Faramarz's Latest Rambling

Bijan A M: Keep your opinions to yourself

I am not trying to convince you. My intention here is for others to read my side and your side and decide. I don't have much hope that you could ever get over your paranoia, exaggerated greed and the victim game you are playing only so that you can steal more and get away with it. So, please, spare me the Zionist cult brainwashing propaganda and go back to your "NEVER AGAIN, NEVER AGAIN" chant. I don't know what anti-semite means, I have seen it used to shut up anybody who criticizes the only apartheid regime in the world today, but if it means anti-apartheid, you are absolutely right, that I am, and proud of it too. But if you are trying to muddy the discussion because you have no answer and because I have made you look like a fool, representing retarded savages who have obtained fancy killing weapons and have come back to continue a savage war that they had lost 2000 years ago, I think you will agree that readers on this site are above that level of intelligence and can see through you.It is very interesting that you think that Palestinians deserve what is coming to them but the Jews have been "persecuted." Well, did it ever occur to you that maybe you also deserve it? Go chew on that for a while.

Mehdi, you don't get it

As odd as it may sound to you, it is quite understandable to me. I don’t see any contradiction between democracy and being a safe haven for those who have or are being persecuted for being Jews. You have demonstrated on this site to be anti-semite and my point was, to tell you that don’t waste your time and energy. Your argument is dead. The Jewish state of Israel is here to stay (as long as the planet that you and I live in exists).

 If you want to stay In the state of denial, that’s your purgative, but nothing will change the facts and realities. Keep on dreaming that Hamas would eliminate Israel….you only wake up with a bunch of dead infants on your hands…..

Kaveh Nouraee: if it burps like a human, it's a human

That's my measure. :-)

Faramaz, you are the man!

Seriously, Israel/Palestine is a fight between TWO OTHER ETHNIC GROUPS. I, as an Iranian, have zero incentive to care and pick either side!

The minute a group of Arabs comes to the aid of Iranians (and not the Palestinian Basijis essentially collecting Iranain welfare in the name of that wrethced book of LIES and MYTHS) is when I will HALF-ASSED pretend like I care about any Arabic struggle! Historically they've proved how much they care about Iranzamin va Farzandha ye Kourosh!

There are half a billion Arabs on this planet, there are less than 100 million Iranians. They can fight their own fight, the devil I care! They have plenty of their own money, they can fund the fight of their own bogus MYTHICAL holy crusade on their own!

Licking my lips in anticipation of "Enghelab e-Sekular"...

excuse me, mehdi

but "white black" IS a valid term.

mehdi... meet michael jackson.

LOLOL

Bijan A M: Israel, Ishmael, whatever

I really have no problem with drawing arbitrary lines around and area and giving it a name. Call it Israel, Ishmael, whatever. In fact it can be fun to come up with more funny names and create a whole bunch of "states." I couldn't care less. Just realize that you cannot have apartheid and democracy together. Separation of "church and state" is a principle of modernity and democracy. So please, quite using the invalid phrase "Jewish democracy." It is embarrassing. It's like saying "white black."

Mehdi

Actually, you only used the word "humans". That's why I was asking if Israelis fall into that category.

Mr. Mehdi

I believe you are hallucinating. You say: “Israel, as a regime, has no right to exist, and it will eventually disappear. In fact its disappearing act has already started". You expressed your opinion, now let me express mine. Israel, as a Jewish state is here and is here to stay as long as the humanity, as you and I know it today, is in existence.

You have come to that juncture in human existence that you can no longer persecute a Jew for his/her faith. You have to treat him as a human being like any other or you will be vaporized. There is no apartheid. They take the threat very seriously and do whatever it takes to protect their citizens.   I guaranty you the growth of non-Jewish population is no threat to existence of Israel. You know why? Because this thing is here to stay and there is nothing you, Hamas, Hezbollah, Al queda, or IRI can do about it. Just accept the fact and reality and take another path to peace.

Time to wake up and smell the roses….

Kaveh: I said Israeli people have a right to live not the regime

Is that confusing?

Mehdi

Humans have a right to live?

When you consider Israelis to be human too, let us know.

People have a right to exist but not an apartheid regime

Israel, as a regime, has no right to exist, and it will eventually disappear. In fact its disappearing act has already started. There are Israelis who are now standing up and speaking out againstt the apartheid that is Israel. It is just inevitable. You cannot ask for modernity and democracy and at the same time as for apartheid. It's an impossible paradox. So what is Israeli makers trying to do? I think they are confused. I honestly don't think that even they know what the hell they are trying to accomplish.

When you listen to the usual Israel lovers like zion, fred, farhad kashani, kaveh nouraiee, etc, they say the purpose is to create this euphoric government/country where people enjoy democracy, modernity and the best of science and anything possible - but non-Jewish is not allowed in there. They paint a picture that is like stories in children books. Then they say the way they will do it is by applying a certain amount of violence against the Nazi Arabs! This is ironically exactly what Hitler was doing when he was murdering the Jews! First Hitler, with his propaganda machine, convinced people that the Jews were something like virus and were not even really humans. Once people somewhat believed that falsehood, the murders could start and progress with almost no objection from anyone. Israel is now doing the same exact thing. The only thing people see on TV is the rockets fired by Hamas. The TV is not allowed to show how Israel came to existence and how people of the area were broken and their possessions, along with their pride were stolen and trampled on, without any compassion. The Israeli methods were precisely Hitler's methods.

Yes, humans have a right to live, but Israel as a system of government not only has no right to exist, it is not even possible for it to exist. In fact it has never truly existed. Today we find that growing non-Jewish population in Israel is probably the second greatest concern they have.

Why do Iranians talk about Israel or Palestine? Because Israel is involved in clandestine operation pretty much everywhere in the Middle East, including Iran. Because Israel has openly and publicly announced that it wants Iran bombed now! So get your head out of the sand Mr. Fateh, Iranians are not the ones meddling with Israel, it is Israel that is meddling with EVERY nation in the Middle East, if not the world. 

first of all I am a former

first of all I am a former Iranian muslim. Currently an athiest. Dislike some of the lsraeli policies but I can relate to them and I can understand why they do what they are doing in self defense. It's not all about Arabs and the Isrealies. It is about Fanatism against the whole world. I personally believe that The Israeles, Americans, Russians, Indians and many countries have been trying to deal with the threat of Fundamentalism. The oppressed is the whole world.

I liked the following pro-Isreali site in particular. It answers to all of your questions.

Looking at the conflict in the Isreali eyes:

//www.masada2000.org/islam.html

I also found the following athiest site very interesting:

www.faithfreedom.org

Rosie

I do not know whether I am commenting on the correct part of your post, but if you mean Shiism and Khomeiniism, then here are my thoughts.

Velaayat-Faghih - or what you called Khomeiniism - is a form of government advocated by some Shi'ite Ayatollahs. It has its supporters, and its roots go back far, but it also has strong opposition among even the ayatollahs. So, it is not a universally-accepted concept within the Shi'ite hierarchy.

Those who opposed it do so on various grounds:

(1) VF is based on the idea that in the abscence of the hidden Imam - the Mahdi - someone among the ayatollahs acts as his "deputy" until he re-emerges. So, some who oppose the VF believe that this is nonsense. If you cannot see the hidden Imam, how can you know who his deputy is? In Iran, the Hojjatiyeh group before the Revolution, and even for first few years after the revolution (until Ayatollah Khomeini banned it) belonged to this school of thought.

(2) There are those who believe that, regardless of the legitimacy or lack thereof of the VF, Rouhaniyat should get out of the business of governing, because they reason that power corrupts and that, ultimately, will damage the faith. What has happened in Iran over the past many years gives credence to this school. It is believed that a big majority of the ayatollahs in Iran think so, but for one reason or another are silent.

3. There are those who believe that, once a government is formed based on Islam and VF, and more generally any religion, it becomes incompatible with human rights and democratic values. For example, Dr. Mohsen Kadivar - a cleric himself - belongs to this group and went to jail for it.

Even those who support the VF cannot agree on the extent of the powers of the Faghih himself. The right-wing ayatollahs who support the VF know no limits on the power. Some left-wing Ayatollahs - such as Ayatollah Mohammad Mousavi Khoeiniha - believe only in a "monitoring" role, just to make sure that things do not get out of control, but no executive power. 

So, Ayatollah Khomeini was not the first who advocated the VF; he was, however, the first who actually implemented it; and his thesis does not have universal support.

Mammad

Anonymous observer

Yes, I have read Ayatollah Montazeri's memoir, and yes, it is, in my opinion, very interesting. It reveals a lot of facts that would be useful to future historians.

Two recent statements by Ayatollah Montazeri which, once again, reveal what kind of a man he is:

1. "The shah was also selling 6 million barrells of oil/day and doing somethings for the country. But, people revolted because they wanted freedom and independence. So, the present government must explain why we have not achieve freedom. If it does not, people should protest. If they do not, then why did they revolt in the first place?

2. "Velaayat-Motlagheh Faghih is ein-e sherk ast," hence invalidating the IRI Constitution completely.

Mammad

FK

I forgot to say the following:

In yesterday's post I did not say that I know more or less than you do. As usual, you imagined things, because you get yourself so worked up.

But, I admit that I do not even close to the level of your fabricated knowledge. Your production of novel history, fabrications, exaggerations, and in some case outright lies is tremendous. I confess I cannot even come close!

My reference to Google was either misunderstood by you, or, as usual, you skewed it. You "commented" on my professional job. So, I told you to check my name with Google to see what kind of references you get for my scientific work.

Mammad

FK

You are the one who was embarrassed, not me. Your anger, and your hitting your head against the wall showed it!! I set a trap for you, and you fell right into it!!

I only provided more details of how the Sepaah was formed, so that your fabrications become clearer. I talk with authority here, and I explained why in my last post. You do not come even close to that level, and even if you do, in your parallel universe you skew them or forget them.

The rest of your mumbo jumbo is, as usual, not woth commenting on. Say what you want and think of me any way you want. that is your right, but it is also my right not to give a hoot.

Mammad

Oh Niloufar there is definitely a case for Israel or at least

for ordinary Israelis and Zionists holding the views they do, but the problem is that every time most of the particular Zionists here who are regular posters state it it degenerates. They are not doing it justice. I think you would be better off continuing the discussion with Arash who granted, I had a lot of problems with tha last blog, but he does see both sides (and he's not an ideological Zionist either).

In my case MM comes along, jumps down my throat, I try to get him to re-articulate coherently but he always disappears on me (see my blog Zionazis as one example). As for the other main Zionists here well go to the top of the now-featured All Shia Men Are and you may be surprised. Bijan is a Zionist who can SUSTAIN a rational conversation (sorry but the other two don't seem to be able to sustain one for long...) and there are many others all over the world...here, I don't really know.....a few at best..  

buuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuut...big but...

HERE ARE A COUPLE OF REASONS WHY "THEY" SEE "US" AS IRRATIONAL TOO:

"We" could do better to improve the dialog. One thing I can tell you for sure about the case for Israel is that "we" do whitewash Hamas and it would be very helpful not to do it to get the Zionists to hear US so we could hear THEM etc..Mammad talked about Hamas too on this thread. He is one of the very few people in this forum who seems to still support the REVOLUTION itself (not what it turned INTO but the actual Revolution), he is a devout Muslim and so forth... and he does not whitewash Hamas.

As for the use of the Nazi terminology you can go to the end of my last and very long post on the blog to Zion, also my blog previous to that one, Zionazis, I am very sure about how harmful it is in most cases here. Yet some people still argue with me about it and I'm Jewish and brought up in a Zionist home!

We could do better.

Sorry not to provide the links but  the Shia Men Are blog  featured and mine you can just click on my name here.

Roxane

thanks Kashani!

Kashani says: "... before you make yourself look bad, maybe you need to do some research!"

Kashni_jAn, following your advice I called an Esfahani friend who was in Tehran during the early days of IRI. He told me he did not see any "Palestinian thugs" with their "Jeeps" and "guns", however he confirmed seeing many Martian thugs hovering above Tehran in their saucers protecting IR. Thanks for enlightening me.

this is a

very dizzying circular argument. over and over. can someone remind me of the point of going on and on about the same thing with the same people? there does not seem to be much persuasion or meeting of minds going on.

i really would like to see the zionist side of the argument but i can't understand it. they don't see how badly they are compromising their future security.

two sides that are totally convinced about their own case. this same thing is going on in palestine. israelis know that they are right, but they also know that the palestinians are right. they see 2 rights that cannot be reconciled. and because of their overwhelming military power, there is a total impasse.

plestinians have legitimacy and justice on their side. this also makes them very powerful and the israelis are scared of them. they are even trying to outlaw arab political parties in israel while relentlessly preaching democracy to the region. of course, people whose children can be openly and shamelessly bombed cannot be allowed to have a political voice. it doesn't make sense to give them the right to political participation if they have no right to life itself.

Peace!

Anynimous7, I’m not

Anynimous7, I’m not supporter of Shah, and that’s that as far as you’re concerned.

Samsam111, thank you aziz. And you are absolutely right.

 Mammad, 

I see that you took some time to respond to my posting after the initial embarrassment that you suffered because I exposed your outrageous effort to re-write history. And I should give you credit for twisting and changing the subject of the discussion in a smooth fashion. That shows your analytical skills. But after all, all propaganda perpetuators should have that qualification in order to be effective. You’re certainly one of them

Look, you’re the one who initiated to turn our discussions in the past personal, not me. And that resulted when, over and over again, I exposed your shameful attempts to justify for the IRI and to twist reality. You got mad and turned belligerent. So I’m pretty much giving you a taste of your own medicine. All that being said, I’m not mad at all to be quiet honest. I’m actually happy to be able to expose people like you more and more. But I am, at the end of the day, very disappointed that a fellow Iranian, a fellow human, a fellow researcher, engages in pathetic games of fabrications and propaganda.

And you can’t be serious about “typing your name in Google” to prove that you know more than me, or anyone else for that matter!! Brittany Spears has millions of hits on her name, are you saying she knows more than you about politics? And just because the left who has hijacked Colleges and Universities in this country hired, you to empower itself and its ideology, doesn’t mean that you know more than others my friend. You’re the one who brought up the “I’m a professor at some CA college”, not me, in order to prove a point. I never asked what you do, nor did I ever care. If I’m not mistaking, you were at some point trying hard to find what my real name is. As if that makes any different about my logic. So, again, leaves personal matters aside.

I was very clear when I said a Palestinian guy by that name, not an Iranian guy. You came back and said pretty much that no such Palestinian person ever existed. That in itself discredits you, now that the truth has been proven, from making any further statements on how the Sepah was formed. When you missed (advertently or inadvertently) a vital part of IRIs history, then you have been automatically discredited my friend. Obviously there are many people out there who know more about Sepah than you and I do. But we know things also, and sometimes getting caught up in the small details derails you from understanding the big picture. And frankly sir, I believe you are a good example of someone who does that. You are missing the very important point here, why was the Sepah formed? What was the philosophy behind it? Now, what happened to the people who formed it, is not the topic of our discussion here. We all know that Khomeini was the head Fascist; so obviously, he had the final say in everything. And please stop putting words in my mouth, I never said “PLO formed Sepah”, but they definitely used many of their experience, especially in the guerilla warfare that PLO was so accustomed to, in establishing the Sepah. And yes, Abu Shareef did play an important role in the establishment of Sepah. Because Sepah itself is not an Army per say as in the classical definition of Army, rather, it’s a half army/half militia, and where do you think Sepah got their militia skills from? Well of course from groups like the PLO and others. And who was the main connection between IRI and POL? That would be Abu Shareef.

Mammad, I told you before that you have prejudgment of events that happen before they even happen! And that prejudice represents in your hate for America and Capitalism. You fault everything on the U.S. From that perspective, you cannot be a neutral/fair/effective analyzer of matters. But you’re only an example on what is wrong with our society. Like Obama said in his inauguration speech, you are one of those folks who blame their society’s shortcoming on America. That’s an easy way out that many dictators and groups took and are taking around the world, and if you look at the situation on those countries where those dictators and groups exist, you will see it as pathetic. Bottom line at the end of the day, by listening you aziz, Iranians can look back and see what went wrong with our society. Thanks for your contribution to that.

"Someone should start laughing"

Mammad

You're welcome, and the name calling is truely shameful.  By the way, you had previously talked about Ayatollah Montazeri.  Have you by any chance read his memoir?  I read it and thought that it was pretty interesting.

Hi, Mammad, I was hoping to run into you...

Would you mind going to the following blog and addressing however briefly the third part of my recent long post, title beginning Laleh, Responsibility:

//iranian.com/main/blog/lalehgillani/all-shia-men-are

The third part of the post is just called Shiism in bold.

I thought you would be the person most qualified to do so.

At first I just wrote a short post rejecting the blog on basis of illogical premises inherent in title but since a hot debate is brewing including with the author I decided to continue up the thread.

Thanks,
Roxane

Anonym7

Some people, regardless of what people like you and I say, always find an excuse, or respond to their uncontrollable impulses, to "comment" and in the process say something absurd, insult others, etc. Such people do not need any excuse - such as any comment that you or I may post - in order to act on their impluses.

Thanks for your concerns.

Mammad

Anonymous Observer

Thank you. Let me add that being civilized is NOT an extraordinary virtue. This is the way that should be natural and humane. But, unfortunately, the only way some people in this site know how to debate someone is by accusations, etc. All you need to do is reading what people like FK post. Look at his last one, for example.

I have been called Islamist (in its derogatory meaning), Islamist-leftist, Islamist-Marxist, IRI supporter, IRI sympathizer, IRI agent, moron, megalomanic, shameless, Haji (in the racist way that the US soldiers use it in Iraq), Mashdi (again in a supposedly insulting way), Dr. nuke, nuke defender, etc., all by "pure and true superpatriot Iranians" who consider patriotism their God-given property. They believe that they are the true patriotic Iranian and they, and only they, decide who else might be. In other words, they have the patent rights and copyrights on patriotism.

The patriotism that they believe in is, in fact, nothing but an extreme form of chauvinism (imagine, extreme form of chauvinism) that has invariably led throughout history to racism and war. For example, they say that we should earase our history over the past 1300 years, and go back to the era before that, and these people consider themselves modern, enlightened, secular, ..... One of them even regrets that we have had people like Hafez, Khwarazmi, Khayyam, Rumi, etc., because they contradict his chauvinistic views regarding Iran's history. Another person even spies on me, and constantly brags about how he knows everything about me, as if I have something to hide!

All I have done has been expressing my views, in the most civilized way that I am capable of (which may or may not be good enough), and have always tried to post only when I have something to add to the discussion, and not as a result of my impulses.

Mammad

mammad

mammad, sorry that my comment to Kashani generated such an unusual response. I did not think even Mr. Fateh himself was serious about that (probably he got that kind of info from his older aunts).
Anyhow, as you stated:
"We need to read history exactly as it happened, not the way we would like it to have happened. The only way forward is by learning from the past. "
gozashte_cherghe_rahe_ayandeh_ast
--best regards

Your missing the point

Because I hate the IRI does not mean I have to approve the slaughtering of children in Gaza, Sudan or Burma.

Post news from equal conflicts, and people will show as much hate towards those governments as well.

Extra hate towards Israels actions are shown because, unlike those mentioned governments, Israel gets broad support in defense and finance from some of the most powerful richest countries, including the US.

A secular democratic Iran should have nothing to do with countries like Burma, North-Korea, Israel etc. Mild diplomatic contact is alright. But this fantasy or notion that our future is attached to 6 million Israelis and not the hundreds of millions of Syrians, Iraqis, Lebanese, Azeris, Afghanis, Tajiks etc is just stupid and unrealistic.

Mammad & Zion

I just want to say that I enjoy reading your comments, and commend you for the way you debate issues.  I personally may disagree, or agree, as the subject matter may be, with either or both of you, but I find it very refreshing to see two individuals with opposing ideologies debate each other on issues without resorting to name calling.  There are few others on this site who do the same, and leave rational comments who I cannot think of on the top of my head (actually, just thought of a couple: Irandokht and my good friend Sadegh), but your debate style should be an example for everyone else to follow.    

PS Mehrmaz, thank you for the term "Isomorphosis". That is

exactly what I ws trying to say when I said in my blog Zionazis telling my sotry about how I became a non-Zionist that what the Arab woman did with the offensive banner, the delusions my parents held about  the condition of thePalestinians, and Israeli soldiers ighting flares for Christian fascists at Sabra and Shatila are the same phenomenon in substance, varying only in degree: psychic splitting, unconscious delusional holding of two completely different ideas which totally contraddict each other and make no sense, in order to adhere to a specific ideology which the individual feels at a deep level is necessary for their own survival. Please note the inclusion of the pro-Palestinian Arab woman here.. It is quintessential.

Mehmaz, I did say when the use of Nazi terminology is

useful. I went into it at great length in the second half of the long post I wrote, my last one at the end of my last blog, the one to Zion.  I will do it again and at greater length. Isee you already understand how the Jewish people are being manipulated but I will go into it in this post for the benefit of others who are reading it. So some of it is directly for you, other parts are for the general public.

Use of Nazi terminology, espeically the word Nazi itself, is always fine once you have establlilshed a healthy rapport with a Zionist  (and there are plenty of moderate Zionists who will establish healthy rapports but they won't if you use the terminology to start off with, especially in a hostile way). Then you can explain but you have to be careful and patient. It is good to ask questions like don't you see how the Wall and the fragmentation of Palestine int ghettos resembles the Warsaw gheetto?  Or did you hear what this and such extremist leader said about killing all Palestinians? Isn't that like Hitler's genocidal theories? And so forth.

When you do this it is always important to bear in mind the extraordinary suffering of the Jewish people during the Reich and how it traumatized us. You have to remember that it is in living memory. My mother was an adult, 20 at the end of WWII, my father was alraady 37. You have to discard such ideas that just because there is in fact something referred to as a Holocaust industry and just because the Jews got some kind of indemnification for their lost properties and others didn't and so on, that the vast majority are gleefully profiting from the Holocaust. Some people talk like this a lot these days. You have to assume that there is a causal relationship between the similarites of Israeli tactics to certain Nazi ones among ordinary Zionists, and that that causal relationship is trauma, and the well-known psychological fact that abused people very often become abusers, individuals as well as collectives. You have to be patient in your discussions.

Israel is within its boundaries a democracy. People vote for their leaders. They have a free press. There are Israeli Zionists who go to prison rather than serve in the OT under circumstances far less dire than what just happened in Gaza. There are many Israeli pacifists. There are many good Israelis and good Zionists all over the world. There are two main problems. 1) The Jewish people are paranoid and for good reason, and 2) unscrupulous leaders take advantage of their paranoia to lead them to do, support or ignore things they would never do otherwise.

Wouldn't you rather see these many decent people join the peace movement than fall into the arms of the far right? In reality the ordinary population statistically sways to far right under certain circumstances which only proves they are malleable. Some of them could be educated enogh to hold fast and not join the hawks when the heat is on, but they are not going to do that if they keep reading things from all over the world in English which they are all fluent in titled "Zionazis" and "Nazi State of Israel." These things only make things much worse. Then the people who write them while intending to support the Palestinian cause become unwittingly part of the problem.

In reality, in order to sway Israelis and Zionists in general to the peace movement (and to restoration of certain borders and so forth, or even a rejection of Zionism) you HAVE TO use analogies with the Nazis but ONLY AT THE RIGHT TIME and with the right people and in a healthy context. Doing it with a severlely paranoid Zionist hardliner won't work and it's a waste of time. But you do have to remember that in a public forum you're not talking to any one person, So you have to be very careful what you say to hardliners in public too. Speak very harshly but never forget others are reading you.

Every discourse, every dialog you have, will be unique. The basic thing to remember is that we have suffered unspeakable horrors in living memory, we are paranoid and traumatized, but the Jewish tradition is also a great humanitarian one. The same Ashkenaz who perpetrate these things in Is/Pal or look the other way are the Ashkenaz who brought Socialist ideas to the United States for societal reform at the turn of the last century and risked death to register black voters in the South during the Civil Rights movement.

You have to remember that every ideology exists within a spectrum, that we are human and we have suffered, that the majority of people in any population at bottom are moderate, and hencemalleable, and you have to appeal to our better selves. Using Nazi rhetoric without empathy for us will only make us deaf from the first word you say. Deaf. Not evil. Scared stiff and deaf.

It happenedd to me. If you read my recent blog Zioazis you will find out how I stopped being a Zionist. But I had a very patient and loving friend to educate me.

I have no ill will toward the ordinary German people who lived during the Third Reich. I went to live in Germany in my thirties. I hold these people collectively but not individually responsible. I forgave them long ago. Even up to Hitler. Hitler was severely mentally ill. Goebbels on the other hand was an evil man. People like Goebbels manipuated Hitler as their poster child to do their evil deeds, not the other way around That is my firm opinon. People use the term "Hitler" as interchangeable with "Nazi Germany" and "the Third Reich". This is absurd. He was one person surrounded by many far more intelligent and calculating than him.

If I can try to understand Hitler, why can't you try to understand us?

Wouldn't you rather win the heart and mind of one Zionist than push twenty to the far right? When people do things like use titles like Nazi state of Israel or juxtaposecertain photos they're not convincing anyone. They are preaching to the converted. I already know the parallels, so does anyone in the peace movement. Israel is right now the most loathed country in the world. So who are you trying to convince with this rhetoric? What is it FOR? What is your OBJECTIVE?

For the rhetoric to have a concrete objective and achieve it, it must be modified.

Peace Now,

Rosie