Jahanshah Javid

Circumcision Gains More Acceptance in AIDS Fight

JJJ you go around and make so much hoopla against circumcism and yet the UN Health Organization HIV prevention says the "good news" is that circumcision is on the rise!  So you're preaching a backward view!  Eyvallah!

 Circumcision Gains More Acceptance in AIDS Fight

Everything is sacred

Time for a little humor

Why Jewish men are circumcised? Because Jewish women wont buy anything unless it is 20% off!

Wise advice!

Dear
Jahanshah,

Thank you
so much for the excellent blog! Circumcision
is a barbaric act, with no real measurable health benefit. I am very proud of
you for spreading this wisdom! 

Ayatoilet

Get off the paranoia it is getting really silly. I know about it. The way you get Aids is well known and has nothing to do with foreskin so please. Do not waste your time. Go to any medical site but the main ways you get it are:

• Receptive anal sex from infected partner. Foreskin or not make no difference. 
• Needle sharing again nothing to do with foreskin.
• Transfusion with infected blood.

Best way to not get it is to avoid sex with infected people. Please don't give me the BS about "big bad AIDS" is gonna get me. It is as ridiculous as some of your other posts. This is how you ruin your credibility. I already lost much respect for you.

PS: I got a better idea; if you are really worried about it. Just cut the whole thing off and you are set. As long as you don't do any of the other stuff above. Why go half way instead of 100% safe you might also try living in a sterile bubble.

VPK - If Khamenei was foreskin, Every Iranians would Circumcize

I think I could get you to always circumcize, by changing the name of foreskin to Khamenei. Suddenly you would forget all your arguments against circumcision and actually promote it. I know you would do that. I am sure.

Remember they had no penicilin in the past so any infection people could avoid would have been good. UTI is no joke.

And don't forget about AIDS. Now in this day and age, the desease to avoid is Aids -- and its very real. There can be No hiding behind anyone - not even if you're Sandusky or a Mullah or a Catholic Priest. AIDS will come and get you... but that is not neccesarily if you;re circumcized. VPK you should tell that to all the Mullahs and Catholic Priests in Seminary in Khorasan.

Ayatoilet

You are wrong. Foreskin has a very large number of nerves which greatly increase pleasure. It protects the business it is meant to. Do you understand logic? It is mine not my parents. It was no right of theirs to remove it.

Tonsils and appendix are only removed if badly infected. My kids have theirs. You seem to have a problem differentiating between medicine and "Khorafat". Medicine is when there is a real medical emergency. Khorafat is to please the invisible dude in the sky. 

Please do not try to insult my intelligence by hiding behind HIV protection.. There was no HIV until 1980 and this barbarism has been going on for 1000s of years. Besides the way to avoid HIV is to use condoms or not have multiple partners. Not to mention receptive *** sex. How does removing the foreskin help there? You realize grasping at thin straws now. But still insist on doing it. All you are doing is making me lose any respect I once had for you.

JJ Jan - Breast serve a useful purpose, Foreskin doesn't!!

Your only objection is the pain part of the equation. In and of itself Foreskin serves no valuable purpose. As for breasts ...need I say more!! Very very valuable part of the female anatomy ...

If you can improve your hygene and reduce the possibility of desiese by taking out a non-functioning piece of skin from your body, I think it has value.

There are many other parts of the body that are treated in the same way. Tonsils and the appendix. 10-20% of the world's population have tonsils removed depending on the region. People remove them due to repeated throat infections etc. This is similar to foreskin removal that reduces the propensity for UTI (urinary tract infections).

This is very normal, and I think reasonable ...and yes preventative. I have had my tonsils removed!!! And I remember many times when I was a child where I missed school due to bad throat infections - which all disappeared after the tonsils were removed. Had my parents arranged for me to have the procedure earlier it would have saved me a lot of grief.

Have you ever had UTI or do you know anyone that has had UTI? I haven't  (you can assume why), but I know people that have had it and it is very very painful.

By the way, tonsil removal is a very ancient procedure (over 3000 years old) ...not quite as old as circumcision!!

HIV by the way is no joke. And you totally discount the AIDS epidemic in the world. There are places in South Africa where something like 40% of all adults are HIV infected. You've totally ignored the significant role of circumcision on reducing aids transimission. It absolutely plays a very vital role. 30 Million people have died from HIV/AIDS.  Circumcision could have saved a very large part of those deaths.

You should read the WHO report on this subject. Its informative.

 a bit off topic but

 a bit off topic but relevant:

Warning; Graphic pictures

 این حیوانات زبان بسته با روش های بسیار فجیع مانند ضربه به جمجمه توسط لوله های فلزی و کوبیدن سر آن ها به دیوار و یا حلق آویز شدن کشته می شوند...

تبریز – خبرگزاری مهر: یک تشکل مردم نهاد فعال در آذربایجان شرقی با طرح این ادعا که سگ های ولگرد و بی سرپرست در تبریز به طرز بیرحمانه ای توسط برخی شرکتهای طرف قرارداد با شهرداری کشتار می شوند، از مسئولان برای جلوگیری از این اقدام استمداد کرد.

//www.iranianuk.com/page.php5?id=20111210103245028

 //www.iranianuk.com/page.php5?id=20111210103245028

Separation of Church and State AND Corporation

JJ is right

Hey it is possible to get Alzheimer so why don't we remove our brains? Or 100% of people die at some point so should we prevent the problem by doing it right now! I mean this medical prevention thing is really silly and dumb.

I think people should be prosecuted for doing this to children. It is child abuse and I would gladly vote to criminalize it. In time sanity will win out over this and it will be banned. Mark my words.

BTW: I do know of women who after reaching maturity decided to remove their breast. However it was done because of a family history and by choice. Not by some religious mambo jumbo forced on their parents. 

Prevention?

12.2 percent of women born in the United States today will develop breast cancer at some time in their lives...

If I have a daughter, I will ask the doctor to remove her breasts at puberty.

THAT's the same logic parents use to justify circumcision: there's a possibility of disease, so let's chop off the boy's foreskin.

Leave it alone!

Men as adults can choose for themselves what to do about the risks of disease. Beh man o to cheh?

No Pain - No Gain

A few simple facts (JJ):

(1) there are many things in medicine where a little pain goes a long way towards improving someone's health. Needle pricks, dentist's instruments etc. Just because something "hurts" it does not mean its neccessarily bad. Sometimes you actually pay more for something if it provides additional benefits...is a Mercedes the same price as a Peykan? So the focus has to be a question that goes something like this: Does cicumcision provide any benefits to the circumcised?

(2)Circumcision is NOT just an Iranian or Islamic tradition, but practiced in many regions of the world as well as many other faiths (notably Judaism) and actually started many thousands of years ago when humans were in caves i.e. before Judaism came along as a faith. As a human 'activity' it has stuck with "us". So the question has to be why?

(3) Now lets look at facts, not rhetoric. What are the real facts about this for boys:

(a) World Health Organization (WHO) has done studies on this, and flat out comes out in favor of circumcision in Men, not women. It reduces the risk to HIV transmission in virtually every form of sex practiced; and in areas of the world where there are literrally AIDS/HIV epidemics, it is a recomended public health practice.

(b) In a very large combined RECENT analysis of over 400,000+ children from many different sources it was found to reduce the risk for UTI (urinary tract infections) significantly.

(c) The risk of Penile Cancer is 3x to 22x lower in circumcized populations than non-circumcized populations. Depending on which study you accept as a basis.

(d) It is actually a recomended medical treatment plan for many deseases such as balanitis xerotica obliterans, paraphimosis, balanitis, posthitis, balanoposthitis and urinary tract infections. i.e. medical students are taught to use it as a treatment plan (worldwide).

(e) And on the issue of pain, it is now common (recomended) practice to anaesthetize children (locally) before conducting the procedure.  i.e. its not as bad as it once was...and having said that the rate of infections in centuries past was much higher (and there was NO penicillin)...so it was a public health must (in centuries past).

In conclusion, I don't see the value for women (as they practice in Africa etc.), the literature does NOT support it; but for boys it really is better - there is a factual case for it.

To put it bluntly my son (born here) is circumcised. And I would ask for it to be done again and again if I had more boys. If I had my way I would have had at least a dozen boys and formed the best soccer team in this area with them...but someone I love very much had different ideas.

By the way, I am NOT a medical doctor. If someone out there is a professional and has read different literature let me know. I am curious.

I don't mean to attack Islam

This is not an only Islamic practice other religion also have it. My objection is to any mutilation on children. And circumcision is mutilation; please don't tell me otherwise I know first hand.

 The body of a child belongs to them not their parents. Yes parents do have a right to make medical decisions. But it is only when it is a medical necessity.  Not due to a religion the kid may not even chose.

Wait until the children are adults; then have them make their own decisions. Is it so hard to respect your children; to allow them to decide for themselves; if so why; if you respect your kids maybe you will respect each other next.

...

 The adult male should have the right to make the decision for himself and not have his body permanently damaged as a baby.

//www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/midr9/series_on_circumcision_psychology_today/

Khatnehists

This piece is not intended to attack Islam, but the act of circumcision itself, which was not invented by Muslims, and it is not carried out only by Muslims.

Call it what you like. What it comes down to is that parents are blindly following custom in tampering/deforming/mutilating (take your pick) with their boys sexual organ without any REASONABLE justification.

When the majority of uncircumcised men in the world are living normally, when no uncircumcised man will willingly remove penis foreskin, when uncircumcised man face no definitive, unacceptable, life-threatening health risks, then why put boys through this?

The risk of uncircumcised men developing a serious disease is a fraction of women who will develop breast cancer. So should girls' breasts be removed as a preventive measure at puberty? Of course not.

Don't be ridiculous. Think!

Disenchanted; Parsa

How do you know it does not hurt have you tried it on yourself?  By all means take a knife and cut as much of your own as you want. But don't mess with children. I heard the same *** about health from my mother when I confronted her.

Face it  this is religious and that is it and no one should have religion forced on them. People should wait until they are of age and then decide. If you want to be a Muslim get it done at the age of consent. If it does not hurt then what is the problem.

But I know it hurts like hell and that is why you would see a lot of people saying no. Therefore the Muslims do it to helpless babies who are unable to object. Muslims are good at one thing: beating the helpless. Too afraid of dealing with thinking adults.

It ain't that bad! :-)

     I don't make much of it. It may even have some health benefits if you listen to some (not sure about their scientific competence though!). Bavafa is correct...

      BUT...

    from a philosophical point of view one wonders: Why almighty created something only to order it to be removed later?! :-) Couldn't he calibrate the "dodool" on his own?!This presents  a major theological puzzle!

Circumcision

Hi JJ,

A stimulating discussion as indicated by the number of comments. However, I did not see why you had mixed the boy and girl circumcision. The first, whether it is performed for religious or scientific rasons could be discussed forever with no end. This circucision causes practically no pain  or no more than a pain of vaccination needle especially if performed in infancy. It actually increases the sexual pleasere in adult life.

But the second one or girl circumcision as purportedly done by Taliban is the one that is rightly called mutilation as it deprives the girl of sexual pleasure. This is the cruelty in truest sense of the word whereas the boy circumcision is not. 

khodee 

Its great to discuss this subject now actually.

No child in our family from the new post 1979 generation has had this done, do the research its a terrible thing to have done, cost vs benefit demands we let this one go too.  This is why we need a society that is free from terror so we can discuss these points, so that is still #1 on the list.

Mehrdad

I know Islam has plenty to criticize it for and I do that. But my beef here is very specific. I want to discourage Iranians in the West from torturing their boys. This is separate from my regular criticism of Islam.

My kids get no torture whatsoever; no physical injury of any kind. The only exception is absolutely necessary medical procedures. Things like important vaccinations and dental work. Those I research and make sure there is no way around them. 

About circumcision we must agree to disagree. I do find it torture. You may not believe but I still feel and remember the pain. I want it banned but know it won't happen because is a part of Judaism. Nevertheless I am going to raise my voice.

VPK: This type of thought process is similar to …

to fail to see the jungle because of  trees.

If you aim to criticize Islam, fortunately this religion and its leaders give plenty material that is far more effective and less subjective.  Use those, not something controversial as this which is also practiced by other religion and  make sure to condemn them all so it does not give you the appearance of bias which contributes to lack of credibility.

Just because Islam tortures more, it does not make it OK when others do it even if they do it far less. Nor should it be ground for not criticizing it.  Besides, who did blame America for all or is it simply your imagination of such thing?

Lastly and more importantly, which was my original point and you missed it completely and interpreted as my defense of Islam, characterizing this act as “torture” simply diminishes the value and effect of that word and it is a disservice to those who have been subjected to torture.

'Hambastegi' is the main key to victory 

Mehrdad

In that book of Siamak

The "Iranican dream" , there is a part about "Khatneh" which is funny to death! I wish I could post that part here , but it's too long. Your blog reminded me of the chapter about Khatneh-souroun in America..LOL

...

جنابِ راجر رابیت ...

شما را با ذکاوت تر (موجه الرفتار) از این حرف ها می‌ پنداشتیم،خدا نکند که تغییر رفتار دهید،حیف است .

تصویری را که مشاهده می‌‌فرمایید،تصویری است نقاشی شده به رویِ یک قهوه خانه قدیمی‌ در شهرِ زیبایِ شیراز.نقاش مشخص نیست و کارهایِ زیبایِ دیگری دارد که قابلِ تکریم است .

با سپاس از جهانشاه خان از این مطلبِ جالب و ممنون از توجهتان .

الهی که خداوند یک جو عقل..به کنارِ سلامتی،به تمامیِ ما پارسیان دهد که در این روزگارِ وانفسا ،بد جوری بدان محتاجیم .

Is the painting about Nasseraddin Shah

Dear Mehrdad; others

I guess you chose not to give a response and that is fine. I don't want to get in a fight but I have a right to my opinion. Islam tortures many more people than CIA; FBI and Mossad put together. 

Yes I am sick and tired of all of this blame America for all. You know it is really simple to blame America for every problem. But to me this is torture and I reject any minimization of it. I remember the same minimization when I mentioned how my home was taken.

This is barbarism disguised as religion and I will say it. Because when a child get this from his parents no wonder he grows to be a nut. A baby needs love not a knife to his genital; think about it.

رسول اكرم: ختنه برای مردان سنّت و برای زنان کرامت و شایستگی است

What a load of crap, attributed to Mohammad the sex addict!

The whole thing goes to ancient Egypt, and the Pharaonic tampering with the nobles' genitalia, in order to enhance the male experience, and to dull the female's.

To have it for the boys is a choice, but to impose it on the girls (as a measure of dignity and honor) is simply wrong and in most places illegal.

PS: there will be no military strike on IRI for at least 2 more years ... so this blog is more useful than the whole of the front page articles.

I am glad mine done to it before I knew what it's for.

Any way it look more friendlier this way.

VPK: For your flat out question ….

Let me give you a flat out answer, without sugar coating it this time (well not completely).

Your question and conclusion that my response somehow is tied to a defense of a religious, Islam for that matter or some how I am a closet Muslim is quite frankly absurd at best. 

These days, you seem to be “sick and tired” of anything that does not sit squarely in line with your beliefs and you have been expressing it every chance you get, your right and continue to do so but don’t expect much sympathy. 

And just in case you feel I am not answering your question, that is correct, I am not going to dignify an absurd question it by answering it.  If you don’t already know where I stand regarding religion, any religion, you will not know it if it hits you in the head so speak.

'Hambastegi' is the main key to victory 

Mehrdad

P.S.  calling this ritual which I am certainly in different to “torture” is, in my opinion, of a moral bankruptcy and a great insult/disservice to those who are actually being tortured at the hands of IRI, CIA or any of their counter parts. 

Brother JJ you are medically challenged

The picture is far from clear as you try to draw brother. There is a large body of evidence in favor and there is also a similar amount against.

//www.circinfo.net/

see both sides of the argument brother before condemning it so flatly.

//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medical_analysis_of_circumcision

For an Islamic democracy

Mehrdad

Quite frankly I believe only those who have no other thing in life to complain will turn to their psychologist to talk about the trauma that they went thru few days or weeks after birth and I ponder they are typically those spoiled kids who otherwise would have complained why I don’t have a nice and shiny hat on their penis.

Your minimization of the horrible torture of male children betrays your bias. I ask you a flat out question: are you a practicing Muslim. Do you put Islam about human rights. All your posts have a pro-Islamic bias. Why not just come out and admit ti.

I am sick of this "I am against IRI; but ..." stuff which goes on to defend Islamic barbarism. I don't care if Judaism does it as well. I think it should be banned for minors. Only a person over 18 should be allowed to "chose" without pressure to have it.

Great point

I never had any doubts my kids will not be circumcised. You would have to be of sound mind and age of consent to get it done. In my opinion a minor should never be subject to any of these base on their parent religion

This is not the same as vaccination or other medical procedures. Those are legitimate medical things. I would agree to circumcision of a minor only if several reputable doctors said it was absolutely necessary for their health.