Apartheid South Africa
was also very democratic toward whites ONLY."

This is absolute bullshit. Now who is the simpelton? Israel also has a 20% PALESTINIAN Arab
non Jewish population that are Israeli citizens (over a million Arabs). the 10,000 prisoners you
speak of (actually its probably much higher than that) are 99% from
the occupied territories who were involved in the intifada. I am not
justifying Israels actions only that what you are saying is 100% bull
and dishonest. I am not saying that Arabs have full equal rights in
Israel and that everything is hunky dory. But which country in the
world is free from these issues? Is France free with equality rights
for its Arab citizens? is America always equal to blacks? Is
Australia? Yes, Israel is brutal to Arabs in occupied territories but
not to its own Arab citizens.

You have every right to think this is futile. Be my guest. It
apparently did touch a nerve to see our fellow hamvatans speak such
garbage.  I was not justifying Israel killing Iranians. Where
did you get that from? The title? Get real. 

Finally, you say "One very simple fact that you do not seem
to comprehend: world tensions such as this can only be resolved
through negotiations".

OK- well does this video and its airing to 70 million Iranians
help in negotiations? Will you want to negotiate with people who have
such mentality? Isn't this Ahmadinejad mentality

Asghar

I am afraid it is not that easy!

1. Torah etc: all that these 2 gentlemen did was either a) to deny the fact that Zionism is anti-Jewish in its tenets, or b) argue that modern zionism has basically 'reinterpreted' classical Judaism in order to fit its political objectives. This is a common trait among all fundamentalist ideologies: to play with texts until their own objectives are achieved and/or supported. In this case: 'God gave us this land' leading to the disaster of Israel and misery for Palestinians and the wider region. And oh, btw, we don't really need a Mesiah involved anymore. 

2. Zionism and political Islam and fundamentalist evangelism and fundamentalist Hinduism all have this tendency in common. There is little difference in their nature, but they differ in form. But we get simpletons like yourself and Zion trying to prove that one form of fundamentlism is superior to another. No my friend! No amount of name calling and 'anti-left' jingoism by any of you is going to hide the fact that Zionism is a fundamentalist idelogy that feeds on the blood of innocents.

3. In case you missed it, Israel was paid in cash for the arms it sold Iran, and at a rate that was about 3 times the market rate. All that proves is that they are willing to sell their soul for any price. And I doubt that they meant to save Iranian lives. On the contrary, the idea was to ensure that Iran could carry on fighting so the war would not end. It is called a policy of 'dual containment' that was also applied by the Americans to both Iran and Iraq. And btw, Israel was also the agent that the CIA used to support the Afghan mujahedin with all kinds of arms throughout the 80s. And FYI, Israel consumes Iranian oil through European agents. But no doubt this you would see in a different light.

4.True that internal Israeli politics are far more open that Iranian ones when it comes to Jews EXCLUSIVELY (over 10,000 Palestinians in Israeli jails). Apartheid South Africa was also very democratic toward whites ONLY. It is also true that Israel is far more ferocious and barbaric when it comes to foreign enemies compared to Iran now or before. What are you doing defending such a dangerous warmonger?

5. It was futile of you to try and use this stupid video to justify an Israeli massacre of innocent Iranians. Israel has enough blood on its ugly hands already. Shame on you for selling innocent Iranian lives to an Apartheid Regime.

6. One very simple fact that you do not seem to comprehend: world tensions such as this can only be resolved through negotiations. Threats, wars and fighting may result in victory for one side in the short-term, but they guarantee that the fight will continue. This has been the history of Israel since its misguided inception.

Everything about your piece is disappointing. You, zion and your ilk are on the extreme fringes always cheering on wars. Why do you do it?

Peace!

No Good

Nice try Super Girl, but that won't do. Don't change the subject to the usual cliche vagaries. You asked a couple of loaded questions about Zionism, Judaism and Israel. I answered you. Do you have any arguments to give to counter my points? It is clear you are not. That is what is contemptible about your type.
You are welcome to raise another straw man and cliche compositions, and you will be shown false again there. That is a separate issue.

C'est Tout.

Thanks again Asghar. Both for the eye-opening videos, and for your words of wisdom.

Thanks every one for your post!

I chose the title to draw attention to the IRI's lack of class.
Look who they show and what kind of garbage they support. This type
of programming would not get on the air if it did not have the
government's support. Period. 

And Niloufar, Zion clearly gave you answers with regards to your
claim that zionism goes against the tenets of Judaism/Torah and all you can
do is call him a racist and the rest of the typical
lefty/Dabashi/Finkelstein garbage? You did not give a single source to your claims that Zionisimgoes against the Torah.

Sarlashkar gave you the same answers/questions as well. Even if you say that
you do not agree with the expressions of these idiots on the video,
your rhetoric is intended to bring the same results that they desire. It does not solve the
issue.

The record is clear. Israel has not killed a single Iranian or has
not supplied any Arms that have killed any Iranians. In fact, Israel
has supplied arms the the IRI when it was desperately fighting the
Iraqis. Conversely, the IRI supports all of Israels enemies, supports
anti semitic views, has Holocaust denial conferences, world without
zionism conferences and you expect them to support the doves in
negotiations with the IRI? You expect them to sit quietly?

Again, no one these days is listening to Finkelkhars or the
Dabashis of the world. Thy are on the Fringe with all their stupid
views. 

What are you protecting here? There are plenty of Israelis and
Zionists who are against their governments policies. Have you heard
of Peace Now or Bat Selem? Where is the internal opposition to the
warmongering garbage that comes out of the IRI. Why does it not
exist? Is it because of the Zionists?

You language and rhetoric is really disappointing!

zion

now u just sound despeperate for an argument. I will deal with your racist idelology more comprehensively in an upcoming blog. c u there no doubt,

Peace!

See, I told you you'll be back in no time

Now, are you finally going to talk about my answer to your question and give reasonable counter-arguments to what I said, or are you going to continue to slander, attack me personally and throw in slogans about Israel picked almost verbatim from typical nonsense of the Islamic regime in Iran?

I think we already know the answer to that, don't we?

twilight zion

dream on! the only thing that is broken is your tired old zionazi record. once again, give up your deep hate for humanity and be at peace with the world. Why do you stand up for apartheid and racism? 

Peace!

A Broken Heart?

Aaah.. What have we here? Did I break your delicate heart, Super Girl? You shouldn't let me do such things.
I have a lot of respect for ordinary Iranians, it is the members of the Islamist Leftist Alliance of Morons that I have contempt for.

A good example is you yourself: You start by behaving supposedly in a calm and rational manner and ask seemingly reasonable questions. Once they are answered you resort nothing but innuendo and to name calling. Only prove you have no counter-argument to provide and instead start throwing verbal garbage. This I find utterly contemptible. Not enraging, just contemptible.

Now don't worry, It'll pass and you will feel like your usual Super Girl again.

peace! be upon you. As-salaamu aleyik yaa bint al-hudaa!

Calm down zion

I know I have exposed your contempt for ordinary Iranians, and the fact that you are an unquestioning and blind slave to a racist ideology. You clearly have no care that millions of Iranians are at risk of being annihilated by the Apartheid Regime of Israel, as you patently fail to express any concern for them or to utter any criticsm of Israel.  But it is no excuse for you to get rude.

Try to reach beyond your nonsensical dogma and release yourself from the bonds and self-loathing that come with supporting racism and apartheid. You will feel better about yourself, I promise you.

Peace!

Sad to watch

I always welcome the rants that makes the mask of moderation your likes try to wear slip, but the level of nonsense you are demonstrating here is quite sad to watch. 

<i>I for one will NOT let you get away with such audacious disregard for humanity.</i>

Really? Who are you? What <i>audacious disregard  for humanity</i> are you talking about? Israel has nothing against the people of Iran, it is the regime whose claims you so pathetically parrot that is posing an existential threat to Israel. It is this regime and this ideology that is in <i>despicable</i> disregard of humanity, of the people of Iran first and foremost and of Jews particularly as is clear from these videos and myriad of other documents and records, and of every one else who does not bow down to their dogma and refuses to be a parroting useful idiot either. 

 It is the regime in Iran that has to go, for Iran's sake, for Israel's sake and for the sake of all humanity. There would be no war then, and all efforts are made to avoid any such catastrophic war. 

Twilight zion

Yet another typical performance by you. Playing the victim as most warmongerng zionists do. FACT is: millions of innocent Iranians are facing an existential threat to their lives from this menace in the Middle East and their imperialist zionists backers in USA. All you have to offer is to make an excuse for these dangerous war criminals by holding up a stupid video as an excuse for their blood thirsty behaviour. I for one will NOT let you get away with such audacious disregard for humanity.Twist and dance around the truth all you like, we can see clearly that you would sell out millions of innocent lives quite happily in order to safeguard your precious zionism, with your bizzare, childish, hypocritical and ridiculous lack of reason.  

Peace!

that's rich coming from

that's rich coming from agents of a terrorist regime in occupied palestine!

Sigh

Yes Niloufar, as much as reality might sound funny and unblievable to you, that is what it is. Balfour declaration simply recognized Jewish right to the land. It might interest you to know that he was compared to Cyrus for this. That was the right thing to do. It did not allow the formation of a Jewish state, merely recognized historical facts and allowed Jews to settle in parts of the land of their ancestors. Britain did have many reasons for this. That does not affect the validity of the Jewish position towards its land. Of course Britain constantly broke the promises in the declaration in favor of Arabs, true to its colonialist interests, since there were much more Arabs than Jews and Britain had always good relations with Arab leaders. It was not only Britain that recognized Jewish rights, but the first league of Nations as well. So did the United Nations ultimately, but for that Jews had to fight the British forces to gain independence fo their state. These are facts my dear, at least in the real world. Maybe not in the Bizarro world your psyche probably inhabits, but in the real world this is the way it was.

I will criticize Israel where criticism is due, as I have done in the past discussions with others when the occasion arose, but if you expect I will give up my people's natual right to their historical home for the sake of idiots here and there, you are very mistaken.

You can continue writing like this and exposing your truly bizarre, childish and ridiculous logic, and the dogmatic biases that have filled you with paranoia and hate.
What will come of it?

Hilarious

Zion you really take the biscuit man! True to form as always!

Let me see if I got this right: you are now saying that the Zionist colonization of Palestine was a genuine anti-colonialist struggle against the Brits to free 'our' land! BRILLIANT! What amazing imagination dude! LOL!

By the way, ever heard of the Balfour Declaration and the fact that the Brits were totally responsible for the creation of Israel? And I am sure you also know that the only Cabinet member of the time to oppose the Balfour Declaration was a Jew, and he did so because he did not want to be told that he was not a Brit just because he was a Jew, and he also correctly anticipated that the Declaration would lead to more Anti-Semitism. But don't let mere reality disturb your hallucinations my friend.

Oh and there is another one: the consistently warmongering regime that has on several occasions openly threatened to attack Iran (even at the level of the Deputy Prime Mininster, which makes it much more 'official policy' than a stupid video) is actually fighting for the 'survival' of the Jews by threatening a nuclear holocaust on the only other country that still has a sizeable population of Jews in the region? WOW! What an amazing line of reasoning! That's just like a typical Zionist argument. Here is a hint: peace might be a good way to save lives, unthinkable as it may be for you.

Thanks for the entertainment. You never fail! But I was right: you are a TOTAL waste of time. A reasonable person would see that both sides of this antagonism are to blame, but you are here only and only to defend 'our' land (i.e. their land) without any sense of self-criticism. You dress it all up in a pretty language, but it is clear what you are about.

One suggestion: if you are going to constantly spew out Zionist garbage and propaganda, do it with someone else. I can't help exposing your trash.

Peace!

Glad

The title of this post is not justifying an attack. It is warning Iranians and reminding them of the real source of the threat. Any effective effort to curb a possible war is to know the cause of the problem and to defuse it before it goes off.

Iran is different from the Islamic revolutionaries you dig. They fought for 7 extra years to liberate Jerusalem and are the documented world center of terrorism. Israel has fought for her survival, and was either attacked or provoked to defend herself and her citizens. That is what free men do.

I am not more catholic than you or the pope. Such videos are clear evidence that we, all of us normal people of healthy minds, are facing a new form of Nazism in our life time. This is a sruggle not only for freedom, but for survival. And my dear Niloufar, I did expand on the historical facts of Israeli fight of independence against British colonial forces in our land in length, just as I have done in this thread. And Just like now, you merely reiterated your usual allegations and insults and then vanished. I wonder why?

In any case, I am truly glad to read your latest comment Niloufar. As always it is good to get your type to talk. Especially once your feeble tactics are met and your loaded questions answered.

I just want to quote you. I think that suffices:

-Consipracy theories like this are found all over the world.
-Islamic revolutionaries defense of Islamic democracy
-This lunatic of a country , has in recent months threatened ... to 'destroy' a nuclear weapons programme that does not exist.
-A very likely outcome would be a nuclear attack on Iran since Iran's firepower is too great for Israel to cope with in a conventional war.
-I don't know if this video is IRI 'state policy' as you claim.
-But I can't let Israel's crimes go so easily on

Enough said.

Zion

It is always amusing to debate with you but one also gets the distinct feeling of one's time being wasted with a simpleton with a condescending attitute, desperately trying to sound like an intellectual.

But my dear, how can I ever forget your unique obscurantism with that famous description of Zionism as 'a successful anti-colonial' movement!

And then to witness your laughable struggle here to describe an original fundamentalist movement that bases its whole legitimacy on story books written thousands of years ago by 'god' for his 'chosen people' as 'secular'. Zionists are truly acrobatic with the truth.

To answer your ill-conceived question: we are dealing with one of the worst warmongering regimes in the world with hundreds of nuclear weapons. This lunatic of a country that is CONSTANTLY at war with its neighbours, has in recent months threatened a holocaust against the Palestinians and threatened an attack against Iran to 'destroy' a nuclear weapons programme that does not exist. Now somebody putting up a stupid video up here to try and 'justify' such madness on behalf of this blood-thirsty country with a title that exposes its menacing purpose needs to be reminded who the real aggressor in this game is.

Let me take a little time to remind you of certain realities that you may find unpalatable: Iran has for over 200 years not attacked any of its neighbours save for some minor skirmishes, and certainly not under your beloved Mullahs. Now do I really need to remind you of all the wars that Israel has been engaged in? No point really, because you will find some excuse to justify all of them. Zionists do that, endlessly and tirelessly. But it is hardly convincing my friend. If Israel was at all interested in peace, it would not be so keen to murder so many people and so often.

Now, an attack on Iran by Israel would lead to a massive regional war, if not a global one. A very likely outcome would be a nuclear attack on Iran since Iran's firepower is too great for Israel to cope with in a conventional war. My people and my family are being threatened with annihilation.

So the REAL question, my little twilight zion is: Where is your criticism of so much death and destruction done in the name of...well, not sure what it is in the name of! Ziofascism?

While Iran is seriously threatened with a nuclear holocaust by a warmongering state such as Israel, tell me:

Why are you being so much more catholic than the Pope Zion?

And if at all possible, please do not avoid the question like you did with your 'anti-colonial' disaster that you never bothered to explain - for understandble reasons though it has to be said.

Peace!

Niloufar joon, Now I am confused!

When you say you are talking about the "actual text of the Torah", which "actual text" are you referring to?

Can you give me the actual text? What text are we talking about?

If you are talking about the coming of the messiah as a pre condition to the creation of a jewish entity, I am telling you that 95+% of devout jewish authority has waived this pre condition and has differentiated between a modern nation state of Israel and a religious state of Israel which has no relation to a modern nation state in legal terms. These are literally two different concepts (apples and oranges). Please clarify. I hope you are not doing what Ahmadinejad does.

Supporting Regime change in Israel is rather extreme. What kind of Regime change are you proposing for the Israelis? This is a nation state recognized by the overwhelming majority 90% of the countries in the world. Its is also recognized by Egypt, Jordan & Turkey. Israel also has relations with the Gulf States, Morraco, Tunisia.....As much as you like to have Israel look like South Africa. It does not. Sorry.

Although Israel at times goes to far in its treatment of Palestinians and treats them brutally, Israel does not mistreat its own citizens like the IRI does. If Israel mistreated its own citizens, I would be for regime change in Israel like you as well. However, Israel offers a Dmocracy to its Citizens (IRI DOES NOT), total freedom of religion to its citizens (IRI DOES NOT), total freedom of press (IRI DOES NOT), equality between sexes (not perfect but better than any Islamic country and 1000 times better than the IRI), Poor and substandard equality to its Arab Citizens (but still better than any other Arab country treats their own Arab Citizens and better than the IRI).

Solh va movafaghiat!

Niloufar

You are misinfomed my dear about the Torah and about Judaism. So let me put your mind at ease. First, Judaism is not just a religion, not in the sense that Islam or Christianity are. Jews comprise a nation, a people, a culture, and a part of that, a big part during the exile years for keeping the idenitity, is religion. So there are no dogmatic tenets of Judaism as you refer to them, unlike say Islam or Christianity who have a set of basic dogmas and well defined doctrines to believe in. Judaism is a culture and like all things cultural does not accept this kind of sharply defined tenets.

Also, there is nothing, nothing, in the Torah that in anyways forbid Jews from establishing their state in their land. To the contrary, the Torah, the entire Tanach, is the record of struggles of a nation to do exactly that. What you are referring to erroneously is a specific tradition in the Talmud. There is areason Talmud takes that position. The time of Talmud, after the destruction of the second Temple, was preceded with several huge jewish revolts against the Romans which were brutally put down leading to huge massacres of Jews. Talmud at its time tries to put down the next round of Jewish revolts against Rome because of the risks envolved. I wonder why a self acclaimed atheist has to resort to such debates, but if you insist, the conditions under which Talmud states its position also envolve certain promises and pacts with Gentiles that they were expected to observe. It is commonly accepted today that those vows were uttrely made void after the pogroms and the Holocaust and thus the statehood is accpeted as a prelude to the ultimate Messianic age of peace and propserity in the future. Personally I and many many other Jews could not care less of such irrelevant religous details and pilpul, but since you asked I am answering you. That is what Sarlashkar Gholami was trying to tell you. The bulk of religous Jewish heads and authorities accpet and support Israel based on this and that is what defines the religous decree at this time. You are saying you know more of myriads of Rabbis around the world about Jewish halacha?

You are thus wrong to assume Zionism is undermining Jewish religous tradition. The correct thing to say is that Zionism is a secular movement and thus is neither restricted by such details,, neither based on them. Like all things secular Zionism has no position vis a vis the religious aspects in Judaism. It is a national movement.

Unlike what you claim, Israel is not fomed by invading "palestinian land". There was no "palestinian" land, people or identity. There was a vast land under Ottoman rule and later British mandate who was populated by different people, with an arab majority. That is all. Jews were always an indegenous people of a small part of that vast land, known in Europe as palestine since Roman times, espiet their years in exile, because they of their surviving identity. Because that is what Jewish idenitity entails.
In the same way, unlike your mistaken position Israel is not an apartheid state. It is comprised as Jews and Arabs, with two official languages and the positiosn of power open to both Jew and arab alike. It is a Jewish state in the sense that she is besides this also meant to be a safe haven for Jews worldwide, were they can always turn to, look for support and be able to be totaly free to practice their rites. Arabs of course have many many lands to do this and do not face extermination threats as Jews have done in all their histories.

So why do lieks of you insist on demolishing Israel and takingt this aspect out (since that is the main difference between the present state of Israel and your alleged "one state solution". Let's just assume for the sake of argument that this policy is implemented. What is going to stop Arabs from suppressing Jews as they have always done in the history of the region. Since the charters of palestinain choices fo government clearly denies any Jewish connection to the land and Jewish rights. Islam denies Jews equal rights as you can see in Iran herself. It is certain that the same fate will befall Jews in your "solution" state, if not much worse. Actually given the expulsion of Jews from Arab lands and many pogroms and massacres by Arabs of Jews before the state of Israel was formed, in Jerusalem, in Baghdada, in Damascus.. and given the many times clear stated vision of "throwing Jews into sea" which was and is very popular among Arab populations, what Jews will face in your ingenous state is total destruction.

Where as Arabs have the same political rights as Jews as long as they are citizens of Israel, and freedom to practice any religion, any life style and any belief system the demand for abolishment of Israel is a disguised demand to eradicate Jewish presence in their homeland toned down and embelished in nice wrappings of political correct promises. That is all.

Nice try though!

Why do you think you have to bring about such issues, make such vile claims and accusations precisely under a thread about a video that already demonizes Jews and Zionists enough?
How come you cry out:

'But I can't let Israel's crimes go so easily on '

but do not feel the same urge to not let IRI's crime go so easily on? Why is it that there, you need to hear all sides, including Islamist rulers of Iran's view, and seek a gradual evolution of the butchers of your own people?

At least, you can hear part of their views here, can't you? Or is it too embarrasing that you have to resort to such tricks:

'I don't know if this video is IRI 'state policy' as you claim.'

Really? You think such views can be expressed in public TV under such a system without being approved first? Do you think this can be the case for a systematic repetition of such programs and declarations in Iranian state TV otherwise? These are documented cases, my dear. Choose your words wisely.

Why being so much more catholic than the Pope Niloufar?

Wow, this is Unblievable !!

These Zahakan have no honor, character or sense of
decency.

But then again we already knew that didn't we? :D

B.K.

Sarlashkar Gholami khan

You are chipping at the edges, but not addressing the issues. Like I am talking about the actual text of the Torah and you throw numbers at me.

Actually, the only real difference between us is that you support regime change in Iran, but you are a Zionist supporter, whereas I support regime change in both countries. I believe in co-existence and resisting sectarianism, but you only appear to believe in the 'existence'  ('there is a Jewish state') of one of those 2 regimes, and you are into 'strongly opposing' only one of them.

I think that makes you a little one-sided.

Peace!

Niloufareh Aziz...

1) I did refute your statement that "Zionism is against the basic tents of Judaism". I gave you numbers. Most Jews, including religious Jews who strictly follow the tents of Judaism, recognize the "Zionist" state. They are two different things. Only a minority (a very small minority) believe that no state of Israel should exist until the Messiah comes. You have picked the belief amongst a very tinny minority of the Jewish community to make you point-like the President of the IRI these days. If you look at the numbers I gave you, the vast majority of Jews in the world (95+ %) believe in the right for the "Zionist" entity to exist as a Jewish state. So the creation of the state of Israel have not undermined the core message of Judaism as you would like to see.
2) as to the following claim " Furthermore, Zionism is dispicable because it is made exactly out of the stuff of fascism. It feeds on racism and promotes segregation and ethnic cleansing, and it is based squarely on European colonialism. No rational person could support it."
This is just utter nonsense and propaganda. Jews are not a race. Its a religion. You have Arab Jews, black Jews, chinees Jews, afghani Jews, Russian Jews, German Jews, Pilipino Jews, Ethiopian Jews....All different races. Can you please give us the elements of Fascism and apply them to those elements to that apply to the state of Israel (and I'm not talking about the occupied territories)?
As to your suggestion that it is based on European Colonialism. There were Jews living in Palestine for 2000 years- I don't think we would have a state of Israel (in the form it exists today) if it was not for WWII- WWII is not colonialism.
3) As to the following: You can shout all you like about 'Arabs' but the fact remains that it was the Zionists that invaded Palestinian land and colonized it, and then went on to continue with ethnic cleansing for another 60 years right up to today.
There was no Invasion prior to 1948. Armies invade. Please stop the mischaracterizations of the facts. There was a mass migration after WWII. The world had no place for them. Unless it was Alaska or something else. UN partitioned the land. Post 1948, there were more mass migrations- but from Arab and Islamic lands- due to Arab miscalculations. As to your "ethnic cleansing" claim. This is partially correct and partially not correct. If it was completely correct, Israel would not have a 20% Arab population who are its citizens today (not counting the occupied territories). Yes there were elements in the Israeli government who took advantage of the 1948 war and disposessed Palestinians from their land. But again, Jews were also met with the same tragedy from Arab lands. They to lost property and land.
4) As to the following: I believe that the land should be shared in a non-sectarian and democratic way. What exactly is wrong with that? You are the one with an extreme rhetoric especially as the concept of 'sharing' would not even occur to you.

There is a Jewish state. Either you live with it or you fight it. I don't think you will be able to convince many Jews today to "share it". At least their democracy is 1000 years more advanced than the IRI system. Perhaps in a few hundred years when humanity figures out how to live in harmony regardless of ethnic and religious hatred, the Jews will hear your Kumbaya calls for sharing and caring. Right now, in the middle east, the Arabs and Moslems can not share their land in a "non-sectarian and democratic way". Why do you expect this from the Jews when the Moslems can't do it? Jews are human to you know.
I really did not consider my self an extremist. I guess hoping for a two state solution between the Israelis and Palestinians, opposing any invasion of my homeland Iran, strongly opposing the IRI (who ethnically cleanses Sunni Arabs, Bahais, Zoroastrians, Suffis, Baluchis, Azaris & Kurds and any Non believers in the Velayt eh Fagih,) makes me an extremist.

Sarlashkar Gholami joon

You are right. I am not sure about the numbers involved, but it is interesting that you did not refute the basic argument itself: that Zionism is against the basic tenets of Judaism. Would you care to discuss that? The fact that Zionists have undermined the core message of Judaism.

Furthermore, Zionism is dispicable because it is made exactly out of the stuff of fascism. It feeds on racism and promotes segregation, land theft and ethnic cleansing, and it is based squarely on European colonialism. No rational person could support it just like no rational person could support Apartheid South Africa, but both Israel and America did as official state policy. Can you explain why? Try an 'axis of racism' as a hint.

You can shout all you like about 'Arabs' but the fact remains that it was the Zionists that invaded Palestinian land and colonized it, and then went on to continue with ethnic cleansing for another 60 years right up to today.

As for the Jews moving anywhere: when did I suggest such a thing? It is your paranoia and extremism that leads you to such inflammatory conclusions. I believe that the land should be shared in a non-sectarian and democratic way. What exactly is wrong with that? You are the one with an extreme rhetoric especially as the concept of 'sharing' would not even occur to you.

In the case of Jews from the region, you know full well that this occurred precisely as a backlash to the injustice done to Muslims by the Zionist colonizers. Not that it was justified in any sense, but where is your balance in recognizing the cause?

As for India and Darfur, I would gladly express my 'outrage' when these subjects are put up for discussion. Why have you not done that yourself if you care so much about them? For the record: yes, Pakistan was a total mistake, and it too, just like Israel, has never really seen peace ever since its flawed inception. It is an apt parallel. Darfur is a completely different case. But I doubt you would know anything about it. But I am sure you would like to use it for more Muslim-bashing like your Israeli and American friends.

I don't know if this video is IRI 'state policy' as you claim. But I did call it utter garbage. It is particularly annoying because it gives fodder to extremist Zionists like you, and gets you up on a high horse to defend a most destructive regime our region has seen in the longest time.

But I can't let Israel's crimes go so easily on the basis of some stupid video produced by some rediculous mullahs. Don't imagine that this gives extremists like you the chance to support a barbaric bombardment of Iran by some poxy little racist state. It is you who is the cause of the absence of peace. Even your name here has war written in it!

Peace!

Niloufar it is clear that

You do not know what you are talking about based on the following statement:

"To take it further: Zionism is against the basic tenets of Judaism that has the return of the Messiah as a precondition for establishing Zion. This is why most devout Jews are against the establishment of the state of Israel."

How many jews are in the world Nilou joon? 12 Mil or 13 Mil?

6+ Million live In Israel. 95+% of them (this includes the ulra urthodox devout jews who are members of the government- look at the mayor of Jerusalem, shas party, Agoudat Israel party ......) are either zionists or support the Zionist Government. About 5+ Million Jews live in the us and 90+% of them support the state of Israel. The only "devout" jews who are against "Zionisim" are the Neturei Karta- The same idiots who met with Ahmadinejad for a visit. Off course there may be other jewish groups who are against zionisim or Israel - but this is in the minority-

The point is that you have no understanding of Jewish history and talk with such absolutism.

People with your extreme rethoric and propaganda style statements is one of the main reasons why the Arabs and Jews have not established peace. You fuel the fires of hatred. What do you suggest? Sending the 5+ million jews to Alaska? What about the 800,000 jews that were kicked out of Arab lands or forced to leave arab lands as a result of the creation of "Zionist colonization of Palestine"? They and there ancestors are the Majority of Israelis today. Where should they go back to? Bagddad? Tunisia? Cairo? Tehran?

The fact of the matter is that there have been such tragedies in history in much larger scale. Look at the millions of Muslims that had to leave India. Much larger than the Palestinian issue. Where is your sense of outrage? Where is your sense of outrage at darfour?

This video is IRI state policy. That is why it matters so don't down play it (as you far lefties always do when you are confronted with something you can not argue with) . This is the type of garbage that lead to the creation of Israel in the first place (in Europe for the past 2000 years). This is the type of garbage that gave the excuse to Zionists to colonize others. This is the type of garbage that lead the UN to vote for partition of Palestine. That is why it matters- So don't down play it. Instead be ashamed that your fellow Iranians hold these views as official IRI policy!

The Mask Slipping Too far?

Niloufar:
'Consipracy theories like this are found all over the world.'

Is that right Niloufar? Are these conspiracy theories formaly adopted by regime outlets and openly broadcast all over the world as well? Do the lunatics, who hold such theories all around the world, have their hands on launch buttons of rockets and bombs, and just happen to be striving for nuclear weapons too?

'Zionism is a despicable... .'
[yawn] Ok, what ever you say dear.
It is just funny how what you claim afterwards is so much in line with the source from which all this nonsense comes from?

What is your real beef with this video? Are they being too honest? Are they not cautious enough anymore and let the mask slip too far? :-)

[Love the irony of that 'peace!' at the end!]

Utter garbage

The video is utter garbage, that is clear. But HOW is this an excuse for Israel to bomb Iran? Consipracy theories like this are found all over the world.

If anything, the drive to war is coming from Israel (it always has in its short and ugly history), so let us not be confused. And Zionism is a despicable and nasty fundamentalist ideology regardless of this stupid video's claims.

To take it further: Zionism is against the basic tenets of Judaism that has the return of the Messiah as a precondition for establishing Zion. This is why most devout Jews are against the establishment of the state of Israel.

Zionist colonization of Palestine has been the most potent catalyst for the rise of fundamentalism in the region since the disasterous Balfour Declaration. Zionists are the original political fundamentalists and they revel in sectarianism, racism and war.

Peace!

Arze maghsod??

I remember my Bahai grandmother referring to the Holy Land as "ard-i-maqsud" for pilgrimage(ziarat)
I do not recall any Bahi calling Iran för that.
And you call these people as "ignorant idiots".
Oh no, they are not. Those who listen to them are. Any person with a little brain between his ears would question their statesment and check some facts.

Britain is run by Jews over 200 years ??!! and yet does nothing for years to fight Hitler?That is what we say in Persian:"it makes a cooked chicken covered in rice to laugh"
مرغ را لای پلو به خنده می اندازد

SamadAgah You Are wrong

The point is that if the government can do this to the Jews or Bahais, it can do it to all of us. This is the problem with this type of behavior. This is not how you confront international pressure (as you argue). A government that can not confront international pressure with mantegh and reason and has to resort to outright anti semitism is just flat wrong. It only means disaster in the wrong run. Kish o Maat in Chess!