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HISTORY FORUM: Turkey and the Armenian Genocide - 'The Betrayed' (BBC Documentary)
02-Jun-2010
The Armenian Genocide also known as the Armenian Holocaust refers to the deliberate and systematic destruction of the Armenian population of the Ottoman Empire during and just after World War I. The Republic of Turkey to this day continues to deny that it ever happened.
ARARAT (2002) a film by Canadian Armenian director Atom Egoyan starring Charles Aznavour and Christopher Plummer:
The Armenian Genocide also known as the Armenian Holocaust, the Armenian Massacres and, by Armenians, as the Great Crime refers to the deliberate and systematic destruction (genocide) of the Armenian population of the Ottoman Empire during and just after World War I.It was implemented through wholesale massacres and deportations, with the deportations consisting of forced marches under conditions designed to lead to the death of the deportees. The total number of resulting Armenian deaths is generally held to have been between one and one and a half million.Other ethnic groups were similarly attacked by the Ottoman Empire during this period, including Assyrians and Greeks, and some scholars consider those events to be part of the same policy of extermination.
It is widely acknowledged to have been one of the first modern genocides,as scholars point to the systematic, organized manner in which the killings were carried out to eliminate the Armenians,and it is the second most-studied case of genocide after the Holocaust.The word genocide was coined in order to describe these events.
The starting date of the genocide is conventionally held to be April 24, 1915, the day that Ottoman authorities arrested some 250 Armenian intellectuals and community leaders in Constantinople.Thereafter, the Ottoman military uprooted Armenians from their homes and forced them to march for hundreds of miles, depriving them of food and water, to the desert of what is now Syria. Massacres were indiscriminate of age or gender, with rape and other sexual abuse commonplace.
The Republic of Turkey, the successor state of the Ottoman Empire, denies the word genocide is an accurate description of the events (see, Denial of the Armenian Genocide).In recent years, it has faced repeated calls to accept the events as genocide. To date, twenty countries have officially recognized the events of the period as genocide, and most genocide scholars and historians accept this view.The majority of Armenian diaspora communities were founded as a result of the Armenian genocide.
BBC Documentary: Armenian Genocide - 'The Betrayed' :
Part I:
Part II:
Part III:
Part IV:
Part V:
The Armenian Genocide (PBS) - Trailer :
The Armenian Genocide is the story of the over one million Armenians who died at the hands of the Ottoman Turks in World War I. Produced by Emmy Award-winner Andrew Goldberg. Narrated by Julianna Margulies with additional narrations by Ed Harris, Natalie Portman, Laura Linney, Orlando Bloom and others, the program features interviews with Pulitzer Prize-winner Samantha Power, author Peter Balakian and never-before-seen historical footage.
"...powerful... the documentary honors the victims of the Armenian genocide and also pays tribute to dissidents in Turkey who are brave enough to speak out despite government censorship." - Alessandra Stanley, Chief Television Critic, New York Times.
"Serious, literate and ultimately heartbreaking." "...(made with) precision and intelligence." - NJ Star Ledger.
World marks 95th anni of Armenian genocide- April 24, 2010 -Russian TV Report:
Presidential Candidate Sen. Barack Obama Discusses Armenian Genocide ...(January 30, 2008):
President Obama once elected shares views about Armenian Genocide and Turkey's historical responsability to this question - April 06, 2009:
Prime Minister Erdogan's dismisses the question of a Turkish responsability in the Armenian genocide as of "archeological" interest and that he should await definitive conclusions by an Independant Panel - (conference 44th Security Conference held in Munich, Germany, 2008):
Turkey debates on possible preventive actions against the adopting N106 Resolution in the U.S. House of Representatives recognizing the Armenian Genocide:
Resolution unacceptable say's Turkish President :
Charles Aznavour speaks to Turkish ( Or Armenian ? ) Journalists in Paris about the Armenian Genocide and his expectations of Turkey's President to acknowledge it:
Charles Aznavour- Pour Toi Armenie- mobilizes French Artists after the Major Earthquake in the 1990's:
Live Performance:
Iranian Armenian Pop Icon - Vigen - Beh Yadeh Tehran:
Vigen-Baroon Baroone:
Vigen - Parvaz:
Armenian Iranians, Ballet of Zal and Rudabeh:
Related Pictory:
Armenian commemorative coin ( Pahlavi Era)
Iranian Jews celebrate Iran's Constitutional Revolution's 2nd Anniversary (1907)
pictory: (SURPRISE) Shah and Sadat Pro Palestine Statement (1975)
Related Blog:
PUTTIN' ON THE RITZ: Why I won't Sign a Petition or Demonstrate Against Bad Bad Israel ...
Recommended Readings:
Iranian Diaspora Intelligentsia Unite Against Islamic Republic's Holocaust Revisionism By DK
Banalization of history By DK
Mehdi Karroubi Targets Ahmadinejad's Holocaust Denial
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French President pushes new law to criminalise denial of Armeni
by Darius Kadivar on Sat Jul 07, 2012 04:05 PM PDTHollande pushes new law to criminalise denial of Armenian genocide (France 24)
French president François Hollande confirmed Saturday that he plans to push a new law that would criminalise the denial of the 1915-1916 Armenian genocide by Ottoman Turkey. A French court ruled Thursday the law was unconstitutional....
by Red Wine on Tue Feb 28, 2012 09:52 AM PSTJe dédie cette magnifique mars à Don Darius.
* Marche pour la cérémonie des Turcs *
- J.B.Lully
French genocide law: President Sarkozy orders new draft
by Darius Kadivar on Tue Feb 28, 2012 09:36 AM PSTSarkozy orders new genocide law (bbc)
French President Nicolas Sarkozy orders his government to draft a new law punishing denial of the Armenian genocide after a top court strikes down a previous bill.
...
by Red Wine on Fri Jan 27, 2012 01:09 PM PSTداریوش جان فرقش این است که در آن زمان ثابت شد که نازیها با نقشه از قبل طراحی شده یهودیان را به قتل رسانیدند،اما در این زمینه هنوز مدرکی دالِ بر اینکه عثمانی با نقشه قبلی این کار را کرده باشد،موجود نیست،تنها چند سری حرف و چند کاغذ که هیچی را ثابت نمیکند.در ضمن،انگلیس و فرانسه بیشتر مقصرند در قتلِ عامِ مردمِ کشورهایِ دیگر .
Norway apologizes for Holocaust role so Why not Turkey ?
by Darius Kadivar on Fri Jan 27, 2012 10:00 AM PSTNorway apology for Holocaust role (bbc)
The Norwegian prime minister apologises for the role his country played in deporting Jews as Europe marks Holocaust Remembrance Day
Turkey says French bill 'racist'
by Darius Kadivar on Tue Jan 24, 2012 04:55 AM PSTTurkey says French bill 'racist' (bbc)
Jonathan Head BBC News, IstanbulThere has been plenty of strong comment by Turkish officials and in the media over the newly approved genocide bill - one paper likened President Sarkozy to Satan - but in his first comments Prime Minister Erdogan was surprisingly restrained.
For us this law has no validity, he told MPs from his party in Ankara - it will take European values right back to mediaeval times. Turkey, he said, is a big power now - nobody can play games with us.
Mr Erdogan said he would take retaliatory measures against France if President Sarkozy approved the law but did not spell out what they would be, nor did he encourage Turkish people to show their own displeasure.
Beyond symbolic sanctions, like withdrawing its ambassador, it is not clear what Turkey can do. France is its fifth biggest trade partner but economic sanctions are impossible because of the free-trade agreement Turkey has with the EU.
However political and diplomatic relations will remain frozen for some time, especially if Mr Sarkozy is re-elected later this year, and that cannot help Turkey's already faltering candidacy for EU membership.
Turkey vents fury at French vote
by Darius Kadivar on Tue Jan 24, 2012 12:40 AM PSTTurkey vents fury at French vote (bbc)
Turkey reacts with anger after the French Senate approves a bill making it a crime to deny genocide was committed by Turks against Armenians in World War I.
French Senate passes Armenian genocide law
by Darius Kadivar on Mon Jan 23, 2012 02:30 PM PSTFrench Senate passes genocide law (bbc)
The French Senate approves a controversial bill that criminalises denial of the Armenian "genocide", fuelling tensions with Turkey.
20,000 people marched in Istanbul to honor Armenian Journalist
by Darius Kadivar on Thu Jan 19, 2012 01:47 PM PSTAt least 20,000 people have marched in Istanbul to mark five years since the murder of prominent Turkish-Armenian journalist Hrant Dink.
Some of the demonstrators were driven by anger over verdicts delivered this week in the latest trial of people linked to his killing.
Three people were jailed but allegations of official negligence or state collusion were rejected.
Dink's actual killer, Ogun Samast, was jailed earlier for 22 years.
The journalist, shot dead outside the Istanbul offices of Turkish-Armenian newspaper Agos, had angered Turkish nationalists by describing the mass killing of Armenians a century ago as genocide...
by maziar 58 on Fri Dec 23, 2011 06:09 PM PSTdar sal haye 50'
dar Iran ketabi chap shod be nam "ghatle aame aramaneh" by esmaeel raeen
By the time I'd saved enough to buy it It was already cleared under mamnoee!
And never knew it WHY ? back then.
Maziar
...
by Red Wine on Fri Dec 23, 2011 04:15 PM PSTساده اندیشی بعضی از حضرات در امورِ سیاسی که بدان واقف نیستند بسیار مضحک است...این یک جریانِ ساده سیاسی است و تنها اسلحه خاصِ آقایِ سارکوزی برایِ جمع کردنِ رای از طرفِ احزابِ راستِ فرانسه و شاخههایِ افراطیِ این کشور،یک چیزی در حدود بیش از یک میلیون رای !
خیر... هنوز خیلی آنچنان این را قتل عام ندانند،میبینیم که دوستان حتی چند برگِ ساده از آن جنگِ (۱۹۱۳-۱۵-۱۶) مهلکی که در آن ارامنه نیز شرکت داشتند بی خبرند... حال نه از الان چیز میدانیم و نه از گذشته و هزار چیزِ دیگر مدعی هستیم،وای اسفا !
Genocide it was
by Rea on Fri Dec 23, 2011 01:01 PM PSTBut not be confused with the French elections.
Simorgh Jan
by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Fri Dec 23, 2011 12:40 PM PSTYou are very welcome and I agree about life outside IC and your points including meaning of friend. My point on Armenia is that it needs Iran to survive. Given its geography Iran is its best neighbor.
Turkey is moving the wrong direction. Its people still seem to idolize Islam. My observation is Iranian people are going the right direction. Once Islamic Republic goes we are done. But Turkey is just beginning down the road to Islamism.
Hope to hear more from you because we need more sane posters. We may disagree but I get something out of discussions with you. Best of luck with your outside IC life :-) Perhaps I will get one for myself.
VPK jan
by Simorgh5555 on Fri Dec 23, 2011 12:02 PM PSTThank you for your kind words. My life outside Iranian.com has been very busy recently....Maybe thats not a bad thing. I broadly agree with you save I think that the word friend is overrated when it comes to.international politics. I'm not impressed with Erdogen. From his Hijabi wife to his manufactured crisis with the Floatila accusing Israel of murdering its citizens when he sends his own troops to neighbouring Iraq to kill Kurdish troublemakers.
Turkey is unlikely to apologise or even acknowledge the Armenian genocide because of international law.
Simogrh
by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Fri Dec 23, 2011 11:24 AM PSTI missed you have you been out for a while; nice seeing you! Of course you are absolutely right about ADL and Israel. The right thing is to admit reality. It is not worth *** Armenians to appease Turkish revisionists.
Armenia never sent a "Flotilla" to Israel but Turkey did. No matter how much Israel kisses up to Turkey they will not be a good ally. Armenia is a better friend for them. Might as well do the right thing because it is right both morally and politically.
Armenian Genocide is a real tragedy
by Veiled Prophet of Khorasan on Fri Dec 23, 2011 11:18 AM PSTThank you DK. We need to acknowledge this horrible thing . Safavids did the right thing for once and gave them refuge. Thankfully Islamic Republic has not ruined our relation with Armenia or not yet.
I am glad France is recognizing this and it behooves Turkey to admit it and move on. Modern day Turks are not responsible but as a nation they must get history right. Just as many nations have accepted past actions both good and bad.
I believe that Iranian Armenian relationship is vital. Much more important than many recognize. Armenia is a land locked nation which depends on Iran for access. Iran in turn needs Armenia to check pan Turkics with greedy eyes on our territory. Armenia will never accept pan Turk rule over Iranian Azarbayjan. Because it is dangerous to its survival. I have read many Armenian blogs and know how many view Iran: as close friends. We need all the friends we may have. Armenia is God send to Iran!
Erdogen#2
by Simorgh5555 on Fri Dec 23, 2011 10:38 AM PSTEven more shameful was the Jewish groups such as ADL for refusing to acknowledge the mass murder of Armenians as genocide because of the strategic alliance (well maybe not now!) between Turkey and Israel. It took Foxman a while before he finally capitulated and acknowledged the genocide which had taken place. Absolutelty shameful.
Erdogen
by Simorgh5555 on Fri Dec 23, 2011 10:28 AM PSTTwo wrongs don't make a right.
This is all a game. To apologise would give Armenia a right to persue compensation and war damages through an international court. It is the same as the United Kindom which refused to apologise for slavery in 2008 marking the 200th anniversary of Lord Wilberfoce's law to ban slavery. Instead the UK government expressed "Regret"- 'Sorry' would mean paying descendents of slaves could claim for enormous damages.
Erdogan say's "French Burned Algerians en masse in ovens"
by Darius Kadivar on Fri Dec 23, 2011 10:18 AM PSTMr Erdogan said there were "massacres" in Algeria where Algerians were "burned en masse in ovens
How Childish ...
Turkey accuses France of genocide
by Darius Kadivar on Fri Dec 23, 2011 10:15 AM PSTTurkey accuses France of genocide (bbc)
Turkey accuses France of genocide in colonial Algeria, after French MPs backed a bill criminalising denial of genocide in 1915-16 Armenia.
Turkey retaliates for French bill
by Darius Kadivar on Thu Dec 22, 2011 08:27 AM PSTTurkey retaliates for French bill (bbc)
The Turkish prime minister announces punitive measures against France after its parliament passes a bill criminalising denial of the Armenian "genocide".
red wine
by Fesenjoon2 on Tue Dec 20, 2011 03:59 PM PSTدرود
من نیز امیدوارم که ایرانیان جایگاه خویش را دوباره بیابند (هر چند که در این روزگار از این بابت بسیار ناامیدم).
لیکن من نیز با جایگاه دین به خودی خود مشکلی ندارم (گرچه از نوشته هایم شاید اینطور استنباط نشود). مطلوب من جدایی کامل دین از سیاست است. ولی متاسفانه ترکیه نیز در همان مسیری قدم می گذارد که انتهایش به جمهوری اسلامی ایران و پاکستان و افغانستان ختم می شود. خسته شدیم بس که عمری با چماق دین و پتک تقدس بر سرمان زدند. و چه تاسف برانگیز خواهد بود اگر ترکیه نیز آینده اش مثل ایران تاریک و دلگیر باشد.
یلدای شما نیز گرامی باد.
...
by Red Wine on Tue Dec 20, 2011 02:40 PM PSTشاراتی بس جالب فرمودید.
کمال پاشا هیچگاه نظرِ ترکان را در قبالِ نظراتش جویا نشد،در واقع سود جوئیِ ایشان زمانی آغاز شد که ارتشِ بزرگِ عثمانی اندکی بعد از جنگ ضعیف شد و باز دستِ پنهانی انگلیسیها نمایان شده و اینان سنگ اندازیِ فراوان کردند تا کمال پاشا با خیالِ راحت افکارِ کثیفش را در این سرزمین عملی سازد،آنگونه که هیتلر عمل کرد،کمال پاشا نیز بدین نحو عمل کرده و شبانه بسیاری از بزرگان،خوانین،سیاسیون،فلاسفه،نویسندگان،شیوخ را به قتل رسانید و مردم هیچ نفهمیدند که چرا این شخص بدین شکل تمدنِ این قومِ بزرگ را تغییر داد.
مشخص است که اینها در ظاهر و باطن مسلمان هستند و بدان ایمانِ کامل دارند،مشخص است که اردوغان در این کشور به خوبی عمل کرده،مردم از ایشان حمایت میکنند و افرادِ لأییک پراکنده میشوند.
ما هیچ گونه استقبالی از اسلامیون نمیکنیم،هیچ گونه علاقه و دلبستگی به این مذهب و دیگر مسائلِ مربوط به آن نداریم،ما تنها بر این عقیده هستیم که با ایمان و فرهنگِ یک مملکت نمیشود بازی کرد ،همانا این نظر را در قبالِ ایران نیز داریم و مطمئنیم که زمانی میرسد که ایرانیان جایگاهِ واقعیِ خودشان را پیدا خواهید کرد.
در موردِ ارامنه باید بگوییم که پدر بزرگِ بنده،چند عمو زاده پدری و چند وابسته و شازده دیگر در آن زمان رفت و آمدهایِ فراوان به سرزمینِ عثمانی داشتند،در زمانِ خودش چند مطلب در این رابطه خواهیم نوشت،هلو کاستِ ارامنه نیاز به بحث و تفحصِ فراوان دارد.
یلدایِ شما فرخنده باد.
Red Wine
by Fesenjoon2 on Tue Dec 20, 2011 11:23 AM PSTبله. کسی نبایست دخالتی کند. اما حرف من حرف دیگریست:
اینهایی که اینقدر دم از دموکراسی ترکیه و نظام مردم سالاری اسلامی میزنند متوجه نیستند که ترکیه امروز همان ترکیه صد سال پیش است که ارامنه را قتل عام کرد. اگر امروز مردم سالار بنظر میرسند فقط و فقط دلیلش موفقیت نسبی در وضع امرار و معاش جامعه آنهاست. اگر اقتصادشان همانند دیگر کشورها رو به کاستی بره آنوقت است که باز چهره حقیقیشان را خواهید دید. ترکیه اصالتا یک مملکت اسلامگراست. من هم آنجا مسافرت کرده ام. فکر کنم شما هم قبول دارید که نظام سکولاری آتاتورک در ترکیه رو به موت است و دیر یا زود ترکیه چهره ی اسلامی خود را باز نمایان خواهد ساخت. اینها چه بسا از ایرانیان نیز معتقد و دیندارترند. همین الانش هم ادعای الگو بودن برای سایر ممالک اسلامی را دارند. درست همانند عصر عثمانی ها. پس حقیقتا چیزی عوض نشده. ترک ها همان بازماندگان عثمانی ها هستند: مغرور و پرمدعا. ما هم همان بازماندگان نظام صفوی هستیم: موجوداتی خراتفاتی و نزاع طلب که در سایه عثمانی ها زندگی میکنیم و از اینکه آنها در منطقه استیلای فرهنگی و سیاسی دارند ناخرسندیم. قبول کنید که ماهیت کسی در این سیصد سال عوض نشده. همانطوریکه شاه عباس برای ارامنه در اصفهان کلیسا ساخت امروزه ایران نیز به ارامنه پناه داده و اینجا و آنجا اعتراض به رفتار ترکیه میکند. همانند دیروز توان شکست روسها را نداریم. دیروز ترکمانچای بود. امروز حقوق بیست درصدی دریای خزر. حتی نظام ایران نیز عوض نشده. کماکان یک نظام شاهنشاهیست که تاجدارانش تاج کیانی را با عمامه تعویض کردند. قبله عالم شده جانشین اهل بیت و ولی فقیه مسلمین جهان. انگار که در ژنهایمان همه چیز جلو جلو مکتوب شده.
...
by Red Wine on Tue Dec 20, 2011 10:35 AM PSTجنابِ فسنجان (نیک شما بسیار جالب و خاطره انگیز است)
مطلبِ شما را خواندیم،تا اندازهای نیکو نگاشتید اما این ربطی به کشورِ ترکیه چند دهِ سالِ قبل ندارد (زمانِ حضراتِ گرامی عثمانی)،وضعیتِ فعلی ترکیه از تمامیِ کشورهایِ مسلمانِ منطقه بهتر است،این را از این جهت گوئیم که خودمان چند بار به این کشور مسافرت کرده و اموراتِ کاریِ فراوان در آنجا داریم.
این یک زخمِ قدیمی و بد بوییست که تنها ارامنه و ترکها میتوانند آن را حل و فصل کنند و جایز نیست کشورهایِ دیگر در آن دخالت کنند.
Hooshang
by Fesenjoon2 on Tue Dec 20, 2011 10:27 AM PSTThere is no real democracy in Turkey. It's all a smokescreen.
Turkey's secularism is on the decline, as was admitted by Niall Fergussen in his latest interview with Charlie Rose.
If people seem to be living a shiny happy seemingly "democratic" life in Turkey, it's only because things are economically going well for everyone there. They are riding the wave of success amidst a revived Ottomon-style nationalism. (which is why they no longer want to join the EU). This all will end. And when it does, youll see a quasi-Iranian Islamic state emerge once again, where muftis call for chopping of heads and hands and executing infidels.
Turkey is just like Iran at it's core. Filled with brainwashed animals called muslims:
//www.volleywood.net/volleyball-related-news/volleyball-news-europe/turkish-player-gets-punched/
...
by Red Wine on Tue Dec 20, 2011 10:08 AM PSTA wrong move from the French govroment, I know that the Armenians have a great influence on French culture and politics but France still needs Turkey ,Why ? Because at his side in terms of the geopolitical situation has Turkey in the area the Middle East.France need this !
I am sure that France will pay dearly for this.
Thank you dariush jan for info .You are the best .
With all due respect for Turkish brotheres and sisters,
by Hooshang Tarreh-Gol on Tue Dec 20, 2011 10:06 AM PSTThe Turkish nation should once and for all get the phocking balls to admit what happened to Armenians (killed with the aid of Kurds), Greeks, Gypsies, Orthodox Christians,...
What kind of a democracy is this that you can't even have an objective understanding of your history in the 20th century? It's a very compromised democracy, from head to toe.
France genocide law angers Turkey
by Darius Kadivar on Tue Dec 20, 2011 09:58 AM PSTFrance genocide law angers Turkey (bbc)
Turkey's president urges France to scrap plans for a bill criminalising the denial of the 1915-16 mass killings of Armenians as genocide.
The French lower house of parliament is due to consider a bill that proposes a one-year prison term and a heavy fine.
Turkey has warned of irreparable damage to ties if the legislation is passed.
Armenians say up to 1.5 million people died during mass deportations. Turkey puts the figure at closer to 300,000.
Ankara says Turks were also killed when Armenians rose up against the Ottoman Empire during World War I when Russian troops invaded eastern Anatolia, now eastern Turkey.
Well done Dariush, very timely
by fozolie on Fri Jun 04, 2010 06:43 PM PDTVery smart way of exposing the Turkish hypocricy. Maybe they should sort out their own house and come to terms with ethnic cleansing of Armenians and Greeks before they worry about Palestine.
Kazan's America America
//www.youtube.com/watch?v=90davCkZlZU
A Touch Of Spice
//www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOhpWC8Nl70
Mr. Fozolie